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King Lucifer

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posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 07:22 PM
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Originally posted by Sun Matrix

Ecclesiastes 1:9 The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Really, is the Antichrist to come a mere man?

Also find out what happens to Nimrod when he dies. It is he that becomes Baal the sun god, the false Day Star. Check Nimrod, Baal, Semiramis and Tammuz.


ECCL 1:9 was uttered by King Soloman. You must consider the context in order to understand why he made this statement. Ecclesiastes begins with these words: “ ‘The greatest vanity!’ the congregator has said, ‘the greatest vanity! Everything is vanity!’ What profit does a man have in all his hard work at which he works hard under the sun?” (Eccl. 1:2, 3) The Hebrew word for “vanity” literally means “breath.” It indicates something that lacks firmness, stability and permanence. “The greatest vanity” well describes human affairs.

Next Soloman mentions repetitious cycles in nature. Generations of people continually come and go, the sun keeps rising and setting, winds ever circle about and rivers constantly empty into the sea but never fill it. (Eccl. 1:4-7) After reflecting on this, the wise king observed: “All things are wearisome; no one is able to speak of it. The eye is not satisfied at seeing, neither is the ear filled from hearing. That which has come to be, that is what will come to be; and that which has been done, that is what will be done; and so there is nothing new under the sun.”—Eccl. 1:8, 9.

The consideration of all these natural cycles appeared to Solomon as “wearisome.” It is, of course, true that the immensity and complexity of these cycles are such that a man could exhaust his entire life and never be able to comprehend the full sum of these. His vocabulary could never adequately describe it all in full detail.

There is no scriptural basis for linking this in any way with Nimrod.

[edit on 14-9-2006 by Sparky63]

[edit on 14-9-2006 by Sparky63]




posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 07:57 PM
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Originally posted by Sun Matrix

Sure, first this from Wikipedia.

In 539 BC the Neo-Babylonian Empire fell to Cyrus the Great, king of Persia. It is said that Cyrus walked through the gates of Babylon without encountering any resistance. He later issued a decree permitting the exiled Jews to return to their own land, and allowed their temple to be rebuilt.
and this.

The constant turmoil virtually emptied the city of Babylon. A tablet dated 275 BC states that the inhabitants of Babylon were transported to Seleucia, where a palace was built, as well as a temple given the ancient name of E-Saggila. With this deportation, the history of Babylon comes practically to an end, though more than a century later, it was found that sacrifices were still performed in its old sanctuary. By 141 BC, when the Parthian Empire took over the region, Babylon was in complete desolation and obscurity.

A sword did not come against Babylon as prophesied, Cyrus walked in. Babylon was later abandoned.


This is essentially correct. The city continued to exist but Babylon as a world power was crushed.
October 5, 539 B.C.E. (Gregorian calendar), when Babylon fell before the invading Medo-Persian armies under the command of Cyrus the Great.

That fateful night in the city of Babylon, Belshazzar held a banquet with a thousand of his grandees. Nabonidus was not there to see the ominous writing on the plaster wall: “MENE, MENE, TEKEL and PARSIN.” (Da 5:5-28) After suffering defeat at the hands of the Persians, Nabonidus had taken refuge in the city of Borsippa to the SW. But the prophet Daniel was on hand in Babylon on that night of October 5, 539 B.C.E., and he made known the significance of what was written on the wall. The men of Cyrus’ army were not sleeping in their encampment around Babylon’s seemingly impregnable walls. For them it was a night of great activity.

In brilliant strategy Cyrus’ army engineers diverted the mighty Euphrates River from its course through the city of Babylon. Then down the riverbed the Persians moved, up over the riverbanks, to take the city by surprise through the gates along the quay. Quickly passing through the streets, killing all who resisted, they captured the palace and put Belshazzar to death. It was all over. In one night Babylon had fallen, ending centuries of supremacy. Isa 44:27; 45:1, 2; Jer 50:38; 51:30-32;

Any who resisted were killed. Belshazzar was killed by the sword. You can bet Cyrus's army did not walk in shaking hands with the Babylonian Army.

