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LaHaye's "Rapture" Ideology Was Not Even Considered Until 1830

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posted on Oct, 30 2006 @ 06:35 AM

Valhall >> The Evidence of Terral's Anti-Christ Teachings: Christ's prediction of the evil one who will snatch away the message of the kingdom of God:

Why is it that every time I receive replies from any “scholar” on this Board that they have every appearance of being an idiot? This one here quotes many verses using no commentary, but refuses to quote one word I said anywhere! Is that throwing effort after foolishness or what? This contemptuous woman has been “Terral Bashing” with the approval of our Mods for page after page of this ‘Rapture’ thread. Why do some of us receive three warnings for a single offense to have 1500 ATS points removed AND have five threads sent down to BTS, when the privileged among us can get away with character assassination in flaming post after flaming post and nobody does a cotton picking thing????

I cannot defend my original statements, because little Miss Priss here never quotes anything. She quotes parables from the Four Gospels, but offers no evidence that she even begins to understand what is being taught. Does any of this have anything to do with the Rapture Topic? No. She is misusing this thread to continue her “Terral Bashing Campaign” unhindered by our Moderators who appear to be paying no attention at all. How are we supposed to have a Rapture debate for the benefit of unbiased third party readers and judges, when the playing field is turned upside down by all of this “Terral Is The Antichrist” garbage? And this is the work of a “Writer / Scholar”?! Heh . . . The real conspiracy here is that a privileged few are allowed to walk all over the COC guidelines and personally attack any member they like, while others among us must walk the straight and narrow. What next?

Vallhall >> While Terral is pounding out another character-limit-bumping excuse for why he must not be seen as the Deceiver he is, I'll just put up a couple of predictive scriptures on the direction all this anti-christ teaching is going:

Then she has the gall to plaster six verses of Revelation and again with NO COMMENTARY on what those things might mean. The funny thing is she presents her latest blog entry on the “Hate-Mongerer” Topic like she is doing anything but. There is nothing like the pot trying to call the kettle black! This lady would not be lowered to write in this way, if she could pen two solid paragraphs on any of these Bible Topics. How are sins forgiven through her ‘one gospel?’ How do those believers receive the Holy Spirit? Are they under Mosaic Law or not? How are they justified? She hasn’t the slightest clue. : 0 )

My Gospels Thread >>

No one has been saved by this gospel message for almost 2000 years. Our gospel for today is #2 below:

I. Gospel of the Kingdom (Matthew 4:23 , 9:35, 24:14, Acts 8:12). Gospel to the Circumcised. Galatians 2:7.

1. The good news that the ‘kingdom of heaven’ is ‘at hand’ (Matthew 3:2, 4:17, 10:7). i.e., ‘preaching the kingdom’ (Acts 20:25).
2. According to Prophecy; seen by the OT Prophets. Isaiah 40:3, Malachi 3:1.
3. Obtain eternal life by keeping the commandments. Matt. 19:16+17.
4. Water baptism (during confession) for the ‘forgiveness of sins.’ Mark 1:4, Acts 2:38. (John’s Baptism; Acts 19:3; name of the Father; John 1:6, 33, Matt. 28:19.)
5. Baptism in the ‘name of the Lord Jesus’ (Acts 8:16, 19:5), ‘name of the Son’ (Matthew 28:19)
6. Receive the Spirit through the baptism in the ‘name of the Holy Spirit’ (Matthew 28:19) through the laying of hands (Acts 8:17, 19:6).
7. Justified by ‘works and not by faith alone.’ James 2:20-24.
8. Kingdom disciples are under Mosaic Law (Matthew 5:18, James 2:10).

This is our “word of the cross” (1Cor. 1:18) gospel for today, apart from borrowing any works from Gospel #1 above.

