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Ghosts: Debunked on Yahoo!

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posted on Oct, 27 2006 @ 01:04 PM
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During a morning sweep of the headlines today, my attention was grabbed by this line on the front page of Yahoo: Halloween Bummer: Ghosts Debunked

The article references a paper written by a professor at the University of Central Florida named Costas Efthimiou. The paper is called Ghosts, Vampires, and Zombies: Cinema Fiction v. Physics Reality

I’m just going to focus on his two points about ghosts. (Efthimiou goes on to “debunk” vampires by claiming that the earth’s population simply couldn’t sustain a vampire population over the course of a few centuries. As far as the zombie part goes…I won’t lie…I don’t really read about zombies unless it’s the manual for a video game.)

The paper “debunks” ghosts by focusing on two aspects of the paranormal:


1) People receive a "cold chill" when encountering ghosts.


…sharp temperature drops are very commonly reported in association with supposed real-life encounters with ghosts or poltergeists. This feature of supposed ghost sightings lends itself naturally to physical explanation.


Efthimiou goes on to give a Physics 101 lesson of what “heat” is. (i.e., heat and cold are not entities that are encountered, they are simply symptoms of heat energy being transferred from a warmer entity to a cooler entity.) After a lengthy explanation regarding the transfer of heat energy, the author lays out his history-making “debunk.” Ladies and gentlemen I give you…SCIENCE:


The rumor that ‘cold spots’ are associated with ghosts seems to be a myth created by the construction of old buildings and the vivid imagination of people.


Go ahead. Read it again.
Talk about getting left cold.

And just in case all you foolish ghost-hunters are not feeling properly PWNED, here comes debunking #2:


2) Ghosts can walk through walls.

The author begins this section with a solid scientific example…


For instance in the movie “Ghost” (starring Patrick Swaze, Demi Moore, Whoopi Goldberg), the recently deceased main character tries desperately to save his former lover from a violent intruder. His attempts grant him no avail, as at each lunge he passes right through the perpetrator. It is interesting, however, that he was able to walk up the stairs just previous to this.


Here’s the thing, if you are going to reference my man Patrick Swayze in a scientific analysis of anything, at least take the time to research the spelling of his name.

But I digress. Let’s continue…

The professor goes on to explain that it doesn’t make any sense for a ghost to be able to walk, which requires a certain reliance on Newton’s 1st and 3rd laws of motion, yet be able to walk through walls, which requires an entity to disregard those same physical rules.


So which is it? Are ghosts material or material-less? Maybe they are only material when it comes to walking.


Okay professor, but believers in the paranormal may need solid proof…


Well then we must assume that they can’t control this selective material-lessness, otherwise Patrick Swayze would have saved his girlfriend in “Ghost.”


DOUBLE PWNED!! In your face TAPS.
And he even spelled Swayze right! TRIPLE PWNED!!!

If you’ll excuse me for a minute, there’s something I need to do…

* * *
Dear Yahoo,

In regards to your “Debunking of Ghosts” article, I feel that you have left out significant research done in this area by Bill Cosby (Ghost Dad, 1990), Richard Dreyfuss (Always, 1989), and Bill Murray (Ghostbusters, 1984).

Please remove this article until it has been properly amended.

Sincerely,
Essedarius

* * *




posted on Oct, 27 2006 @ 01:15 PM
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Ghost Dad??? You mean that wasn't just a bad dream I had as a child?

Have you ever heard of the "Brown Noise" or "Brown Tone". It is supposedly a certain pitch that when experienced causes a person to lose bodily control of their.. yes.

This news report, plus your critical analysis of it, have all of the hallmarks of a "Brown Thread".


Better than coffee.



posted on Oct, 27 2006 @ 01:17 PM
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Obviously, he hasn't seen the supported amount of evidence to their reality which has been seen on tv and online. How does he explain the enormous amount of poltergeist activity; especially in the abscence of another physical force (i.e. hoax).

I have had my own experiences with the paranormal and researched others experiences with the paranormal. In the genuine cases; especially by research groups with many years experiences and with qualified members of the teams. I would think that they are having a laugh at him, and debunking him and his remarks based on ignorance and not research.

He obviously hasn't researched the evidence that has been compiled over the recent years.

Knowing him, if he was haunted, he would rationalize it to death.



posted on Oct, 27 2006 @ 01:42 PM
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Sorry but nothing has been debunked but the same old theories of certain aspects of the paranormal linked to well known occurrences and theme base movies.

Nothing more.

Is just an opinion like many other opinions going around discrediting issues that other wise can not be explained.



posted on Oct, 27 2006 @ 06:43 PM
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To give credit where credit is due, however, I think there is some merit in thinking about the implication that it is silly for a "non-materialized" entity to walk.

