Then vote his majority out if he's the issue. that still doesn't hinder you.

What Majority? Harper has an extremely thin Minority government and if he pisses Canadians off too much the other three parties have more then enough votes to bring him down.

The Last election was a vote against the incumbants for rampant corruption.

[edit on 10-9-2006 by sardion2000]

There is another angle to this homosexual agenda that people do not realize. It has to do with how the "New World Order," or elite has opened the matter for public discussion, favoring "gay rights," and other things. At the same time Gloria Steinem was sponsored by the CIA. The result of her brand of "feminism," was that two people have to work to earn the same standard of living as one did in previous years. These issues speak to the breakdown of the family. The NWO wants to do this so that it can be the substitute father figure, to make centralized leadership no matter how unequivocally bad for that matter, into the one who "rescues you," and "protects you." In fact it does nothing of the kind! The psychology of it delves into transference and other mechanisms yielding social control and authority from a topheavy hierarchy. Neglecting the stabilizing functions of decentralization, the NWO creates chaos, then steps in later as your "father figure," or benevolent other.

Now when the Pope makes his statements, they are based upon thousands of years of historical experience. You see the cycle we are witnessing is one that civilizations have entered and passed through many times. People are recieving their "homosexual rights," from a governmental agency that is steeped in "political correctness.

There are many other reasons why the Pope is right than only his recent statements illustrate, but his opposition in many reasoned steps is far more profound than anyone realizes. We are living in a period where the breakdown of the family is happening, and it is by design.

If the Pope wants to criticize Canada in particular, he may be missing the point that these things are happening on the basis of an elite agenda and the wrong kind of "New World Order." As long as we live in a free and open society the Pope, and anyone else for that matter should speak freely, from the heart, and from convocations.

Shall we just take this totally out of context and blow it out of proportion to provide another opportunity for the Catholic haters to spew their venom?

The Pope didn't go to Canada & stand up and address the entire nation. He was addressing his bishops on a visit to Rome. What do you expect him to say to them? Sheesh!

Originally posted by interestedalways
Not all Catholics are bad people of course just brainwashed and wanting something to believe in

Oh really? Thanks for the insult. What makes you such an authority on Catholics?

If the Church is so good at brainwashing they wouldn't have a problem with so many people calling themselves Catholic while blatantly picking and choosing which precepts they follow, then you might have a point. Unfortunately, you are wrong. The very fact that problems exist in the Church proves they aren't brainwashing anyone.

Catholics practice free will. If your free will pulls you away from the teachings of the Church, you are not a Catholic. If you are a Catholic you have chosen to follow the teachings of the Church.

Statements like this are ignorant because they can be only be made by people who don't really know what a Catholic is. I can assure you some of the most devout of them have higher IQ's than the average joe, are incapable of being hypnotised let alone brainwashed and aren't there because they want something to believe in. That would assume they needed something to believe in, and most of them I know don't "need" this, they chose it.

So, let's go back to the original ire of this thread. The Pope reinforces the Church's teachings to all it's leaders as he should. He doesn't single out Canada, this just happened to be the meeting with Canadian bishops. I'm sure he says the same things to plenty of other bishops when it's their turn for their meeting with him.

I really find it amusing how much power so many of you think the Pope has. Half his flock doesn't even follow him. Nothing he says is any different than what the office has always said. If his words were any cause for concern to those who aren't part of his flock, these things he speaks of would not need to be said, because obviously he would be in control in the first place and the situations would not exist. Nothing has changed, no one is threatened, this is not an earth shattering event, so you can all calm down now.

posted by Duzey

We don't get to vote for our PM. He is simply the person the party who has the most seats has chosen to lead them. [Edited by Don W]

OK. I’ve come to admire that system. America is stuck with an unpopular leader until a fixed date, January 20, 2009. That can be very bad for the country. In any “lame duck” situation. More so in this one. OTOH, I do think the Canadian voters are pretty certain which of the party leaders will become the next PM, so that may have some influence on how they decide to vote. The Brits are tap-dancing now, how to get rid of Tony Blair without the government falling. They don’t want elections in the short term. I suspect Labor wants to hold on until after the US election on November 7, at the minimum for Blair's departure.

Nobody is imposing anything on the Catholic church. They are free to deny ordination to women, kick out members who have had divorces

While you are exactly correct on the legal conditions that exist today, there is a new school of legal principles that says “no” to the old accepted notion that a private organization can do anything it wants to its members. As the notion of human rights expands even if the reality does not, a large organization partakes of the public weal despite its claim of being private and therefore beyond any laws; in the case of religions, laws of men. We all know in Barry Goldwater’s heart of hearts, that all laws are laws of men however they are denominated or represented.

Aside: The best newscast ever was the 1980s CBC Sunday Morning radio program. It was played on our PBS from 6 AM to 8 AM, the first hour re-played making a 3 hour program covering 2 hours of news. Most American newscasters are fond of asking the survivors of anything “how did you feel” when you saw your family member cut in half? Or similar trite.

