China's Geo political strategy

Originally posted by ape
nobody is ignoring the deficit, we got in this situation because the average american borrows to much and invests less

Once again, you amaze me with your ridiculously uneducated remarks. The deficit is caused by UNCHECKED Federal govrenment spending... this has nothing to do with the avg. american borrowing too much and investing too little... You're scaring me now ape, you are truly scaring me.

also this is a prime example of the games china plays, we are the sole reason for their growth as no other country wont let them undermine their currency. you're misinformed
www.washingtonpost.com...

[edit on 23-12-2006 by ape]

You are wrong at first... you said China is undermining the U.S.' currency... they are not... And according to the Bush Administration, China is not a Currency manipulator.

goldsea.com...

And you've got to be kidding me. "The sole reason for China's growth?" HAHA, hear me buddy, our consumption of Chinese products is NOT the sole reason for their growth. How ignorant and stupid of a statement can that be? We surely HELP the Chinese economy grow, but we are in no way the sole, or even the top factor of their growth. Sigh.... you are giving me a true fit with your outrageous statements.

I'm starting to wonder if you even understand the basic concepts of economics.





"Owned."





[edit on 23-12-2006 by k4rupt]

what you just did was break up my post and them reformat it in a way that wasnt even posted, proving how you attempt to manipulate the truth, you are a globalist.

i said americans borrowing so much and relying on the government for money they dont even have along with no oversight and clear view on how federal tax money is being spent all contributes to the defecit and debt.

once again you post a stupid remark without highlighting on how you would go about handling our situation, please stop posting.



[edit on 23-12-2006 by ape]

Originally posted by ape
what you just did was break up my post and them reformat it in a way that wasnt even posted, proving how you attempt to manipulate the truth, you are a globalist.

Wow, are you that... wow. i did not break up ANYTHING. That is what you said, refer to your previous post if you don't remember.

i said americans borrowing so much and relying on the government for money they dont even have along with no oversight and clear view on how federal tax money is being spent all contributes to the defecit and debt.

You didn't own yourself enough?

How would borrowing money = relying gov't for money? That makes no sense whatsoever. Sigh.... looks like public education failed someone.

once again you post a stupid remark without highlighting on how you would go about handling our situation, please stop posting.

I did highlight how would should handle our situation.... looks like someone doesn't read.


Your posts are beyond hillarious. I debunked so much of your crap.... I can't even believe someone would post some of the statements that you have. Funny how you claim that I'm uneducated and at the same time suggest that China undermines the dollar, America is the sole reason for China's growth, our national deficit is caused by Americans borrowing too much and investing too little, and Americans who borrow money rely on the gov't for money.

[edit on 23-12-2006 by k4rupt]

you didnt debunk anything, in the end you said you think fair tax should be implemented, I said fair tax will solve our deficit, all you have done was flame these pages constantly repeating yourself " THE DEFECIT THE DEFECIT THE DEFECIT' without highlighting on how u propose to solve it, you're an idiot and a troll.

also you have areading comprehension problem, you have not debunked anything at all, reread my post I said 'americans' borrowing so much ( this goes for the average middle class american getting entrenched in credit card debt with no means of paying it back due to low income wages and federal income tax making it hard to advance usually end up filing for bankruptcy), and relying on the government ( this goes for the welfare people section 8 housing all of that WHICH I HAVE TO PAY FOR) all contribute to federal spending and other wastefull spedning when fairtax would literally eradicate this, you dont even know the different class of americans and how many rely on the government when fair tax would literally give them the push they need.

I think you have proiven you're not an american and you dont pay taxes in this country, invest in this country and live in this country, i suggest posting somthing intellectual instead of constantly talking crap and not contributing anything, you globalist.

you didnt debunk anything you're pathetic.

[edit on 23-12-2006 by ape]

[edit on 23-12-2006 by ape]

[edit on 23-12-2006 by ape]

[edit on 23-12-2006 by ape]

Originally posted by ape
you didnt debunk anything, in the end you said you think fair tax should be implemented, I said fair tax will solve our deficit, all you have done was flame these pages constantly repeating yourself " THE DEFECIT THE DEFECIT THE DEFECIT' without highlighting on how u propose to solve it, you're an idiot and a troll.

