Hugo Chavez speaking at the UN Against American Imperialism and Bush the Devil

Not on subject, but I just have to share something I heard on the radio today. They were discussing the people from around the world who are at the U.N. right now and then I heard this:

Well you know the French have sent Chirac. The Iranians have sent Amidinejad...... The Mexicans have sent the last five people in their country--everyone else was already here.

Originally posted by Shar
He told Pres. Bush Hes going to live the rest of his days as a nightmare cause the rest of us is going to stand up.

Who is the rest of us?

What did he mean by that?

What the heck did that mean? Did he just threaten us? Seems that away to me.

He is not threatening us. He is threatening Bush politically. Cmon man!! When did he all of a sudden become our enemy? When he began questioning and Critisizing Iraq and Israel! Up till then he was great...we even sold him weapons, we sold him fighter jets and all kinds of goodies. Its just that because he was speaking his mind and telling people the truth, thats when he bagan to be vilified! Thats when Bush started calling him names, Bolton began critisizing him in the UN, then Pat Robertson came out with the death threats towards him. Just like Iran, a leader can only be pushed so far before they just burst. They can't look weak in front of the people they lead.

We banned him from buying weapons and equipment from us and then even tried to blackball him from other countries selling him stuff. Good for Russia, they got themselve a cash customer...pretty soon our only customers will be the ones getting Military aid and then we end up footing the bill 150% with our taxes. (yes 150% since we pay full price, then give them the loan to buy it with, they pay 1/2 price under the Surplus Equipment act and the debt is forgiven and never repaid!)

When did we sell him these things was it during the clinton adminstration or the bush adminstration?

When did he become our enemy? You tell me its his qoute.

The U.N. was founded in an era of two superpowers, he said. "The Soviet Union collapsed. The United States empire is on the way down and it will be finished in the near future, for the good of all mankind."

www.cnn.com...

[edit on 21-9-2006 by Shar]

the USSR never really went away however. the CIS was signed into existence at the same meeting the ussr dissolved iirc. with the convertable ruble & oil exchange finally opening up, we havent heard the last of russia & her daughter states.

Originally posted by RRconservative
This post is being reported to the proper authorities.

Suggesting Bush be assassinated and offering to buy the bullets? Dude you NEED to be checked out.

I'm all over it.

How lovely. You actually intend to "inform the authorities".

You'd have gone down a treat in Soviet Russia.

" You've been watching too much Fox News Channel, Buddy." As opposed to watching what? I mean everybody puts FOX News down, who is so much more credible ?





[edit on 21-9-2006 by lorentrook]

Originally posted by Shar
He told Pres. Bush Hes going to live the rest of his days as a nightmare cause the rest of us is going to stand up.

Who is the rest of us?

What did he mean by that?

What the heck did that mean? Did he just threaten us? Seems that away to me.

I would repeat my earlier observation: bullies live in fear.

Now this post is typical of a regrettable and ignorant sector of the US populace.

Originally posted by Kwintz
Excuse me, but the last time i checked, The United States of America was slightly more powerful and influential than Venezuela. I don't know, maybe i'm terribly mistaken. Venezuela is a good example? Of what? Some egotistical dictator to be rising to power by preying on the poor?

Whew! The inaccuracies come almost too thick and fast to deal with. My point is that the US got so powerful and influential by subjugating the other countries in the hemisphere. Try checking out the history of how the US has acted in the hemisphere. How many governments they've subverted, the death squads they've used and organised, that sort of thing.

My point about Chavez is that he's helping the poor, not preying on them, and there is abundant evidence that when that sort of thing happens the US steps in to prevent it. Please provide evidence that Chavez preys on the poor.

It may be totally hip to bash the USA right now, but come on, saying Venezuela is an example we should follow is ludicrous.

I'm not saying that Venezuela is an example the US should follow. They're an example of a nation standing up to the US and trying to use their own resources for the good of their own population, not allowing the US to come in and rip them off again and again. They're also providing literacy programs and health care. That's a threat, now, isn't it?