From that memorable date, 539 B.C.E., Babylon’s glory began to fade as the city declined. Twice it revolted against the Persian emperor Darius I (Hystaspis), and on the second occasion it was dismantled. A partially restored city rebelled against Xerxes I and was plundered. Alexander the Great intended to make Babylon his capital, but he suddenly died in 323 B.C.E. Nicator conquered the city in 312 B.C.E. and transported much of its material to the banks of the Tigris for use in building his new capital of Seleucia. However, the city and a settlement of Jews remained in early Christian times, giving the apostle Peter reason to visit Babylon, as noted in his letter. (1Pe 5:13) Inscriptions found there show that Babylon’s temple of Bel existed as late as 75 C.E. About the fourth century C.E. the city appears to have passed out of existence. It became nothing more than “piles of stones.”—Jer 51:37.

Today nothing remains of Babylon but mounds and ruins, a veritable wasteland.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 08:00 PM
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Originally posted by Sparky63



With all due respect, you have yet to prove this to be true. Speculating on Bible prophesy is both dangerous and deceptive. In order for your statement above to be true, you would have to show that every statement about Ancient Babylon made my Jeremiah, Isaiah & Daniel has its modern day fullfillment in the current situation in Iraq. Can you do so?


I was very aware of all the answers that you gave about the Medes etc. So aware in fact, I realize that it has not happened. Babylon was not destroyed it was abandoned. The are still people living in the land of Chaldea therefore the prophecy has not been fullfilled. There was not a coalition of nations that came from the ends of the earth to destroy Babylon. That just happened. They did not try to heal Babylon but they are now.


For instance, your curious statements about Nimrod. They are vague, at least to me, and his connection to the prophesies in Isaiah has not been clearly explained. Perhaps I missed them in my overly long posts.


The prophecy of Isaiah 14 is about Nimrod and not Nebby. The verse about the fir tree and cedar not being cut will explain this.(If you understand it)


Jeremiah 10:2 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. 3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. 4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not. 5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good.


Jeremiah 10 is talking about the Christmas Tree. And they are still being cut.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 08:05 PM
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Originally posted by Sun Matrix

Ecclesiastes 1:9 The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Really, is the Antichrist to come a mere man?

Also find out what happens to Nimrod when he dies. It is he that becomes Baal the sun god, the false Day Star. Check Nimrod, Baal, Semiramis and Tammuz.


Even as the Antichrist is more than a mere man so was Nimrod.

The thing which hath been was a world government that defies God. What do think that the Antichrist kingdom will be.

AND THAT WHICH IS DONE IS THAT WHICH SHALL BE DONE.

At Nimrods death he becomes Baal the sun god.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 08:08 PM
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Originally posted by Sparky63


Today nothing remains of Babylon but mounds and ruins, a veritable wasteland.



This prophecy is against the whole land of the Chaldeans.

Also there are people living in Babylon right now. Sadam was rebuinding it.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 08:31 PM
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Originally posted by Sun Matrix
Really, is the Antichrist to come a mere man?

Also find out what happens to Nimrod when he dies. It is he that becomes Baal the sun god, the false Day Star. Check Nimrod, Baal, Semiramis and Tammuz.


In his book The Two Babylons Dr. Alexander Hislop identifies Tammuz with Nimrod, the founder of the city of Babylon, about 180 years after the flood of Noah’s day.

Nimrod was the great-grandson of Noah. According to Genesis 10:1, 6, 8-12
Religious tradition recounts that Nimrod was executed for his rebelliousness against Jehovah, the God of Noah. Nimrod’s followers considered his violent death a tragedy or calamity, and deified him. Annually they memorialized his death on the first or second day of the lunar month named Tammuz, when the idolatrous women wept over his idol. Thus the reason for this weeping over him by the Babylonian cultists is understood. Also, the fact that Nimrod is recognized by scholars as identified with Marduk, the chief god of the Babylonians, enables us to see why the Jews, then tributary to Babylon, and in danger of being swallowed up by this World Power of the day, might be induced to take up Tammuz worship.
Ezekiel reports, “Look! there the women were sitting, weeping over the god Tammuz.”—Ezek. 8:14

