Here's a question....

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posted on Nov, 9 2002 @ 05:11 PM
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I'm Wiccan.

I would say "NO."

And if someone held a gun to MY head and said "NOW do you believe in Jesus?" my answer would still be "NO."




posted on Nov, 9 2002 @ 05:17 PM
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Wata stupido qestion - Ifa man holda gun upa to me - Pleesea - wherea I live disa no happen - cause - ifa da man olda guna to me - I kicka him muchee muchee inda noosa - (nutsa) in englese - Capice - anda if he dida dis anda aska me whicha goda I likee - Boy - den I kicka him in the u knowa wota - and he hurtee muche muche more - sorry buta i tink you confuse mucha tings here in disa questions - cratzie dno



posted on Nov, 10 2002 @ 11:47 AM
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Well it's a question on your beliefs. Gun or no gun my answer would be yes I do believe in God because it's the truth. I think I would say yes then break the guy's face


Didn't this happen in the Columbine incident and the girl survived or something?

And you can't just ask God, "prove to me that you exist" I tried that and got no answer. It's like saying "well i don't believe in you so i don't know why I'm asking this, but I have virtually no faith so make it obvious you exist because I refuse to believe in you otherwise" I tried it..it doesn't work. You have to be calling out, already have faith and wanting HELP from God not proof, or you won't find it. It's like the devil tempting Jesus in the desert, "If you're really God, turn this rock into bread" I think God would laugh at you for asking something like that. Now maybe if you ask, "Give me a sign of what to do" or something God will answer, but not "Do this and I will believe in you"



posted on Nov, 10 2002 @ 10:03 PM
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Yes, it happened at Columbine.

The girl was killed.



posted on Nov, 10 2002 @ 10:07 PM
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You know I just had a thought while reading your post LostProphet about asking for a sign that god exists.

Normally I would just say well why shouldn't god prove his existance, then it hit me!

HE DOES!

In everything from the simple blade of grass to the mighty galaxies...his design is all around us...and he leaves it for us to find...that is our great test...we ask him to prove his existance to us...but the truth is...he asks us to find him.

Sincerely,
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posted on Nov, 13 2002 @ 06:16 PM
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FreeMason, from your replies it is not clear to me if you believe in the existence of God, so I can see why you replied in the manner you did. I do hope you make up your mind during the days God has given you on this planet - seems you have much turmoil and very little peace. I heard this once said, from a humble viewpoint - "If you knew what I know about Jesus, I'd want YOU to tell ME!"

Some thoughts:

Quote: OH carebear....Why do people let the power be taken out of humanity? We are not some pawns to be battered around by a thinking god....

We were CREATED by a thinking God, in His image! By his own character, God would not abuse his own creations. We are given a mind and a body and are responsible for them and for the decisions WE make.

Quote:....Of course I doubt much I can show you how I percieve what happend to you without looking much the bad guy, it does seem a shut case.

I believe the most important view is how God sees us, no matter what mess or season of life we are in. Reguardless of how you see me, God understands me and knows my heart right where I am... and vice-versa!

Quote: However....I don't think people believe in fate//irony//karma enough, they took it all and said "God did it". This drastically harms our position in this world.

Exactly what position do you believe humankind has in the world? I believe people are searching for meaning and purpose in their lives. While we are more than capable of making our own decisions, can God toss in some "food for thought?" Who is to say he can't?

Quote: Ok I figured out what I want to say...it's just as Buddha said....the Truth is that we create much of our own suffering needlessly.


I agree. Who cannot look back on his or her life and say, "I wish I'd done this or that differently?" We are all imperfect... and we certainly learn by doing!

Quote: Sometimes fate if you will....or maybe it is just coincidense, but it IS really well timed whatever it is....sometimes that really well timed statement is said at the most crucial moment, and you are that much more enlightened, however you wish to interpret it, from my stand point you simply changed your view of the world, and consequently you stopped making yourself suffer. All that Needless suffering was somewhat removed.

Sure, it could be coincidence. But how can you rule out, if you believe anyways, that God had possibly orchestrated some events to call our attention to needless suffering? "For I know the plans I have for you," declares the Lord, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future." - Jeremiah 29:11

Quote: Now if you want to believe it was God's doing be my guest...it's your choice...but it's thoughts like that that made me become an Athiest for so long, too much "Humanity sucks" and "All we have left is our Saviour...let's all be saved" saved from what?

