Is the UK ready for a Romanian crime explosion?

Ready for this? really? is the UK ready to cope with what could be one of the most violent and destructive influxes of a peoples in its entire history since 1066??

Im a former custodial officer here in the UK, and every one always asked me who was the worst to look after violence /criminality wise, and my and others answers were always the Romanians.. They have no equal in sheer savagery and brutality - not even the jamacans can gather such fury as these peoples...oh and a blood feud can last well over 500 years...

www.dailymail.co.uk...

this scares me - read this and see the true figures of criminalty in these people..and we are going to get swamped by them - This could be the straw that breaks this countires back..

A secret Cabinet memo warned of increases in street violence, ATM theft, sex trafficking and fraud, according to reports.

The document reportedly estimates that Romanian gangs are behind "80-85 per cent" of cash machine crime in the UK.

According to the Sun newspaper the memo comments: "There is concern that free movement will encourage people from Bulgaria and Romania to come to the UK, some of whom may be drawn towards organised criminal activities already well established in the UK."[/exe]

Its easy to see why the British National Party is gaining popularity so quickly hey.

Originally posted by NumberCruncher
Its easy to see why the British National Party is gaining popularity so quickly hey.

In the words of my favourite Jaffa:

Indeed........

Nuff said.

I cannot say where this took place, but it was a detention center in the north of england in 2001.

We had the usual mix on the wing, jamaicans, indians, pakistani, algerians... and then we got 5 romanians in on the same day.

It went to hell within 12 hours.

It was all peaceful up till then, every one mixing, watching TV in the same tv rooms ect, eating at dinner together ect, then next day - wham.

total chaos. A Jam came up to me clutching his neck - stabbed with a sharpened tooth brush handle - wouldnt tell me who it was ! (very unusual). A couple of hours later, an Indian beat sensless with a table leg (where they got it from was at that minute unknown).

Dinner time two hours later, romanians all sat together, and 50 detainees swarmed in a whaled the living crap out of these guys... im not kidding it took 20 officers nearly an hour to restore order...

next thing we did was look in the lockers of the romanians once they were put in isolation...

Every thing of value that belonged to the other detainees. Walkmans, MP3 players, money, watches, the lot. Turns out they stabbed the Jam to demonstrate they ruled the block, and were enforcing protection out of every one else...

We even caught that night a visitor trying to get money OUT of the center in a babies nappy... but the wonders of extremely sharp eyed cctv staff stopped it - £900 all in notes...

These people, of all the races and nationalities I have met, make my blood run cold... Britian will be forever changed if the same amount of Romanians come here as did the Polish people (Poles are great, work hard and are very very nice natured people) 360,000 Romanians? I don't think law and order will survive that amount in the UK to be honest...

hmmm

The Daily Mail

enough said.

Well of course.
Well what do you expect?

The Daily Mail said something scary (but utterly speculative.....cos it hasn't happened yet) about 'those foreigners' and now we're all supposed to be afraid of a deluge of swarthy eastern Europeans.

There is absolutely no indication a significant number of Romanians or Bulgarians are going to come here (Germany, Italy, Spain, France and Israel of all places are apparently the preferred destination).
The British Gov has also imposed limits on the numbers that can come here and look for work.

So imagined "crime explosions" are simply imagination at work.

Pardon me if I don't 'buy it'.

It's so dreary and so predictable.
Always harping on about the negative and never once mentioning the positive.

Once upon a time it was invitations to be afraid of Scots, Welsh and Irish people.....it's the same paranoid s**t, different day, different target.

On today's 1PM BBC 1 news a Gov spokesman said the wave of immigrants from the last EU expansion had added to the British skills base and contributed approx £8 billions to the British economy.
In terms of education the British exchequer now benefits to the tune of approx £5 billions in fees paid by foreign students coming here to study.

Interesting that today (for once) we also had the news items mentioning 'net' figures - cos the habit is almost always to concentrate on immigrants and utterly ignore emigration.

People can deny this and simply 'believe' that 'they' come here and contribute nothing but there probably is no talking to people that have decided this as a matter of belief.

Interesting too that claims for asylum here have now fallen down to below their 1991 levels (ie pre the break up of Yugoslavia and the Kosovan war).
I doubt the right-wing will make anything like as much of that as they did when numbers were going up, hmmmm?

....and as for deciding about an entire nation because of the criminal behaviour of a relative handful detained at an immigration detention centre (not exactly a place where only 'nice people' go, right)?
You'll be telling me somewhere like Parkhurst prison is representitive of all British people next, hmmmm?

.......and as per I have to say I find the 'worry' about the far-right here grossly over-done and usually laughable.

The Green Party took twice the votes the BNP did in our local council elections held here a mere 6mths ago.

