Blair - shed a tear or open a beer?

What will his legacy be?

Innovative moderniser & major force in creating modern Britain?

Or

Deluded war-happy zealot & happy-clappy poodle?

Still not sure myself, need opinions to consider.

Two parties--one blue, one red and both taste the same. Next election you too can vote for MI5's candidate. I'll take a beer and watch democracy roll back.

What will his legacy be?

His Legacy will be the Iraq War, If anything goes by the recent Anti War Protest in Manchester.

All of his so called great policies will be overshadowed by Iraq. Oh Wells here is to the next bush's poodle.

I for one will be glad to see the back of him.

i'll open a beer

cuz i love to drank.

As I've said before Blair’s biggest legacies are war, pioneering propaganda, and draconian protest legislation (including biometric passports).
I'm happy he's going but for me the thought of Blair and beer doesn’t go down to well. But given what’s on offer I would almost be surprised if the future was much different; especially if people put their trust in the same deceptions because they’re coming from the mouth of a different person. Therefore I may shed a tear (not for Blair) but our general future as a nation.

I'll have a couple of beers. Maybe 10 or 20. Not because I have anything bad to say about Blair. He was a good leader, who can write a good speech or two. But sadly, his record as Prime Minister will be sullied because everyone will remember the Iraq war. He was led on by faulty intellegence. Not much you can do about that, but thems the breaks.

Well, as a committed Liberal Democrat, I'm going to lean back and chug a beer or three. The war in Iraq was a mistake of horrendous proportions - amazing to think that we tied ourselves to the monkey brain in the White House.
That said, Saddam was a monster who had told so many lies about his own WMD programme that when he was finally telling the truth that he had none, absolutely no-one believed him.
But still, we were taken into war based on lies. And yet more lies on top of it.

It's the way of these things, once he goes many apolitical people will miss him.

It's funny, much as I agree Iraq will always reflect badly on TB and personally I'd rather things had workled out differently the fact remains his has been one of the most successful 'Premierships' for a very long time domestically.

Other than those obsessed about the war I think the judgement will be far more favourable than some assume - I'd say with all of them I've seen that has invariably been the case.

Anyone seeing his oratory last week can't deny the guy still has 'it' when it comes to making a speech.....as indeed still does Bill Clinton.

Thanks for posting this thread dude, this is what I was looking for, a thread to bash Bliar!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So... how did Bliar perform as PM?

Google the phrase "War in Iraq" and everything will be clear.

Seriously, Bliar blatantly lied about the WMD. That lie has costed us 119 British lives. He should not only resign, but also be tried by the Hague Tribunal.

If Saddam Hussein had those WMDs, he would use them. Even though Bliar keeps lying despite IAEA director and the Norwegian Nobel Committee saying that Iraqi WMDs didn't exist.

[edit on 14-10-2006 by SackBliar]

Blair is a war criminal: this is the overshadowing fact of his administration. He should end up in the Hague, but we know that will never happen.

I have yet to see anyone in this thread point to something substantive and positive that this government has achieved. Privatisation has continued almost as if the Tories were still in, the PFIs have been an utter soak on the treasury serving only to line private companies' pockets and delivered poor services for which the taxpayer will be in hock for the forseeable future, and the mechanisms and legislation for a police state to rival the US have been put in place. Plus there's this ludicrous and highly suspect war on terror...

Anyone see the story about the largest ever explosives cache found at the home of a sometime BNP candidate? No, thought not... because he's not a Muslim. If he had been, the story would have been on the front page of all the nationals. Why have only the local paper and the Morning Star covered this? D-noticed, perhaps?

As much as i can't stand the Labour administration and Tony Blair, he has done wonders in Northern Ireland and brought an end to the IRA (which most in this Country seem to forget), plus the introduction of the minimum wage and are involvement in Europe.

Sadly, the Iraq war will overshadow all his positive points

The idea that everything TB and Labour have done will be overshadowed completely by the war, for the majority, is one I don't think will be shown to be true in time (I doubt it even is now, for a majority here......and the idea that the country is split on this is one the anti side constantly refuse to acknowledge).

As happened with Vietnam and the USA, other later governments and their conduct will, in time, come into consideration in this too.

Political opponents on the British right would, of course, claim to the contrary......right up until Cameron and the tory party got re-elected, then the tune would radically change.
Political opponents on the British far left have a habit of being against every government ever so no change there then anyway; they might find someone like Stalin just left-wing enough.

The idea that Iraq is illegal is worth considering.
Cos if you really do want to insist that TB and this Labour government (and the whole of Parliament seeing as they voted for it under a free vote - and have voted for subsequent measures) acted illegally and are war criminals then that is exactly what you are saying about all of the British forces out there.

Sorry but I don't believe that for one moment......and there's no point trying to wriggle away from the point cos that really is exactly what you are saying if you think it through.
The days of saying you were only following orders finished a Nuremberg.

