Are Catholics still excommunicated if they join..

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posted on Feb, 1 2007 @ 05:03 PM
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Short answer - yes they are excommunicated.

Here is the text of the document:

CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH


DECLARATION ON MASONIC ASSOCIATIONS



It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church’s decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous Code.

This Sacred Congregation is in a position to reply that this circumstance in due to an editorial criterion which was followed also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as they are contained in wider categories.

Therefore the Church’s negative judgment in regard to Masonic association remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable with the doctrine of the Church and therefore membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful who enrol in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion.

It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what has been decided above, and this in line with the Declaration of this Sacred Congregation issued on 17 February 1981 (cf. AAS 73 1981 pp. 240-241; English language edition of L’Osservatore Romano, 9 March 1981).

In an audience granted to the undersigned Cardinal Prefect, the Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication of this Declaration which had been decided in an ordinary meeting of this Sacred Congregation.

Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, 26 November 1983.

Joseph Card. RATZINGER
Prefect

+ Fr. Jerome Hamer, O.P.
Titular Archbishop of Lorium
Secretary




posted on Feb, 1 2007 @ 05:14 PM
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But isn't the stance softening a little bit and it's becoming more accepted?



posted on Feb, 1 2007 @ 05:17 PM
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Originally posted by da bears
Short answer - yes they are excommunicated.

Here is the text of the document:

CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH


DECLARATION ON MASONIC ASSOCIATIONS



It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church’s decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous Code.

This Sacred Congregation is in a position to reply that this circumstance in due to an editorial criterion which was followed also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as they are contained in wider categories.

Therefore the Church’s negative judgment in regard to Masonic association remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable with the doctrine of the Church and therefore membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful who enrol in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion.

It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what has been decided above, and this in line with the Declaration of this Sacred Congregation issued on 17 February 1981 (cf. AAS 73 1981 pp. 240-241; English language edition of L’Osservatore Romano, 9 March 1981).

In an audience granted to the undersigned Cardinal Prefect, the Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication of this Declaration which had been decided in an ordinary meeting of this Sacred Congregation.

Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, 26 November 1983.

Joseph Card. RATZINGER
Prefect

+ Fr. Jerome Hamer, O.P.
Titular Archbishop of Lorium
Secretary


Considering he was in the Hitler Youth I dont put much stock in his opinions.



posted on Feb, 1 2007 @ 05:53 PM
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Originally posted by corsig
But isn't the stance softening a little bit and it's becoming more accepted?


In my parish, I know of one man who is a Freemason - a good man - I am in the Knights of Columbus so this has come up a few times in conversations with him. The difficulty is in the "indifferentism" component of Freemasonry - that all religions are equal. This places Jesus on the same plane as Buddah, Krishna, Mohammad (sorry for the spelling). Catholic and mainstream Protestant theology holds that Jesus is the living God come down to live, and die as one of us and it is only throught Him that salvation is brought into the world. So it is beacuse of Jesus (here is where Catholic and Protestants may differ) that Hindus, Muslims, and Jews get to Heaven as well as Christians. We are judged by the "light", the understanding we have been given. Waaaaay to complicated to go into detail here but I think you get the drift. By the way, my Freemason friend believes as I do about Jesus so his relationship with the Catholic Church is something he works with to the best of his understanding. For me, my understanding and willing obedience to church law forbids my association with Masonic organizations.



posted on Feb, 1 2007 @ 06:42 PM
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I'm a non-practicing Catholic and just became a mason. There are a lot of Catholics in the lodge. I was told by one brother that at another lodge he once belonged to, there was a Catholic priest who was a member. Also, I've heard there are quite a few brothers who belong to both the masons and knights of columbus. When it comes right down to it the majority of Catholics are cafeteria Catholics, they don't give a damn what church law says. Birth control is another perfect example, and for the most part the threat of excommunication is a joke now a days. If they kick you out the church down the street will be more then happy to have you and your money.

Michael



posted on Feb, 1 2007 @ 07:19 PM
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Originally posted by da bears
Short answer - yes they are excommunicated.


Apparently not "across the board"

As you can see from my previous posts, I went through RCIA and TOLD the Priest I was an active Freemason, asked him it it was OK...wrote "yes" on the registration paper that asked if I was a Freemason and NO ONE...neither Priest nor Bishop had a problem with it.

I went through RCIA and became a full member at Easter Vigil (with the Bishop as celebrant).

Some time later I joined the Knights of Columbus (and am now a 33rd Degree Mason and a 3rd Degree Knight of Columbus).

They accept my tithe every month and I receive communion every time I attend Mass (several times a week)

As I said before, there's much disscussion that says "yes" and "no" and when I receive a personal note from the Holy Father himself telling me that I cannot remain a Freemason AND be a Roman Catholic, I will terminate my membership.

Internet postings and web-links will not suffice. I require a letter from the Pope...as my Parish Priest and the Bishop of my Diocese know me well and know that I'm a very active 33rd Degree Mason...and have no trouble with it.

Something leads me to believe that they know more than the...should we say...average Joe.

My two cents.



posted on Feb, 2 2007 @ 10:51 AM
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Originally posted by da bears

Originally posted by corsig
But isn't the stance softening a little bit and it's becoming more accepted?


In my parish, I know of one man who is a Freemason - a good man - I am in the Knights of Columbus so this has come up a few times in conversations with him. The difficulty is in the "indifferentism" component of Freemasonry - that all religions are equal. This places Jesus on the same plane as Buddah, Krishna, Mohammad (sorry for the spelling).

Hi da bears

I understand that this perception of "indifferentism" causes problems with freemasonry for many Christians. But I am of the opinion that freemasonry actually is not in any way indifferent to religion, and/or Christianity.

My Grand Lodge makes the following statement:

"Freemasonry is far from indifferent to religion. Without interfering in religious practice it expects each member to follow his own faith, and to place above all other duties his duty to God, by whatever name He is known."


There is also no explicit or implicit statement from an official masonic source that all religions are regarded by freemasonry as equal - I believe this is an assumption made by individuals on the basis that freemasonry has an opinion on the matter, which it does not. Freemasonry makes no comment on the validity or otherwise of any given God. It enables members of different faiths to pray together in the same way that prayers can be said:

At the commencement of a city council meeting
At the beginning of a sports event
At a funeral
At the meal table
At a scouting event

At all of these ocassions one could find oneself sitting or standing next to a non-christian who would, presumably be praying to a 'different' god. Likewise on attending a Bar Mitzvah as a guest, when prayers are raised to God the Christian visitor presumably is in no doubt to whom his prayers are raised (should he elect to join in).

Anyway, sorry to ramble on, but its just so refreshing to read a viewpoint contrary to mine put forward with integrity, maturity and honesty. SS forums have been lacking that recently, and I thank you.





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