Rumsfeld to be tried for war crimes in Germany!!!

Originally posted by Vitchilo
Do you? I do. I know a lot of people who would. Just an example, I think Alex Jones and all his fans would fight for and die for, when some groups starts fighting, I'm guessing a lot more people will understand what's going on and join the fight. I'm also guessing that a good part here on ATS would also and a lot of George Noory public too.

(or i'm a dreamer)

- I wish you weren't, but I think the reality is slightly less hopefull. I know a lot of people that are ready to do it - as long as it doesn't scarfice their living standard, or effect them, or inconvience them. I really hope I am wrong(First, I hope we never have to find out, but failing that - I hope I am wrong) but I just don't see it. Even in this last election what was the actual turnout just to vote? How much less will it be when standing up means potentially getting arrestted, losing your job, or even getting killed?

Originally posted by Vitchilo

In Illinois today, the feds took guns from people forcefully... just wait till it happen on a large scale what will happen to those traitors in the white house...

[edit on 15-11-2006 by Vitchilo]

- Really? I didn't hear about those guns? What happened there? Did the people stand up and fight back for their rights, or did they stand down and accept "the man" taking them away?

I realize this is off topic. Bush and Cheney both refused to be questioned under oath....as did Former President Bill Clinton and Vice President Gore.

The REAL issue is that Bush refused to be questioned UNLESS Cheney was present.

Former U.S. Army Brigadier General Janis Karpinski, who ran the Abu Ghraib prison at the time photographs depicting the abuse of prisoners were widely published and was blamed for it, said she was ready to testify against her former boss Rumsfeld.

news.yahoo.com...

What a scumbag.

I remember this sack of dung after the incident and, frankly, I've never seen such a spineless twerp in all my days.

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott

I remember this sack of dung after the incident and, frankly, I've never seen such a spineless twerp in all my days.

I couldn't have said it better. He looked as hollow as his defense strategy.

AAC

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott

What a scumbag.

I remember this sack of dung after the incident and, frankly, I've never seen such a spineless twerp in all my days.

Glad to see you're as dedicated as ever to the personal insult and non-sequitur.

Please explain why someone who was scapegoated by her superiors and who is prepared to testify to the handwritten note she saw that Rumsfeld had written authorising torture is a "spineless twerp". If she's prepared to do that, she not only has a spine, she has a brain, too! Perhaps it's her having a mind of her own that really gets your goat.

Here's someone whose idea of patriotism might cause you some cognitive dissonance:

In November of 2002, I was asked to present the commencement speech at the graduating class of Military Intelligence Officers at Ft. Huachuca, Arizona. It was a very difficult decision for me to accept this invitation; the storm clouds of war were definitely on the horizon. I had seen what I believed to be tainted intelligence in the media used to garner support for a war in Iraq. I wanted to do or say nothing that might in any way be seen as support for the coming conflict – those who promoted it, or those who would fight it – an almost impossible feat to accomplish in a military environment.

When the day arrived and I was introduced to those in attendance, which included high-ranking officers of the post, graduates, instructors, parents and guests, I began my presentation by asking how many in attendance remembered their oath of enlistment.

Everyone raised a hand indicating they did. I then asked how many could repeat that oath; a significantly smaller number raised their hand. I then read the Oath of Enlistment each soldier takes on entry into the various military branches. I emphasized the following was listed first in the oath and was therefore intended to be the most important:

"I, _____ , having been appointed an officer in the Army of the United States, as indicated above in the grade of _____ do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign or domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; …

I reminded them it was their duty to fully understand the meaning of the words and phrases: support, defend, and true faith and allegiance in the context of that oath. I told them that anytime they received orders, no matter the origin of those orders, when such orders were in conflict with their oath, they were honor bound to refuse to carry out those orders. I told them their first allegiance was to the Constitution and not to any politician who became their superior simply because they had tricked a majority of the people into voting for them. By this time the higher-ranking officers on the front row were beginning to squirm in their seats.

I spoke of domestic enemies and how much more insidious they are than those we call "foreign." I explained that when one is ordered by any superior to do that which is a violation of their oath, the entity issuing the illegal order becomes the domestic enemy mentioned in their oath.

I spoke to those gathered of my ignorance of my obligation to that oath during my military tenure, and the obvious offenses I felt I had committed and the unlawful orders I had obeyed. I stated I did not want them to make the same mistakes I had made. When I finished my presentation, the ranking officers on the front row made a hasty departure, but other instructors and soldiers stayed and presented their perfunctory appreciation.

I’m sure many of the young officers in attendance that day did not fully understand the presentation; most were in a hurry to check out, and get started on their leave before their next assignment.

Several days later, my son came to visit and was obviously in a state of anger. He related he had just returned from the Tucson, Arizona office of the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) where he was interviewed for his Top Secret Clearance. During his interview the agent conducting his background check informed him that I was both a subversive and a racist; subversive because I had written articles critical of the government and racist because I was a member of the Sons of Confederate Veterans. At least they had it half right; I had written, and continue to write, articles that are critical of the government, but I have never been a member of the SCV. I qualify for membership in that organization because several of my relatives fought for the Confederacy, but I have never applied for membership.

In other words, because he had suggested that graduates of the military academy took their oath to uphold the Constitution seriously, the government was prepared to slander him.

Rich, not really sure if I'm correct, but I believe that grady was referencing Rumsfield as a sack of dung... not the soldier... Though grady could best settle this...

AAC

What kind of crap do you think this is going to stir up between the U.S. and German governments if he is tried and convicted?

