North Korea says nuclear test successful

The world will never be the same. This action will turn Asian politics and diplomacy on their collective ear. Japan is likely to militarize as it has not since pre-WWII. The US will have to gear up for strategic attacks against NK and South Korea's economic development will certainly be affected by the extra military expenditures that will follow. Decisive action is mandatory.

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BTW I'm hearing on the news that according to US sources the blast was only in the range of 4KT, that is weak. Apparently North Korea expected a result of 400KT which would have been impressive and VERY serious.

There really is no such thing as a weak nuclear weapon. I don't know what there intention was, but none the less the genie is out of the bottle. I say it's time to destroy the bottle.

Gave china 20 minutes warning, and apparently no fallout.

It measured 3.5 on the Richter scale. The indians managed only 5.0 and that was 12 kilotons. So its less than 12 kilotons and might be 1kt


Compare with indian results

If the devices actually produced the yields claimed by Indian weapon scientists, we would expect to observe a seismic signal strength corresponding to 55 kilotons, or magnitude 5.76 on the Richter scale. Instead, the average recorded magnitude was 5.0, which indicates a probable yield of 12 kilotons, with the range possibly as low as 5 kilotons and as high as 25 kilotons.

Wikipedia also list some examples
3.5 _____ 178 metric tons______Chernobyl nuclear disaster, 1986
4.0 ______1 kiloton_____________Small atomic bomb


So its about the power of Chernobyl

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Two words, dumb move. Congratulations North Korea, you just further isolated yourself by turning your only supporter against you, China. And by also showing your true capabilities and intentions, which in turn, give a dose of reality to those who supported you before. Not to mention making the geopolitical, military, and security situation in

YUP, I agree with you. Let him enjoy his new nuke (it used to be only for peaceful puposes, like Iran is saying) power.

[sarcasm]It is going to help his country so much now.[sarcasm].

The only thing he just accomplished is further isolating his country off from the rest of the world where they will fall further into poverty.

Where are those people who feel like it is Iran's right to have nuclear power for peaceful puposes?

Mark my words, just like NK, the next thing you will be hearing is that they are testing a nuclear bomb. If you have nothing to hide, why wouldn't you let international commisions inspect anything they want to?

The rest of the world just needs to isolate these countries now and let them enjoy their new found power until their own people are ready to change their government.

[edit on 9/10/06 by Keyhole]

I forget now, but how did NK come by this fissionable material?

They have plutonium reprocessing plants that seperate plutonium 239 from their reactor's spent fuel rods.

North Korea's Plutonium Program GlobalSecurity.org

Flashback: N. Korea moves nuke fuel rods - Dec. 26, 2002


[edit on 9-10-2006 by Regenmacher]

Did the U.S provoke North Korea?
www.guerrillanews.com...

Originally posted by chinawhite
Gave china 20 minutes warning, and apparently no fallout.

It measured 3.5 on the Richter scale. The indians managed only 5.0 and that was 12 kilotons. So its less than 12 kilotons and might be 1kt


Compare with indian results

If the devices actually produced the yields claimed by Indian weapon scientists, we would expect to observe a seismic signal strength corresponding to 55 kilotons, or magnitude 5.76 on the Richter scale. Instead, the average recorded magnitude was 5.0, which indicates a probable yield of 12 kilotons, with the range possibly as low as 5 kilotons and as high as 25 kilotons.

Wikipedia also list some examples
3.5 _____ 178 metric tons______Chernobyl nuclear disaster, 1986
4.0 ______1 kiloton_____________Small atomic bomb


So its about the power of Chernobyl

Ok.. since you're posting this all over the place, I have to ask you:
Which Indian test are you talking about?
Shakti I or II?
Looks like the latter to me more and more..

From personal experience with conventional explosives, there's no such thing as small nuclear explosion. In 1993 I set up a blast of 19,000 lbs of Class A 1.1 E explosives. It left a crater about 50 foot deep and about 150 foot across that only 9.5 tons of explosives. Do the math, a kiloton nuclear blast is 100 times stronger, literally burns the air and would completely destroy an area of over half mile wide. Then there's the fallout, radiation sickness and cancers to follow. Even the Chinese are condemning this act. We have a Hitler with a bomb.

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
I forget now, but how did NK come by this fissionable material?

Concerns have also been raised about Pakistan as a proliferant of nuclear materials and expertise. In November, 2002, shortly after North Korea admitted to pursuing a nuclear weapons program, the press reported allegations that Pakistan had provided assistance in the development of its uranium enrichment program in exchange for North Korean missile technologies.
Source : FAS

Haha anybody pointing fingers at China?
Its a major US non-NATO ally!!

Please don't cry foul now..
Another Source.

Maybe the material was mined at home but the tech has come from ..cough..cough..

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
I forget now, but how did NK come by this fissionable material?

Well you asked!

Rumsfeld's Dirty Bomb
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Written September, 2004.

Secretary of Defense, Donald Rumsfeld, sat on the board of ABB Combustion Engineering from 1990 through 2000. During seven of these ten years, ABB aggressively sought to secure a contract with North Korea to build nuclear reactors. During this same period of time, in a blatant conflict of interest, Donald Rumsfeld headed the Rumsfeld Commission which looked into the growing ballistic missile threat.

[reduced quote to relevant content]

[edit on 10/9/2006 by 12m8keall2c]

And another source.

If your read it well enough, its easy to conclude that the assistance provided was not by a 'renegade' A Q Khan himself, but actually a eapons exchange f\program fully endorsed by the government, and the military most notably Musharraf himself.

Im no political expert but why should Korea listen to the UN and not test nuclear weapons when countries like America can go to war against the UN's wishes (Afghanistan)?????

also why is one country allowed to have nuclear capabilities and another not?

