Murderers

I saw this story about Kyle Huff on the news. He committed a mass murder in Seattle in March 2006 and then committed suicide by turning the gun on himself. Interviews of friends and acquaintences say that he was a very friendly and helpful person in his neighborhood and had no criminal background.

www.seattleweekly.com...

A strapping 6-foot-5 figure, Kyle Huff arrived around 4 a.m. at the Capitol Hill house where the party was just beginning. It would end abruptly in an explosion of gunfire three hours later Saturday, March 25, after Huff went to his pickup and armed himself with a 12-gauge shotgun used in an earlier crime, a handgun, and rounds of ammo in belts and stuffed in his pockets. He began pulling the trigger the moment he walked back up to the house, hitting two people who were sitting outside, enjoying the new day. "There's plenty for everyone!" he shouted, or words to that effect, as he entered the rental home and began spraying several dozen strangers with his shotgun. Within minutes, after Huff had made himself the final victim — shooting himself in the face before quick-arriving patrol officer Steve Leonard could kill him — seven were dead or dying on the floor and outside the house on East Republican Street, including girls 14 and 15 years old.

I have been very interested in the reasons why seemingly 'normal' people suddenly become violent. I found another article on the educate-yourself website that introduces the idea that some mass murderers and serial killers are victims of the Montauk Project, a mind control training program that took place in various underground facilities in Montauk, Long Island.

educate-yourself.org...

Mind Control 'Programmed' Individuals

The lone gunman that we hear about in assassinations, assassination attempts, school shootings, etc. are mind controlled individuals who had been 'programmed' to carry out those missions. Ted Bundy, the 'Son of Sam' serial killer David Berkowitz, Oswald, Timothy McVeigh, the Columbine shooters, Chapman, Sirhan Sirhan, etc. were mind controlled individuals who were programmed to perform these killings. Tens of thousands of young teenage boys were kidnapped and forced into the mind control training program called The Montauk Project starting around 1976. Al Bielek, under mind control, was involved in many areas of the secret Montauk Project. After slowly recovering his memories beginning in the late 1980's, he came to realize that there were at least 250,000 mind controlled "Montauk Boys' produced at 25 different facilities similar to the underground base at Montauk, Long Island. Many of these boys were to become 'sleepers' who are individuals who were programmed to go into action at a later date when properly "triggered" to engage in some sort of destructive or disruptive conduct. Other Montauk Boys were woven into the fabric of mainstream American life as journalists, radio & TV personalities, businessmen, lawyers, medical professionals, judges, prosecutors, law enforcement, military men, etc.

I'm looking for other opinions on this topic.

Thanks!

I live about 30mins drive Noreth from Seattle, so I remember this.

I seem to remember he killed the people because of the
"overt sexuality" they were showing, apparently he was
really against it, his brother admitted that he was.

It was just a tragic murder by someone wh was able to
appear normal but was unstable.

If the government wanted to turn people into killers, wouldn't they take advantage of their weaknesses?

Not really.

1. There's nor profit or real reason to turn a person into a murderer
of nortmal people.

2. Though it does'nt seem like it, some of the people in our government
do have conscince, and would'nt allow it.

There have been times when I could have easily snapped in the last year, and I can tell you now a lot of people would have understood it. But I am not a violent person. I joke about it a lot, but when it comes to doing I wouldn't. But under stress, or when everything is gone and you don't know what to do, people change.

Originally posted by iori_komei
Not really.

1. There's nor profit or real reason to turn a person into a murderer
of nortmal people.

2. Though it does'nt seem like it, some of the people in our government
do have conscince, and would'nt allow it.

1. If they are experimenting, then that's a real reason to turn a person into a murderer.

2. Not all of the people in our government have a conscience, and they would allow it.

It's the "normal" ones you have to watch out for.

That area has spawned some real "winners", Ted Bundy; the Green River killer Gary Ridgeway (49 known victims) and The I-5 killer Randy Woodfield, just off the top of my head.

Maybe it's the horribly dreary, rainy weather nine months out of the year?

I sure don't miss it.

hate to break you heart n all but there is no such hing as mind control in Australia random people suffer from a illness not sure of the name but they are usally mentally disabled and when taking the drug can turn from suicidle, homocidle to calm normal person.

Specail Agent MDIA
AU/US

Originally posted by annestacey
If the government wanted to turn people into killers, wouldn't they take advantage of their weaknesses?

