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1+1 is sometimes 3

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posted on Nov, 19 2006 @ 12:30 PM
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A chord is any two notes or pitches played simultaneously.
All chords produce certain sounds which are unique because whenever two notes are played together, a third note or beat is also heard. this third note is not inherent in either note but only as a synergetic consequence of their unity, constructed in the brain.
Two notes played together produce a third, three notes played together produce three other notes from the various combinations of two notes, four notes produces six new tones, five produces eleven, and so on. The notes may not always sound like musical pitches because their frequencies may be below 16 cycles per second, the minimum frequency that sounds like a note to our ears.



This subject is playing with my mind sometimes
in school i learned 1+1=2
But is it always ?
In my experience it is sometimes 3

Are there any people into maths that can confirm this idea ?




posted on Nov, 19 2006 @ 05:42 PM
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I'm not a maths nut, but I do understand that a car is more than an internal combustion engine and wheels.

What I mean is that the sum of the parts is often greater than the whole. Your car engine on its own would equal 5, the wheels on their own equal 5, but the sum of the parts is a car which would equal alot more than 10. I hope this helps and my example isn't too confusing. Numerical concepts can't account for synergy, and that is all you are explaining.

Regarding your example, the two notes acting together produce an effect that could not have been expected by studying either note on its own. They synergise to provide an added effect, in this example the introduction of a third note, which can probably be explained by some 'sound scientist' anyway. Consequently, I dont think it is correct in examing 1+1=2 in relation to the effect of synergy. The former is a relationship between to logically fixed values and the latter is an explantion of the realtionship of two parts when they form a whole.

If I'm wrong then I hope some wiser mind will show me why. Its just the concept of synergy means alot to me in relation to my current research and I saw this as a perfect oppurtunity to explain it in a way that debunks the refutation of a logically standard law.

[edit on 19/11/06 by byhiniur]



posted on Nov, 19 2006 @ 07:54 PM
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It's actually just overlapping waves that do that.
Say you've got a wave cycling at 60hz (producing a click), and another cycling on the same ear at the same 60hz but offset by half a wave cycle.
The waves acting together would be heard as 120hz.

(The reason I say click, is because if I were to emit a 60hz sign wave, and a perfectly inverted version of that sign wave at the same target at the same amplitude, you wouldnt hear anything at all.)

A similar thing occurs if you play a click once every .5 seconds next to a click every .2 seconds. On every second cycle of the .5 second click, both clicks would hit at the same time, giving the impression that you are also recieving a third click every second.

Here's an analogy.
If I were to shine a blue light at a wall every 2 seconds, and a yellow one every 5 seconds at the same target. Every 10 seconds, you will see a green light on the wall.
This would give the impression of seeing blue, blue, yellow, blue, blue, green, repeatedly.

[edit on 19-11-2006 by johnsky]



posted on Nov, 19 2006 @ 08:13 PM
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There are many examples of synergy floating around. Synergy is when 1 + 1 = more than 2.

You can take a Valium and it will slightly depress you. No big deal. You can drink a vodka martini and get an alcohol buzz. No big deal.

You can take a Valium and Drink a Martini and there is a very real chance your going to meet God. 1 + 1 exceeded your wildest expectations.

I found this quote on Google:


An effect of the interaction of the actions of two agents such that the result of the combined action is greater than expected as a simple additive combination of the two agents acting separately.
Link



posted on Nov, 19 2006 @ 09:03 PM
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I'm no maths nut either,

But isn't one chord that's different from another chord not the same? In the equation 1 + 1 = 2, both the ones are identical, whereas 2 is the sum of both 1's. Two identical chords played together would give a sound twice as loud as just one hence 1 + 1 = 2.

Therefore for 1 + 1 = 2 to be correct both the chords (1's) would have to be identical perhaps.

But I get where you are coming from. There can be 1 of something which are different. Eg when you have 1 apple and 1 banana, you have 2 pieces of fruit. When combined however you are on your way to get a fruit salad.