II. Paul’s “my gospel” (Romans 2:16, 16:25, etc.). Gospel to the Uncircumcised. Galatians 2:7.

1. The gospel of the grace of God (Acts 20:24), the ‘word of the cross’ (1Corinthians 1:18).
2. According to the revelation of the Mystery; NOT seen by the OT prophets. Romans 16:25.
3. Saved by God’s grace through faith APART from works. Ephesians 2:8+9.
4. Sins forgiven through the redemption IN Christ (Romans 3:24) and His shed blood (Ephesians 1:7).
5. Our ‘one baptism’ (Eph. 4:5) is done by the ‘one Spirit’ (Ephesians 4:4) into the ‘one body’ (1Corinthians 12:13), which is into “Christ’s body” (1Corinthians 12:27).
6. We receive the Spirit when hearing (Romans 10:17) and believing (Ephesians 1:13+14) Paul’s Gospel by ‘hearing with faith.’ Galatians 3:2.
7. We are justified by faith apart from works. Romans 4:4-6.
8. We are under grace and not under law. Romans 6:14.

John the Baptist, Christ and the Twelve all preached Gospel #1 above in the Four Gospels and Acts. Even Paul is ‘preaching the kingdom’ (Acts 20:25) to the disciples of Acts 19:1-6 like most everyone else in Acts. Is Christ preaching Himself crucified here?

“Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God, and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel." Mark 1:14-15.

Well? No. Nobody here can prove that Jesus Christ is preaching our gospel above here in Mark 1 as the “gospel of God,” because He will not die for anyone for another three years. So, what is this “gospel of God” that Christ Himself preached straight out of the box? His is preaching the “gospel of the kingdom” (Matt. 4:23, 9:35, etc.). Paul does not receive our gospel above, until after the start of Acts 9! Does John the Baptist preach the forgiveness of sins through Christ’s shed blood (Eph. 1:7) to start the Four Gospels? No.

"John the Baptist appeared in the wilderness preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. And all the country of Judea was going out to him, and all the people of Jerusalem; and they were being baptized by him in the Jordan River, confessing their sins." Mark 1:4+5.

If Satan had known about our gospel above, he would have never crucified the Lord of Glory (1Cor. 2:6-8). Ms. Valhall here does NOT even know the difference and everything she posts on this topic reveals her IGNORANCE to ‘the truth’ (2Thes. 2:10-12) of this Gospel Topic.

In Christ Jesus,


posted on Oct, 30 2006 @ 07:21 AM

Terral Original >> Nobody has been saved by obeying the ‘gospel of the kingdom’ (Matt. 4:23, 9:35, etc.) for almost 2000 Years. The fact that my debating opponents do NOT know the difference ( ) is ‘their’ problem. How shall “My Spirit” be poured out on all mankind very near the ‘end of the age?’

Valhall >> Look! More anti-christ teachings from the resident Deceiver!

Please . . . Since when are ‘one-liner’ member bashing ‘flaming’ posts allowed on the ATS Board? This place keeps sinking lower and lower and lower indeed. Has Valhall established that anyone has had sins forgiven through repentance and water baptism in ‘almost 2000 Years’?? No. Our sins are forgiven today through Christ’s shed blood (Eph. 1:7), which is a doctrinal precept of Gospel #2 from the post above. She is confusing the gospel message (gospel of the kingdom) that Christ Himself preached AND Israel REJECTED with the “word of the cross” (1Cor. 1:18) gospel message we preach to the unsaved TODAY.

Valhall is blind (2Cor. 4:3+4) to the fact that Christ is the “Bridegroom” (Mark 2:19, Luke 5:34, John 3:29) gathering His prophetic kingdom ‘bride’ (John 3:29) in the Four Gospels where He was sent to Israel “ONLY” (Matt. 15:24). John the Baptist (Matt. 3:1-6), Christ (Matt. 4:23, 9:35, etc.) and the Twelve (Matt. 10:5-7) are all preaching this same ‘repentance’ and ‘baptism’ for the ‘forgiveness of sins’ throughout the Four Gospels, which Peter continues to preach AFTER Calvary (Acts 2:38). However, by the time we approach the middle of Acts (15), Paul has something to submit to these same (Peter and John) kingdom disciples! What might that be?

