School Bus Driver Fired for "flipping off" Bush

A few months ago a 43 year old female school bus driver was fired for giving president Bush the Bird and now has filed a union grievance in an effort to get her job back.
Here is the story as short as it is, it contains sufficient details to answer my question which is was the firing justified/unjustified or was it a violation of her first amendment rights?



Now the question is was this justified or unjustified?

I'd say since she did it in the presence of the children it was justified. You can't just flip someone off when you are driving a bus full of children.....president Bush or not.

With a bus load of children? Maybe my child? The driver should behave themselves, and keep their political views to themselves.

Bush is really irrelevant to the discussion. A person with that little impulse control really has no business driving a school bus.

They fire a school bus driver for flipping Bush the bird as his motorcade went by. I would say wrongful termination, however, there were kids on the bus. A person with that kind of responsibility should actually watch what they do on the those buses. Who knows what some kid will pick up after they've seen their school bus driver do it.

The thing is, they fire the driver for flippin' the bird to the President, but yet they still allow them totalk on cell phones while driving the bus.

There is a time and place for everything and driving a school bus is certainly not the time for obscene gestuers; however I think a stern warning and probation would have been sufficient punishment.

I must agree there is a time and place for everything, and this not one of them.
With that being said I think Bush seen her


[edit on 3/11/2006 by Sauron]

The first thing that came to mind was exactly how did her employer find out? I'm assuming she was pulled over or something?

Firing her is certainly acceptable in this case...regardless of the fact that there were children in the bus. She was driving a company vehicle, while driving this vehicle she was representing the company she drove for. She acted innapropriately and risked the company reputation by flipping off the president. It's not like she was driving in her own car with her own kids.

That being said.... I probably would have done the same thing.

Yep I have to agree with others that for me it's the presence of the children that makes the termination justified.

The problem they will have with the lawsuit is if they claim the bus driver was terminated for any other reason than for using an obscene gesture in front of children.

If there had been no children I would say wrongful termination.

So in the end I think we pretty much agree that flipping off the president is fair game under freedom of expression but doing it in front of kids - who really are impressionable - is bad.

I for one think flipping off the president is bad behavior on any level. I am not a fan of President Bush but I would certainly never flip him the bird.

You can respect the office without respecting the man.

IMO of course.

Spiderj

[edit on 11/3/2006 by Spiderj]

Originally posted by YoBrandonRaps
Firing her is certainly acceptable in this case...regardless of the fact that there were children in the bus. She was driving a company vehicle, while driving this vehicle she was representing the company she drove for. She acted innapropriately and risked the company reputation by flipping off the president. It's not like she was driving in her own car with her own kids.

This is a very good point. I once worked with a guy who had the company's logo on his car. He flipped someone off one day and the guy called our office. Needless to say my coworker got into alot of trouble over it. He didn't get fired though.

Wow that's a pretty lean story. Little to go on either than the Rep. dimed here out. Was she in trouble before? Was this her first intance of inappropriate behavior? You don't usually get terminated for a first time offence of this nature.

Originally posted by Spiderj
I for one think flipping off the president is bad behavior on any level. I am not a fan of President Bush but I would certainly never flip him the bird.

You can respect the office without respecting the man.

I agree with this 100%. It is just bad form. It's like being in a debate and your oponent flips you the bird. No place for it IMO.

You don't usually get terminated for a first time offence of this nature.

It'd be great if it comes out that the driver had an impulse control issue when it comes to the bird. Perhaps she's flipped off heads of state in the past...or her boss, or teachers or the children themselves.

A person who flips the bird in front of kids probably doesn't have a problem swearing in front of them so perhaps you're right and there are other issues.

Be great if it came out she was a serial bird flipper.

Kind of like emenem, flipping the bird is sort of his "shalom".

Perhaps she lost her other fingers and thumb in some sort of accident and it's all some unfortunate misunderstanding...though I suppose that would have been in the article.

Spiderj

Originally posted by Griff

Originally posted by Spiderj
I for one think flipping off the president is bad behavior on any level...You can respect the office without respecting the man.

I agree with this 100%. It is just bad form. It's like being in a debate and your oponent flips you the bird. No place for it IMO.

Yeah, I'm constantly confused by people who don't understand that you can still be civil while protesting against the man.

Of course for me I like being an American and am quite proud of it most of the time.

An american giving the president the bird in a way disrespects him or herself as an american(again IMO).

I will add however the minute he's out of office you can flip it all day long in his direction for all I care, but whoever takes his place wether democrat or republican...well no bird flipping...untill that guys out any way.

Spiderj

Another school bus driver with impulse control problems:

NOVEMBER 2--Meet Amber Hamilton. The Florida school bus attendant was arrested yesterday on charges that she showed pornographic videos stored on her cell phone to underage students en route to their elementary school. According to a Sarasota County Sheriff's Office affidavit, three male students (a 12-year-old and two 10-years-olds) told investigators that Hamilton, 20, last month showed them the sex video while traveling to Phillippi Shores Elementary School.

www.thesmokinggun.com...

www.heraldtribune.com

It's really important to know who's minding the kids.

[edit on 2006/11/3 by GradyPhilpott]

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
Another school bus driver with impulse control problems:

It's really important to know who's minding the kids.

[edit on 2006/11/3 by GradyPhilpott]

Nice find grady...good lord what is wrong with people.

So let me get this straight, she left her phone on the seat either long enough for the students to find the porn or it was on her phone and the kids picked up the phone and saw the porn?

I'm going with the kids on this one, she showed it to them...IMO of course but it sounds like she's lieing to me.

Spiderj

These allegations were posed last month and she just happens to be arrested the same day as she flipped off the Prez? Yeah, right. The police take these allegations VERY seriously. That cell would have been confiscated the next day and her questioned. My BS-O-Meter is going off BIG TIME!

It's two different cases ya crazy canuck...I think it's two different cases?

First bus driver forty three years old, cell phone porn girl twenty years old.

Spiderj

Originally posted by Spiderj
It's two different cases ya crazy canuck...I think it's two different cases?

First bus driver forty three years old, cell phone porn girl twenty years old.

Spiderj

See, this is why we stay on topic, so I don't get confused and look like a moron.

Intrepid,

I believe the two bus drivers are different people. The original post says that she's 43 years old, while the second one by Grady says that the other driver is 20.

edit:
You guys beat me to it.

[edit on 11/3/2006 by Griff]