Mystery Plane Identified (theory)!

Maybe it was a hybrid. Cause he said, when it reached the end of the air field, it basically went up, and as it accelerated, THEN it made noise. I saw a stealth aircraft at an air show. i was sitting in the bleachers, i did not hear that thing coming, even though it flew right over my head, very low, until it was already past me. then it was a big roaring sound. the sound kinda trailed behind it but didn't proceed it, even though it was not moving rapidly enough to account for the sound phenomenon (red shift blue shift, i forget what that's called... doppler effect?). perhaps this is the same kinda thing. maybe they're using anti-grav and
stealth and conventional something or other, but he said he saw no afterburners, when it climbed up from the "deck" , so what would be making the noise? no engines, anti-grav. totally silent here, noisy when climbing. notta clue.



[edit on 5-4-2007 by undo]

Originally posted by johnlear

Exhaust? HaHa. A B-52 big? HAHAHA? Keep 'em coming Canada_EH you are hilarious!!!

Mr. Lear,

I appreciate and admire all of your aeronautical achievements sir, may i ask you to start a thread and invite me so that I may hera/read the information that you have been privy to?? I worked on team for Hornet development and have spoken to another member here regarding some pretty elaborate and futuristic weapons systems at the time. You seem to have some info as well and I am curious to write/speak/u2u with you. Not to claim anything one way or another, especially regarding the moon bases and so on, but I do share aviation with you.
Anyway, I believe that you were not trying to scoff at Canada_EH, only the suggestion that the technology that is available far outreaches most people's imagination.

Also, not to create a tangent on this thread..just want to get it nouch and hear some of John Lear's thoughts.

Peace, Mondo

it also surprised me that he said it seemed to jump ahead, rather than fly. i was like, what do you mean, "jump"? he said, it vanished for a second and reappeared farther away. and did this more than once. will ask him if it did that the entire time. it might account for the noise phenomenon. perhaps the tech to warp, or jump incrementally, operates with internal engines that make noise?

Originally posted by yfxxx
It's ironic that someone, who hasn't even the slightest clue what gravity itself actually is, and how modern science describes it, tries to talks about "anti-grav"

!

Thanks for your post yfxxx, I can alway depend on you to speak your mind.

That said, and regardless of how modern science describes it, my opinion is that gravity is an electromagnetic wave and like any wave has amplitude and frequency.

There are 2 types of gravity, Gravity A which works on an atomic scale and is currently labeled the strong nuclear force, and Gravity B, the gravity that holds us on top of the earth, the earth and all the planets in orbit around the sun and the moon in orbit around the earth.

Gravity is instantaneous and is not, as mainstream science have you believe ‘just a little faster’ than the speed of light. Any gravitational force exerted by the earth will be felt instantaneously anywhere else in the universe.

It is possible that remote viewing somehow accesses the gravity B wave and in that fashion gives instantaneous access to any place and any part of the universe.

Alien craft such as the one Bob Lazar studied at S-4 access and amplify the gravity A wave to travel through space.

I doubt if the craft that Undo’s husband saw at Hill AFB was powered by anything as sophisticated as a gravity A wave manipulator.

Probably the craft Undo’s husband saw was powered by essentially the same anti-gravity method that my father helped develop in the mid 50’s. They have had 50 years to develop that type of anti-grav.

The reason I don’t think the Hill AFB craft used the S-4 type of anti-grav unit is that because of its advanced technology we couldn’t even build it even if we hard the parts which we don’t have. All we have is some element 115 with which we have managed to make an extremely powerful bomb but thats the limit of our ambition and technology.

Also, it would be impossible to remove one of the anti-matter reactors in the craft at S-4 and put it into a craft of our own design and the reason for this is that the saucer at S-4 is essentially one molded piece.

Undo’s story is without any doubt 100% true and accurate but not for the weak of imagination. The weak of imagination will kick and scream, wave their arms around and pray to "Mainstream Science" (whoever he is at this time. They will threaten and insult and screw themselves up into the ceiling but fortunately for some of us, burning at the stake is not considered 'good form' these days.

Originally posted by johnlear
That said, and regardless of how modern science describes it, my opinion is that gravity is an electromagnetic wave and like any wave has amplitude and frequency.

As someone with no clue about modern physics, you can have as many "opinions" about the subject as you like, but nobody will even consider them as scientifically useful input. You could just as well ask a four-year-old for their "opinion" on gravity ... actually, the four-year-old will quite possibly produce less nonsense than you.

There are 2 types of gravity, Gravity A which works on an atomic scale and is currently labeled the strong nuclear force, and Gravity B, the gravity that holds us on top of the earth, the earth and all the planets in orbit around the sun and the moon in orbit around the earth.

This sounds like the BS, which was originally told by Bob Lazar.

Gravity is instantaneous and is not, as mainstream science have you believe ‘just a little faster’ than the speed of light.

Thank you for explicitly confirming that you have no idea what "mainstream science" says about gravity.