Yeah, you're right, "bullies live in fear". But at least bullies live. It's either bully or be bullied right now, and i think most would choose the former.

No, it isn't "bully or be bullied", right now, or at any other time. To maintain this is simply to parade the feebleness of your own imagination. And as an attempt to justify bullying (which you actually admit to!) it's not terribly convincing.

What if Bush stood in front of the UN and called a fellow world "leader" the devil? That would go over real well.

What if Bush (or Colin Powell, say) got up and spouted lies about another country and then INVADED THEM? Oh... right... that actually happened. Your blindness to the evil in your own country is worthy of the "good Germans" of the thirties.

but this man is my president and i will not take kindly to these kinds of attacks on my president.

This mystical attachment to the trappings of office is one of the weird, weird things about Americans. No-one else in the world has that kind of semi-religious awe of their elected officials. It's not rational.

Fox News channel is the neo-con propaganda channel owned by Rupert Murdoch. It's about as credible as TASS was during the heyday of the Soviet Union. It isn't pro-American, it is pro global corporate hegemony. Murdoch believes he and his fellow elites should decide what's best for humanity and the ordinary people shouldn't have the freedom to choose their own destiny.

"Even today the class/caste system flourishes in those countries

Yeah because it isn’t like that in the US who are you kidding the class/caste system exists everywhere.


Hitler was a grand orator but the architects of the Nazi party were above him.

I agree with your comment, but I think a better way of putting it would be that they are around him.


Venezuela is an example we should follow is ludicrous. Our nations are in totally different places in our respective histories"


I agree that it is a silly comment.



"That's a very true and astute observation... but it begs the question, is that really a bad thing?

Is the US so paranoid that it can't allow any possible threat to exist?

If the US was completely uncontested in all international matters, would that not be equal to global domination?

More cuttingly, what about the very widely held belief that the US is, infact, a threat to the rest of the world?

My point is, you can't silence every threat (real or imagined) without sliencing everybody.

As to Chavez himself, I've been following what I can about the man for awhile now. In general, I find him to be an idealist who faces very serious problems. Sometimes he does well, sometimes he doesn't. He makes mistakes and has successes. He's crafty, for sure. He does say and do things to further his own agenda, but please give me the name of a politition who doesn't! I think he believe that his agenda is morally correct. I find myself agreeing with alot that he has to say.
Then again, I like Chomsky.
I'm also kinda anti-capitalist.
*shrug* "

Very much agreed. Well apart from the second last-line, I believe he is doing all the right things, what he did in the UN was a stunt to “embarrass” Georgey boy, by giving him the finger and saying “your not going to bully me or my people”. He simply mocked him the way a kid slags a bully off and when he cant take it decides to kick-his-head-in


"He told Pres. Bush Hes going to live the rest of his days as a nightmare cause the rest of us is going to stand up.

Who is the rest of us?

What did he mean by that?

What the heck did that mean? Did he just threaten us? Seems that away to me. "


He threatened in the sense that the smaller countries arent going to be bullied or “threatened” themselves anymore by the power hungry corrupt government that is the United States (GOV).

Originally posted by LogansRun

Um, have you seen the state that Iraq is in? They are slipping more and more toward civil war - if not already. The removal of Sadam was a good thing as he was an ass, however the state the country is in is FAR worse than it was when we started. And we have a HELL of a lot more work to do before it can be considered "free". That statement you made would make me laugh if it wasn't so pathetically sad and far from the truth.

I wouldn't say civil war. There's plenty of insurgent activity, and they are trying to spark a civil war but with credit to the Iraqi people, there is no civil war yet. Now some of the commanders on the ground say there is a chance of civil war, a good one but there isn't one yet. You can thank Chavez's buddy in Iran for helping the insurgents bomb, torture, and kill.

Yes the country is in sad shape, it needs a huge hand in building it's infrastructure. However it's difficult for us to build schools and hospitals, power plants and water treatment plants while we are fighting insurgent activity. Once again you may want to ring up Chavez and have him ask his buddy in Iran to lay off the bombings, torture and killing.

