John Lear's Moon Pictures on ATS

Originally posted by TheBorg
... How is it possible for them to shuttle astronauts up to the Moon and back, with payload no less, without the general public seeing or hearing about it? If you can logically explain that little fact, then I might be able to buy this crazy notion.
...

It's actually a very good question. How many countries have technology to detect those movements in and out of orbit? Many is the answer...
It's actually pretty hard, if not altogether impossible, to explain how can you conduct such operations for so many years in secrecy...

The possibility exists that these are old facilities, ancient even. Perhaps what has happened is, earth folks have commandeered it, investigated it, and are basing some of their new concepts for mining, terraforming and technology, off what they've found during their investigations.

Not to be repetitive, but there is indication in the ancient texts of an ancient, advanced civilization on this planet, pre-dating Adam. If you're interested in this topic, I highly recommend "God's Plan for Man," by Dake. In the lesson he describes as "The Angelic Dispensation" or the "Dispensaton of the Angels", he outlines that not only this planet, but several others in our solar system, were indeed inhabited in the ancient past. This book was written by a christian man (Dake) several decades ago, and is actually biblically-based. It was rather revolutionary for its time, not because no one else had thought of the possibility of life on other planets, but because it was a highly speculative work about extra-terrestrial and terrestrial pre-Adamite civilizations which used the bible as its primary source of evidence. During an age of skepticism and staunch traditional interpretation of the biblical texts, such speculation was completely out of the norm and generally regarded with disdain, but the more we learn about our universe, the more his work seems to be right on the money.



[edit on 24-11-2006 by undo]

Originally posted by undo
The possibility exists that these are old facilities, ancient even. Perhaps what has happened is, earth folks have commandeered it, investigated it, and are basing some of their new concepts for mining, terraforming and technology, off what they've found during their investigations.
...

Yes, there is an old case for supposed pre-existant moon bases, however that still does not explain how all this movement back and forward, and the activities on the moon still manage to remain so secretive, not to mention why would anyone keep getting photos of those areas if they had previous knowledge of the activities in there...

Originally posted by jmlima

Originally posted by undo
The possibility exists that these are old facilities, ancient even. Perhaps what has happened is, earth folks have commandeered it, investigated it, and are basing some of their new concepts for mining, terraforming and technology, off what they've found during their investigations.
...

Yes, there is an old case for supposed pre-existant moon bases, however that still does not explain how all this movement back and forward, and the activities on the moon still manage to remain so secretive, not to mention why would anyone keep getting photos of those areas if they had previous knowledge of the activities in there...

Well, let's speculate, shall we?

1) It could be a case of oversight. If this was an international project on the scope of New World Order theology, they may accumulate records to keep tabs on one another. If the facility was already there, they wouldn't need to bring new equipment to the site, only pioneering scientists/astronauts. Then it would be simply a task (lol) of determining how the existing equipment works. This is purely speculative, however.

2) Perhaps the facility is ancient and no longer functioning, and the photos are evidence of an ongoing investigation. This is better addressed, however, by people who understand atmospheric physics (see dust/smoke, etc).

3) Maybe this is an alien facility and we are spying on them. Again, highly speculative.

[edit on 24-11-2006 by undo]

Originally posted by undo

1) It could be a case of oversight. If this was an international project on the scope of New World Order theology, they may accumulate records to keep tabs on one another. If the facility was already there, they wouldn't need to bring new equipment to the site, only pioneering scientists/astronauts. Then it would be simply a task (lol) of determining how the existing equipment works. This is purely speculative, however.

2) Perhaps the facility is ancient and no longer functioning, and the photos are evidence of an ongoing investigation. This is better addressed, however, by people who understand atmospheric physics (see dust/smoke, etc).

3) Maybe this is an alien facility and we are spying on them. Again, highly speculative.

[edit on 24-11-2006 by undo]

1) An oversight? This would not be something small, if it existed it would represent a major effort requiring massive amounts of money, and besides, one should be careful about using speculative item (New World Order theology) as a comparison to another speculative item, it just makes the comparing kind of redundant I think.

2) If the photos were part of an ongoing investigation, why would they be rather public in nature? And on the topic there are clear references to dust clouds, which wouldn't be the case if they were not active. Out of curiosity, can we have dust clouds in a 0 atmosphere environment?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
trimmed triple nested quote


[edit on 24/11/06 by masqua]

you said:
can we have dust clouds in a 0 atmosphere environment?

my response:
well there's some argument regarding the moon's atmsophere. there seems to be a thin atmosphere. how thin, i dunno. but zorg and john have info on that.