Regards
yf

okay, he confirmed that it only jumped and made noise, when it started to accelerate away. and i verified with him about the roundel.
no roundel on it that he could see.

[edit on 5-4-2007 by undo]

Originally posted by yfxxx
Thank you for explicitly confirming that you have no idea what "mainstream science" says about gravity.yf

Thanks yfxxx, your comments are always welcome.

So to sum up would it be safe to say that in your opinion (of course you are not liable to actually identify yourself but we can overlook that), that in your opinion:

There is no possiblilty that Gravity A and Gravity B exist.
There is no possibility that the frequency of the gravity wave is 7.46 Hz.
That the gravity wave is not and can't be instantaneous.
That aliens, if they do exist, do not use the gravity A wave for their travel.

Would these be correct statements of your opinion?

Thanks again for your input yfxxx, it is always appreciated.

Mr. Lear,

Thanks for the u2u. looking forward to talking with you.....not to get in the middle of the heated arguement here though.

Peace, Mondo

Originally posted by johnlear
There are 2 types of gravity, Gravity A which works on an atomic scale and is currently labeled the strong nuclear force, and Gravity B, the gravity that holds us on top of the earth, the earth and all the planets in orbit around the sun and the moon in orbit around the earth.

Gravity is instantaneous and is not, as mainstream science have you believe ‘just a little faster’ than the speed of light. Any gravitational force exerted by the earth will be felt instantaneously anywhere else in the universe.

You're out of your depth John. Don't try and lecture on things which you have no idea what you are talking about.

I'd like to know what basis you have to assert that Gravity is an electromagnetic wave. There is nothing to back up your theory. Also if it is a wave, how can it be instantaneous? This violates the general heory of relativity.

Originally posted by johnlear
That said, and regardless of how modern science describes it, my opinion is that gravity is an electromagnetic wave and like any wave has amplitude and frequency.

There are 2 types of gravity, Gravity A which works on an atomic scale and is currently labeled the strong nuclear force, and Gravity B, the gravity that holds us on top of the earth, the earth and all the planets in orbit around the sun and the moon in orbit around the earth.

Gravity is instantaneous and is not, as mainstream science have you believe ‘just a little faster’ than the speed of light. Any gravitational force exerted by the earth will be felt instantaneously anywhere else in the universe.

John,

Despite our differences, I respect you. However your post would suggest that you and Not current in your beliefs as they relate to the sciences of gravity and Physics in general.

The first issue with your point is the behavior of waves:

Electromagnetic waves move at Exactly the Speed of Light. This is simple to prove, as it is a well known fact of science that light itself Is an electromagnetic wave. Visible light is a part of the electromagnetic spectrum. All energy within this spectrum bahaves according to the same laws of physics. Therefore ALL of these waves move at Exactally the same speed.

Here's some information from NASA on
Electromagnetic Waves

A electromagnetic wave, by Definition includes light waves, therefore an electromagnetic wave can NOT exceed the speed of light!

Now, About Gravity!

Gravtiy is not a wave, it's a Force! Second, Gravity is a function of Mass. The more mass something has, the more gravity it creates. The sun produces gravity, which is why the earth orbits the sun. However, if gravtiy was instantaneous (as you are proposing) the light created by the sun would never reach us.

Second, the Strong and Weak Nuclear forces, are Not the same as gravity. They are forces of their own that hold atoms together. It's the Strong Nuclear Force that keeps you from falling through the sidewalk as gravity tries to to pull you towards the center of the earth.

John, I respectfully recommend a trip to the Las Vegas Public Library. You really should catch up on current knowlege and thoeries of gravity!

Repsectfully,

Tim

Originally posted by johnlear
So to sum up would it be safe to say that in your opinion (of course you are not liable to actually identify yourself but we can overlook that), that in your opinion:

There is no possiblilty that Gravity A and Gravity B exist.

Wrong. As long as you don't define what "Gravity A" and "Gravity B" are actually supposed to mean, your statement is meaningless.

There is no possibility that the frequency of the gravity wave is 7.46 Hz.

Wrong. According to General Relativity, gravitational waves (which are not electromagnetic waves!) can have arbitrary frequencies, including 7.46 Hz (the wavelength of a 7.46 Hz gravitational wave would be about 40,000 km, by the way).

That the gravity wave is not and can't be instantaneous.

Correct.

That aliens, if they do exist, do not use the gravity A wave for their travel.

Wrong, see above. As long as you don't say what "Gravity A" is, the statement is meaningless. E.g., your statement could be loosely interpreted as saying "Aliens use General Relativity effects for travel" (which would include e.g. wormholes), which I would definitely not exclude.

I can only repeat: Without having even the most basic understanding of the modern theory of gravity (i.e. General Relativity), you are very ill equipped to argue about this topic.

Regards
yf

just curious. but i thought any kind of frequency wave was electromagnetic?
can you explain, please? i did some very rudimentary study on physics, so don't get all quarky on me, but i can handle the basics

Originally posted by undo
just curious. but i thought any kind of frequency wave was electromagnetic?
can you explain, please? i did some very rudimentary study on physics, so don't get all quarky on me, but i can handle the basics

No. Electromagnetic waves are waves that consist of coupled oscillating electric and magnetic fields. The majority of waves are just something else osciallating.