You'd assume that if the government had the ability to control minds, that these killers would themselves be under a bit more control eh? The way serial killers get away with their behavior, is that they do seem outwardly normal. If they acted psychotic, men in white coats would lock them up.
The more likely answer is that there are just some messed up, evil people among everyone else, rather than a more Zoolanderesque explanation.

Originally posted by annestacey

Originally posted by iori_komei
Not really.

1. There's nor profit or real reason to turn a person into a murderer
of nortmal people.

2. Though it does'nt seem like it, some of the people in our government
do have conscince, and would'nt allow it.

1. If they are experimenting, then that's a real reason to turn a person into a murderer.

2. Not all of the people in our government have a conscience, and they would allow it.

Experimenting is a reason to turn a person into a murderer? Wouldn't it be more likely that they'd experiment with people working longer hours for less money, and being happy with their meager existence?

You have evidence that people in government would allow mind control over people, turning them into murderers? There are politicians with whom I have a great deal of disdain for, but just because we're in disagreement doesn't mean I attribute them the ability to carry out any act no matter how heinous. Yes there are crooked politicians, but that's a far cry from them being involved in a project like that. How many are involved, and who's paying for it?

They turn people into murderers every day of the week, for profit, for power and control, as experiment and no doubt through sheer stupidity.

They turn servicemen into murderers, for example. 'Here in Australia', as an above poster said, we're informed by our paid-by-the-word tv newspersons, that this or that serviceman died in Iraq and is therefore regarded as a 'hero' for defending his country !

Really? For defending Australians against civilian Iraqis? How does that work again? When was the last time Iraqi civilians attacked or injured any Australian living in Australia ? Oh, that's right -- we're not supposed to ask why Aussie servicemen are killing Iraqi civilians who've never even stepped foot in Australia or lobbed so much as a spit-ball in Australia's direction.

Just as we're not supposed to speculate as to why a seemingly sane and balanced individual would shoot and kill several people for little or no apparent reason.

Nor are we supposed to link the dots between these allegedly random killings with subsequent repressive legislation speedily introduced by those stalwart, 'trustworthy' politicians, 'for our own good', ala the random, seemingly pointless mass killings in Scotland and Port Arthur which very rapidly resulted in gun-laws.

Do I believe governments create shock and horror killers? Yes. I do. I think they've been doing it for hundreds of years, in order to cause wars which in turn result in millions of needless deaths which strangely enough turn a very handsome profit, not to mention staggering power and control, for the killer-creators.

But I didn't always believe so. No, for quite a while I lived in blissful ignorance.

This is explored in-depth in the Sinister Forces books (3) by Peter Levenda.

One of the more interesting 'coincidences' explored in these books is that both Manson and Sirhan were in the same city, and they shared the same cell (albeit one year apart).

It has been well documented that experimentation on prisoners was, and most likely is, taking place in the US.

What follows are some general links related to prison abuses, with a
particular focus on mind control abuses against prisoners. A _NY
Times_ article about the recent court ruling is excerpted at the end.
In that article it states that the prisoner in question began having
mental problems in 1987. As the following quote indicates, there are
strong reasons to believe that prison experiments *were* being
conducted at that time.

Mind Control, By Harry V. Martin and David Caul
whale.to...

[...]

Despite the pledge by LEAA's director, Donald E. Santarelli, LEAA
ended up funding 537 research projects dealing with behavior
modification. There is strong evidence to indicate psychosurgery
was still being used in prisons in the 1980's. Immediately after
the funding announcement by LEAA, there were 50 psychosurgical
operations at Atmore State Prison in Alabama. The inmates became
virtual zombies. The operations, according to Dr. Swan of Fisk
University, were done on black prisoners who were considered
politically active.

[...]

Such experiments on prisoners have a long history. The following
article describes, for example, CIA mind control experiments on
prisoners in Philadelphia. Various other tests were also conducted.

Retin-A's Wrinkled Past
www.freerepublic.com...

In 1974, Senator Sam Ervin headed an investigation into federal
behavior modification experiments, particularly those in prisons. The
report actually discusses remote brain monitoring technology that
could be applied to prisoners, and could track, observe, and influence
them even after their so-called release. A footnote even mentions
computerized systems of this sort.

