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A Masonic Question

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posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 02:59 AM
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Since Masons only need to believe in a 'supreme being' to be accepted into Masonry, it is possible that a Satanist could be a Mason? In other words, is Satanism compatible with Masonry? And if it is, how likely would it be for a Mason to know how many of his fellow Masons are Satanists? Could this be used to promote anti-Christian ideas through Freemasonry?

I don't have any agenda. I am trying to research and come to my own private conclusions. Thank you.

[edit on 14-9-2006 by ReincarnatedIn1983]




posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 03:08 AM
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Originally posted by ReincarnatedIn1983
Since Masons only need to believe in a 'supreme being' to be accepted into Masonry, it is possible that a Satanist could be a Mason? In other words, is Satanism compatible with Masonry? And if it is, how likely would it be for a Mason to know how many of his fellow Masons are Satanists? Could this be used to promote anti-Christian ideas through Freemasonry?

I don't have any agenda. I am trying to research and come to my own private conclusions. Thank you.

[edit on 14-9-2006 by ReincarnatedIn1983]


Without knowing the beliefs and values of Satanist's I wouldn't be able to comment.

I CAN tell you that Freemason's beliefs have nothing incompatible with christian beliefs or any other religion that I know of ie. treat other people as you would be treated, obey the law etc.

Charity and truth are the most important beliefs in Freemasonry, I dont know how that would sit with satanists.

Ezk.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 03:14 AM
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Originally posted by Ezekiel
obey the law


Umm, what's the law?



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 03:43 AM
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Originally posted by In nothing we trust

Originally posted by Ezekiel
obey the law


Umm, what's the law?


Sorry I should have been more clear..

Obery the laws of the state or nation that you live in, or may termporarily call your home. Be a law adbiding citizen.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 06:39 AM
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According to this podcast interview with Magus Peter H. Gilmore, the High Priest of the Church of Satan. (Episode 25: Hail Satan), members of the Church of Satan are actually atheist. (they don’t actually believe in Satan as a god)

So they would not be allowed in regular Masonry because they don’t believe in a “Supreme Being.”

Mind you, the Church of Satan is only one of many (I suppose) satanic organization.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 07:36 AM
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In general, Satanists are either atheists or agnostics (see "The Satanic Bible" by Anton Szandor LaVey). They consider Christianity to be a religion of organized hypocrisy, so they use the enemy of Christianity (i.e., Satan) as a symbol for personal responsibility, rebellion against oppressive authority, and individual freedom. This is opposed to what they believe that Christianity is, i.e., an organized paradigm of the herd mentality.

Since Satanists do not believe in the existence of a Supreme Being, they are not eligible to become Freemasons.

A possible exception is the Setians (members of the Temple of Set), although technically, the Setians are not Satanists. However, they have their roots in the Church of Satan. Setians believe that the ancient Egyptian deity Set is the Supreme Being.

Neither Satanists nor Setians promote acts of crime, violence, and/or evil. Indeed, they consider themselves "good", as opposed to the supposed "evil" of Christianity.





[edit on 14-9-2006 by Masonic Light]



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 08:02 AM
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For some reason I don't think a satanist would want to be a Mason anyway.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 08:36 AM
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Originally posted by ReincarnatedIn1983
Since Masons only need to believe in a 'supreme being' to be accepted into Masonry, it is possible that a Satanist could be a Mason? In other words, is Satanism compatible with Masonry? And if it is, how likely would it be for a Mason to know how many of his fellow Masons are Satanists? Could this be used to promote anti-Christian ideas through Freemasonry?

I don't have any agenda. I am trying to research and come to my own private conclusions. Thank you.

This is an extremely good question, and it's so refreshing to get such a thing that you deserve a full reply.

As has been mentioned already, one must need to believe in a 'Supreme Being' in order to be a freemason, and this may or may not rule out Satanists. But this is not the only requirement to be a freemason - there are others, both formal and informal, which I shall run through:

Formal requirements for membership:
1. Belief in a Supreme Being (definition left up to the candidate)
2. Requesting membership 'of own free will and accord'
3. Must not be a slave, or obligated to a third party in such a way that (2) is compromised. This might include members of certain religious cults that 'brainwash' members.
4. Must have a favorable opinion of freemasonry.

Informal (effective) requirements:
1. As freemasonry is all about morality tales from the Bible, anyone who objected to those biblical stories or their message would effectively be excluded. This would include any religion who believed Satan is God, and/or Evil is Good, as the morality tales would be in direct contravention to the teaching of their faith. And freemasonry insists, as a condition of membership that you continue to follow your faith.
2. Must have a tolerance of other religions and religious viewpoints. Fundamentalists from any religion would not be comfortable in a masonic lodge. I have heard legitimate complaints from evangelical christians regarding masonic practices as being incompatible with their personal beliefs, and those people should not join.