“Then after an interval of fourteen years I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, taking Titus along also. It was because of a revelation that I went up; and I submitted to them THE GOSPEL [#2] which I preach among THE GENTILES, but I did so in private to those who were of reputation [James, Cephas and John = Gal. 2:9 = reputed pillars], for fear that I might be running, or had run, in vain.” Galatians 2:1+2.

Hold on now! Valhall is intimating (not knowing WHAT she is doing) that only ‘one gospel’ exists in the NT. What has Paul to submit to the kingdom disciples of the Four Gospels and in fear of failure? Gospel #2 from my outlines above was given to Paul “through a revelation of Jesus Christ” (Gal. 1:11+12) in one of his “visions and revelations of the Lord” (2Cor. 12:1). Paul names his “my gospel” (Rom. 2:16, 16:25, etc.) calling this “message of truth” (Eph. 1:13+14) the “gospel to the UNCIRCUMCISED.” Galatians 2:7. How many among you wish to go back into the Four Gospels and prove that Christ sent the Twelve ‘kingdom’ disciples out to preach this “gospel to the UNCIRCUMCISED” to Israel ONLY?

“These twelve Jesus sent out after instructing them: "Do not go in the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter any city of the Samaritans; but rather go to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. And as you go, preach, saying, 'The kingdom of heaven is at hand.' Matthew 10:5-7.

Simply compare Christ’s words here to John’s preaching in Matthew 3:2 and His own in Matthew 4:17 to see they are identical! Israel anticipated becoming a ‘kingdom of priests’ (Ex. 19:6) since promises were made way back in Exodus. Hosea sees the Lord betrothing Israel to Himself (Hosea 2:19+20), which Christ is doing throughout the Four Gospels through the ‘gospel of the kingdom.’ That is an ‘earthy’ kingdom “on earth AS IT IS in heaven” (Matt. 6:10). Paul teaches that ‘our’ citizenship is IN HEAVEN (Phil. 3:20). Peter teaches that “baptism now saves you” (1Peter 3:21), because he continued preaching the ‘gospel of the kingdom’ ALL OF HIS DAYS on this earth. THAT is the last commands he received from Christ (Mark 16:15+16 = Matthew 28:18-20) just prior to His ascension! Peter warns that ‘these things’ pertaining to the ‘wisdom given him’ are indeed ‘hard to understand’ with a WARNING!

“Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, and regard the patience of our Lord as salvation; just as also our beloved brother PAUL, according to the WISDOM GIVEN HIM, wrote to you, as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort [Valhall], as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their OWN DESTRUCTION.” 2Peter 3:14-16.

You have my ‘two gospels’ presentation at the link above and laid out on this thread. Where is her ‘one gospel’ doctrinal outline??? Where is her proof that John the Baptist, Christ and the Twelve are all preaching “Jesus Christ and HIM CRUCIFIED” (1Cor. 2:2), as far back as Mark 1 [‘gospel of God’ = Mark 1:14+15]???

What does it mean that ‘our gospel’ (#2) is veiled to those who are “PERISHING” (2Corinthians 4:3+4)?? That is the result of mixing the two gospels together, which drags the WORKS of the gospel of the kingdom into Paul’s “my gospel” that MUST be accepted by God’s grace through faith APART from works. Ephesians 2:8+9.

She has inherited the ‘deluding influence’ (2Thes. 2:10-12) and now she is trying to drag you all down with her!

Somebody start a ‘Gospel’ thread so we can stop misusing this one. I would but all of mine get booted down to BTS. Maybe one of you will have better luck.

In Christ Jesus even now,


posted on Oct, 30 2006 @ 07:44 AM
Closing thread.

Attacks are growing on all sides, and it's gone away from a discussion of the historicity of LaHaye's beliefs.

Do start other threads, and please keep them civil. You're discussing topics of great interest to many, and we are NOT discouraging you from talking about these things. But this thread is devolving into Cheap Shots With Biblical Quotes, and that's not serving anything.

[edit on 30-10-2006 by Byrd]

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