Originally posted by half_minded
It depends on the situation actually. Ill give you example from my own family. I am from a muslim family from india. As you know, there have always been tensions between India and Pakistan (which is a muslim country).
Now if there is a conflict on some physical region, then my parents seem to support india but if there is religion conflict then my parents support pakistan.
Thanks for the reply half-minded -very informative.
I think this thread is going to get side-tracked into muslim-bashing and you're going to be pretty busy fighting other battles, but I'd like to come back at you on a few points.
First one would be your statement about 'religion conflict'. Most Europeans are really 'post-religious', and more interested in their material wealth or personal freedoms, which is perfectly valid, imo.
So let's say a Dane draws a satirical cartoon, or the pope states that Islam can be aggressive? Most Westerners would accept that under freedom of speech even if they didn't agree. Do you think muslims should accept this, or at least confine their protests to non-violent actions?
And from what I have seen, every muslim guys considers himself Indian first and muslim second. Infact, that goes for the non-muslim friends too.
But hey, the new generation is the one who will shape the future. So, I guess the whole extremism thing in Islam is fading away slowly.
I wonder if it comes back to integration - North American muslims seem to integrate, whereas, at least the 7/7 bombers in the UK really didn't.
Concept of Umma is very simple. . Prophet Mohammad was the last prophet and it was said that every human being till the end of the world (Judgement Day) is his Umma. Muslims are expected to spread their religion to every soul on earth because everyone is under prophet muhammad's umma. Non-muslim people are considered as the people who have lost the right path and therefore it is the duty of every muslim to bring everyone to the 'right path'.
Thanks for the explanation! I have no problems with the religious except when they start to infringe on my rights to live my life according to Western norms. Do you feel that post-religious people have the right to refuse the message of Islam? Can islam live alongside other religions and the non-religious?
So its more like saying that we are human. People consider themselves human first then comes the race and distinction.
OK. But. A muslim in London has religious freedom. A Christian (or Buddhist) in Saudi or Egypt doesn't. I was under the impression 'Umma' meant 'muslim brotherhood', rather than 'human'.
But we all know that its not the case because not every muslim follows islam wholeheartedly. out of those who follow, there are moderates and extremists.
Moderates, as I described earlier, look at the situtation first. Extremists however are way too engrossed in Islam and consider every single word in the Quran as the absolute final word.
Yup, you have religious extremists who are Christians too, difference being they have less power in the West because most people are Christian in name only.
I think if most people had the impression that being a muslim didn't interfere with national loyalties (think of Catholics in England in the 16th century) or meant imposition of values on other people (Sharia Law on non-muslims) then I don't think anyone would have a problem with that.
What's your position on Sudan and Nigerian provinces imposing sharia law on non-muslims?
You posted a long answer! I had to cut your post to get anything else in...I'll go back and try to get at the rest now.