Great Britain In The Grip Of Madness.

Originally posted by theukman
What tripe people talk here on this forum sometimes.

I couldn't agree with you more.

Give all our police officers guns, and let them do there job without all the political red tape. Go back to execution and get rid of all the evil in this country. Give tougher longer jail terms...

Has the experience of America taught you nothing? What about the lessons of history, which teach that systematic suppression always ends up strengthening and potentizing that which is suppressed?

I am so sick and tired of all the do gooders they really make me sick.

Would you rather cast your lot with the do-badders, then? You seem to be very ready to use violence against your fellow human beings, which is something decent people regard as abhorrent. Do you plan to punish and kill your way to a just society? Have three million years of evolution taken us no further than this?

If you are a criminal face up to your actions and take your punishment...

Who is a criminal? Criminality is a matter of definition. Today you're a law-abiding citizen with nothing to fear from gun-toting police officers, hanging judges and the like. But tomorrow... ah, what if tomorrow they change the law and all of a sudden, without doing anything different from what you are doing today, you become a criminal too? All of a sudden that hard policing and zero-tolerance justice is going to look very different to you. I hope you won't change your mind about it then, because it might be just a leetle too late.

Originally posted by clearwater
The war on drugs is a war on human rights.

Correct. And may I say, excellent post overall.

The demoralized and addicted make easy targets for politicians and are widely hated by every wounded co-dependent, [so] they fill the jails instead of treatment centers.

Right again. Another bogey to scare the voters with. And why?

Private interests and governments are getting rich and maintaining their power with the illegal drug trade.

Yes, that's why. As long as the stuff is illegal, producing, distributing and retailing it remains a high-risk business. And as any hedge fund manager will tell you, the riskier the investment, the higher the returns. So it's in the interest of all those involved, including the politicians who get kickbacks from the drug lords, to keep the drugs trade illegal.

One is obliged to add that the epicentre of this ghastly phenomenon is the United States of America, which is both the largest market for illegal drugs and the main international prosecutor of the so-called War on Drugs. America wheedles, bribes and threatens other countries to adopt harsh anti-drug policies and cull supplies (another way of keeping the price up). If not for this influence, much of the rest of the world would long since have adopted a more sensible attitude towards drugs.

In countries where addiction is not criminalized and addicts are given their drugs, the recovery rate is much higher and the social problem much less toxic.

Britain itself provides evidence for this. Just look at how heroin addiction used to be controlled, and how it took off after its use was criminalized in the 1950s. You can read about what it was like here. Silcone Synapse, you really ought to take a look at the link.

For those who want a bit more detail, try this 2001 article in the Guardian.

All drugs should be made legal. It's an open-and-shut case really.

All drugs..

does that include cigerettes?

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
All drugs... does that include cigarettes?

Are they illegal where you live? Gosh.

I don't think any sensible person would object to a prohibition on shooting up in restaurants or other public places.

Originally posted by TheNockerNox

Glad you feel so safe, unfortuantly I dont at night.

That's just my point, I DON'T feel safe when I or my family go out, day or night and it shouldn't be like that.

Nox


[edit on 15-11-2006 by TheNockerNox]

That's nobody's problem except yours.

Hi There,

I fail to see how compensating 'heroin' addicts constitutes the UK as descending into madness, there are greater issues than this that one could choose.

What about the fact that they were in prison for taking a drug which is responsible for the breakdown of our society?

I disagree. The breakdown of society (if it is in fact breaking down?) is not due to the drug, per se, it would be due to the actions of the people whom constitute said society. Of course, there might be a relation with the 'addictive' pangs a heroin user experiences and their anti-social behaviour arising from a need to gain their next 'fix', but even if no addictive drugs existed, societies would still be perceived as breaking down.

The problem with this court case and the compensation being paid has absolutley nothing whatsoever to do with the fact that those being compensated are addicts to heroin, but that these people were forced to undergo 'cold-turkey', which was not in their sentances, it was not stipulated as something they would have to do. The law states that prisoners have 'rights' (regardless of whether or not you agree), and that in these cases they were trampled on. It was the mechanisms that failed these persons by the behaviour of those in charge of them. Those in charge failed you and I and the rest of law-abiding citizens (if we class ourselves as such), and brought this upon us. If they had done it the right way, compensation would not have had to have been paid.

In the eyes of the law, those in charge of those whom are on sentance, committed a crime against them, and by that relation, against us. It might stick in one's craw, but there it is. This does not represent the failing of a society, but society protecting even those that many feel have no rights, they do, and society successfully reprimanded itself by acknowledging its failing.

[edit on 15-11-2006 by elysiumfire]

Well,this topic has raised good points on both sides.
I happened to watch Morgan Spurlock`s "30 days" program last night-The episode where he was locked up with drug addicts for a month.
There was one guy in his cell doing a forced withdrawal from heroin-I admit it was not nice to watch someone go through that,and i felt bad for the guy.Especially as he seemed to want to get clean.Anyway the guy did a rehab program in prison,then was released,then got busted burgling someones house 2 weeks later and locked up again.
So his rehab did not seem to work.
Thanks for all the informative replys,they have pointed out the fact that I maybe do not know enough about the subject to have steamed in with my opinions like I did.
I still feel strongly about what heroin does to society,and cannot except the viewpoint that all addicts are "victims."
One other point I have learned from this thread-The scale of the problem is global,and many people (most posters it seems)have been directly affected by the problem of heroin.
Hope I havn`t made any enemies from this thread,as that is not what I was aiming for.
Think Ill leave this one for now.
Thanks all.