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Dramatic Arctic ice reduction

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posted on Oct, 10 2006 @ 08:52 PM
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What exactly is it going to take for all these nay sayers to say.. yeah.. orite its happening my bad..

there are islands of the coast of australia that have experienced so much SEA RISE.. they are now labeled as Climate Refugee's ( or something there of )

Are they also over stating the extent of the SEA rising and wiping out crops and homes..

They showed us there coast line.. and about 20 meters o the coast there's a log

' 5yrs ago.. that was our coast line '

Im not saying if we all stop now we will fix it.
we have stuffed it up that much.. that well its now happening regardless.

Sigh... seems man cant even be untied in the way we have destroyed our only home.




posted on Oct, 15 2006 @ 08:18 PM
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Originally posted by shotsI did some research and what I found for the antarctic, claims the ice there is getting thicker, so where does that leave us? I happen to agree with those that claim it is not as bad as the other side is trying to convince you.

For all any of us may know this may be the start of a pole shift that some scientist think happens x years a part. If that is true this could be nothing more then a normal variance. Pole Shift & Pole Reversal in 2012

More pole shift theories

New Clues to Earth's magnetic flip flops

[edit on 10/10/2006 by shots]


I am amazed that there is any data suggesting Antarctic ice is increasing. It is very possible that in some places it is getting deeper, but overall there has been a dramatic and massive decrease in the amount of ice in Antarctica, from all I have read or heard. Icesheets that had been there since the area was first visited have totally disappeared, breaking off in pieces bigger than some US states. You may be right, and it might be a normal variance, or a combination of human cause and that. But as far as it not being as bad as they say, all I can put that down to is that the predictions did not take into account how human responses to the crisis would slow the process down. It is still happening, almost exactly like was predicted 25 years ago with computer simulations, the only difference being that it is happening a little bit slower. I feel that it is likely we will reach a critical mass at some point, like the beginning of unpredictable turbulence in chaos theory. That will be kind of like hitting the wall. Maybe we won't. It's just my opinion that the unsustainable, and destructive human actions will lead to a huge global crisis eventually.



posted on Oct, 15 2006 @ 08:53 PM
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Originally posted by BlackGuardXIII


I am amazed that there is any data suggesting Antarctic ice is increasing.


What is there to be amazed about? NASA and Goddard have done a study that lasted two decades if not more that supports the claim. Source

You do not see those kinds of studies from others do you? Now ask yourself why, I think the answer is obvious.



posted on Oct, 15 2006 @ 09:29 PM
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Originally posted by shots

Originally posted by BlackGuardXIII


I am amazed that there is any data suggesting Antarctic ice is increasing.


What is there to be amazed about? NASA and Goddard have done a study that lasted two decades if not more that supports the claim. Source

You do not see those kinds of studies from others do you? Now ask yourself why, I think the answer is obvious.

Thanks for that information, I didn't know about that study. As you say, it appears to be expanding. But I did notice that the article also states that the arctic ice sheet is decreasing. You make a good point about the general media coverage on the topic. I am a good example, having seen many claims that it is shrinking and none like the one you have provided which show it to be growing.
Thanks again



posted on Oct, 15 2006 @ 11:10 PM
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True, other factors are involved. I have a pretty penny no one has measured the amount of hot air contributed to the atmosphere by our legislators. A change in policy and their makers is bound to have an impact.



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 01:11 PM
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Originally posted by LogansRun
$115,000 over the last 4 years from coal and energy interests. I wonder why he downplays global warming huh?


Well each and every research scientist on the planet needs money and since most of them get it from governmeny sources why do we trust much anything they come up with? Every scientist is biased and while taking money from such interest may ecnourage the reader to be a bit more skeptical it hardly invalidates the entire work just like that! If you have objections bisides who pays feel free to tell us about them.


No offence, but considering this guys backers I wouldn't put any merit into what he is saying. The fact is global warming does exist.


Global temperatures has been showing a cooling trend since 1999. You don't have to believe the guy but obviously the rest of us are going to make up our own minds.


Humans do play a role in affecting our climate.


So lets drain the world's oceans as water vapour is the biggest contributor to higher temperatures. :0


All you have to do is look at the amount of orest coverage over the US and how it has declined over the last 100 years.


Tree coverage in the USA ihas gone up by a large percentage in the last century as i remember....


That is one small part of a HUGE equation (both natural and manmade mind you) that is global warming. We are speading up a natural process, period.


0.5% , 5%? You give me a number and then suggest what we could do without destroying current human civilization in the process of trying to lower out contribution.