I would say the fact they Iraq has held mostly unviolent elections with huge turnouts is a freedom. Their government has now been elected by the people of Iraq.

I don't really give a rat's azz what Hugo Chavez has to say about the United States of America or President Bush. I didn't elect this azz and I suspect the majority of his country men didn't either This guy is a true blue marxist dictator fo the purest form. Look who he is aligning with; Castro? Iran? Syria? I mean, come on!!!! Rest assured, no matter what happend this guy is going to be President for life of Venezuela - much Castro in Cuba. And let's face it, Castro hasn't been a bellweather for the people of Cuba either!

Keep talking Chavez, the mosre you say, the more you reveal your true colors. I can't wait until election time in Venezuela - you can count on either a.) the elections being cancelled or b.) some serious poll rigging of the highest order. Bet on it!

Originally posted by The Iconoclast

That's interesting. Just the opposite of what someone who is down there right now says. My brother-inlaw does international consulting and one of his customers in in Venezuela. He travels there regularly (being forced to fly out of Miami because our government has restricted travel to and from Venezuela) and has never run into any of the issues you speak of.

Perhaps a doctor who lives and works in Venezuela has a more realistic take on how things really are there. I doubt a consultant (who is supplying needed information and services to a minute population) would be privy to the same conditions as a person who actually lives there. Your brother-in-law is not an accurate barometer.

Originally posted by rich23
Have I really got this right? Are you saying that anyone who disagrees with the US is a threat? Anyone who has a different opinion from the US, and who has the temerity to voice that opinion, is a threat to the US?

From a government standpoint in relation to another nation, YES.

Is that really what you're saying? Because I don't actually see how it is a threat, and it sounds rather totalitarian to me. If you could explain to me how, precisely, the holding and expressing of different opinions is a threat to the US, I'd be grateful.

Chavez isn't only running his mouth, he is positioning himself and making deals with other nations that threatens the monopoly the US has in this hemisphere, that monopoly which grants us our convenient and mostly pleasant way of life. If he was just talking points and not taking actions it would a different story.

Is the US so flabby and useless that anyone who expresses exactly what the US government doesn't want to see presented in the world presents a threat to them?

Yes, haven't you followed history? Cuba? Libya? These are examples of the above, and they being threats were completely silenced and well guess what..they aren't threats anymore.

I have an observation to make, and it is this: bullies live in fear.

I have no disagreement there, but so does everybody else.

I'm sorry, worldwatcher, but I have to say that this is not, to me, a terribly compelling argument, unless you're explicitly arguing in favour of US imperialism. Cuba is SUCH a threat. Their enormous army straddles the region and their consistent drive to upgrade their military makes other smaller nations tremble in their boots.... riiiight... I think that Cuba's major export is doctors, for heaven's sake. The US has been trying to put an economic stranglehold on Cuba for decades, and yet Cuba has one of the best (and best value) health care systems in the world.

I have no choice or say in the matter of American Imperialism, even though I'm a citizen of this country, I'm not in favor or against it, because my opinion on this has no weight as to what the govt of this country does. American Imperialism isnt something new, it's goes back to British Imperialism, it's a way of life, the most powerful regardless of time or place where always the imperialists.

Cuba could have and would have been a greater threat, with weapons and a more developed army if sanctions and pressure weren't applied by the US and its allies. Cuba's major export is doctors...and it's import is foreign students from the caribbean, without the help of other nations and support from Caricom, Cuba wouldn't even be in the position to train it's doctors, not like this has anything to do with this discussion.. but whatever...

as for the rest of your arguments, you make good points, but it's like the chicken and egg, which came first... corrupt local government exploiting their people and the aid they DO get to build up their countries or the US sanctions and policies that some say don't enable them to do these things.

I come from South America, I lived under a socialist/leftist system, my country has had it shares of border disputes with Venezuela. I've spoken to Venezuelans now living here, and I can say we do not see the same rosy picture that is being painted here by some, of Chavez and conditions in Venezuela. Chavez is a powerful speaker and that has its benefits, just look back at history again.