Extracts from Individual Rights and the Federal Role in Behavior
Modification, 1974
sonic.net...

The US routinely ignores not only its own Bill of Rights, but also
international treaties on human rights. As the following article
states, "The United Nations Committee on Torture cited a variety of
ways in which the United States is violating the UN Convention Against
Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment
that was ratified in the US on October 21, 1994."

It's Official, It's Torture...So What!
by Corey Weinstein, M.D.
www.prisons.org...

Former prisoner Brian Wronge was instructed by a federal judge to have
an alleged implant he received in prison removed for study. He could
find no surgeon willing to help him, and even the group Physicians for
Human Rights rebuffed him. According to the following article, many
surgeons cited fears of FBI retaliation.

IMPLANT VICTIM REFUSED HELP BY 'HUMANITARIAN' PHYSICIANS
www.raven1.net...

The following article discusses the general situation where medical
professionals refuse to help mind control victims. Not only that,
many have actually been co-opted into the system of denial and
repression. Do no harm, indeed.

Won't medical professionals help mind control victims?
www.datafilter.com...

Note from Shawnna - the above is a bad link and I can't find a good one but am leaving this in for context

Finally, here is an article by David Fratus that appeared on Usenet in
1988. In it he describes his own allegations of mind control torture
and experimentation in Utah State Prison. I have not talked to him
personally, but his letter is quite eloquent and believable. He
describes quite well the attitude of his torturers, which is that he
can complain all he wants since no one will listen to him or believe
him.

Remote Control Electronic Brain Punishment?
www.netti.fi...

That is the true situation in the United States.

I've corrected some dead links in the above excerpt for purposes of this post. But here is the link to the original webpage.


And I'm sure there will be those who will simply ignore or not even read this information - frankly - I didn't want to either. But ignorance is never bliss, at least that's how I feel about it.

Always,
Shawnna

Dock6, all i have to say to you is bingo, that was spot on.


Iori_komei and others who don't think the government could/would do this

Say for instance the government doesn't want us to have guns anymore because they are about to enforce some new and very strict laws that the majority of us would go ape sh** about, "convince" a few people to go on killing sprees and there you have it, new gun law.

Also, war is very profitable for politicians connected to corporations that make their money supplying troops and making weapons etc. To them, people are a renewable source that they can use to make themselves richer, they don't care about us, WE make them rich, as long as more people are blindly handing themselves over to Uncle Sam, then the war industry is happy. If not, they simply reinstate the draft, problem solve. Convince enough people that an attack was orchestrated by leaders of a certain country, and you have a war in the making.

Of course not everyone in politics is like this, there are actually some good people trying to help us, but they don't hold enough power to do much at all.

I'm am not saying that they are using mind control, i'm just saying that i wouldn't put it past them if they had the technology to do so, and the CIA is very good at mind games (as are many other agencies).

It's all about money and power, they always want more of it, no matter what the cost is to the "common" people. After all, kids these days are having babies left and right, they will have a whole new generation at their disposal, that is if they are as blind as we are.

I'd be curious to see how much various politicians have profited off the war. A lot of them got voted out. It probably wouldn't be too hard to check out this notion, if there was anything interesting to be found.
It's easy to make a claim, but quite another to offer proof. I'm pretty sure the liberals would've used any dirt they could find to hurt any politician that profited from the war. Congressman tend to go to jail if they're found to be on the take.

www.nctimes.com...

What companies should be helping out if Halliburton, etc... are all evil war profiteers, that wish their fellow countrymen ill will? Is anybody that gets a contract a bad guy? The camel's nose is under the tent- whether you like the fact that we're in Iraq or not, is moot now. Somebody has to do what the contractors are doing, to try to get Iraq self sufficient, as just pulling out would cause worse problems in the region, and for global security.

I never said that all politicians are this way, i even stated that there are in fact good ones.

Also, it's not evil to supply our troops, or support our troops. What is evil is to push so strongly for the war when you and/or your friends hold rather high positions in the companies that will supply or support or troops. War never truly solves our problems, if it did, then there would no longer be a need for war; but the fact is that war is a profitable business for those who are involved in supplying weapons, transportation, etc. Obviously not every politician is involved in this, but there are those that do have involvement with this war industry.

Now back to the subject of this thread which is the possibility of government implemented mind control and it's uses. We can argue all day, but i do not wish to hijack annestacey's thread.