As much as i'm against the system and fascism, i do have to say that it is a public place, and they can do it. On the other hand though, this could very well lead to things that are much worse (1984 situation). I could understand how you would be mad if you owned the entire city and it was your private property, but the truth of the matter is that it's the government's or "public". The only difference between a cop standing on a corner and a camera is that the camera will have a perfect memory of what it saw versus the cop who will have a slightly distorted one.

Originally posted by Mcphisto

......;All this talk of 'rights' and 'invasion of privacy' you want to keep, just forget it dude! Your a target of some really nasty people now and they are really pissed. If your not up to no good, why worry about the cameras? In fact by having these cameras you can worry a little less. As for the 5th amendment, them laws were made up for the cowboys days. These bastards I am talking about dont care for the rules!

I think it's funny when people talk about "terrorists". They don't even realize who the real terrorists are. It's kinda funny how America had one "attack" five years ago, and not a peep since. It bewilders me how nobody thinks that if there really were terrorists that wanted to destroy our countries, they would have done it by now.

Ever notice how there hasn't been a terrorist attack on any chemical or petroleum plants? That's because the real terrorists would lose money if they had to blow up their own money makers. The WTC didn't cost them anything, in fact it made a lot of people money. The people who put in the put options, the owners of the buildings (from insurance), all of the home security people, the company that's going to build the "freedom" tower, etc. If you really want to stop the terrorists, stop making them rich, refuse to do things their way, and tell them what we want.

I read somewhere that the UK has something like 23% of the worlds CCTV cameras.

People using the Oyster card can be followed around the capitol, your credit cards show where you been and what you bought and when.
The congestion cameras can identify your car and whether you paid the charge or not. They can follw you into the city and back out.

Now they want ID cards. Government databases are not secure. There will always be a greedy or week person to do as you want. The DVLA were once notorious for licence cleaning. It has been accepted that high profile / vip records will not be kept on the database incase of security breach....hat tells me something.

This is enough but there is more. No wonder people are paranoid...conspiracies in every corner.

Still I don't get depressed about it. I just tell myself that it is for my own good. Its there to protect my freedom

I honestly thought that USA already had cameras installed in the cities. I'm so used to seeing them over here in Britain that I thought it was just the norm for UK and USA.

It is a bit weird walking down the street and thinking that you are always being watched by cameras, but it does help catch criminals.

I have been totally unfazed by cameras in the streets in Towns-yes towns not cities like the USA over the last 12 years and it's the norm. I have forgetton the fact about certain rights, I have been brainwashed and children who are 12 will no no different. What is the debate about like you should be amazed? Is the rest of the world not like that? I guess I have been living in this environment too long it seems like the Trueman Show you are born with cameras around you.

I live in the UK or YUCK place where they have cameras up your ---- too but what can we do? Get used to it.

Originally posted by The time lord
...too but what can we do? Get used to it.

There is plenty you can do, don't be so defeatist, get active! This is why things don't change for the better and we just except more intrusions into our lives, do nothing and 'get used to it'... Like the frog in the boiling water...

Originally posted by The time lord

I live in the UK or YUCK place where they have cameras up your ---- too but what can we do? Get used to it.

Get used to it is what they want you to do. They want you to just accept the fact that they rule over you, but that's not true. When you think about the people in power these days, it's usually the people with money also. They are powerful because of their money. Without their money they have no power, without us working for them and buying their products they have no money, so without us their is no power. We hold the power, but they don't want you to start thinking like that again, after all that might cause people to start another free country like the US originally was. We almost destroyed their plans, but now we are letting them right back where they want to be.

In America, there is no written law that says that you have to pay income tax, but will they take your things away and bring you to a court where they own the judges, yes sir. Money isn't even worth anything, they print it from out of thin air, don't you think that if there really was gold backing up the money (which was created to be a receipt for gold, you used to be able to exchange your money for gold) then why can't I go and trade it in for that gold? They have us so brainwashed and willing to give up everything because we are "powerless".

