Ps. and where stays the idea that Satan is just fiction... the Egyptians in that time did really believe he was there, just like the Christians believed Jezus and Mozes were there...

Where is the idea that it was just fiction... while everybody back then believed it was really happening...

As with All "Bible Thumpers " your wrong !
'Where is the idea that it was just fiction... while everybody back then believed it was really happening... "
Everybody Back then Didnt believe the same thing as
people of the Judeao-Chrisitan belief system
Are you asserting the entire world believes the same things
Please !..............
Most all concepts of Religion are born of ignorant men trying to explain the unknown

Originally posted by straterx
Most all concepts of Religion are born of ignorant men trying to explain the unknown

If you ignore the truth..then you are truly lost in Satan's grand plan. What concept do you need?...except that God came down to this earth in a man's form...Jesus...and proved that there is life after death.

better being safe than sorry? in that state of mind, you would have to abide to every belief on this planet, as they are all equally likely to be true, as christianity for example. but here's my thoughts on how god gives us our so called "free will" and "loves" us soo dearly...

god is a water slide instructor, there are two slides/paths that you are able to choose, thus the two ultimate destinations you will be going after you die, heaven/hell. you dont get to see god, or the two paths until you climb up the ladder/life. but as always, there is a sign at the bottom of the slide, with many more as you climb up, both proclaiming the negativity of one slide, and the goodness of the other. yet on every sign, it is clearly stated that you do have a choice. it is until you get to the top that you realise that god's just a jerk ass pimply faced teenager monitoring the slides for minimum wage. he tells you that you have two choices, you can take the super fun happy slide (heaven), or the slide of sharp and pointy blades (hell). at this point, you also realise that your choice, although fully given, technically has not been, thus a false pretense of free will, as there is an obvious outcome that everyone would rather choose the super fun happy slide, than the #ing slide of sharp and pointy blades! at this point i would throw that #er down his own slide (super fun happy slide) and course my own way down the slide of sharp and pointy blades.

all in all, the moral to this story is that the whole hell/heaven thing is a fix, an illusion, one that tricks you into thinking you have a choice at all, when it's pretty obvious that everyone will not take the path less travelled (slide of sharp and pointy blades). thus i think it's all bull#, and i will do what i said as above if it leads to be true. but as i believe it is not, i highly doubt that i will.

what i'm trying to say is, walk your own path, build your own slide! respect yourself, make your own choices. if that's what you want, then fine, if not then fine. but this better safe then sorry # really seems like the biggest cop-out in the world. i mean, do you not think a god would know your motives?

well, that's it, any thoughts? (this should be interesting)

Hell is real......The Orthodox Church understands hell as a place of eternal torment for those who willfully reject the grace of God. Our Lord once said, "If your hand makes you sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter into life maimed, than having two hands, to go to hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched -- where their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched" (Mark 9:44-45).
He challenged the religious hypocrites with the question: "How can you escape the condemnation of hell?" (Matthew 23:33).
His answer is, "God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved" (John 3:17).
There is a day of judgement coming, and there is a place of punishment for those who have hardened their hearts against God.
It does make a difference how we will live this life. Those who of their own free will reject the grace and mercy of God must forever bear the consequences of that choice.

Originally posted by deafence#
better being safe than sorry? in that state of mind, you would have to abide to every belief on this planet, as they are all equally likely to be true.

Perhaps, but the only one that could mean spending life in an eternal state of suffering is the one where you're asked if Hell is real or not. Everything else is just basically a bed time story by comparision.

The fact that you are cursing throughout your entire post pretty much invalidates everything you said.

what i'm trying to say is, walk your own path, build your own slide! respect yourself, make your own choices. if that's what you want, then fine, if not then fine. but this better safe then sorry shyte really seems like the biggest cop-out in the world. i mean, do you not think a god would know your motives?

Of course god knows my motives. And he knows I truly, in my heart, believe in hell. I say "Better safe then sorry" to try and protect myself from the infantile ranting of the pre-teen pseudo intellectuals on this board.

If I were to say I believe completely in hell, 500 Gothic-loving Self-hating "I am a vampire, I am dark, please pity me because I have no friends" members of ATS would converge on my post and call me a bible-thumper, a bigot, a liar, and a gullible A-hole. I try to avoid that by giving all the self-haters and potential suicide victims a roadblock on their way to attacking me.


[Edited on 5-11-2003 by Kai-Raega]

First of all; nice Avatar Sapphire. Darklanser made mine too.

Second; That's a good link. It kinda shows people how little they know about the bible. I can't say I'm worried about the location of Hell.

[Edited on 11/5/03 by NotTooHappy]

the word and idea was not introduced untill greco-roman-troy beliefs...


in reference to hell the votes are in this is it and those who dont follow the leader recieve the most suffering...

[Edited on 5-11-2003 by bigsage]

Originally posted by deafence#
some say that hell is the absence of god... i say that it is a state of mind, how you view your life, and how you choose to handle it.

And others would say hell is god. I would say hell is whatever you dislike most, be it an internal chasm of fire, a pit of fire, or a small room with a Shania Twain song perpetually playing. I really don't believe in life after death, so for me hell is just something half the populations is scared to death of, something that keeps them in line.