Originally posted by zorgon Also notice the direction that the smoke is moving in

Smoke is attracted to beauty, you know that, right?

Sorry, couldn't resist. Hope everyone had a good Thanksgiving, now it is back to the grindstone! Any ideas how to address Borg's contentions? He is right, someone would notice all the traffic, perhaps another country or astronomers based around the world. Even China painfully recorded every meteoric event since ancient times (think when writing began)! So unless they have cloaking, or are small, or do intentionally limit traffic, or are super fast, or any combinations of these, then we should have seen something.

Here's some pics on the Moon's atmosphere..


Apollo 14 images, numbers 14-10279 and 14-10280.
The mist stayed together without dispersing, and moved across the lunar surface.


image number 16-758, from Apollo 16
Long cloud moving through a mountainous crater rim through some pass or low point.

Photographs courtesy Fred Steckling. This is from an Excerpt from 'UFOs and the Complete Evidence from Space' by Daniel Ross here.

Originally posted by mikesingh
...
Photographs courtesy Fred Steckling. This is from an Excerpt from 'UFOs and the Complete Evidence from Space' by Daniel Ross here.

On that website it says:

He identifies them as Apollo 14 images, numbers 14-10279 and 14-10280.

Is this confirmed by any other source?

Originally posted by Matyas

Any ideas how to address Borg's contentions? He is right, someone would notice all the traffic, perhaps another country or astronomers based around the world.

Probably all the big stuff is launched from the south pole space command launch complex. You might check the amount of DoD traffic going down there. As far as the very large equipment built in the US going to the moon or Mars I am not sure how they do that but remember we've had anti-grav since the late 50's so by now it shouldn't be that much of a problem. Those of you that are looking for rocket type propulsion transportation to the moon and Mars....thats just smoke. (So to speak).

Originally posted by johnlear
...As far as the very large equipment built in the US going to the moon or Mars I am not sure how they do that but remember we've had anti-grav since the late 50's so by now it shouldn't be that much of a problem. ...

You are basing a supposition on an assumption. Not very reliable.

Re the South Pole moves, an interesting thing from the New Scientist magazine:

The Scott-Amundsen base is home to a growing amount of scientific equipment. But it is out of sight of most geostationary communications satellites, so it cannot reliably send back real-time data to the laboratories in the US that use the equipment. The cable would solve that problem.

source:

www.newscientist.com...

Originally posted by jmlima
On that website it says:

He identifies them as Apollo 14 images, numbers 14-10279 and 14-10280.

Is this confirmed by any other source?

no , if you actually look in the archive - as i told mike singh to do previously

you find the images in question archive

the actual image numbers are

AS14-75-10279

AS14-75-10280

and none of them show the " atmosphere " claimed .

PS - before you go off ranting that " the archive is edited " please look at the entire collection of AS154 magazine75 . they are presented sequentially , in order taken .

archives are great , why do some people prefer to trust 2nd and 3rd hand sources that have been printed , scanned , possibly redeited

or as in this case certainly edited by a kook with a book to sell

why ?

Originally posted by Matyas
Any ideas how to address Borg's contentions? He is right, someone would notice all the traffic, perhaps another country or astronomers based around the world.

Better yet how about the folks who live near or work at Vandenberg AFB or Cape Canaveral or numerous other launch sites around the world? Surely they would notice something that wasn't on the menu wouldn't they?

Spaceflight Now | Tracking Station | Worldwide launch schedule
spaceflightnow.com...

Spaceflight Now | Tracking Station | Launch log
spaceflightnow.com...

NASA's Shuttle and Rocket Missions
www.nasa.gov...

Space Rocket Launch Sites Around the World
www.spacetoday.org...

Do you have idea how many people are involved in launching and constructing a vehicle? Do you seriously believe NOT ONE of these people in what, at least the last 40 years, would have come forward? Is everyone involved including the janitors and the mail guy subject to a NDA under penalty of death? Oh yeah and what are "they" doing with all this stuff they're mining? The doomsday energy shortage is highly over rated anyway.

World oil supply still plentiful, study shows
www.msnbc.msn.com...

Get real suckers!