Nimrod was indeed worshipped as a god. But this does not mean he actually became one.
More than 1500 years later, when Babylon reached its greatest glory in the days of King Nebuchadnezzar II, who is mentioned in the Holy Bible, the chief god of the imperial city was Marduk. His temple there was called E-sagila (meaning “Lofty House”), the tower of which was called E-teme-nanki (meaning “House of the Foundation of Heaven and Earth”). In connection with the god Marduk, who is called Merodach in the Bible (Jer. 50:1, 2), it is interesting to read the following comments:

Nimrod has been identified with Merodach, the god of Babylon . . . He has been identified with Gilgamesh, the hero of the epic which contains the Babylonian Deluge story . . . with various historical kings of Babylonia, . . . The Encyclopaedia Britannica, Volume 19, edition of 1911, page 703

Although worshipped as a god. Nimrod was dead and had been for about 1800 years.

Alaxander Hislop in his book The Two Babylons traces the the origin of the Mother-Son imagery worshipped around the earth.
In regard to this, The Two Babylons, pages 20, 21, says:


The Babylonians, in their popular religion, supremely worshipped a Goddess Mother and a Son, who was represented in pictures and in images as an infant or child in his mother’s arms . . . From Babylon, this worship of the Mother and the Child spread to the ends of the earth. In Egypt, the Mother and the Child were worshipped under the names of Isis and Osiris. In India, even to this day, as Isi and Iswara; in Asia as Cybele and Deōius; in Pagan Rome, as Fortuna and Jupiter-puer, or Jupiter, the boy; in Greece, as Ceres, the Great Mother, with the babe at her breast, or as Irene, the goddess of Peace, with the boy Plutus in her arms; and even in Thibet, in China, and Japan, the Jesuit missionaries were astonished to find the counterpart of Madonna and her child as devoutly worshipped as in Papal Rome itself; Shing Moo, the Holy Mother in China, being represented with a child in her arms, and a glory around her, exactly as if a Roman Catholic artist had been employed to set her up.

The original of that mother, so widely worshipped, there is reason to believe, was Semiramis, already referred to, who, it is well known, was worshipped by the Babylonians, and other eastern nations, and that under the name of Rhea, the great Goddess “Mother.”


[edit on 14-9-2006 by Sparky63]



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 08:53 PM
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Originally posted by Sun Matrix

Originally posted by Sparky63


Today nothing remains of Babylon but mounds and ruins, a veritable wasteland.



This prophecy is against the whole land of the Chaldeans.

Also there are people living in Babylon right now. Sadam was rebuinding it.


"Was" is the Key word. No one lives in the remains of the ancient city of Babylon.
The book Archaeology and Old Testament Study states: “These extensive ruins, of which, despite Koldewey’s work, only a small proportion has been excavated, have during past centuries been extensively plundered for building materials. Partly in consequence of this, much of the surface now presents an appearance of such chaotic disorder that it is strongly evocative of the prophecies of Isa. xiii. 19–22 and Jer. l. 39

Here is a link to a news story about the condition of the ruins of Babylon
www.nytimes.com...

Im not sure if I am allowed to post it here. Mods please correct it if I am in error.

Regarding he Whole land of the Chaldeans. in 539 BCE it ceased to be THE WORLD POWER. Its king was killed and it no longer had authority over Gods people. Cyrus took control and allowed Gods people to return to their homeland and begin rebuilding Jerusalem.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 09:10 PM
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Sparky

Find out the origin of the Christmas tree that is spoken of in Jeremiah 10



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 09:27 PM
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"Was" is the Key word. No one lives in the remains of the ancient city of Babylon.
The book Archaeology and Old Testament Study states: “These extensive ruins, of which, despite Koldewey’s work, only a small proportion has been excavated, have during past centuries been extensively plundered for building materials.


The prophecy against Babylon is against the LAND OF THE CHALDEANS and not just the city of Babylon that was not destroy by the sword but abandoned.

THIS IS A JUDGEMENT AGAINST THE LAND OF THE CHALDEANS.