But I know if you have 1 man and 1 woman sometimes that can equal 3 in good time
.

Take care and peace,
- Naz

PS - I hope I haven't confused anyone else cause I confused myself!



posted on Nov, 20 2006 @ 12:25 AM
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Originally posted by jaamaan


All chords produce certain sounds which are unique because whenever two notes are played together, a third note or beat is also heard....

Two notes played together produce a third, three notes played together produce three other notes...

Could you provide a link to your external source?

Playing two notes together do not produce a third note. The sound of two notes sounding together produces a harmony or a discord, both of which are emphatically the sound of two notes played simultaneously and not that of a theoretical 'third note' created by wave superposition. You don't need to be a mathematician or an expert on music to know this -- your own ears will make it quite clear.

Our ears -- or rather, our brains -- are very good at teasing apart and identifying a number of sounds heard simultaneously. How they do this is still a mystery to science, but the theory put forward by your external source is plain wrong.



posted on Nov, 20 2006 @ 05:46 AM
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If you look up "beats" in a physics book or online, it should explain what you are talking about. Basically, the brain gets tricked into hearing frequencies that aren't there. For example, if a 60 Hz and 70 Hz sound wave reach your ear, you hear those normally, but you also hear a 10 Hz sound (the difference between the two) even though there is not such a sound wave present.



posted on Nov, 20 2006 @ 08:45 AM
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Here is the source link

www.miqel.com...



posted on Nov, 20 2006 @ 10:04 AM
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Originally posted by DragonsDemesne
If you look up "beats" in a physics book or online, it should explain what you are talking about. Basically, the brain gets tricked into hearing frequencies that aren't there. For example, if a 60 Hz and 70 Hz sound wave reach your ear, you hear those normally, but you also hear a 10 Hz sound (the difference between the two) even though there is not such a sound wave present.



It seems to me that this is all "relative" then and how we perceive or sense things. But if we still "hear" the frequencies "that aren't there" why say they don't exist?



posted on Nov, 21 2006 @ 11:51 AM
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In radio mixing signals of two different frequencies is essential.

Really, 1+1=4. When you combine two signals you get the two original signals in addition you get the sum and also the difference of the two.

Here is an example from one of my old HAM radio books:

29,200kHz + 28,745kHz

=

57,945kHz
29,200kHz
28,745kHz
455kHz




[edit on 21-11-2006 by angryScientist]



posted on Nov, 21 2006 @ 01:14 PM
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Nice to know

i knew 1+1=2

and 1+1= sometimes 3

but never knew 1+1=4



posted on Nov, 21 2006 @ 06:49 PM
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Originally posted by angryScientist
In radio mixing signals of two different frequencies is essential.

Really, 1+1=4. When you combine two signals you get the two original signals in addition you get the sum and also the difference of the two.

Here is an example from one of my old HAM radio books:

29,200kHz + 28,745kHz

=

57,945kHz
29,200kHz
28,745kHz
455kHz


I've forgotten the name of this phenomenon, but this is 100% correct. The 57945 and 455 khz signals will be smaller amplitudes than the original signals. The 57945 and 455 can then mix with each other or the two original signals and make even more signals in the same way, and those will be even smaller than the 57945/455 ones. This keeps going on, but each time the signal gets smaller and smaller, and quite quickly is too small to be of importance in almost any application. Usually only the first set or two really matters.



posted on Nov, 21 2006 @ 07:05 PM
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Originally posted by DragonsDemesne
I've forgotten the name of this phenomenon, but this is 100% correct. The 57945 and 455 khz signals will be smaller amplitudes than the original signals. The 57945 and 455 can then mix with each other or the two original signals and make even more signals in the same way, and those will be even smaller than the 57945/455 ones. This keeps going on, but each time the signal gets smaller and smaller, and quite quickly is too small to be of importance in almost any application. Usually only the first set or two really matters.