If we agree that an apparition has a fleeting relationship (at best) with our material world, then there would be only two reasons for the numerous accounts of ghosts walking:

1)
Every ghost that is seen as walking along a surface is, in fact, a vision proceeding from the heat-oppressed brain of the viewer and doesn't actually exist. The viewer is actually pressing their world view (that is, the view that when an entity moves it involves either wheels or feet) onto a hallucination.

Or

2)
It is a voluntary or involuntary action of the ghost to keep up the façade that they are part of our reality. Possibly they don’t want to let go, or possibly they are trying not to freak us out by simply levitating all over the place.

Let’s face it…levitating is creepy.

Me personally, I would go with option number two.

So maybe the author isn't as far off base as I might have implied...although I refuse to offer forgiveness for presenting a Demi Moore movie as “Exhibit A.”



posted on Oct, 27 2006 @ 07:23 PM
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I am not sure if 1) covers this but..

A 'ghost' that does not apear to interact with its surroundings in a physical way, yet DOES exhibit the behavior of walking on a solid floor could also be part of what has been come to be known as a residual haunting, however, from the way I see it, that would also make it not a proper ghost.



This article would be like trying to decipher the truth about aliens from watching and analyzing Will Smith movies.



posted on Oct, 27 2006 @ 07:52 PM
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Originally posted by Essedarius
To give credit where credit is due, however, I think there is some merit in thinking about the implication that it is silly for a "non-materialized" entity to walk.


That merit belong to the article understanding of what is deem to be the truth, no necessarily the views and opinions of . . .let say a believer. . .

I personally and by experience do not agree with your number one explanation.

But I will agree with you on number 2 explanation, and levitating,flying and hovering is and the appearance of ghost are only the manifestation of what the person having the experience may want to see.

I agree also that movies are poor choices to express what a person experiences may be.



posted on Oct, 27 2006 @ 08:18 PM
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that's one of the worst attempts at debunking i've ever seen. It's blatantly poorly thought out and biased. I'm all for questioning the existence of ghosts, but the questioner should appraoch the exploration with skepticism, not preconcieved notions, and arguments should be based on more significant material than a movie.

The first point explains away one example of temperature change, when the merit for paranormal activity of this example wasn't very strong in the first place. I'm not sure how his point explains sudden and sharp rises or drops followed by stabalization of temperature in single areas of a room which doesn't usually exhibit such behaviour. I'm not saying there aren't any scientific explanations, and i don't generally regard temperature change as proof of ghosts, but i also don't discredit it. The fact that this article only attempts to briefly discredit one case of temperateure change, and not even a case with genuinely interesting temperature phenomenon means it's worthless and doesn't really debunk anything, just states the obvious.

The second point is just silly. When you're talking about something like ghosts, and you use a physical, third dimensional argument to try and debunk them, you've lost before you've started. The entire concept of ghosts relies on sets of laws beyond that of this physical plane, laws that our current scientific understanding does not solidly explain. Quantum Physics gives decent effort towards theorising multi-dimensionality, but even then there is no solid fact involved. So when somebody tries to explain ghostly acitivty solely based on our own physical laws they're automatically setting themselves up for a fall. Building evidence on ignorance never works.

This article is no different to any other attempting to debunk ghosts. In this case the debunker uses poor examples and very minimal examples. He obviously knows what he's talking about when it comes to physics, but the way he applies his knowledge makes it blindingly obvious that he knows little - or is at least illustrating little understanding - about paranormal activities. Like i said, i'm all for skepticism, and there may well be explanations for ghostly activity, but not in that article.



posted on Oct, 27 2006 @ 09:26 PM
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Originally posted by rachel07
Obviously, he hasn't seen the supported amount of evidence to their reality which has been seen on tv and online. How does he explain the enormous amount of poltergeist activity; especially in the abscence of another physical force.


Physical manifestation of a psychological trauma? Or physical manifestation of pubescent sexual emotions? Most Poltergeist activity involves a young girl.

We are yet to fully understand the Human brain and it's abilities. I would go with the above scientific explanations before I say it's an evil spirit from the great beyond...


[edit on 27/10/2006 by ANOK]



posted on Oct, 28 2006 @ 02:53 AM
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But, wait a minute! I know ghosts can do all of those goofy things because I see it every week on "Ghost Whisperer". So, The professor just hasn't been watching the right medium, get it... medium, oh never mind. He should just watch TV and forget about the movies.



posted on Oct, 28 2006 @ 07:14 AM
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This is another of those articles that popup every year at this time. It can be summed up as follows.
"If you cant dazzle them with your brillance, Baffle them with your BS."



posted on Oct, 28 2006 @ 12:33 PM
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Yeah ghosts don't actually walk through walls THEY FLOAT LOL. This guy is going to have to do much better than this to DEBUNK ghosts.