Saved from being a slave to sin, fear, condemnation, confusion, spending eternity separated from God!, Satan's lies... "Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a lion looking for someone to devour." - 1 Peter 5:8 Here's another thought: "Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, tolerance, and patience, not realizing that God's kindness leads you toward repentance?" - Romans 2:4

Quote: I don't know about any of you but I intend to live....this world rules, and when you sit down and actually look at it, whether it be a simple blade of grass or a mighty tree or mountain...it rocks, and I wouldn't wanted to be parted from it ever, I'd never imagine a heaven better than this earth and this universe.

Yeah, creation is beautiful. I believe it reflects the love of our Creator! (If you like nature stuff, check out Psalms.) However, I don't believe the world rules us. God made wonderful things like animals and mountains and oceans and cells (though I don't understand his thinking upon creating mosquitoes!!), but sin created war, hatred, abuse, starvation, and the many ills that plague our world. I certainly do not want to be ruled by these. They weren't in God's original design, but now we have to deal with them.

Quote: But that's just me...a lot of people suffer and to them this world is a pain, and they seek an escape, that's because I haven't been able to enlighten them.
I always feel like a nut when I think that, but it's the truth, maybe my way of thought is only compatible with me...but it IS serenity incarnate. No more seperation from reality, no suffering, just peace.


Reality has been painful, I don't know of anyone who could claim otherwise. God allows suffering in our lives. We do cause much hurt to ourselves and others, but "in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose." (Rom.8:28) God never promised us that, once we are believers, that we'd never suffer again. Instead, he provides us with strength to face our troubles and with reasons to go on. True peace in the storms comes from knowing God is there with you - you're not facing life alone.

Quote: That is why I always get so sad that people hide with god...sure I guess there IS a god, this universe is very organized, and kinda pointless when you think about it, nothingness is easier.
But that doesn't mean he sits there and actually plots out every point on your life line, and then will change it if you pray.

Again, "For I know the plans I have for you", declares the Lord, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future." - Jeremiah 29:11 If God knows the end from the beginning, he certainly includes us in the mix. He PROMISES us hope and a future, but it is our choice to recieve it or not. We can only see a few pieces of the jigsaw, but God can see the whole puzzle.

Quote: Then you may wonder...well why do I believe in Fate??? I believe in fate because I believe that there is nothing more orderly than this universe...

If fate guides the universe, then what created fate? As science shows us, you don't get something out of nothing. SO if God created the orders and physics of science, we are able to say that the one who created the laws of the universe could also create the universe, even from nothing. From that, we can say that God must have a reason for creating, and so on...

Quote: ...I believe that people cause their own suffering by stepping out of the stream, and carving their own paths...for some, it turns out benifitial, but for most...they leave the calm waters that flows around everything, and guides it in perfect syncronization...and end up in great turmoil...fighting eachother to get ahead...when fate wins in the end. And you return to the sea...to be born again.

I see the "stream" as God's will... Or like an umbrella, when we are walking under it, we have some shelter. We are protected from certain things. Likewise, when we walk out from under God's will, we trip up much more easily, causing hurt to ourselves and each other. Like a loving parent, God gives us plenty of cautions and sets up guidelines for our safety and well-being. We then have the freedom to follow them, or risk strife and injury. Ultimately, God's good purposes will be fulfilled in his own ways and timing - we can be part of them if we wish.

Quote: God, is man's escape, from his arduous journey....he leaves these waters and feels the pain, and so makes a god that cares about him, and punishes his competitors so as to make his journey on foot more easy to bare...but no one ever thinks to realize that the only god IS this universe, including that great stream of fate...and it doesn't care about you, and you consequently fight it (him whatever) as you fight nature to get ahead, thinking you have freedom of choice.

First, God created man, not the other way around. Second, God is not out to punish people. If our god really was the universe, why it care to create us? the true God does care about people, even for the ones who don't care about him. Why else would God tell us to love and pray for our enemies? Our life and death is of no consequence to the universe. However, it matters very much to God. Also, we don't just "think" we have freedom of choice, we own our freedom of choice. Even if every physical choice was taken away from you, wouldn't you still have the choice over what you think, believe, and say? God loves us enough to not treat us as robots, but to give us that freedom of choice no matter what we choose. That is love.