The final part of this judgment will occur when the DAY OF THE LORD happens and the nations are punished for their evil


Isiah 13:9 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it. 10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine. 11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible. 12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.


Jeremiah 50 and 51 is occurring now up to the part where the Medes come. This will happen on the DAY OF THE LORD just like it says.

Isaiah 13 and 14 have not completely happened either.

Isaiah 14 is talking about Nimrod and Satan/Lucifer.

Until recently nations have not come from the fartherst borders against the land of the Chaldeans.

I understand what is being taught in Bible schools, it's just wrong.

[edit on 14-9-2006 by Sun Matrix]



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:12 PM
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Originally posted by Sun Matrix
Sparky

Find out the origin of the Christmas tree that is spoken of in Jeremiah 10



I am well aware of the origin of the Christmas tree or Yule log as any student of the Bible should be.

On December 25 both Romans and ancient Greeks celebrated the birth of the unconquered sun. The practice traces back to Babylon. Nimrod was deified as the sun-god. When cut down by his enemies he was represented by a log, and when reborn he was symbolized by an evergreen tree. After documenting this, Dr. Alexander Hislop’s The Two Babylons states:

‘Now the Yule Log is the dead stock of Nimrod, deified as the sun-god, but cut down by his enemies; the Christmas-tree is Nimrod redivivus—the slain god come to life again.”

The log was burned on the eve of December 24; by the next morning it had been replaced by an evergreen tree. Dr. Hislop shows the pagan origins of the other customs surrounding Christmas—the candles, the feasting, the wassail bowl, the mistletoe, the giving of gifts and others.—Pp. 91-103.

However you offer no scriptural proof to support your claim that Jer 10:3 is making this connection.

An interesting Book on the subject of Babylonian & Sumerian Gods is by Author
Petra Eisele. She speaks of 500 gods, saying that some of the more extensive lists contain up to 2,500 names. Finally, in course of time, “the official theologians of Babylon fixed the hierarchy of the gods more or less definitely, dividing them into triads,” says the New Larousse Encyclopedia of Mythology. One prominent triad of gods was composed of Anu, Enlil, and Ea. Another was made up of the astral gods Sin, Shamash, and Ishtar, also known as Astarte, the mother-goddess, consort of Tammuz.

So does the scripture at Jer 10:3 identify the specific god the idol maker was carving? No.

Also, keep in mind that the tree in this passage was being cut down for the purpose of carving it into an idol for false worship. Those practicing this custom were mocked as assigning power and glory to something worthless.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:33 PM
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Originally posted by Sun Matrix

I understand what is being taught in Bible schools, it's just wrong.


With that statement, the burden of proof is on you. Please provide sound scriptural backing for tha statements you make. Merely saying something is true over and over again does not make it so.
For instance, you keep making the statement that Nimrod is Lucifer. and yet you have not demonstrates it to be true. The word Lucifer only occurs once in the Bible and Only in some versions. As already explained The Hebrew word translated “Lucifer” means “shining one.” The Septuagint uses the Greek word that means “bringer of dawn.” Hence, some translations render the original Hebrew “morning star” or “Daystar.” But Jerome’s Latin Vulgate uses “Lucifer” (light bearer), and this accounts for the appearance of that term in various versions of the Bible.

Who is this Lucifer? The expression “shining one,” or “Lucifer,” is found in what Isaiah prophetically commanded the Israelites to pronounce as a “proverbial saying against the king of Babylon.” Thus, it is part of a saying primarily directed at the Babylonian dynasty.

That the description “shining one” is given to a man and not to a spirit creature is further seen by the statement: “Down to Sheol you will be brought.” Sheol is the common grave of mankind—not a place occupied by Satan the Devil.

Moreover, those seeing Lucifer brought into this condition ask: “Is this the man that was agitating the earth?” Clearly, “Lucifer” refers to a human, not to a spirit creature.—Isaiah 14:4, 15, 16.

Like I said, the burden of proof is on you. Please procede with caution. The bible strongly condems those that make false prophesies. Please dont take this personally, I am not accusing you of this, this applies to anyone who takes on the responsibilty explain Bible prophesy, or state as fact their own opinions.