Harsh words coming from an idiot... I DID highlight on how we should solve it, maybe you didn't bother to read... I stated clearly: SLASH federally funded programs and spending, increase taxes - all of which are CLEAR CUT WAYS, SOLID WAYS to pay off our debt.

also you have areading comprehension problem, you have not debunked anything at all, reread my post I said 'americans' borrowing so much ( this goes for the average middle class american getting entrenched in credit card debt with no means of paying it back due to low income wages and federal income tax making it hard to advance usually end up filing for bankruptcy), and relying on the government ( this goes for the welfare people section 8 housing all of that WHICH I HAVE TO PAY FOR) all contribute to federal spending and other wastefull spedning when fairtax would literally eradicate this, you dont even know the different class of americans and how many rely on the government when fair tax would literally give them the push they need.

Okay, you SERIOUSLY don't know anything about the deficit... and this again PROVES IT. You have owned yourself with your own words. The deficit is not caused by "welfare people" or because "people cannot advance." God, you don't know ANYTHING about economics do you? The insane deficit is caused by GOVERNMENT SPENDING in an attempt to stimulate the economy, and it did work, in a way. People on welfare IS NOT A REASON WE HAVE SUCH A HUGE DEFICIT. You've got to be kididn me... it's like teaching a 6 year old about economics... pathetic.

I think you have proiven you're not an american and you dont pay taxes in this country, invest in this country and live in this country, i suggest posting somthing intellectual instead of constantly talking crap and not contributing anything, you globalist.

you didnt debunk anything you're pathetic.

LOL, i just debunked you AGAIn.

And HOW IN GOD'S NAME did I prove myself as NOT an American? Such a statement shows what kind of IDIOT you actually are. Because I state that Fairtax cannot solve the deficit , you automatiically assume that I am unAmerican?



Please, make me laugh more, your idiotic attempts to sound educated and your pathetic attempts in stating that you've proved I'm not an American are too funny.

are you a complete idiot? dont you know the government taxes me to pay for welfare and section 8 housing, all of which are federal programs designed to spend billions just to take care of people who are at the poverty level and who dont want to work or who work but still needs the governments help to survive, you do realise that the fair tax would not only put more money in the hands of the poverty level and allow them to advance and invest along with the massive industry fair tax would create people would not only be keeping more money they would be making more money and massive high paying jobs would emerge allowing massive amounts of americans to advance and rely less on the government, of course you dontknow anything about this because you dont pay taxes, you're not an american citizenm you more than likley dont support yourself, and you're horribly ignorant.

taxing the american workers income will not solve the deficit it will only slow the economy and hamper growth. increasing the income and revenue and increasing investment both foreign and domestic for the country along with smart fiscal responsibility and less spending and unprecedented growth will infact help us get a handle on the current deficit.

you once again prove your ignorant and should be banned for trolling, you have a wealth of information right before you yet you choose to ignore it and persure a globalist outsourcing agenda, once again i live in american and invest and contribute to my country, dont lecture me and stop posting unless you have something smart to say.


even though i know u dont know how to read im sure others do bvut here are some more benefits.

fairtax.org...

fairtax.org...

fairtax.org...





[edit on 23-12-2006 by ape]

If there isn't an immediate cessation of the sophomoric vitriol that is currently pervading this thread, dire consequences are in order.

Please take the time to read the following tokens of wisdom... The knowledge you gain may preserve your membership.

Mod Note: Courtesy Is Mandatory – Please Review This Link.

Mod Note: How Not To Be Banned From ATS – Please Review This Link.

Mod Note: Terms & Conditions Of Use – Please Review This Link.

fair enough i will respect the rules of ATS but if this thread is terminated it would seriously go against the motto of this site which is deny ignorance, I apologize if I got upset and violated any rule of the site but this is truly a situation that needed to be adressed and I hope you understand my position, if you dont understand my position well then I would suggest rethinking the motto of this website.

good day.

[edit on 23-12-2006 by ape]

[edit on 23-12-2006 by ape]

ok ok how about this, stop making power moves and wars all over teh place, that should save the US a pretty penny, eh? cut the military spending in half, we really don't need 12 carrier groups you know...(for intance..)

yeah that would help, but the fairtax would only provide more revenue to be spent for militarty or whatever is decided, point is it is a more fiscally responsible move to make and it needs to be done, our system is so flawwed its amazing, I work in this country for a living I pay my taxes and do my part, I invest and love this country, it bothers me when people just discredit it then provide no intellectual insight on how to improve our situation as americans. especially someone who has no idea about the tax system and who think raising taxes is the answer to our problem, HAHA can you say recession?? fair tax is the answer, look at how the US is outsourcing it's industry, far tax is a must if the american work is to survive and get fair justice.