Coal & energy companies would have to invest billions to reverse the damage they are causing, let alone just to stem the flow....THAT is why books like this are written. You see, when the $&*% hits the fan in regard to the environment, we most likely wont be alive. Future generations however, will look back at our ignorance and we will go down as the era of blindness & ignorance.


Things have gotten better for the vast majority of humanity in the last century of human development and technological progress and i see no logical reason to suspect that further technological breakthroughs will not do the same if applied in the right ways. The problems humanity faces has absolutely nothing to do with our ( according to global warming crowd) generally good western living standards and everything to do with how our governments chooses to employ the fruits of our labour. We can bring about a virtual paradise if we applied the knowledge we have and have living standards that would make our current world seem tremendously backwards.

Stellar



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 01:32 PM
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Originally posted by Agit8dChop
What exactly is it going to take for all these nay sayers to say.. yeah.. orite its happening my bad..


Evidence?


there are islands of the coast of australia that have experienced so much SEA RISE.. they are now labeled as Climate Refugee's ( or something there of )


Over how many years? Why not blame it on plate tectonics or for that matter too many fat islanders?


Are they also over stating the extent of the SEA rising and wiping out crops and homes..


If their suggesting that this happens in a year or two they sure as hell are. These things do not happen fast and they can be prepared for and to blame it on human activity is going to require some proof at least.


They showed us there coast line.. and about 20 meters o the coast there's a log

' 5yrs ago.. that was our coast line '


I regularly go to a beech where the high water mark and low water mark is about 50 meters from each other. What was the difference in Cm's between the five years high water marks and was it not simply a question of the beach sand being eroded out from under the log?


Im not saying if we all stop now we will fix it.
we have stuffed it up that much.. that well its now happening regardless.


So basically your a uninformed pessimist that likes doom and gloom scenarios without investigating the alternative bright future there might very well be had we all become more informed about what is happening in this world beside the lie that is consistent global warming.


Sigh... seems man cant even be untied in the way we have destroyed our only home.



If you have such a low opinion of humanity i suggest you find yourself another planet.

Stellar



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 01:42 PM
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The BBC recently did a report on how the Permafrost in Siberia is melting very quickly.
Buildings are literally sinking into the slop left behind.
Huge holes are opening up all across the north,as methane deposits,oncee safley locked in the ice are now bursting though the surface.
Pretty darned serious.
Its happening.Its real.



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 04:52 PM
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Originally posted by Silcone Synapse
The BBC recently did a report on how the Permafrost in Siberia is melting very quickly.
Buildings are literally sinking into the slop left behind.


Melting very quickly by who's standards? Buildings sink into snow wherever you are and that's why they have to keep building new levels...


Huge holes are opening up all across the north,as methane deposits,oncee safley locked in the ice are now bursting though the surface.


Safely locked in the ice? Do you think that ice has always been there or that the methane has never been in the atmosphere?


Pretty darned serious.
Its happening.Its real.


There are very many horrible things happening on this planet but global warming and wide scale completely unnatural and historically improbable ice cap melting is certainly not happening. The interesting discussion would happen when it becomes evident that it is as then we can discuss how relevant our contribution to the warming is or could possible become.

Stellar



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 05:00 PM
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Stupidity:

Waiting for the effects, and the evidence before you act

Responsiblity:

Understanding your actions are changing the world, and using every means at your disposal to protect your fragile economy

Unfortunate:

We allowed a corporate enticed government to retain control and ignore global warming.

US Government:
Heartless, they care more for money in there pockets.
Why would they BLOCK reports on global warmining?

I hope you nay syers are happy, your allowing your government to sacrifice the futures of your childeren, simply to keep there rich friends ' happy '



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 05:08 PM
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Originally posted by StellarX



Pretty darned serious.
Its happening.Its real.


There are very many horrible things happening on this planet but global warming and wide scale completely unnatural and historically improbable ice cap melting is certainly not happening. The interesting discussion would happen when it becomes evident that it is as then we can discuss how relevant our contribution to the warming is or could possible become.

Stellar


Maybe it is part of the natural cycle,but Siberia is melting now,and it wasn`t before.So that part at least is happening and is real.
I`m not sure how much the activities of humans have contributed to the current events there but i do accept we MAY be contributing to destabilisation of the environment by our actions.

"The interesting discussion would happen when it becomes evident"
That would be a bit late,waiting until the problem is upon us....Oh it is.



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 05:59 PM
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Originally posted by Agit8dChop
I hope you nay syers are happy, your allowing your government to sacrifice the futures of your childeren, simply to keep there rich friends ' happy '


Oh I am very happy, but then I do not believe all the lies the green jeans crod are spreading, while you do. :shk:

Do yourself a favor rathr then listen to their liea look up the new laws that have been implemented in the past several years, that will eventually remove most if not all green house gases, then check the figures that show the improvements already made that have reduced them by over 95% iif no9t higher, where they have been implemented.

