This is why the Iraqis hate us.

Link here with video

It just gets sicker everyday. First the inmates now little kids? Come on now.

you mean it's not because we came as an 'occupation force' under the guise of a 'liberator' ??

here's an interesting, but lengthly, paper (it might hit antiwar or other sites soon)

www.opednews.com...
the essay talks of a 'Iraqi praetorian guard satrap Army
ready to take over security operations supported by US air power
with a smaller US ground force redeploying to hunkered down positions
inside their protected super-bases...'

there are +106 small and large 'forts' built all over Iraqi territory,
which the imperial forces of the US are not about to relinquish to Iraq
anytime soon !

later in the nighttime i'll click the video link you provided, thanks

Originally posted by Everythingyouknowisalie
Link here with video

It just gets sicker everyday. First the inmates now little kids? Come on now.

Hate who? the west? Those are british soldiers that are beating those young Iraqis. You can also hear the british accent from the cameraman. Honestly we dont know [snip]. Those kids could be insurgents (wouldnt suprise me) and those soldiers know it.

Mod Note: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 20-11-2006 by sanctum]

on a side note.. The guy with the camera sounds satanic. Why are they hitting them? They obviously have them in there custody.

Originally posted by semperfoo


Hate who? the west? Those are british soldiers that are beating those young Iraqis. You can also hear the british accent from the cameraman. Honestly we dont know [snip]. Those kids could be insurgents (wouldnt suprise me) and those soldiers know it.

I know, now that you have told them those were british soldiers this thread will be quietly swept under the rug since it does not further america bashing.

At least do your homework before you link this with abu ghraib or any of that crap.

I am not a hypocrite. I know this is WAR...its not [snip] monopoly!
Those soldiers were protecting an instalation. I am not going to sit here and condemn them be they british, american, or otherwise.

I find it sickening that people get up in arms about a beating, yet practically cheer while watching videos of soldiers of their own country get shot at! . (refer to other threads)

This is how I view this, and this is just my opinion so dont have a hissy anti-war people.

The arabs, more specifically the muslims, have declared "holy war" against ALL of the west! They have stated it, they have done it. They blew up the world trade centers on 9/11. They ble up bombs in london on 7/7 and are STILL plotting more attacks in the UK.

It's the other side, not us, who have decided there will be no negotiation.

I just hope they enjoy being conquered....

and good work brits!

bet them kids wont screw with your stuff anymore, huh?


Mod Note: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 20-11-2006 by sanctum]

I agree Xphiles. At the beginning of the video you can clearly see the young Iraqis throwing rocks at the british soldiers. Those kids shouldnt be there in the first place! Why should we bow down and play the lesser hand? Like xphiles said they have declared a holy war on western civilization. Its time to wake up! They will kill as many of you as they can! If thats not a wakeup call then i dont know what is.

Originally posted by semperfoo
I agree Xphiles. At the beginning of the video you can clearly see the young Iraqis throwing rocks at the british soldiers. Those kids shouldnt be there in the first place! Why should we bow down and play the lesser hand? Like xphiles said they have declared a holy war on western civilization. Its time to wake up! They will kill as many of you as they can! If thats not a wakeup call then i dont know what is.

thanks semper, I appreciate it.

Some of the average citizens of the west need to wake up and see whats happening and stop just shooing it off as "oh thats just propaganda, they dont really want to kill us". yes, they do! or at the very least subjugate the west to Islamic idealogy.

We are in a war! they have declared it and it's time to face facts before it's too late. Europe already has an EXTREME islamic problem. What happened europe? since when do you not fight for your own values and traditions?

Europe is a front in this war between the east and the west. There is going to come a time where the average european citizen is going to be a freedom fighter and will have to fight on their own streets. For God's sake! dont let it come to that! FIGHT! fight for the land that is YOURS and fight for your traditions! Stop giving the muslims special treatment! IT IS YOUR COUNTRY, they are the ones that need to adapt!

SEND THEM SOBS PACKING! you've done it before, do it again!

That's just one of countless reasons. So we all can agree that the Iraqis hate the occupying party. If another country invaded Chicago, I'd be pretty pissed off too. The question is, What can we do about it?

Here are some very sobbering lists of murdered, kidnapped, and threatened academics that would be another good reason too:

www.brusselstribunal.org...

Usually stuff like this dosent really get to me. But wow, hearing the psychopath behind the camera sent chills up my spine.
So these are the people we are letting into the army nowadays? Which raises another question, how violent are these people coming out?

I had to watch the video twice because the first time I simply could not believe it.