Are we on the verge of a 'Green' Gov?
No, perhaps sadly not......but if you really did think so you'd have at least twice the substantive and reasonable grounds for saying so than anyone insisting or pretending that the far-right in Britain are about to gain huge 'ground'.

The extreme-right are always looking to 'talk up' their prospects but the truth is, as you may imagine, very different, no matter what some might try and tell people here.
They were once a far far greater 'threat' that they are now.
Tens of thousands once publicly marched in support of them.......now they're lucky to scrape up a couple of hundred.
To try to claim they are 'on the verge' of anything genuinely major is merely at best plain wrong or at worse working an agenda that is deceitful, delusional and a pathetic denial of the facts and even their own sad history.



[edit on 2-11-2006 by sminkeypinkey]

Originally posted by infinite
hmmm

The Daily Mail

enough said.

^Exactly. Take anything the Daily Mail says with a huge bag of salt.

As for the Romanians... whilst it's true to say there are some dangerous criminal types in Romania, it's just as true that there are equally dangerous British criminals. I don't think a country/race is inherently criminal... just seems to be some nasty stereotypes. And the example you use... do you truly think all Romanians behave like that? If you do, then do you think all English football fans are hooligans?

The actions of a few tarnish the reputation of the many, as this country knows.

Sminkey,
you said this..

"There is absolutely no indication a significant number of Romanians or Bulgarians are going to come here"

Do you have any idea how stupid the goverment sounded after they said the exact same thing about te Poles.... now 360,000 Poles later they are having to back track like mad about their figures....

l don't want to get into a flamer war with you or any one else, but I see a massive influx of romanians as a very unsettling and destabilising event for the UK.

FYI, I have worked along side Police services across the UK, and what i have seen and experienced of Romanians makes me very very wary of them per se.

Also, It was very rare within an immigration center to experience such levels of violence, and from not a few members of a nationality, but every single one of them. They hated us British, were fantasticaly racist towards black /asian / arab peoples, had no interest in our country bar what they could get for free, were totaly intolerant of any regime (even a relativley soft one inside a Det Cen) and understood only brute force as a way of negotiation.

As for the daily mail, well if it doesn't suit your views thats fine, but hey, any one with the 12 stars of socialism in their avatars not going to like the mail are they ?

Paranoid? no. Talking from alot of personal experience? yes.

In the UK you have limits of accepting Romanians into the country? Doesn't the EU mean anyone has free immigration privileges? Does the UK also have restrictions on the number of Middle Easterns and Pakistanis which you call Asians? Does the UK get a lot of illegal immigrants like the United States?

Do you know that immigrantion has prevented our housing market from crashing?

Do you know that illegal immigrantion is worth £6 billion and legal immigrantion is worth over £20 billion to the economy?

Do you know they have kept unemployement figures down, pay taxes and even *drum roll* probably prevented this Country from a recession that was predicted?

no, the BNP tends to ignore the factors when it comes to economic worth

any one with the 12 stars of socialism in their avatars not going to like the mail are they ?

EU and socialism, did you turn left at the traffic lights to get there?

You really do not know anything about socialism, do you?

(The EU has more right wing and centre parties than left wing groups btw)



[edit on 2-11-2006 by infinite]

Originally posted by RetinoidReceptor
In the UK you have limits of accepting Romanians into the country? Doesn't the EU mean anyone has free immigration privileges? Does the UK also have restrictions on the number of Middle Easterns and Pakistanis which you call Asians? Does the UK get a lot of illegal immigrants like the United States?

1) Yes, limits have been imposed to the number of Bulgarians and Romanians. I believe it's 20,000.

2) Technically yes, the EU does mean free immigration privileges... but in practice that's often not the case.

3) Yes, there are limits on those too. I'm not sure of the numbers, however.

4) Well, by definition, it's difficult to say how many illegal immigrants the UK has. Guesses range from a few thousand to hundreds of thousands... the far-right of British politics tend to make a big issue of this. Whilst I agree it's a problem that needs to be dealt with, I think some people and groups blow it out of proportion for their own gain (such as the BNP *spits*).

Originally posted by D4rk Kn1ght
Do you have any idea how stupid the goverment sounded after they said the exact same thing about te Poles.

- There is no similarity.

Unlike on this occasion the British Gov did not attempt to limit the number of Poles (or any of the other nationals from the last expansion) coming to the UK when Poland et al joined the EU.

That is so utterly unlike the situation now with the Bulgarians and Romanians.

It's true that they under-estimated the numbers who came but, as it turned out, so what?
What harm was there?
You are implying there was something negative about the numbers of Polish people that came......what are they supposed to have done that was so negative and terrible?

There are umteen positive, quantifiable and factual effects to note thanks to their coming here but, as per, the negative is merely a nebulous 'something' implied.