Take the virtual tour of one example then get back to us



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 06:08 PM
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Im glad previous administrations knew of the consquences fast approaching.

what about the current one, that refuses to ACHNOWLEDGE it, BLOCKS reports... and ensure all there industry friends keep pumping out the CRAP that keeps them rich?



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 06:25 PM
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Originally posted by Agit8dChop


what about the current one, that refuses to ACHNOWLEDGE it, BLOCKS reports...


Where are the links that prove they are blocking those reports? Kindly do not post allegations made by the green jeans crowd either, I want solid proof not allegations.



[edit on 10/17/2006 by shots]



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 06:30 PM
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news.mongabay.com...

just one example.

but thanks for showing character..
you refuse to achnolwedge anything from the greens, because u label it as lies?

who's lied to your more in the past 8yrs shots?
The administration, who GAINS from there lies.
or the greens, whom are losing EITHER WAY?



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 06:39 PM
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Originally posted by Agit8dChop
news.mongabay.com...

just one example.

but thanks for showing character..
you refuse to achnolwedge anything from the greens, because u label it as lies?



I asked you to post concrete facts not allegations.
The site you linked to is from the Green Jeans crowd which I clearly asked you not to use. Now can you show be a newspaper article that states they refused to release said report or not?



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 06:46 PM
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well im glad you have the authority to constitute what is allowable.
give me a minute ill find more then if you refuse to use evidence from people whom you dont agree with



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 07:01 PM
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"A spokesman for President Bush made it clear today the U.S. was no longer interested in the Kyoto treaty on global warming"
www.pbs.org...

"The current Bush administration refused to sign on to the international Kyoto Treaty to combat climate change, saying it would hurt the U.S. economy."
www.msnbc.msn.com...

thinkprogress.org...

"The US Department of Agriculture suppresses research and information related to agricultural pollution."
"Interior Secretary Gale Norton gave false written testimony to Congress regarding drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge when she said that ANWR’s caribou calving occurred mostly outside ANWR while her own department’s research showed the opposite"
"Water Quality Perchlorate, the main ingredient in solid rocket fuel, is a serious health threat. Research in 1997 showed significant health risks, even at low levels, especially for infants and developing fetuses. The Bush Pentagon has systematically suppressed information on the levels of perchlorate in ground water and soils at numerous sites contaminated by the military and its contractors. Instead the Bush Administration is pushing for legislation to protect the polluters from liability."

PROTECT THE POLLUTERS FROM LIABILITY ??
Yep he's surely doing everything to stop isnt he

shall we keep going
nah

look foryourself
ventana.sierraclub.org...

"A secret report, suppressed by US defence chiefs and obtained by The Observer, warns that major European cities will be sunk beneath rising seas as Britain is plunged into a 'Siberian' climate by 2020. Nuclear conflict, mega-droughts, famine and widespread rioting will erupt across the world."

THIS is his own governemnt now...

""I think there is a debate about whether it's caused by mankind or whether it's caused naturally, but it's a worthy debate." "
So george, what happens when this natural cycle mixes with all the extra crap we've put in the atmospehre?

Maybe stronger hurricanes?
www.netscape.com... 06%2F07%2F07%2F121635.php&frame=true


WASHINGTON -- President George W. Bush's first federal budget would slash funding for environmental programs, energy conservation and agricultural preservation.
www.wired.com...

WASHINGTON (AP) - The Bush administration has blocked release of a report that suggests global warming is contributing to the frequency and strength of hurricanes, the journal Nature reported Tuesday.
www.lasvegassun.com...




Your right though, he doesnt need to block any more reports..
hes done enough already.



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 07:10 PM
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Refusing to sign the Koyoto treaty is not suppressing any reports but you knew that didn't you?

As for the rest, again they are just allegations made by the green jeans crowd who have been known to lie to get their way, but again I assume you knew that.



posted on Oct, 17 2006 @ 07:25 PM
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pathetic mate.
your stance is truley pathetic.
you n the president would get along well.

Why do you think hurricane katrina grew, so strong, so quick?
The heating water in the gulf is why.

So unless the presidents advisors bring out the same information, your going to flatout REFUSE what every other scientist says?

Im lost for words shots.
But it doesnt matter, one persons stupidity wont matter any way... there's too many petrol headed hamburger eating gun toting people out there like you obviously, who take great happieness in thinking of there childeren suffering in the future, because we couldnt pull our thumbs out our a$$e$ when it mattered.




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