We are molecules, particules, protons, electrons, neutrons etc etc. When our physical bodies die our Atoms break down and reform to begin to create something new. The energy of that person remains in form of SPIRIT made up of the very things a physical body is made up of without skin and bone. Spirits get around via electro magnetic feilds hence electrics going haywire at the presance of a spirit/ghost. This is how spirit is recorded on tape recorders and how they communicte via WHITE NOISE. You professor has not debunked spooks from this side of the coin. WHATS THE POINT IN DOING HALF A JOB?

I am a Parapsychologist student and if this guy can call himself a professor SO CAN I cause I know more than he CLAIMS......Sorry but what a load of PANTS LOL



posted on Nov, 2 2006 @ 06:55 PM
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Originally posted by IncarnAngel
The energy of that person remains in form of SPIRIT made up of the very things a physical body is made up of without skin and bone. Spirits get around via electro magnetic feilds hence electrics going haywire at the presance of a spirit/ghost.


So I'm curious...how is it that poltergeists manipulate their surroundings?
Are they different ghosts, or are they ghosts that are not quite as ethereal as most?



posted on Nov, 10 2006 @ 06:17 AM
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Its all energy, sometimes poltogist activity can be due to US, the power of the mind is completely underestimated. People can subconciously move obejects without realising.

There are Ghosts who move objects, sometimes it is to get your attention because they want help to go to the other side. Sometimes it is because they don't want you there. They think they are still alive and wounder what your doing in there house!! They may be warning you of people with false intentions which has happened to me. E.g things only happen when a certain person comes to your home.

The main point it is all energy still, it operates on waves, the bigger the stone the bigger the ripple. The bigger the electronic force field the more a poltoghist can achieve physically. Lay lines have a big effect, these are either positive or negative and poltoghist can be active on negative lay lines as the frequency is lower and more powerful.

Its all scientific and quite technical.

Humans are made up with a percentage of metal which acts as a reactor to magnetic energy. Hence why we recieve electrical charges from ballons when rubbing them on your head, or we recieve static shocks so naturally humans can attract electro magnetic fields and influence them at the same time. Electrical equipment can go haywire when a person is very stressed or very upset because of the patterns and waves given off via the auric field, which is a tranciever in its own right.

Non poltoghist ghosts are less etheral than poltoghists as they need to be closer to the physical etheric elements, they are heavier and lower in frequencies allowing them to manipulate magnetic energy.

I am not sure if it is a case that SOME spirits/ghosts can grasp use of energy to manipulate objects while other LESS EXPERIENCED ghosts need to practice somewhat this art. Some people think it has do with how many lives you have had against how experienced you are. I don't quite no the answer, maybe they can ALL do it but its a matter of CHOICE. It may be they operate on different vibrational frequencies and there may not be a choice at all. I don't know if they can shape shift to different frequencies, or if only some can and others can't. Would be interesting to find out. Maybe someone else can be more specific. I haven't covered this on my parapsychology course just yet!


[edit on 10-11-2006 by IncarnAngel]



posted on Nov, 11 2006 @ 11:01 PM
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I have been touched by a ghost on my foot twice, first one woke me up and the second one freaked me out. Just dreaming you say? My brother had the same experience on the exact same night except it grabbed at his foot.

I have also had something leaning on me as if it was sitting beside me. The coolest was seeing a black blob floating over my power cables. This all happened over a two week period and no ghostly activities have occurred since.



posted on Nov, 16 2006 @ 05:28 PM
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Originally posted by DraconianKing
I have been touched by a ghost on my foot twice, first one woke me up and the second one freaked me out. Just dreaming you say? My brother had the same experience on the exact same night except it grabbed at his foot.

I have also had something leaning on me as if it was sitting beside me. The coolest was seeing a black blob floating over my power cables. This all happened over a two week period and no ghostly activities have occurred since.


I have just left my job because my boss whant to demolish the building and turn it into flats. This has upset the local resident GHOST. He has bannged on the kitchen window terrifying a memeber of staff. Another girl felt resistance trying to open a door as if someone had hold of the door handle. I have felt his presance on a number of occasions and one afternoon it was so strong i nearly passed out.
I then saw him last week walk across the front door. My boss has seen him in the toilets.

They say when ghosts are upset due to change all sorts of phenomenom begin to occur!

Either we all need to see a psychiatrist at the same time ....WHICH I VERY MUCH DOUBT or GHOST ARE CERTAINLY REAL.

I was also touched on the finger at work on my last day as I got some food out of the microwave. It felt as if a physical person touched me, I wasn't scared as it was a nice experiance.
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