Are the waves that wash up on the beach an EM-wave? Is sound an EM-wave?

Originally posted by gfad

Originally posted by undo
just curious. but i thought any kind of frequency wave was electromagnetic?
can you explain, please? i did some very rudimentary study on physics, so don't get all quarky on me, but i can handle the basics

No. Electromagnetic waves are waves that consist of coupled oscillating electric and magnetic fields. The majority of waves are just something else osciallating.

Are the waves that wash up on the beach an EM-wave? Is sound an EM-wave?

i think sound is an em-wave, if i remember correctly.
i thought anything that has frequency, amplitude and all that jazzola and is a wave, is an em-wave?
it even sounds like gravitational waves are em-waves.

you're confusing me. lol

Originally posted by johnlear

Originally posted by Canada_EH
Is it possible to get a wingspan in ft that your husband thinks it was did he see any exhaust or cockpit or did it really black out the sky? For my self I've seen the B-52 a big bomber and it did not black out the sky at even 500/1000 ft. and it passed right over me. colour markings did it have roundels etc?

a sketch would be killer if he could.

[edit on 22/08/06 by Canada_EH]

Canda_EH I am amused at your frantic grasps at the conventional. It was not. It was one of our very advanced anti-grav vehicles, probably several hundred feet long. Anti-grav does not make any noise. No windows would be visible. Any roundels? Ha! Come with us to the 21st century. I love it.

Exhaust? HaHa. A B-52 big? HAHAHA? Keep 'em coming Canada_EH you are hilarious!!!

And you make me sick with your BS and being a stuck up jerk to myself. Never once did Undo previous to my post claim that it used anything of the sort. So your attack at me for asking the question was pointless as all I was trying to do was build some idea of what she is claiming her husband saw. How about you sit back John while I do the work of asking the questions and you contribute BS attack about my character which i have tried not to do to your self. Frankly John this post says alot about the way you treat people here on ATS and maybe why alot of the people who ask questions and think critically hate your off topic banter and inablitiy/unwillingness to say anything more. Good day sir

And now for the oneline comment and pointless happy face

[edit on 22/08/06 by Canada_EH]

Originally posted by johnlear
I doubt if the craft that Undo’s husband saw at Hill AFB was powered by anything as sophisticated as a gravity A wave manipulator.

Probably the craft Undo’s husband saw was powered by essentially the same anti-gravity method that my father helped develop in the mid 50’s. They have had 50 years to develop that type of anti-grav.

Care to expand on what type of anit grav this is and it could be applied to Undo's husband sighting since your so keen on jumping all over my post the least you could do is explain to the good people how this would work.

We wait in awe

Originally posted by undo
i think sound is an em-wave, if i remember correctly.

No, sound is a pressure wave (in air, or other materials). Therefore you don't have sound in a vacuum (e.g. in space).

i thought anything that has frequency, amplitude and all that jazzola and is a wave, is an em-wave?

Everything with "all that jazzola" is a wave, but not necessarily an em (electromagnetic) wave. Some examples for em waves are:
* visible light
* infrared and ultraviolet radiation
* X rays
* microwaves
* radio waves

it even sounds like gravitational waves are em-waves.

No, they aren't. Although they also propagate with the speed of light, they are something entirely different. The best non-mathematical description of gravitational waves is to say that they are ripples in space-time. These ripples can move through space like the water ripples in a pond after you threw a stone into it.

Regards
yf

All of the speculation concerning Undo's husbands observaton, one thing came to my mind. Do modern, large bombers do low level bombing? I've had a B-2 stealth bomber fly over my house at 5-8000 ft. The comment my dad made was "What's so stealthy about that thing?". It's big, black, and LOUD. Of course, I know it's not designed to swoop in low over a runway and drop a load. It drops smart bombs from way up, way far away. If you hear the plane, you are already dead.

So, do large bombers make low level bombing runs?

I suppose if the plane in undo's observation had a defective cloaking device (Romulan or otherwise), that might explain the sighting. It seems to me the military already has a way to hide it's planes using current technology - using bombs that are released far from their target, using altitude and distance to hide the plane.

Originally posted by Redfish
So, do large bombers make low level bombing runs?

- using bombs that are released far from their target, using altitude and distance to hide the plane.

You bring up a good point but I seem to forget if we have gotten a date or time from Undo as to when this happened. With current tech it would be crazy to think that they would use a plane like that in low alt unless it was performing some new role that I'm unaware of (always possible). The B-2 was designed for high alt but ended up flying a couple hundred feet off the deck to penatrate soviet airspace maybe thats another reason as to why it was sighted so low.

well he's sleeping atm (day off) but i can estimate the date.
it was probably around 1993-ish or earlier, no earlier than 1984. i will ask him when he gets up but there's something to discuss anyway.

[edit on 6-4-2007 by undo]