[edit on 23-12-2006 by ape]

Originally posted by ape
are you a complete idiot? dont you know the government taxes me to pay for welfare and section 8 housing, all of which are federal programs designed to spend billions just to take care of people who are at the poverty level and who dont want to work or who work but still needs the governments help to survive, you do realise that the fair tax would not only put more money in the hands of the poverty level and allow them to advance and invest along with the massive industry fair tax would create people would not only be keeping more money they would be making more money and massive high paying jobs would emerge allowing massive amounts of americans to advance and rely less on the government, of course you dontknow anything about this because you dont pay taxes, you're not an american citizenm you more than likley dont support yourself, and you're horribly ignorant.

Welfare is NOT the reason why we have the deficit... You have got to be kidding... I don't even know where to begin. I don't think there is a point arguing against someone who thinks that the deficit is caused by people on Welfare.

Someone, please, step in. I don't know how to continue... "Our national debt is caused by welfare." God help us all.

it bothers me when people just discredit it then provide no intellectual insight on how to improve our situation as americans. especially someone who has no idea about the tax system and who think raising taxes is the answer to our problem, HAHA can you say recession?

I am not DISCREDITING the nation at all. I'm pointing out a problem - a $9 trillion dollar PROBLEM.... how am I discrediting the U.S. by doing that?

Seriously, I want to know how you come to that conclusion. Anyone who points out economic problems this country is facing/ is giong to face automatically discredits the integrity of the United States? Ugh...

And yes, I do bleieve raising taxes will solve the deficit problem. I, unlike some, actually believe in DOING SOMETIHNG about our deficit. If we do not, sooner or later, HAHA can someone say great depression?

I would just like to informa all not to listen to ku4upt he is a globalist with an outsourcing agenda

Ahh, how interesting... ON another thread you continue to attack me.... a thread that I haven't even posted in. A globalist with an outsourcing agenda? HOW DO YOU EVNE COME UP WITH THAT CONCLUSION? Is it because I don't think Fairtax will solve our deficit problem? Is that why you label me a globalist? So, let me see, by your logic, ANYONE WHO OPPOSES FAIRTAX is automatically an anti-American, pro-outsourcing, globalist....

You've got to be kidding me.... Mods, seriously, this guy is out of control.



[edit on 23-12-2006 by k4rupt]

once again you prove that you have a reading comprehension problem, I did NOT at all say that welfare and section 8 and all of these government programs are the reason for the deficit, I say they contribute to it. all of it is wastefull and really abused badly, with fair tax this would give more options for work etc because not only would thousands of high paying jobs be created, current jobs like taco bell and mcdonalds would actually become career jobs HAHAHA. the section 8 group would actually be bale to find jobs that pay great to be able to actually own a home with their own money instead of having the government tax me to pay for it, maaybe then they would take better care of the houses since it would be their money and not mine. single mothers with many kids who are actually legit citizen on welfare can get ahead more easily because they have more options, I can see massive work at home jobs being created that are actually legit. they get huge pay raises and they get to keep their check. think about all of the unemployment that is paid out, alot of the unemployment is due to outsourcing, fair tax would eliminate outsourcing prolly pissing off the indians and chinese meaning almost every american would be able to find a high paying good job.


you're missing the entire point here buddy, point is fair tax reduces government and makes it more clear on whats being spent etc, fairtax would lift all of these people that live in poverty enabling them to earn decent money that isnt government and tax payer money and having them blow it on whatever they want without having to rely on me to pay for it.

understand? it's a constitutional amendment and despite you saying ' why have we not heard of this' ' if it was so good why has it not passed' obviously some forces are trying to prevent this as you are a proven example of this, the majority will soon learn of this it cannot be kept under the rug, whats funny is alot of people already do know about it, you're just spreading misinformation.

once again I am a tax payer of the US, i invest in my country and I see what the reality is everyday, I see the average american getting stuck in creditcard debt and finding it harder to find jobs that pay good, you obviously are not in touch with how america works which is why i question your nationality, HAH you proposed raised taxes on the average american who is already being taxed to the max ? and disrupt our sensitive economy??? can you say recession? once again you prove that you're misinformed. also people really felt the great depression because they didnt diversify their investmens so it affected people on a grandscale, things are very diversified now, once again proving you really are out of your element.

and once again you prove how dishonest you are by even trying to manipulate the moderators, you did infact post on that thread take a look at page 1, you posted more misinformation. and being called a globalist with an outsourcing agenda based on your posts on ATS is the truth and is MY OPINION, i was simply giving advice to the readers, thats hardly getting out of line when the opinion is formed from your posts.