Don't get me wrong people, I'm no fan of many our country's foreign policies, but if you look at the grand scheme of things and everything that has gone done since 9/11, you should be able to see that "real threats", threats that could really destabilize our economy and our way of life were not addressed (Chavez, Ahmadinejad actually have power to affect our daily lives) (Saddam didn't, Kim Jong Il, doesnt' yet, but he's trying)

Regardless of my personal feelings about Chavez, I still do applaud him for the speech he made, he did something good, he got Americans talking, thinking and conjecturing. Like I said before it was a good speech and it would have been taken more seriously if he didn't say "blasphemous" stuff he said about Bush.



[edit on 9-21-2006 by worldwatcher]

I like Hugo!

Well I wouldn't call Bushie a Devil - but a Devil Worshipper definetly!

Does Bush worship the Devil?

[edit on 21/9/06 by Souljah]

Did any one notice the rather uncharacteristically benign manner in which President Bush described Hamas's Palestinian election victory when he addressed the UN General Assembly on Tuesday?

Souljah, as much as I'd love to view President Bush as a Satanist, isnt it common knowledge that that hand gesture is also the salute to the Texas Longhorn college football team? The hand symbol representing a long horned bull?



Coincidence? Or corruption? Im not sure, but to openly salute the devil is a bit beyond the pale, even for the Bush family.

[edit on 21/9/06 by subz]

Originally posted by worldwatcher
Chavez isn't only running his mouth, he is positioning himself and making deals with other nations that threatens the monopoly the US has in this hemisphere, that monopoly which grants us our convenient and mostly pleasant way of life.

Well, at least you see that the monopolies forced on other nations by the US is one way that the US enjoys economic advantages. However, you don't seem to care that these advantages are bought by the repression of the other countries of the hemisphere. Germany, after all, had the excuse, when invading other countries, that it had to secure its own economic and political interests. Once you start taking that as your raison d'etre you're on a very slippery slope.

Yes, haven't you followed history? Cuba? Libya? These are examples of the above, and they being threats were completely silenced and well guess what..they aren't threats anymore.

Other posters here consider Cuba a threat. And the only time Cuba was any genuine threat to the US was during the missile crisis, which everyone conveniently forgets was after the US tried a proxy invasion.

Not everyone lives in fear.

I come from South America, I lived under a socialist/leftist system, my country has had it shares of border disputes with Venezuela.

And under this socialist system, were people "disappeared" on a regular basis? I'm not denying that this happened in Eastern Europe, but allegedly socialist systems in South America tended to be nationalist rather than totalitarian... and few lasted very long before the US managed a coup. Which is when the disappearances would start.

I've spoken to Venezuelans now living here, and I can say we do not see the same rosy picture that is being painted here by some, of Chavez and conditions in Venezuela.

Details, please. I'm all ears.

Originally posted by subz
Souljah, as much as I'd love to view President Bush as a Satanist, isnt it common knowledge that that hand gesture is also the salute to the Texas Longhorn college football team? The hand symbol representing a long horned bull?

Well...

Skull and Bones

As Lebanon burns, Blair, Bush Sr. and Schultz will be at Bohemian Grove

The Grove is the secret club that US political elite (and friends like Tony) attend annually, men only. At Bohemian Grove, a 2,700-acre redwood forest in Monte Rio, California, described as a homosexual nudist compound by Alex Jones, there are accommodations for 2,000 people to “camp” (and I use the term advisedly). Among the rituals, partaken by some of your former presidents, is an annual symbolic child sacrifice to Molech Lucifer Satan, before the effigy of a giant predatory owl. Tony, keep your back to the wall or the trees.

Not very NON-Satanic Cults mister Bush is in....

George Bush is concrete proof that the devil exists. God bless Hugo Chavez! He doesn't mince words....a refreshing trait in a world leader. Wish we had that kind of statesmen in this country. It would be a much better country if we did

Wow, hook them horns....I wonder if he is a Texas man. Venezuela is nothing to shrug at. They are the next to become a nuclear power, and predict that within the next 10-20 years. Nukes on the doorstep...