We might have to go through some hard times in the future, but things will be better. People are starting to realize what the "leaders" are up to and will no longer be a part of it. We don't need them or their money, we were fine before they came along, and we will be fine again after their demise. It's only a matter of time now.

Take care, and remember that fear enslaves and love liberates.

Originally posted by The time lord
I have been totally unfazed by cameras in the streets in Towns-yes towns not cities like the USA over the last 12 years and it's the norm. I have forgetton the fact about certain rights, I have been brainwashed and children who are 12 will no no different. What is the debate about like you should be amazed? Is the rest of the world not like that? I guess I have been living in this environment too long it seems like the Trueman Show you are born with cameras around you.

I live in the UK or YUCK place where they have cameras up your ---- too but what can we do? Get used to it.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you encouraging people to be apathetic? Apethy is our worst enemy, next to ingnorance, of course.

Nobody cares any more because they've got their MTV and Survivor. I pray on a daily basis that everyone wakes up sooner than later. It doesn't affect just me, or America, but the world as a whole.

I believe I read awhile back that Manhatten alone has over 2,000 street level cameras* Gives literal meaning to the "eye" on the pyramid

Originally posted by Spores From Space
I believe I read awhile back that Manhatten alone has over 2,000 street level cameras* Gives literal meaning to the "eye" on the pyramid

I don't believe there are any government-installed cameras (except around gov't buildings), but there are so many private security cameras, the city is pretty well surveiled. The police have no problem getting copies of the tapes if they think they recorded a crime.

Chicago has had cameras in the high crime areas for quite a while now. They are one of the, if not the first large city to implement this. There is a mixed view on it here in Chicago. They had Mayor Daley on TV doing his dog and pony show on all the local news stations, smiling and saying how great it is and how it will help fight crime. I seem to recall that they were bragging about how high tech it was and that other cities are coming here to learn from us. Luckily, I live outside the city, but I visit friends and family often and have seen the cameras.

Originally posted by stumason

Why do you think that any of that needs to stop? I won't elaborate, but you'd be surprised what I do when walking down the street sometimes.... You do know that most CCTV camears are unmonitored, don't you? They only retrieve images if a crime is commited. If they are monitored, then why care anyway? Someone can easily just sit there in the street and watch you grab your partners boobs as easily as if they were sat in front of a camera!

Jeebus...You yanks are a paranoid lot.

Like I said earlier, you'd only complain if there were no cameras at all. Just how many robberies and violent crimes would be solved without any images of the perpertrator?

How many crimes wont be caught on camera, but some shmo is in the wrong place at the wrong time. you then have some creep prosecutor moving up the polical ladder solves the crime by nailing the innocent shmo for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Its the reason we shouldnt be allowing this, it will lead to the sytem abusing its powers.

I would rather not have my "public privacy" invaded. I certainly dont do nything wrong, but I know a corrupt system of governemnt when I see one.

Where did all of you "bootlickers" come from?

Surveillance cameras are preventing crime. OK.
Surveillance cameras are helping to catch traffic violators. OK.

But, when something fishy happens they are broken, pointed in the wrong direction, the tapes are lost or too grainy or they just became a matter of national security.

So again, why are they being installed ?

[edit on 21-11-2006 by yanchek]

Putting cameras everywhere, even if it appears to reduce crime, is not the answer to preventing crime. It's a band aid, bailing out the basement while there's holes in the roof.

We need to get to the root cause of crime, which is imo arguably and not in all cases, poverty, dissatisfaction, and dare I say it an unfair biased system. That's my opinion, so I won't go of topic to explain.

We'd be better off putting public cameras in places like say, the white house, the pentagoon, corporate boardrooms etc... Then we'd get to see where they plan the real crimes against humanity.

And in the end, no man will be able to buy or sell without the mark of the beast.

You can run, but you won't be able to hide.

I don't get the part where cameras are supposedly robbing you of your anonymity. How is that? Anonymity means I don't know who you are, not what you look like. Not knowing what you look like is what Michael Jackson does with his children when he takes them out in public - he puts disguises on their faces.