I think the Iraq war was misjudged and ill advised but I don't think it was actually a 'criminal' undertaking.
The original UN resolution 1441 is not exactly good grounds to back that view up IMO.
In any event to be a criminal doesn't that require a conviction?
There is absolutely no sign of any of that at the UN, right?

The rabidly 'anti' attitude also (invariably) steadfastly refuses to even acknowledge the UN mandates and clear legality now properly in place.
Whilst condemning the war almost none of the opponents ever seem to do anything but run away from and completely ignore the issue of what to do now.

I don't think 'most British people' would want us to abandon Iraq to murderous anarchy and the loopy fundamentalists.

......and I don't think it renders the huge list of valuable progress and achievement made under this government worthless either.



[edit on 15-10-2006 by sminkeypinkey]

A vote for the Labour Party, the Conservative Party or the Liberal Democrats is a vote for the American police state.

If you have voted for the Labour Party, the Conservative Party or the Liberal Democrats, you have voted for the American police state.


[edit on 17-10-2006 by SackBliar]

Originally posted by SackBliar
A vote for the Labour Party, the Conservative Party or the Liberal Democrats is a vote for the American police state.

- Well of course.

We're all doomed and there's no point in anything cos it's all controlled and pre-ordained by those in charge.

So why are you bothering to do.....er.... anything, hmmmm?

If you have voted for the Labour Party, the Conservative Party or the Liberal Democrats, you have voted for the American police state.

- Of course.
Their long history shows them to be nothing but.

"Sack Bliar"
Registered: 14-10-2006.
I wonder whos' sock puppet this is?
Are you so lacking a pair and bored that you have to play these rather tedious, laughably dumb and tragicly pathetic little games?



[edit on 17-10-2006 by sminkeypinkey]

The real government of Great Britain is now in Washington DC. It dictates our foreign and "defence" policy.

The Conservatives could win a national election if it promised that it will withdraw British soldiers from Iraq and Afghanistan.

They won't, because their leader prefers to watch British soldiers die for no reason than run the country.

Same goes for the Libdems and the Labour Party. These parties don't represent the wishes of their voters.

The Labour Party is a gang of Marxists, traitors and criminals.

Originally posted by SackBliar
The Labour Party is a gang of Marxists, traitors and criminals.

- Oh right, 'Tory Blair' and what many have described as the most right-wing Labour government ever are a gang of Marxists?

Well of course.

Thanks for clearing that up for us all.

(Maybe you should go away and try to find out what those words actually mean before using them )

[edit on 18-10-2006 by sminkeypinkey]

Originally posted by sminkeypinkey

Originally posted by SackBliar
The Labour Party is a gang of Marxists, traitors and criminals.

- Oh right, 'Tory Blair' is a Marxist?

Well of course.

Thanks for clearing that up for us all.

He's the Vice Leader of the Socialist International.

Tony Blair is a vice-leader (!?......it's vice-President, actually) of 'the Socialist International'?
Oooooh sounds absolutely terrible, ooooh scary commies!
Red in tooth and claw soviet state here we come!

Mind you, I can only wonder what happened to our Marxist workers paradise seeing as Tony Blair's been in charge for 9yrs and has a mere matter of months left to go.

It's laughably absurd nonsense.

I suggest you go away and find out some more about it than a quick google.

The 'Socialist International' is not a Marxist institution.

What propagandists of the right-wing always prefer to edit out and ignore (or are too ill-informed or, frankly, too damned stupid to know) is that the Socialist International was formed as an anti-Communist alternative global network of center-left parties around the world.

See this list linking to the 141 member parties and organizations around the world
(coo, who knew there were 141 Marxist states left in the world!......including the UK )

Better luck next time socky.




[edit on 18-10-2006 by sminkeypinkey]

Originally posted by Strangeroushappy-clappy poodle?

Nice to see people religiously swallowing popular trendy media terms. If anyone's the poodle it's Bush, just like Reagan before him. Watch the conference where the mic was accidentally left on, who's the guiding hand? Certainly not Bush lol.

Originally posted by rizla
Two parties--one blue, one red and both taste the same. Next election you too can vote for MI5's candidate. I'll take a beer and watch democracy roll back.

Of course we're turning into a fascist totalitarian police state with our liberties day after day disappearing. Yeah of course democracy is slipping away with each passing breath

Here's a candidate, former Daily Mirror editor, the disgraced Piers Morgan. Of course he stands for truth, justice and honour. I wonder if he framed those fake torture pics?

Originally posted by spencerjohnstone
His Legacy will be the Iraq War, If anything goes by the recent Anti War Protest in Manchester.

As is often the case, people's memories can be rather short.

Originally posted by spencerjohnstone
All of his so called great policies will be overshadowed by Iraq. Oh Wells here is to the next bush's poodle.

I'm getting tired of these "poodle" remarks, i think it's more than outstayed its charm.

Originally posted by spencerjohnstoneI for one will be glad to see the back of him.

