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What are the consequences of the Iranian Tor M1 purchase?

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posted on Nov, 9 2006 @ 03:34 AM
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Iran recently ordered thirty Russian SA-15 GAUNTLET Tor M1 air defense missile systems to protect its Bushehr nuclear facility, which is expected to become operative in 2007.

Tor M1 In Action





The Tor-M1 is the successor to the Osa (NATO: SA-8 Gecko) surface-to-air missile (SAM) system. The 9K331 Tor [SA-15 GAUNTLET land-based, SA-N-9 naval version] low-to-medium altitude SAM system is capable of engaging not only aircraft and helicopters but also RPVs, precision-guided weapons and various types of guided missiles.

The principal advantages of Tor-M1 is its ability to simultaneously destroy two targets in any weather or at any time of day and night; the use of both the powerful and jamming-resistant radar with electronic beam control and vertically launched missiles able to maintain high speed and manoeuvrability inside an entire engagement envelope; the high degree of automation of combat operation provided by the electronic equipment suite. Tor detects targets at a distance of 25 kilometers and kills them at a distance of 12 kilometers. In combating manned aviation, Tor is thrice and 1.5 times more efficient than foreign systems of the same class - France's Crotale and Britain's Rapier, respectively.

Although it is an autonomous system it can be interfaced into an integrated air defense network. SA-15b is designed to be a completely autonomous air defense system (at division level), capable of surveillance, command and control, missile launch and guidance functions from a single vehicle. The basic combat formation is the firing battery consisting of four TLARs and the Rangir battery command post. The TLAR carries eight ready missiles stored in two containers holding four missiles each. The SA-15b has the capability to automatically track and destroy 2 targets simultaneously in any weather and at any time of the day.

Effective range limits are from 1500 to 12000 m with target altitude limits being between 10 and 6000 m. The maximum maneuvering load factor limit on the weapon is 30 g.

Source



The HQ-17 is a copy of Tor-M1, that China will use it to replace the aging HQ-61 SAMs, will enter service around the year 2005.


Like China, Iran has the habit of (legally or illegally?) copying purchased foreign military equipment. I'm not a military expert, but what would be the consequences should Iran start mass producing those systems for an US invasion. Are those systems really capable of seriously threatening USAF units should it come to a war?





[edit on 9-11-2006 by Mdv2]



Edn

posted on Nov, 9 2006 @ 04:12 AM
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Originally posted by Mdv2


Like China, Iran has the habit of (legally or illegally?) copying purchased foreign military equipment. I'm not a military expert, but what would be the consequences should Iran start mass producing those systems for an US invasion. Are those systems really capable of seriously threatening USAF units should it come to a war?





[edit on 9-11-2006 by Mdv2]

If Iran had the capability of producing those weapons they wouldn't be buying them from Russia and I expect China has probably in the past/present bought the blu-prints for several Russian weapon systems so they can produce there own.

As for the weapons effectiveness I would guess (because i don't really know) Russia is unlikely to sell and Iran is unlikely to buy them if they were not effective against US/Israeli aircraft.



posted on Nov, 9 2006 @ 04:39 AM
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Originally posted by Edn

If Iran had the capability of producing those weapons they wouldn't be buying them from Russia


Don't you think this is only a ''sample order'' intended for research purposes and eventually to produce their own version of the Tor M-1?



posted on Nov, 9 2006 @ 05:01 AM
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Originally posted by Mdv2
Don't you think this is only a ''sample order''


30 systems are quite a lot and if these are normally used to protect locations from cruise missiles or even LGB. These missiles cannot be used in all roles and 30 is enough for the role iran intends to use them in


Originally posted by Mdv2

The HQ-17 is a copy of Tor-M1, that China will use it to replace the aging HQ-61 SAMs, will enter service around the year 2005.


What is this "HQ-17" missile?

The HQ-61 only saw very limited service and if this "HQ-17" was produced to replace the HQ-61 it would be hard press to find reasons why the didn't import more Tor-M1 then make a lmited production run



posted on Nov, 9 2006 @ 05:13 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite
What is this "HQ-17" missile?


This might be of help, Chinawhite:


Just as in the case of weapon platforms of other kinds, China's defense industry does it best for "guochanhua" (reverse engineering) of Russian-made ADM systems.

In 2002-2003, China very probably will master – or has already mastered – serial production of

the following systems, whose development has been under way, based on Russian technology, since 1999-2000:

1. HQ-15. This is the slightly improved version of Russia's long-range high-altitude S-300 PMU1/PMU2 system, with a range up to 120 km and an altitude up to 25 km.

2. HQ-16 or "super-Tor-M1." This is an all-new ADM system, jointly under development with Russia. It is a mid-range system, effective against low- to medium-altitude (100 m to 20 km) targets. The system's reaction time (time between target detection and missile launch) is 6-8 seconds.

A single missile system can simultaneously attack eight aircraft or missile targets, with a target-hit probability of 90 percent for any of these targets. The system uses the currently most-advanced vertical launching technology, a phased-array radar, and a composite-guidance warhead. Plans call for the HQ-16 to widely enter PLA service about 2005.

3. HQ-17. This is a slightly improved version of the Russian Tor-M1 system with a range up to 30 km and altitude up to 15 km. In 2000, the PLA decided to construct, by 2002-2003, between 10 and 12 air defense brigades equipped with hundreds of Tor-M1s and HQ-17s, as well as Chinese original KS-1 and KS-1A ADM systems.

4. HQ-18. This is a slightly improved version of the Russian S-300 V system. Its major characteristics somewhat surpass those of the HQ-15.

Source



posted on Nov, 9 2006 @ 10:00 AM
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oops, miss replied to post, please ignore/delete this

Thanks

[edit on 9-11-2006 by skippytjc]



posted on Nov, 9 2006 @ 02:39 PM
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Seeing as how it's range is limited, and if they are going to deploy them to fixed locations. If the launching platform cannot be touched the system can overwhelmed with multiple missiles especially in a high ECM and Jamming environment.



posted on Nov, 9 2006 @ 09:29 PM
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Originally posted by Mdv2
This might be of help, Chinawhite:


I thought this information would be from missile-threat or Newmax. Its safe to say that nothing published by new-max has/was substaniated.

But i love this catch phase "guochanhua" (reverse engineering) , which does not makes sense in chinese which tells me they just made it up



posted on Nov, 10 2006 @ 05:07 AM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23
Seeing as how it's range is limited, and if they are going to deploy them to fixed locations. If the launching platform cannot be touched the system can overwhelmed with multiple missiles especially in a high ECM and Jamming environment.


Tor-m1 also use passive EO and IR detection.

In Europe systems that use EO and IR are not very effective becuase of rain, cloud, bad weather etc..

But in Iran they have very very clear skies almost 24 hours a day and EO and IR is very effective becuase of good weather and no rain clouds. EO and IR should be taken into consideration when these systems are deployed.

Having good weather allows EO(Electro Optic) to see further without being "blocked" and allows Infra Red to lock onto targets at further ranges.

Also Iran has been getting alot of new kit from China and Russia. I wouldn't be surprised if they have missiles that lock onto jamming aircraft with surafec to air anti-radiation missiles.
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