And, my personal opinion..Germany needs to get the hell out of it. I know what you people are going to say "well the United States gets in everybody elses business" blah blah blah..yeah yeah..keep it to yourself. It's old. Germany has no right to be stepping in doing something about this. I hate Rumsfeld and all those morons as much as the next guy, but this is our problem, stay out of it.

Also, on the United States gets in everyone's business issue..I'd say we're entitled to do so. Who does the world turn to for aid? Who does the world look at when things go wrong? Who do nations turn to when they're attacked? Who supports the world's economy?

If you have a problem with the United States running #..imagine if we weren't here. The world would be run by the Soviet Union. Communism would rule the world. Dictatorship. You say the United States is a threat to world peace..but there has to be world peace for it to be threatened. You think the Soviets would be better suited to bring about world peace? HAHAHA! Sure..

Sorry for going a little off topic there..but I knew and I'm sure it still will be mentioned that the United States gets involved in everybody else's business. We have the right to do so as long as everybody depends on us for things to run smoothly, and, the way things are now, this is smooth compared to what a Soviet run world would be like. You can't have it both ways..you either support yourself..or you give us the right to be involved.

That's all from me. Bottom line..Germany..get the hell out of it.

Dickbinbush.


A few things...

I believe the rest of the world does believe we are a dictatorship.

And also, I don't believe they think we are doing a good job running the world.

I think you are still living in the early eighties with this reply when US image was favorable. Our respect has been lost for obvious reasons.

It will be better again one day I pray.

AAC

I understand that the rest of the world has lost respect for us. I understand, and even agree, that our image is bad. I believe our government is corrupt. I believe our government does things and attacks people for their own interests. But, my whole basic point was, things are smooth compared to what they would be if we weren't here. That doesn't mean it's smooth, just better than it would be if the Soviets were still around.

When we attack other countries for no reason, or for purposes such as oil, then they have a right to complain. But if it's for a justified reason, then they need to just sit down and shut the hell up because they'd do the same thing. As far as getting involved in politics and economics of other countries, I believe we have every right to do that. Every country, I'm sure, has asked us for something at one point or another, or we've vowed to defend them, which, as far as I'm concerned, justifies us being involved. You have to give something to get something.

But, yeah, I hope our image get's restored. It won't, but we can still hope. We could do a better job running things than we are, but other countries need to understand how the world works and realize this is how it is and this is what it will be for a very long time to come. If they don't want us involved, then they need to defend themselves and support themselves in times of need. Simple as that.

[edit on 11/16/2006 by DickBinBush]

DickBush, Rumsfeld and his partners all belong in jail next to Saddam. And this is never going to happen in the USA becuz they live above the law. They can do whatever the F* they want and get away with it (as seen on 911). At least Germany knows who the evil ones are. Really they are screwing the world and its citizens up and people on earth are really pissed at these criminals..

[edit on 16-11-2006 by 137]

Originally posted by 137
DickBush, Rumsfeld and his partners all belong in jail next to Saddam. And this is never going to happen in the USA becuz they live above the law. The can do whatever the F* they want and get away with it. At least Germany knows who the evil ones are.

I agree but that would have been like us sentencing Saddam in the United States. We didn't do that. I don't think we COULD do that so what gives Germany the power to do this?

Originally posted by DickBinBush
so what gives Germany the power to do this?

Becuz they can and it wont ever happen in the US of A. Just think about it, a criminal organisation in controle over one big warmachine and worlds most powerfull weapons, that aint good.. Starting with Rumsfeld (no matter where he would be tried) should be a very good id.

btw i would love to see what would happen if they hooked him up to a lie detector and asked him some questions about 9/11 and other criminal activities, i think that no media (lieing) training could help him out of that.

Originally posted by 137
Becuz they can

Says who? Did he commit war crimes against German civilians? Government officials? Military personnel? How is Germany involved? What gives them that right? That would have been like us convicting Hitler in American courts for killing Jews. That would have never happened. They have no right to do this. They need to stay out of it. I realize it's unfortunate that Rumsfeld won't get in trouble for what he's done, but it's time to move on now. Correct his mistakes. Make it better for the future. There's no point in pursuing somebody that won't ever be held responsible for his actions, and putting him in somebody else's court system that has nothing to do with the situation, and is probably just going after him for the publicity and politics of it, certainly isn't the answer.

Dont you agree that criminals of this magnitude need to be behind bars whatever cost necessary? And how it's looking now, some big criminals are getting away with there crimes. Also this can be seen as a message to Rumsfeld's friends, they do not own the world.

I agree they need to be behind bars. All you need to do is look at my avatar to get my stance on it. But all I'm saying is it will never happen, no matter who is taking them to court. The United States government has major influence all over the world. They can get anything they want. I think Germany should quit trying to make political gains off of this and just back off.

Id like to see the entire Illuminati clique and all their menial servants like Bush and Cheney tried at the Hague in Germany. Sure Rumsfeld is gone, but we still have those pieces of trash at the top who are still running things. Its time to put the trash out for good and get rid of these satanic homosexual pedophiliacs who call themselves "the Elite".

Originally posted by LightWorker13
Id like to see the entire Illuminati clique and all their menial servants like Bush and Cheney tried at the Hague in Germany. Sure Rumsfeld is gone, but we still have those pieces of trash at the top who are still running things. Its time to put the trash out for good and get rid of these satanic homosexual pedophiliacs who call themselves "the Elite".

Good luck with that

It is happening, right now as we speak, we just are not told about it.

2007 and the energies of Pluto will bring about exposure of ALL evil and corruption once and for good. Then we can focus on rebuilding this planet and this species to the rightfully glory we know we are cabable of.