Always back up your claims with sound scriptural proof if you want to speak with authority. By authority, I mean that which comes from the scriptures



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:35 PM
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Originally posted by Sparky63

So does the scripture at Jer 10:3 identify the specific god the idol maker was carving? No.



They cut a tree from the woods and fasten it with nails and a hammer. They decorate it with silver and gold.

They still do this today at Christmas. If you understand the origin, then you should understand this


Isaiah 13:8 Yea, the fir trees rejoice at thee, and the cedars of Lebanon, saying, Since thou art laid down, no feller is come up against us


And why was the cedar of Lebanon cut down?



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:39 PM
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So sparky63, knowing this, tell me what the deal is with Satanists? In your opinion or anyone, what makes them so sure of their beliefs?

And can you shed any light on why Jesus proclaimed himself as the morning star in revelations?

I just can't help but wonder how many vital missing texts there are in the old testament.
Thats actually the reason I don't even like talking about it.. mistranslations, interpretations, missing texts...



[edit on 14-9-2006 by Techsnow]



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:49 PM
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Originally posted by Sparky63


Always back up your claims with sound scriptural proof if you want to speak with authority. By authority, I mean that which comes from the scriptures


I provide plenty of proof showing :

Isiah 13 as I posted says the the Medes will come on the Day of the Lord.
This has not happened.

I showed where Babylon THE LAND OF THE CHALDEANS was being judged and not just the city. There are plenty of people living in Bagdad right now. When this prophecy is fulfilled there won't be.

I showed where a coalition of nations come from the farthest borders, that just happened.

Since we know that Babylon is not completely destroyed until the DAY OF THE LORD we know that this has not happened by the proof of scripture. Saying that the judgement of Babylon the land of the Chaldeans has already happened is incorrect because by scripture I know that there will not be anyone living in the land.

I still see people



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 10:57 PM
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Sparky

can you do anything with this; Some prophecy gurus are using it to say that Babylon will be rebuilt. (Which I don't believe) But if you have anything on this I would like to hear it.



Zechariah 5:5 Then the angel that talked with me went forth, and said unto me, Lift up now thine eyes, and see what is this that goeth forth. 6 And I said, What is it? And he said, This is an ephah that goeth forth. He said moreover, This is their resemblance through all the earth. 7 And, behold, there was lifted up a talent of lead: and this is a woman that sitteth in the midst of the ephah. 8 And he said, This is wickedness. And he cast it into the midst of the ephah; and he cast the weight of lead upon the mouth thereof. 9 Then lifted I up mine eyes, and looked, and, behold, there came out two women, and the wind was in their wings; for they had wings like the wings of a stork: and they lifted up the ephah between the earth and the heaven. 10 Then said I to the angel that talked with me, Whither do these bear the ephah? 11 And he said unto me, To build it an house in the land of Shinar: and it shall be established, and set there upon her own base.
To build it an house in the land of Shinar:



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 11:08 PM
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Originally posted by Sun Matrix

They cut a tree from the woods and fasten it with nails and a hammer. They decorate it with silver and gold.

They still do this today at Christmas. If you understand the origin, then you should understand this


Isaiah 13:8 Yea, the fir trees rejoice at thee, and the cedars of Lebanon, saying, Since thou art laid down, no feller is come up against us


And why was the cedar of Lebanon cut down?


First of all JEr 10:2 says in part," Do not learn the way of the Nations."
Nations , Plural.
What nations? Jer 9:26 identifies those nations as Egypt, Edom, Ammon & Moab.
These nations all their own gods. Idols of many different gods could have been carved from a tree and decorated with silver or gold.

The scripture you quote above is Isa 14:8. not 13:8

Examing the context and looking at ISA 14:4 thru 6 we see that
Babylon has built up quite a reputation as a conqueror, an oppressor who turns free people into slaves. How fitting that her fall be celebrated with a “proverbial saying” directed primarily at the Babylonian dynasty—starting with Nebuchadnezzar and ending with Nabonidus and Belshazzar—that presided over the glory days of the great city!