I don't think you'll find a single serious commentator that would say that the immigration to the UK, from the last wave of new entrant countries to the EU was, on balance, harmful to the UK economy or culture.

BTW do you know how many went east to work in these emergent countries?
Many large European and international companies invested in these countries bringing thousands of workers east to manage and instruct new employees in these emergent markets.
Many US companies operating in western Europe moved east once the doors opened taking managers, training staff and key skilled staff to the new countries.
It does work both ways you know.

l don't want to get into a flamer war with you or any one else

- Don't worry, we don't do 'flame wars' here, try that and we'll probably be saying 'goodbyeeeee' in rapid order.

but I see a massive influx of romanians as a very unsettling and destabilising event for the UK.

- Maybe it would be and maybe it wouldn't. We shall see what happens.

But meanwhile I do see new British laws and pan-EU agreement to prevent a "massive influx", so I still don't see any sign of it in the making nor any serious grounds to imagine that is a likely scenario.

FYI, I have worked along side Police services across the UK, and what i have seen and experienced of Romanians makes me very very wary of them per se.

- ......and what?
A good pal of mine worked for almost 20yrs in the British Police and you should hear him sound off about the British general public.

It's still all just sweeping generalisations and an absurd way to label and 'trash' a whole nation tho.
Quite obviously not something to take too seriously, in other words.

As for the daily mail, well if it doesn't suit your views thats fine

- Well if you really think the ex-Hitler-loving (remind them of that when they're doing their 'never trust/never forget!' type spiel.....'course they mean everybody else, not them ) Daily Mail is anything more than a disreputable, grotesquely partial and laughably biased right-wing comic, feel free
but
don't worry, relax, you really don't have to be 'on the left' to get a good laugh at and appreciate their ridiculous daily pantomime act.

but hey, any one with the 12 stars of socialism in their avatars not going to like the mail are they ?

If you honestly believe 'the EU' is all about 'socialism' well that's your look out too.

I don't know what you imagine the term 'socialism' to actually mean
but it's pretty clear that if you think the sovereign nation states of the EU are 'socialist' in any real and meaningful way (with the singular exception, perhaps, of Sweden.....and even that is highly debatable)
then I can only say that you really don't know what the definition of the term 'socialism' actually is.

If you'd care to show us a few examples of (any) economies where 'the workers hold collective ownership of all of, or ever the majority of, the means of production' across even a few EU countries I'm all ears.

Paranoid? no. Talking from alot of personal experience? yes.

- What "personal experience"?
Nobody has a "personal experience" of this yet.

The Bulgarians and Romanians don't even join the EU until 2007, so, yes, I'd call that prefering or choosing to hold a speculative and groundless fear = paranoia.


[edit on 3-11-2006 by sminkeypinkey]

Uk residants have some rights and accsess if they move to Bulgeria such as free medical care although it is still advised to go private forget the reasons probably get seen quicker or better treatment. Its a case of I will scratch your back and you scratch mine. I think brittan are so busy trying to please other people in other countries to score browney points prehaps.

I do know that Briton wants to strive forward and sucseed and this is what we teach our kids. To aim high and work your behind off for a morgage a nice car expensive holidays, to be stressed out to hell, have no time for family, kids get ignored so they turn to crime because parents dont give them enough stimulation as they don't have much time. The Gov gets tax out of high and medium earners and so on

Bulgarians and Romainians are happy to clean toilets and pack chickens for a living and if a brittish child had a job like that the parents will be dissapointed because everyone EXPECTS BETTER. Bulgarians Poles and the like are far more laid back and they are happy to do the jobs we hate!

Someone has to do it after all!! Yes they are much more skilled as well because were too busy teaching kids a 80% of things they will never have any use or need for completely waisting so much time. Teach them useful skills like mechanics real computer engineering not just learning to search the net or type and save documents. Teach them to make things such as furniture, teach them how to fix things instead of ALGEBRA who the hell uses that anyway I don't no anyone who has ever used it!! Get kids involved in vocational work that THEY WANT TO DO, not the crap they are FORCED to do.

Prehaps if people are givin things they are intrested in there would be less crime as people wouldn't be so board.

There are lots of Romainians in Spain where my friends live and there is never any trouble, everyone lives happily side by side.

Yes there will be race hate and gangs, we have this already in places but the Brittish also run illigal sex trades bringing slaves into the country, A BRITTISH WOMAN FROM NORTH WALES WAS ARRESTED EARLIER THIS YEAR. A big drugs trade operates amoungst the brittish ran by Brittish Yobs, we have violent football hooligans as another poster mentions. Lets worry about our own people and things happenin in the hear and now and not worry about the future, well just have to deal with it when/if it happens.