Ignorant Ape,

I'm a digital painter, meaning I use digital programs to paint artworks. I know how to tell when something's been tampered with and well, that archive photo 279, has definitely been edited. I can check the rest as well, but it's pretty evident that someone changed the image. Ask any artist with graphical art program experience, who know how to clean up their own work before submitting it to a company, and they will tell you, that photograph has been manipulated to remove a band of something around its perimeter. Not only is this evident when you use the techniques for discovering tampering or what is known in the industry as photographic manipulation, but it's also visible on the surface along the edge, where the editing tool has modified the gray of the moon surface to have a green tint - probably due to overlap of the editing tool. If you'd like I can provide the visual evidence.

Originally posted by Saviour Of The Real

Originally posted by Matyas
Any ideas how to address Borg's contentions? He is right, someone would notice all the traffic, perhaps another country or astronomers based around the world.

Better yet how about the folks who live near or work at Vandenberg AFB or Cape Canaveral or numerous other launch sites around the world? Surely they would notice something that wasn't on the menu wouldn't they?

Spaceflight Now | Tracking Station | Worldwide launch schedule
spaceflightnow.com...

Spaceflight Now | Tracking Station | Launch log
spaceflightnow.com...

NASA's Shuttle and Rocket Missions
www.nasa.gov...

Space Rocket Launch Sites Around the World
www.spacetoday.org...

Do you have idea how many people are involved in launching and constructing a vehicle? Do you seriously believe NOT ONE of these people in what, at least the last 40 years, would have come forward? Is everyone involved including the janitors and the mail guy subject to a NDA under penalty of death? Oh yeah and what are "they" doing with all this stuff they're mining? The doomsday energy shortage is highly over rated anyway.

World oil supply still plentiful, study shows
www.msnbc.msn.com...

Get real suckers!

I live by NASA. Cape Canaveral has many launches that are top secret. Canaveral and Cape Kennedy are two different stations. Kennedy is the visual one that launches the shuttles. Canaveral, on the other hand, is not only some fifteen miles away from Kennedy, it is military payload only, and most of their launches are undisclosed payloads.

This also ignores that governments working in tandem together, could easily keep such information from getting to the public. Launch from Antartica. Feed Reuters one thing, do another. Etc.

[edit on 24-11-2006 by undo]

PS : NASA has collated and published catalogues of anomolies sighted during lunar observation , as documented here

if the moon did indeed have atmosphere , it begs the question why would they not report it ?

they had nothing to gain by making false claims

[edit on 24-11-2006 by ignorant_ape]

Originally posted by johnlear
Probably all the big stuff is launched from the south pole space command launch complex. You might check the amount of DoD traffic going down there.

Probably? In other words you have no clue what you're talking about.

As far as the very large equipment built in the US going to the moon or Mars I am not sure how they do that but remember we've had anti-grav since the late 50's so by now it shouldn't be that much of a problem.

BS. Where's your evidence?

Those of you that are looking for rocket type propulsion transportation to the moon and Mars....thats just smoke. (So to speak).

No that's the current state of art. It appears you can’t even grasp basic physics so quit trying to blow smoke up the a__ of young impressionable minds. With all due respect you are (...) to humanity.

(Just my humble opinion of course)

Thanks for sharing your fantasies with us johnlear.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Fixed quote and removed personal attack (...)

You have a U2U



[edit on 24/11/06 by masqua]

Originally posted by ignorant_ape
PS : NASA has collated and published catalogues of anomolies sighted during lunar observation , as cocumented here

if the moon did indeed have aatmosphere , it begs the question why would they not report it ?

they had nothing to gain by making false claims

This, I agree with you on. At this point, there's the question of motive. I am unsure why this would be considered editable information. Perhaps one of the other gentlemen here would have some idea?

Originally posted by Saviour Of The Real


Probably? In other words you have no clue what you're talking about.

To me, "probably" sounds carefully chosen. Perhaps you don't like "probably", in which case I invite you to ignore most theoretical physics.

Originally posted by undo
I live by NASA. Cape Canaveral has many launches that are top secret.

That's true as far as the payloads go (psst they're satellities) but the launches themselves are public knowledge (how do you hide a rocket launch?) and therefore can be tracked and so are the capabilties of the launch vehicles (man rating, payload weight to LEO or higher).

www.patrick.af.mil...

astronautix.com...