What a difference her fall will make! “The whole earth has come to rest, has become free of disturbance. People have become cheerful with joyful cries. Even the juniper trees have also rejoiced at you, the cedars of Lebanon, saying, ‘Ever since you have lain down, no woodcutter comes up against us.’” (Isaiah 14:7, 8)

there is a simple explanation of the trees. Look at the context.
While Vs 6 talked about the Babylonians practice of subduing the nations around her, Vs 7 & 8 makes a contrast showing in illustrative language the changed conditions.

The kings of the nations round about were, to Babylon’s rulers, like trees to be cut down and used for their own purposes. Well, all of that is finished. The Babylonian woodcutter has cut his last tree!

Simple and soundly based on the scriptures. The context must always be considered.



posted on Sep, 14 2006 @ 11:35 PM
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Originally posted by Techsnow
So sparky63, knowing this, tell me what the deal is with Satanists? In your opinion or anyone, what makes them so sure of their beliefs?

And can you shed any light on why Jesus proclaimed himself as the morning star in revelations?

I just can't help but wonder how many vital missing texts there are in the old testament.
Thats actually the reason I don't even like talking about it.. mistranslations, interpretations, missing texts...


I can not explain the beliefs of Satanists. I have a hard enough time explaining my own

Some do not believe Satan to be real. Some I think are drawn to it because they dont want to be held accountably by a higher power. I do not think they all have the same beliefs or reasons for choosing this path.

Regarding Jesus and identifying him as the morning star; or Daystar.
The word “daystar” occurs just once in the Bible, and it is similar in meaning to “morning star.” Revelation 22:16 calls Jesus Christ “the bright morning star.” At certain seasons of the year, such stars are the last ones to rise on the eastern horizon. They rise just before the sun appears, and they thus herald the dawn of a new day.
Peter used the word “daystar” to refer to Jesus after He received Kingdom power. Peter had been given a brilliant forgleam of this during the Transfiguration vision recorded at Mat 17:1-9.. thus Rev 22:16 identifies Jesus Christ as this figurative Daystar or Morning Star. The Transfiguration vision depicted him arrayed in Kingly Power as the glorified king of Gods kingdom.
At that time, Jesus rose in all the universe, including our earth! As the Messianic Daystar, he heralds the dawning of a new day, or era, for obedient mankind.



posted on Sep, 15 2006 @ 12:12 AM
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Originally posted by Sun Matrix
I provide plenty of proof showing :

Isiah 13 as I posted says the the Medes will come on the Day of the Lord.
This has not happened.

What scripture are you referring to? Is it Isa 13:9? If so you must consider the context. If you contend that this is modern day Iraq then please explain the modernday fullfillment of Isa 13:19. It says that Babylon is the decoration of kingdoms, the beauty of the pride of the Chaldeans.
Is Babylon today the beauty of the pride of the Chaldeans or is it already a deslolate ruin?


I showed where Babylon THE LAND OF THE CHALDEANS was being judged and not just the city. There are plenty of people living in Bagdad right now. When this prophecy is fulfilled there won't be.
Bagdad is not mentioned in the scripture. Please provide scriptural proof to support your claim that Bagdad will be unihabited.



I showed where a coalition of nations come from the farthest borders, that just happened.
That is mere speculation on your part. You need scriptural proof to firmly establish that current events are the unequivical fullfillment of these prophecies. You have not presented it yet.

Unless your bizarre reference to Eccl 1:9 had something to do with it.


Since we know that Babylon is not completely destroyed until the DAY OF THE LORD we know that this has not happened by the proof of scripture. Saying that the judgement of Babylon the land of the Chaldeans has already happened is incorrect because by scripture I know that there will not be anyone living in the land.


Bible prophesy usually has a initial fullfilment & a Symbolic one. the initial fullfillment occured in 539 BCE. This involved the geographic region occupied by the Babylolonian Dynasty. the Symbolic fullfillment encompasses something far greater than the nation of Iraq. The Messiahs coming to execute divine judgement on Babylon the Great as referred to in Rev 14:8 Rev 16:19 Rev 17:5 Rev 18:2 & Rev 18:21

Like I said. The Burden of proof is on you to establish that current events in Iraq are the fullfillment of Bible Prophesy. You made the claim. Can you offer more than your own opinions and ideas?