Originally posted by g60kg
Im no political expert but why should Korea listen to the UN and not test nuclear weapons when countries like America can go to war against the UN's wishes (Afghanistan)?????

also why is one country allowed to have nuclear capabilities and another not?

I totally agree with you.
Bush should keep his nose out, and so should Blair.
Who the hell are they to say if one country can have nuclear weapons, and another can't.

The Bush administration are'nt the good guys, and to be honest IMHO N.Korea are probably saying to America and others "come and have a go if you think you're hard enough."

In other words: "Don't try and bully us like you have the other country's.

Originally posted by g60kg
Im no political expert but why should Korea listen to the UN and not test nuclear weapons when countries like America can go to war against the UN's wishes (Afghanistan)?????

also why is one country allowed to have nuclear capabilities and another not?

I doesn't need to listen to anybody, but it will literally implode if the neighbouring countries cut off aid, fuel, food etc..
if that happens they'll be forced to sell such means to terror groups in order to make up for the loss of input.
Very very grave situation indeed.
For this purpose alone I hope everybody doesn't go slapping on sanctions..

Originally posted by DYepes
Perhaps they alreayd had everything in place way before the time they announced they would test, and that is why everyones satellites did not pick up any activity. Good for Korea, perhaps now they can supply themselves with the energy they need to sustain a more stable society. It seems pretty stable to me now anyways though.

Excuse me? This is the worst thing to happen to the region in decades. It's most likely going to start an Arms race in the region. Japan can have a Nuke in a matter of months if it wanted, same with Sth Korea. Why would you applaud Nuclear Weapons proliferation?

Detonating a Nuke in no way helps their energy program. That is not how Nuclear Reactors work. There is only one purpose for a nuke and that is utter destruction.

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
There really is no such thing as a weak nuclear weapon. I don't know what there intention was, but none the less the genie is out of the bottle. I say it's time to destroy the bottle.

How would you destroy the bottle without Sth Korea taking heavy casualties? There are million man armies facing each other across the DMZ. They have Nuclear weapons now. How in the hell can you solve this militarily?!? YOU CAN'T! Any attempt would be suicidal.

EDIT: The only way this could be solved militarily, is if China were to invade Nth Korea as that border is undefended I believe.

[edit on 9-10-2006 by sardion2000]

Originally posted by Daedalus3

Originally posted by g60kg
Im no political expert but why should Korea listen to the UN and not test nuclear weapons when countries like America can go to war against the UN's wishes (Afghanistan)?????

also why is one country allowed to have nuclear capabilities and another not?

I doesn't need to listen to anybody, but it will literally implode if the neighbouring countries cut off aid, fuel, food etc..
if that happens they'll be forced to sell such means to terror groups in order to make up for the loss of input.
Very very grave situation indeed.
For this purpose alone I hope everybody doesn't go slapping on sanctions..

The international community says NK can't have nukes. The NPT says they can't have nukes. Pretty much everyone in the free world says they can't have nukes. Why are you so different?

They actually did it

There is one reason the North Koreans did this and that's blackmail. Make no mistake, there is no danger of the North Koreans using nuclear weapons aggressively. This test is just another event in the long line of "look at me! pay attention to me!" acts to have come from Pyongyang. Japan was holding it's first face to face meeting with China in over 6 years. That would of hurt Pyongyang's ego and sense of importance.

North Korea wasnt getting what it wanted from aid deals and military concessions (non-aggression pacts) so it's done what it always does, ratchet up the vitriole and tension to the point where it cannot be ignored. Which is effectively what this test has now done as far as Japan and the United States is concerned.

No longer can lack of oil cause the Korean penninsular to be relegated to low priority for the United States. Even when the Iraq War 2.0 was in it's preparation stages North Korea was openly breaking the Non-proliferation treaty yet it was ignored in preference for Iraq which was only "suspected" of having a nuclear program.

Since North Korea is now a political priority in both Japan (with it's brand new Prime Minister it should be noted) and the United States it can now squeeze out much more concessions for it's nuclear disarmament. A nuclear disarmament that it once offered for the bargain basement price of a non-aggression pact from the United States.

So the only big question now is, what will they ask for so as to disarm? I have a feeling they will get what they ask for.

Please read my Op/Ed from last year for some background info on how North Korea plays these events out.

OP/ED: The North Korean Nuclear Confrontation: A History Of Efforts

This is certainly a development! Kim Jong has run the gauntlet, he's picked it up and thrown it back into the face of a world that condemns him. The only thing to do now is to wait and see if that world can goad him into using his newly-acquired weapon?

Not far off in the future I think we might see incursions into NK from the South, backed with token forces from a number of other countries. Even more sanctions will be put in place before we see this, however, and I feel that decisions will be made to cause regime change and eventual re-integration of the North with the South; the country will eventually become whole again: Kim Jong just 'nuked' himself from his job. What the cost will be to that region and the rest of the world is anybody's guess at the moment, but at least we are dealing with a rogue party whose nuclear capability is small (at the moment), and I doubt very much that it will be allowed (whether rightly or wrongly) to make it larger. The longer the world prevaricates and hesitates over action on this, the greater the cost exponentially.

Be under no illusion here, Kim Jong has turned the heat up under the crucible, and pretty soon it will boil over. Political hands have been forced by this, not only have the talks and dialogues been kicked out the window, the table itself has been dismantled. We've all just got accellerated towards the world's first nuclear (but limited) exchange...the world either starves or attacks NK...those are the only options currently left. No doubt all the prophets will be out in force predicting apocalypse and 'end-of-days' scenarios. Will we ever learn?