I also like how your trying to get me banned, I think it further proves that you have an agenda and are trying to 'debunk' the truth, now i refuse to advocate for your ban as that would be against free speech seeing as im an american however I do recommend the mods check your trolling as you have not posted 1 single bit of intellectual information on this thread, please think about that.

nobody is saying your a globAList because you dont support fair tax, it's because of how you conducted yourself on this thread with your previous posts, it seems you have no interest in fighting outsourcing and lower pay wages instead just raise more dracionian tax laws on the citizen. My opinion is justified greatly based on your behaviour on this thread, alot of people are for outsourcing and are for globalism so It should not be taken as a peronsal insult when it was formed based from your comments on this thread. nice try, If i do infact get banned I would be suprised and it would be a very clear abuse of power considering you refuse to clarify your position and if you're even a US citizen, alot of foriegn countrys benefit from outsourcing, so my opinion is justified, nice work on trying to silence my opinion.

you keep repeating yourself screaming deficit, what you're doing now is flaming and trolling, you have yet to post an intellectual response giving the ATS people something good to read, I'm very aware of the deficit and our current system contributes to this deficit and could be the sole cause for it as the fat cat politicans have nobody putting pressure on them making them think twice when they blow my ( the american tax payer ) hard earned money








[edit on 24-12-2006 by ape]

[edit on 24-12-2006 by ape]

I conducted myself as an Anti-American, pro-outsourcing globalist? How? Please, quote me in ONE example that proves I am such... if you can't I HIGHLY suggest you stop labeling me as such.

Secondly, I DID propose how we should handle the deficit.... slash federal spending and increase a tmeporary deficit tax until we can pay it all back. OF COURSE it isn't great for our economy, but you've got to realize that we HAVE to pay it all back sooner or later. Fairtax IS NOT a solution to our deficit, you have failed to prove that.

$9 trillion, we're going to have to pay it back; I would rather see it done now than see it all piled up and thrown to our children and grandchildren to deal with. The longer we wait, the bigger the problem.

There is only ONE clear cut way to get rid of it; dreams and fantasy aside; and that is to TAX.

BTW ape, I have asked you A MILLION TIMES to put a source that directly states Fairtax is a solution to our deficit problem. If you CANNOT, then I highly suggest you STOP using that as an excuse for fixing our $9 trillion deficit.

Good day.

Oh and btw, on the other thread, this is what I said:

Well said Rockpuck...

It doesn't matter whether the gov't is controlled by Dems or the GOP, spending WILL RISE - it's just a matter of what it is being spnet on.

The best way to curve a rising debt, is to have a conflicting Congress and Presidency. For example, a Democratically controlled Congress and a Republican president. In those situations, the deficit rarely rises over .5%... with a united Congress and President, deficits rise between 3-5% annually whether under Democrats or GOP control.

By the way, as Milton Friedman said it, Republicans DONT WANT to be in such a huge debt... thats not the core Republican principle.

AND YOU CALL ME AN ANTI-AMERICAN, PRO OUTSOURCING, GLOBALIST FOR SAYING THAT? You've got to be kiddin me.

Seriously, ape, EXPLAIN yourself.


[edit on 24-12-2006 by k4rupt]

anyone who is not for fair tax is for the outsourcing of american jobs because none of the proposed 'solutions' you have stated will check federal spending or bring back jobs it would only cause more job loss and unemplyment and government spending and I infact have proven how it will get a better handle on the deficit and spending along with bringing back american industry to the US and stronger paying jobs, people who are less fortunate and have no choice but to work at mcdonalds would actually be advancing making more money and relying less on the government, they would be bale to invest in a home and not rely on section 8 which my tax dollars pay for, all of this would help in regards to wastefull spending. i'm done with you man you seriously cannot comprehend such basic and straight forward information and posts I really have no interest in 'debating' (hardly a debate ) and having you bait me into getting out of line due to your ignorance and your further attempts on trying to get me banned.

our current system is horribly flawed, I have provded many links that have information that cannot be challenged and when it was challenged it got countered with actual fact. many things contribute to our defecit including no insight on how federal money is actually being spent and who is wasting this money and who endorses wasting this money, fair tax would clear up all the smoke the the american people have a better view on where their revenue is going.

raising taxes would only contribute to our current flawwed system, the majority agree with me on this subkect and you are apart of the debunked minority, advocating for higher taxes on the american worker is what makes me wonder if you are actually a us citizen, if you pay taxes and live under this current system or if you live off of your parents and only 15 years old, all of which you refuse to clarify so im done.

inc2006 is in 9th grade and can comprehend the benefits of this plan.