[edit on 15-9-2006 by Sparky63]



posted on Sep, 15 2006 @ 12:36 AM
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Originally posted by Sparky63


First of all JEr 10:2 says in part," Do not learn the way of the Nations."
Nations , Plural. What nations? Jer 9:26 identifies those nations as Egypt, Edom, Ammon & Moab. These nations all their own gods. Idols of many different gods could have been carved from a tree and decorated with silver or gold.


Yea, do not learn the way of the nations. From Babylon Nimrod, Baal, Semiramis and Tammuz. From Egypt Osiris, Ra, Isis and Horus. IT'S THE DIFFERENT VERSION OF THE SAME LIE.


What a difference her fall will make! “The whole earth has come to rest, has become free of disturbance. People have become cheerful with joyful cries. Even the juniper trees have also rejoiced at you, the cedars of Lebanon, saying, ‘Ever since you have lain down, no woodcutter comes up against us.’” (Isaiah 14:7, 8)

The kings of the nations round about were, to Babylon’s rulers, like trees to be cut down and used for their own purposes. Well, all of that is finished. The Babylonian woodcutter has cut his last tree!



Afraid not, the fir tree is still being cut in honor of Nimrod at Christmas when the tree is a symbol of the rebirth of Nimrod. Masons continue to cut an evergreen tree in their ceremonies. Sure, it's because of Osiris, but Osiris is Nimrod.

The cedars of Lebanon rejoice because the throne of Nimrod was made from a giant cedar.

Isaiah 14 is referring to Nimrod the king of Babylon who was more than a mere man but was a mighty hunter of mens souls before the God.



posted on Sep, 15 2006 @ 01:02 AM
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Originally posted by Sparky63


If so you must consider the context. If you contend that this is modern day Iraq then please explain the modernday fullfillment of Isa 13:19. It says that Babylon is the decoration of kingdoms, the beauty of the pride of the Chaldeans.
Is Babylon today the beauty of the pride of the Chaldeans or is it already a deslolate ruin?

Surely you were aware of all the beautiful palaces that Sadam had built. Gold faucets, precious jewels everywhere etc. etc.



Bagdad is not mentioned in the scripture. Please provide scriptural proof to support your claim that Bagdad will be unihabited.

Sure no problem.............is it in the land of the Chaldeans? Then I have provided what you ask. Can you provide scriptural proof that Bagdad is not considered to be in the land of the Caldeans?



That is mere speculation on your part. You need scriptural proof to firmly establish that current events are the unequivical fullfillment of these prophecies. You have not presented it yet.

Can you provide scriptural proof that the DAY OF THE LORD has happened and that all the nations on the earth have been judged.



Unless your bizarre reference to Eccl 1:9 had something to do with it.

I was just showing you that the Antichrist will set up his kingdom just like Nimrod did. The thing that hath been is that which shall be done. Are you telling me you don't believe that the Antichrist will set up a world government?





Bible prophesy usually has a initial fullfilment & a Symbolic one. the initial fullfillment occured in 539 BCE. This involved the geographic region occupied by the Babylolonian Dynasty. the Symbolic fullfillment encompasses something far greater than the nation of Iraq. The Messiahs coming to execute divine judgement on Babylon the Great as referred to in Rev 14:8 Rev 16:19 Rev 17:5 Rev 18:2 & Rev 18:21


Remember the book you quoted about TWO Babylons. They will both be judged.




Like I said. The Burden of proof is on you to establish that current events in Iraq are the fullfillment of Bible Prophesy. You made the claim. Can you offer more than your own opinions and ideas?


I had no problem showing scripturally that the LAND OF THE CHALDEANS would be judged. I had no problem showing that the Bible says that the Medes will come on the DAY OF THE LORD.

Can prove scriputurely that the DAY OF THE LORD has happened?




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