Originally posted by NotTooHappy
First of all; nice Avatar Sapphire. Darklanser made mine too.

Second; That's a good link. It kinda shows people how little they know about the bible. I can't say I'm worried about the location of Hell.

[Edited on 11/5/03 by NotTooHappy]

hi there, yes darklanser is great with the avatars eh? Thanks I like yours too!

I'll expand more on this in a while but i really believe people who believe in hell are accepting this concept without really understanding what it is let alone doing any kind of research on it. I mean, it's like the old saying "If Bob jumped off a cliff would you do it too"? kinda thing. I never believe blindly what i'm told, i study everything and i'm forever asking questions due in part because i was discouraged from doing that when i did attend church, and i attended more than one.

I didn't grow up with religion but i've always believed in a higher intellectual presence guiding us. I just don't understand the concept of a Hell and i will never agree with it especially since finding out where Hell derives and how it became a socially accepted idea in our society. People tend to feel better "imho" fearing the unknown rather than trying to understand it. I do remember fearing hell most of my life to the point where it made me ill to think about it. And all i remember was one day after praying for a week straight about it, it left me like a huge boulder had been removed from upon me, it was something i'll never forget. I've never feared hell since. Besides, there is no fear in Perfect Love. Fear is being afraid of the Unknown, there is no balance in fear. ok thats my 2 cents for now on the whole, "as we say in Canada" H .. E .. Double Hockeysticks

in MA fashion...

Lake of Fire, by Nirvana.

Where do bad folks go when they die?
They don't go to heaven where the angels fly
They go to the lake of fire and fry
Won't see them again 'till the fourth of July

I knew a lady who came from Duluth
She got bit by a dog with a rabid tooth
She went to her grave just a little too soon
And she flew away howling on the yellow moon

Where do bad folks go when they die?
They don't go to heaven where the angels fly
They go down to the lake of fire and fry
Won't see them again 'till the fourth of July

Now the people cry and the people moan
And they look for a dry place to call their home
And try to find some place to rest their bones
While the angels and the devils try to make them their own

Where do bad folks go when they die?
They don't go to heaven where the angels fly
They go down to the lake of fire and fry
Won't see them again 'till the fourth of July

Hell is being trapped in front of a computer screen in ATS's US Political Mudpit mode for all eternity with your eyes wired open.

or merit badges for good favor...
really though good to see the old seeker avatar...


"the preacher wants me buried, why? cause i know he's a liar/have you ever seen a crack head? thats eternal fire"2pac-Blasphemy...

Seriously though, my take on hell. I dunno about the flames, if it was a place of torture, I would think mental fears could become personafied.

Physical pain is so 1980's.

Also my view on heaven is different, I mean I can't tell you what to expect because I don't know, but I doubt it's the typical movie setting.

I am kind of thinking that when we die, we are spiritual beings, and heaven/hell is maybe a difference in planes and positive/negative energy,

Here on earth is the place where you decide are you going to become a being of negative energy or positive, I think our actions here shape our next life, whatever exactly it may be.

I can see all the atheist laugh, but something inside tells me there is more to life than just this earth.

i think you are very close though...

what if we decide if we are going to serve others as jesus did, truthfully and honestly; or serve our selves by any means necessary?...

When I was about 10 yrs old I was taken to a hell by a being. I saw groups of people being herded by guards along the top of cliffs above a lake of fiery lava type liquid. The people were herded before a magistrate type person who sat on a throne near the end of the cliffs. One by one the people had to face the magistrate and he read out the charges against them from scrolls of paper. After that the prisoner was pushed over the edge into the fiery lake.

I looked at all the people in the lake and they were standing waist deep in the liquid, raising up their arms and moving around as their flesh just dripped off them.


The experience was very vivid in my mind for years afterwards. Then about 20 yrs later I saw a painting of the exact same hell. The artist that made the painting must have seen the same hell because every single detail was exactly the same. Even the colors were the same. People were being herded before the magistrate etc, and then thrown into the lava; and their dripping flesh was depicted in the same way.

I swear on my soul that this really happened.

Even though I don't expect anyone to believe it.

In the New Testament, Jesus did speak of a place of punishment after death. I give the following two quotes for your consideration.

Luke 16:19
19. "There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day.
20. At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores
21. and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.
22. "The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried.
23. In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side.
24. So he called to him, `Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'
25. "But Abraham replied, `Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony.
26. And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'
27. "He answered, `Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house,
28. for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'
29. "Abraham replied, `They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'
30. "`No, father Abraham,' he said, `but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'
31. "He said to him, `If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.'"

Mark 9:43
43. If your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life maimed than with two hands to go into hell, where the fire never goes out.
45. And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.
47. And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell,
48. where "`their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched.'
49. Everyone will be salted with fire.

Indeed it does seem that Jesus taught that there was some form of post mortem punishment for the unsaved.

ahh yes Life without Humor would be like England without Monty Python ... ACK what a thought

anyhow i was thinking, it would be odd if all the people who believed in hell and stuff came back in their next life as atheists heh, a complete reversal could be rather interesting i must say.