[edit on 24-12-2006 by ape]

[edit on 24-12-2006 by ape]

posted by ku4upt
Ahh, how interesting... ON another thread you continue to attack me.... a thread that I haven't even posted in.

this is what he said in an attempt to discredit me for the ban

and in his next post

originally posted by ku4upt
Oh and btw, on the other thread, this is what I said

this alone should tell everyone that im debating with a manipulator, im done and i suggest everyone challenge this mans opinion whenever he addresses it, as any democracy would do.

i suggest everyone read this link

fairtax.org...

fairtax.org...

basically ku4upt is against small business.



[edit on 24-12-2006 by ape]

[edit on 24-12-2006 by ape]

And yet AGAIN you fail to show me sources that STATE Fairtax is a solution to our deficit problem... our even HELPFUL in our combat against the deficit.

Obviously, you can't find it... obivously FAIRTAX, if it ever even makes it to Congress, is nowhere near a solution to our deficit problem.

I, want to fix the problem. You, ape however, would rather ignore it and push it for our children and grandchildren to deal with.... and what they will deal with is far beyond anything they are capable of as our debt rises every year.

this alone should tell everyone that im debating with a manipulator, im done and i suggest everyone challenge this mans opinion whenever he addresses it, as any democracy would do.

I posted in that thread A LONG time ago, and had no memory of doing so.

And yet you ignore my question: how does that statement prove that I'm an Anti-American, pro-outsourcing, globalist? All I stated was that both parties, the dems and the GOP, spend a lot, just in different ways.

Again, explain yourself. (Which you obviously didn't, ignored, and attacked something else)

[edit on 24-12-2006 by k4rupt]

Oh, by the way ape.

Welfare is in NO WAY a cause for our NATIONAL DEFICIT. The national gov't doesn't even pay for welfare, the state and local gov't is reponsible for it. So HOW can welfare ADD TO OUR NATIONAL DEBT if it isn't even a federal expenditure.



Owned?

Again, you show you know nothing about economics or how the gov't is run... I have debunked you, and owned what you said.

Oh, here's a little lesson for ya ape:

This is a list of gov't spending, in terms of highest amount to lowest:

social security
national defense
income security
net interest on debt
medicare
health
education
transportation
vetern's benefit
natural resources and environment
international affairs
general science and tech
administration of justice


Hm... lemme refer to my high school economics book: OH THATS RIGHT, WELFARE IS A STATE AND LOCAL EXPENSE. How can it possibly be in our national deficit? Oh thats right, because APE said so.

Did you pass economics in high school? All this info is stated very clearly in ch. 3 under gov't spending in my high school economics textbook.

What do you have to say for yourself now? You have a lot of explaining to do.




[edit on 24-12-2006 by k4rupt]

yet another non thought out post from you, what you are doing now is flaming, i suggest you actually read my links before posting. everything i have posted would help the US citizen. please stop repeating yourself as we all get it, the only solution you have provided would only worsen the problem, I am not officially done as I have exposed you for who you are.

you're basically against against low income families aswell, all your solutions would only hurt them and the economy and infact keep them low income against their will.

fairtax.org...


here is a link to the federal welfare reform that occured awhile back

www.urban.org...

so please inform me on what the heck you're talking about? what you are doing now is trolling.


merry christmas and happy holidays to all at ATS.

[edit on 24-12-2006 by ape]

Ahh... and yet again you comopletely ignore what I asked of you.

1.) Show me proof that Fairtax is in fact a solution to our deficit problem. Show me a source that says so. If you can't, then why are you using Fairtax as your only argument for fixing our deficit problem? I think my 10 year old cousin would understand this concept.

2.) i just owned your "welfare theory" when you said that our national debt is caused by people on welfare... when in fact welfare is a state and local expenditure, and that it has NOTHING to do with national level spending so it is IMPOSSIBLE for it to even be affecting our national debt.


Ahh... good day and happy holidays.

[edit on 24-12-2006 by k4rupt]