Replaced by whom? We should give George Galloway a call, the cigar chomping opportunist would be perfect.

Originally posted by Liberal1984
As I've said before Blair’s biggest legacies are war, pioneering propaganda, and draconian protest legislation (including biometric passports).
I'm happy he's going but for me the thought of Blair and beer doesn’t go down to well. But given what’s on offer I would almost be surprised if the future was much different; especially if people put their trust in the same deceptions because they’re coming from the mouth of a different person. Therefore I may shed a tear (not for Blair) but our general future as a nation.

Lol another gem which is just as irritating, 'draconian'. Talk about being one of the most overused words. It's amusing how short peoples memories are, introducing new legislation becuase of a terrorist threat is nothing new. Perhaps you should look back to the 1970's and the 'Prevention of Terrorism Act'. How is using biometric technology in passports constitute as 'draconian' exactly? How exactly would there be a major difference in your life, from the moment you had a ordinary passport to a 'biometric enabled' one? They don't control you in any way, just keeps information that can be stored on a database, which makes it easier to handle information (which shouldn't be senstive) so that tracking criminals for instance, is made that much easier.

Originally posted by SackBliar
Thanks for posting this thread dude, this is what I was looking for, a thread to bash Bliar!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So... how did Bliar perform as PM?

Google the phrase "War in Iraq" and everything will be clear.

Seriously, Bliar blatantly lied about the WMD. That lie has costed us 119 British lives. He should not only resign, but also be tried by the Hague Tribunal.

If Saddam Hussein had those WMDs, he would use them. Even though Bliar keeps lying despite IAEA director and the Norwegian Nobel Committee saying that Iraqi WMDs didn't exist.

[edit on 14-10-2006 by SackBliar]

Yay! All the kids come out. Of course vast swathes of the British public have been embarrisingly sucked in to the media whipped 'anti-war' movement. Which provided many witha a nice day off, including kids. Not to mention an excuse for some trouble making.

Hoe can you definitively state Blair lied, what you're his psychiatrist? He may have been mislead, have you considered that? Consider this scenario, if he's briefed by his intelligence staff that Saddam has WMD and could use them within 45 minutes, then he isn't going to question them and will act upon it. Of course empathy of any kind for politicians is forbidden by trendy populist types, since it is the latest fad.

Originally posted by rich23
Blair is a war criminal: this is the overshadowing fact of his administration. He should end up in the Hague, but we know that will never happen.

I have yet to see anyone in this thread point to something substantive and positive that this government has achieved. Privatisation has continued almost as if the Tories were still in, the PFIs have been an utter soak on the treasury serving only to line private companies' pockets and delivered poor services for which the taxpayer will be in hock for the forseeable future, and the mechanisms and legislation for a police state to rival the US have been put in place. Plus there's this ludicrous and highly suspect war on terror...

Anyone see the story about the largest ever explosives cache found at the home of a sometime BNP candidate? No, thought not... because he's not a Muslim. If he had been, the story would have been on the front page of all the nationals. Why have only the local paper and the Morning Star covered this? D-noticed, perhaps?

War criminal? How exactly? Can you fully elaborate in your own words why that is the case. Have any other nations actually tried to suggest this?

I don't agree with privatisation, however it seems that on the whole water companies in England (& Wales i think) did better than the state/national owned one in Scotland. Although industries such as trains, telecommunications need to be looked into further.

Police state? How lol. You're just buying into media fed crap, people are lazy and will go along with whatever's the trend these days.

So it's Blair's fault that the media/press (who i despise) fail to report this? The media here aren't know for investigative journalism now are they. Try 'R'-noticed, 'R' being ridiculous.

[edit on 19/10/06 by Flyboy211]

[edit on 19/10/06 by Flyboy211]

[edit on 19/10/06 by Flyboy211]

Originally posted by infinite
As much as i can't stand the Labour administration and Tony Blair, he has done wonders in Northern Ireland and brought an end to the IRA (which most in this Country seem to forget), plus the introduction of the minimum wage and are involvement in Europe.

Sadly, the Iraq war will overshadow all his positive points

Thank you, no one conveniently mentioned this. Nor the fact he apologised (although he didn't need to) for the false imprisonment of Gerry Conlon and the other 'Guildford 4'.

He's the only one who's managed to bring all the different factions together, and there is actually hope for Northern Ireland. The Good Friday Agreement of 1998 was pivotal in setting in motion for change.

He along with Bill Clinton stood up for Kosovo, particularly Muslims that were being butchered by Milosevic's thugs. Yet no one conveniently mentions this either. I've never seen France/Germany/Russia/China standing up for human rights and leading the way, they just follow.

Sminkeypinkey is a revelation on these boards. No because he's been more favourable towards Blair, but the fact he's always objective and present his points articulately and concisely. Especially on the Sinn Féin thread, so i shall definitely be toasting Sminkey with a beer