No, we don't know everything about that, or any situation. We never will. Snippets like this get the blood boiling on both sides, without providing any evidence one way or the other.


Nevertheless.. There is a huge friggin difference between 'defending an installation' (rocks verses a wall!?! wtf threat were those kids posing, exactly???) and pummeling children, kicking them in the nads...

Grown men (armed!) should never (repeat, NEVER) be allowed to beat children like that. It's frowned upon in society when an adult does that to a child -- why is it suddenly almost-excusable when it's under the guise of war?

Are morals thrown aside when guns are picked up? seriously..


War or not -- beating anyone senseless is not going to instill anything but hatred.. How is this solving anything?

If they want to declare war on the West -- then let them come over here, let them bring their armies to our coasts.
Otherwise, I say leave them the [snip] alone. Words are meaningless without action. (and for the record, no, I'm not sold that they planned 9/11 and the like. I do not know all the information, thus I refuse to make a solid conclusion.)

Mod Note: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 20-11-2006 by sanctum]

I don't see what is wrong with the video.

Had these been police officers in a western country I would be appalled. In a war zone? .. Wow. Yall need to get a grip on reality. I want to see you guys go out there gun in hand and be mr. nice guy, hand flowers and candy to people trying to stone or shoot at you instead of shoot back. Your fantasy world where everyone should be nice and lovey dovy is completely opposite of reality.

Yet .. funny enough I have never heard a single one of you say how YOU would (or that is your "people" - "liberals") handle this war or .. actually ANY war, because regardless of the reason and who sent the troops this stuff is a NORM.

Also, this movie is incredibly OLD, it was out last year and went it was distributed by the BBC the back ground voice wasn't there that I remember.

My words might seem sarcastic, but I am not intending to start anything. I mean my comments/questions with the utmost sincerity.
I admit that I know nothing of war, and frankly do not understand the morals underlying it.. if there are any. Maybe that is why I do not understand so much about why people feel the way they do..

Originally posted by Rockpuck
I don't see what is wrong with the video.

Had these been police officers in a western country I would be appalled. In a war zone? .. Wow.

Please.. enlighten me: what is the difference, exactly? Aren't these soldiers trying to police the area?

Why is there a line drawn?

Yall need to get a grip on reality. I want to see you guys go out there gun in hand and be mr. nice guy, hand flowers and candy to people trying to stone or shoot at you instead of shoot back.

Your fantasy world where everyone should be nice and lovey dovy is completely opposite of reality.

Flowers and candy? Okay, maybe not quite...

Defending oneself is one thing. I understand that.
Dragging children back to the compound to beat the crap out of them -- I do not understand that.

Using those bean-bag guns to scare them away and make them think twice about coming back.. I understand that.
Using fear and physical punishment as a tactic to instill fear in the rest? no.. I'm sorry, but I don't see that happening.

I understand that there's always conflict in the world. So far, 'tis what humans do - conflict with each other.
I do not think that every human could be lovey-dovey with each other, but what about the basic rights of civility and respect to/from every human?

Do we know why those kids were throwing stones?

Yet .. funny enough I have never heard a single one of you say how YOU would (or that is your "people" - "liberals") handle this war or .. actually ANY war, because regardless of the reason and who sent the troops this stuff is a NORM.

Personally, I refuse all categories. I do not know if others consider me a liberal - frankly, I don't care. I am a tyro at philosophy, and above all else, a human being. My interests lie in the social aspects of the human race, and figuring out how to best achieve the, I think, fundamental principles of humanity.

If I were given the power, this is what I'd do.

1) I'd pull everyone out. To me, this war is simply another Vietnam -- we're not going to win. I did not understand when we started, so I'd simply end it.

I understand war as a last option: the least preferable, and the most destructive.

2) I'd begin working towards an educated population with values based on respect, civility, critical thinking, logic and reason. In fact, I'd start with Gandhi's 'Seven Deadly Sins', followed by a heavy dose of Confucius' Analects.

Beyond that, I don't know. But, it'd be a start towards a true democracy with an emphasis on human rights and responsibilities.

(This is, of course, with the explicit understanding that profit is completely important -- which I understand to be one of the modern key reasons that, if not effects of, going to war, and in general being immoral human beings.)

[edit on 20-11-2006 by Diseria]

Originally posted by Diseria

Originally posted by Rockpuck
I don't see what is wrong with the video.

Had these been police officers in a western country I would be appalled. In a war zone? .. Wow.

Please.. enlighten me: what is the difference, exactly?

[edit on 20-11-2006 by Diseria]

umm..because they usually shoot these people? how is beating someone worse than killing them?