I'm sure there are others, but hopefully I've exemplified the point about how anti-Christianity is incompatible with freemasonry.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 08:54 AM
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Originally posted by Trinityman


Informal (effective) requirements:
... And freemasonry insists, as a condition of membership that you continue to follow your faith.



T-man,
Does this mean one is disqualified if one converts to another faith?

Cheers,
-kid



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 09:07 AM
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Originally posted by thekidxii
Does this mean one is disqualified if one converts to another faith?

I wouldn't have thought so The wording on UGLE's website is as follows:


Without interfering in religious practice it expects each member to follow his own faith, and to place above all other duties his duty to God, by whatever name He is known.

Source: www.ugle.org.uk


I guess this would probably be interpreted as yes, you can change your faith as long as (a) you continue to practice it and (b) you remain consistent with the initial conditions of membership.

I know that if a freemasons loses his faith, and cannot genuinely say he believes in a 'Supreme Being' any more then he must leave the fraternity.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 09:26 AM
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hey t-man
if one were a roman catholic and a mason, how could he continue to practice his faith openly and be open about masonry at the same time? with the new pope any catholics found to be masons will automaticly be excommunicated



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 09:52 AM
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Originally posted by doggmann
hey t-man
if one were a roman catholic and a mason, how could he continue to practice his faith openly and be open about masonry at the same time? with the new pope any catholics found to be masons will automaticly be excommunicated


The Junior Deacon is my Lodge is both a practicing Roman Catholic and is quite open about his Masonry. The rule about excommunicating Catholic Masons is not universally enforced in the United States.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:16 AM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by doggmann
hey t-man
if one were a roman catholic and a mason, how could he continue to practice his faith openly and be open about masonry at the same time? with the new pope any catholics found to be masons will automaticly be excommunicated


The Junior Deacon is my Lodge is both a practicing Roman Catholic and is quite open about his Masonry. The rule about excommunicating Catholic Masons is not universally enforced in the United States.

In fact it's not universally enforced period.

The underlying reason behind the suspicion of freemasonry by the RCC is the belief that freemasonry means harm to Catholicism, and this is compounded by the complex nature of freemasonry in Italy. In countries where regular freemasonry is practiced by the majority of members local decisions tend to be made which are more positive toward freemasonry.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:18 AM
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yes but it is here in canada and to be honest i am chaplain of my lodge and a RC as well. if my church community or better to say my priest found out i know for a fact that i would be excommunicated from that community. so in regards to masonry how can i fully embrace my faith knowing that the church will turn its back on me? and if/when that happens would the lodge turn its back on me for being a irreligious libertine?



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:29 AM
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Even if the worst were to happen, and your religious community excommunicates you, so what? Does that make you less catholic in your heart? Deep down inside you are still the same person, with the same belief in God. No one can take that away. The rule of masonry is that you have to BELIEVE in a supreme being...believing is in the heart, and like I said that can't be taken away.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:35 AM
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As a mason, I'd like to point out that the catholic antipathy towards masons is not reciprocated: masons welcome catholics who choose to join.

I belonged to a really interesting lodge when I lived in Dallas; there were both muslims and jews in the active leadership, as well as many catholic police officers, which go together in that neighborhood.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:41 AM
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My lodge is primarily christian, but we have many visitors come of different beliefs, and we all get along. We even have had orthodox jews come. I have yet to witness any animosity based on religion. Yet the catholic church has a hard on for our destruction for so long now.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:45 AM
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so what you say is that even though masonry earnstly encourages me to be an actve memeber of my church,and if i were to be kicked out of that coomunity because of masonry, thats ok, even thou my faith states that my salvation would be unattainable.remember that if one is required to follow his faith all the rules must still apply

[edit on 14-9-2006 by doggmann]



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:53 AM
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This conversation needs to turn conspiratorial really quick or I will be moving it to BTS chit-chat.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:54 AM
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Originally posted by doggmann
yes but it is here in canada and to be honest i am chaplain of my lodge and a RC as well. if my church community or better to say my priest found out i know for a fact that i would be excommunicated from that community. so in regards to masonry how can i fully embrace my faith knowing that the church will turn its back on me? and if/when that happens would the lodge turn its back on me for being a irreligious libertine?


Hey, if they haven't kicked me out for being an irreligious libertine yet, chances are you're pretty safe.


Seriously though, in your predicament, there re a couple of alternatives. If you believe that that the Roman Church is the one true church, Masonry certainly could not fault you from resigning from the fraternity, as it promised you in the beginning that it would not interfere with your religious or political opinions, be they what they may.

On the other hand, if you consider yourself only a nominal Catholic, you could convert to Anglicanism, which follows the Catholic tradition and apostolic succession. The Church of England is not anti-Masonic, and the late Right Reverend Geoffrey Fisher, former Archbishop of Canterbury, was an outspoken mason and defender of the Craft.



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