Quote: Carebear....Jesus died because an angry mob persuaded the Governor to unjustly crucify him...what benifit do you or god gain by his death...I mean really?

Freedom, of course! With Jesus' death and resurrection, the old requirements on how to have eternal life with God were changed. You no longer had to be perfect in following the law, but only need to believe. Romans 10:10 - "That if you confess with your mouth, 'Jesus is Lord', and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved". God fulfilled his promises to Israel through the life, death, and resurrection of his Son, and showed us his love for us - "But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us." (Rom.5:8)


Quote:I do not need to be saved, no one does, stop escaping, or running, sit down for once and admire the crack in the side walk...it is a peice of this infinite universe too you know.

Escaping or running from what? From what I believe is the truth? How would you know that you needed a doctor unless you knew you were sick? I have to realize that my life and this world are finite. I cannot control the stars and the planets in the heavens any more than you can! However I know Someone who can give life to the dying and keeps chaos from reigning. Whether you believe God's words or not is a choice we all have. I still believe we all have this basic freedom.

God promises that anyone who seeks him with all their heart will find him. Because God cares for me, even before I knew him, it gives me reason to care for other people. I didn't take nearly 4 hours to research and write this for no good reason, you know! I pray God opens your mind and heart to consider the possibilities and how they may benefit your life. Thanks for taking the time to read this.





posted on Nov, 13 2002 @ 07:25 PM
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We obviously differ on points of view....severely, is it safe for me to indeed say then you place Jesus as an part of your life? And that God and his little kingdom is somewhere we want to go.

I believe none of those things....Jesus, a man of his own faith, and god, a design in the universe, THE design of everything...a design viewed by science but not understood by science.

I think you missed the point of one of the Jewels of Buddhism or whatever, that "Truth". It's not to learn from your mistakes, but to realize that greed, and ambitions do cause suffering, and it is important to supress them.

But mainly our schism is the Jesus thing, I don't believe there is a reward, for believing in Jesus. What would christianity say about god, if the world were to nearly end tomorrow by an asteroid impact? I am an observer, not a believer.

But that doesn't stop me from percieving this world in a "spiritual" way, which is why we differ so much on our ideals. Hence why I've come to accept that there is a fate, but I won't try to explain what it is that drives it, it is just there, like irony in a book.

There's not much else to say
, remembering what it was you said that sparked my post, I was just trying to get across points of how I see it...an interesting response I got from you


Not sure what I'll learn from it, except that I think I better see now the schism that is between beleivers of Jesus and others, at least...myself.

Thanks,
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posted on Nov, 14 2002 @ 06:45 PM
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Carebear


That was an absolutely fantastic post and response.
I am filled with joy for the faith that God has put into you. It has somewhat made my day
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I do not reply here to make you proud of yourself but to encourage you to continue to preach the word of life.

I thank our God for you and the work he continues to do in your life.

May the holy spirit bestow power upon you and greatly bless you in your serving of Christ.

Stewards



posted on Nov, 14 2002 @ 08:17 PM
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How wonderful it is that we can all agree that the killing of what is to date a
minimum of 4 billion seems so fair. God is so just and good in relation to the ideals the Christian faith proclaims. Perhaps we can work together to come up with a vedio game which lives up to biblical expectations. One which depicts what is presented in Revelations taken to its natural conclusions.


A meteor hits the earth, sorry guys if a meteor hits the earth the only thing that will survive is insects (less food remember). I guess that means game over unless you accept Reincarnation.



posted on Nov, 14 2002 @ 09:45 PM
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I'm afraid I'd have to go with Toltec's point of view on this. I know as a Christian my behavior would be totally inappropriate, but in such crisis situations I don't have a very good track record of doing the right thing. I tend to respond with intense anger where fear might be prudent. So either way I guess I'd be drilled (I'm older and reflexes are slower, I'm sure I'd lose)

Toltec, we from the Muscogee bunch (Creek) had nothing to do with letting the damned foreigners into the country, so don't go bragging on behalf of all Indians that Thanksgiving is our holiday!



posted on Nov, 14 2002 @ 10:10 PM
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Dude were the only Island in the world with Ballcourts





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