Is this really a case of 1+1=4 or mankinds inability to understand the true nature of radi waves, therefore making this a prime case of synergy in action?



posted on Nov, 21 2006 @ 08:03 PM
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It's neither. The waves are sinusoids, and it can be rather easily mathematically shown that combining two sinusoids can result in this behaviour. You can detect these 'extra' waves produced, and engineering your way around them can be a challenge in some communications applications.

This principle can also be used beneficially, in the case of the Superheterodyne receiver used in all modern radios today. And, incidentally, if you want to read about an inventor who got screwed in the arse almost as hard as Tesla did, look up Edwin Armstrong, the inventor of this receiver, amongst many other inventions.



posted on Nov, 21 2006 @ 09:21 PM
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I believe the term you are looking of is harmonics.

en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Nov, 22 2006 @ 02:05 AM
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Originally posted by angryScientist
I believe the term you are looking of is harmonics.

en.wikipedia.org...


Yes, that's it! Even when you said it, I wasn't sure, so I dug out some books and checked, and they are indeed called 'harmonics', or sometimes also 'spurs'. In AngryScientist's example, he listed the 'second harmonics' of 57945 and 455. These will be stronger than the third harmonics, and those stronger than fourth, etc etc.



posted on Nov, 22 2006 @ 02:39 AM
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Originally posted by jaamaan


A chord is any two notes or pitches played simultaneously.
All chords produce certain sounds which are unique because whenever two notes are played together, a third note or beat is also heard. this third note is not inherent in either note but only as a synergetic consequence of their unity, constructed in the brain.
Two notes played together produce a third, three notes played together produce three other notes from the various combinations of two notes, four notes produces six new tones, five produces eleven, and so on. The notes may not always sound like musical pitches because their frequencies may be below 16 cycles per second, the minimum frequency that sounds like a note to our ears.



This subject is playing with my mind sometimes
in school i learned 1+1=2
But is it always ?
In my experience it is sometimes 3

Are there any people into maths that can confirm this idea ?


I'll try in a number of ways (no pun intended).. lol

When there are TWO........ there is the equation of the difference of the two, which creates a third possibility... (which would create more, ... u get the idea)...

So with two apples..... one perfect apple with worm holes, and one imperfect apple that has a diseased peel, or is small or malformed..
You would then as an observer deduce that apples vary, but your ideal apple would be one that is perfect with no worm holes that is not diseased or malformed..
in other words.. you would reduce it to the self-serving or percievably positive reality... So when there are any two things that are 'different' there will always be the most positive equation/formulation to go along with it.
Which is funny because Jesus said, whenever two come together in my name there I will be with them... humorous to me atleast.

now in another silly way of looking at it..

a three (3) is two 1's (ones) half curved in on itself connected together, (one at the 1's beginning connected to the end of the other ones end) sorry thats hard to understand..

so... in the above three (3) example.. TWO (ones) make a three..
or look at my other example.. lol
I dunno which I like better either..



posted on Nov, 22 2006 @ 01:02 PM
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Thanks for all your enlighting examples

this turn around my world completly



posted on Nov, 24 2006 @ 03:34 AM
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The Garden of Eden
The Wilderness forsaken:


Two lovers entwined together
Ringed around by the serpentine hedge
The fire within and the cold without
All three upon a precipitous ledge....

And three are one...
and the one are three...
and all of them are both you and me!!


Something to do with what PuRe said....

Oroborus!



posted on Nov, 24 2006 @ 08:15 AM
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Originally posted by jaamaan


a third note or beat is also heard. this third note is not inherent in either note but only as a synergetic consequence of their unity, constructed in the brain.



Hi, this bit of info is incorrect, the 'third note' is present naturally and not as a consequence of brain reconstruction.

It says nothing about the addition of positive integers in arithmetic unfortunately, so it can't be used to prove 1+1=3




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