I'd love to see similar treatment doled out to the rightwing fanatics who support this kind of thing. In fact I hope to do some of it myself.

for those who say all arabs, or all muslims, have declared "holy war" on teh west, i would just like to say that i am deeply offended, and sad that there is so much misinformation and much ill-education in great countries such as the US. to make corrections, those who blew up your WTC, and those who did the bombings in London, where one of a few things, either fanatics which only represent a small portion of maybe 1%-5%, which is the same as in the west, or they are bussinessmen like Bin laden, he's a bussinessman, he gets payed to do those things, by either rival governments or powerful shadowy groups, or they were your own governments trying to fool you. i would like to add i am not a muslim, however i am a jordanian, and i am once again deeply offended. iraqis don't the American Occupation because they are simply put, foreign, it's just like if i put Russian troops in the New York, and tell them to patrol every street all day long. however if you look those militias that keep making bombings, do not represent the majority of iraq, and are all making profits some way or another, or are simply fanatics... so please do not go further insulting my race, my culture, or my country, or the muslims.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
I don't see what is wrong with the video.

Had these been police officers in a western country I would be appalled. In a war zone? .. Wow. Yall need to get a grip on reality. I want to see you guys go out there gun in hand and be mr. nice guy, hand flowers and candy to people trying to stone or shoot at you instead of shoot back.

Your fantasy world where everyone should be nice and lovey dovy is completely opposite of reality.

Yet .. funny enough I have never heard a single one of you say how YOU would (or that is your "people" - "liberals") handle this war or .. actually ANY war, because regardless of the reason and who sent the troops this stuff is a NORM.

Also, this movie is incredibly OLD, it was out last year and went it was distributed by the BBC the back ground voice wasn't there that I remember.

This is a war zone. What would half the ppl on this board do if they were in the same position? They dont know! Because they dont have to deal with it... When your there you really are some what paranoid because the enemy is hiding everywhere. Those kids should not be there. Thats a military installation. Most civilians here in the states are not allowed near military installations. Let alone a bunch of snot nosed kids who are throwing rocks at soldiers in a country that is a war zone.

One person said "let them come over here"! Has this person forgotten that they have come over here? And when they did they took the lives of over 3000 innocent ppl?!

We take the fight to them. Not the other way around. We all 'should' know just how that turns out.

[edit on 093030p://111 by semperfoo]

guess my Dutch friends were right when they said Americans were uneducated and badly misguided by politicians like President Bush, etc. but hey Americans are still good people i have to say that, i've been living in the US for 3 years now, and they are good people, except for the occasional stereotyping about Middle easterners every once in a while but whatever....

Originally posted by INc2006
for those who say all arabs, or all muslims, have declared "holy war" on teh west, i would just like to say that i am deeply offended, and sad that there is so much misinformation and much ill-education in great countries such as the US. to make corrections, those who blew up your WTC, and those who did the bombings in London, where one of a few things, either fanatics which only represent a small portion of maybe 1%-5%, which is the same as in the west, or they are bussinessmen like Bin laden, he's a bussinessman, he gets payed to do those things, by either rival governments or powerful shadowy groups, or they were your own governments trying to fool you. i would like to add i am not a muslim, however i am a jordanian, and i am once again deeply offended. iraqis don't the American Occupation because they are simply put, foreign, it's just like if i put Russian troops in the New York, and tell them to patrol every street all day long. however if you look those militias that keep making bombings, do not represent the majority of iraq, and are all making profits some way or another, or are simply fanatics... so please do not go further insulting my race, my culture, or my country, or the muslims.

The problem is (and its not all muslims) where was the muslim community in mass protest against 9/11 and the perpitrators responsible? Was it in the streets of pakistan where many muslims were seen jumping up and down, hooting and hollering in the streets, and shooting AK's in the air in celebration, Saying Allah is good??

Where were they in mass protest against 7/7? How about the spain train bombings? And sadly it goes on and on with these animals.

But draw a cartoon depicting muhammed and what do you get? Muslims burning down churches killing innocent ppl that had nothing to do with the cartoon drawings, and the list goes on..... This is what the world wide community sees. We dont see muslims wanting peace. Just more excuses to kill innocent ppl who dont fall under there religious guidelines as witnessed by the cartoon debacle.

One person said "let them come over here"! Has this person forgotten that they have come over here? And when they did they took the lives of over 3000 innocent ppl?!

Really? They did?
Name one Iraqi among the 911 suicide attackers... go ahead, I'm waiting...

Iraq had nothing to do with 911 - even the President admits that.