I measure any newscast by how much more I know about the topic after the newscast than I knew before, or how much trivial material did I learn verus hard facts to help me be a good citizen? It is rare to learn anything useful in an American newscast. I do listen to BBC every day at 6 PM.

Is that CBC program on the air today?



[edit on 9/10/2006 by donwhite]

Is that CBC program on the air today?

I believe so, though it's probably over by now.

posted by Vitchilo

I thought the Vatican loved and hated the Nazis because they were killing Jews . . [the] Catholic Church are openly anti-Jews since a lot of time. But since the creation of Israel and the stupid things about the apocalypse . . they now kind of “back” Israel because in their stupid version of apocalypse, all Jews will die, except 130.000 who will convert to Christianity . . So by their own saying, they don't care about Jew’s lives. So the youth of the pope in the Wehrmacht under Hitler isn't very important for the Christian’s atrocities. [Edit by Don W]

The kindest thing I can add is this is more proof all religions are dangerous to your health. Speaking of “all” religions, it is now asserted by archeologists on solid grounds that all Western religions originated in Egypt. The current version of Christianity is really a warmed over worship of Isis. And if you grant there are 3 stories of “Origins” in the Hebrew Bible, the first being out of Mesopotamia (Garden of Eden), the second out of Nineveh (flood of Noah) and the third being out of Egypt (Moses) then you can add Judaism to this list of step-children of the old time religion from Egypt.



[edit on 9/10/2006 by donwhite]

Too bad the church couldn't take an equally uncompromising stance on its pedophile priests.

posted by clearwater
Too bad the church couldn't take an equally uncompromising stance on its pedophile priests.

I'd aver it was totally predictable when you ask 1,000,000 men to go "celibate." Now that doctine began aound 1100 AD, and there have been nasty rumors ever since. It took the American justice system and Americans who believe in human rights, to bring an old time problem out into the open. Say thank you, ATLA.

Aside: C/W, would you be offended if I called you a Canuck?




[edit on 9/10/2006 by donwhite]

posted by Relentless

Shall we just take this totally out of context and blow it out of proportion to provide another opportunity for the Catholic haters to spew their venom?

Cheer Up, R/L! I don’t hate Catholics. Why, some of my best friends are Catholic. I hate the historical Catholic Church when it engaged in non religious activities. Like those associated with the St. Bartholomew’s Day massacre of French Protestant (Huguenots). The sitting Pope celebrated a special mass, saying it was the best news he'd heard since the Fall of Jerusalem. I hate such encouraged actions as stacking Aztec Indians as high as their bodies could be raised then setting them alight, in order to “save” their souls. I hate any church that usurps political power. Mormons in Utah. Ultras in Israel. Since 1517 the Catholic Church has begrudgingly been “reformed” but it is dragged kicking and screaming into the present.

All of which has nothing to do with your beliefs. That is you right to hold. But don’t play like - take umbrage - the institution to which you belong does not have a shameful history of deceit, treachery, torture and murder. Ugh!

A little humility would not be out of order.



[edit on 9/10/2006 by donwhite]

Like honestly I am a Christian, but I feel the Vatican Church is full of crap and Vatican City needs to be disbanded as an independant state by the UN or Italian government, and all their secrets revealed. They are hiding so many things in those buildings and underground facilities its ridiculous. What kind of honest church sits there on top of anchient scripts and tries its best to keep them out of public view?

That and their continued aceeptance of pedophiel priests which they have also been known to try and hide. Thats called obstruction of justice, and I think INTERPOL needs to take a bite out of their ass.

The position of Pope should be nullified, as if this whole group of people across the globe OWE him some kind of allegiance or respect. Deny Corruption I say.

I don't have a problem with genuine Christiens. After all, its (in it essence) a kind and forgiving religion, so those practicing it with sincerity (regardless of my personal beliefs) get my backing.

However, I really don't see how the pope and the catholic heirachy fit into all of this. Surley the bible says everyone is equal, and no-one closer to God than anyone else? So why all the wealth, power and superiority of the Pope et al? And this constant judging of peoples actions, and the power to excommunicate people from the church (is it really mans place to do this?) etc etc etc.

I don't want to offend any christiens on here, but I'm afraid I personally believe this whole catholic heirachy is a load of @!*$. It just seems to completley contradict the teachings of christ IMO...

Why would you be ticked? And why aren't you too enslaved unto the limitations that the pope gives you!?


just kidding...


That comment just showed a lack of intelligence, and a lack of respect for liberty and people in general.

Hi Naya ..new to this board

I happen to just come back from Canada as an outsider I walked the streets of Toronto / Ontario..what my eyes saw..my heart felt and my ears heard were the most horrible story including proofs of the Dark world this city represents..the streets are filled with beggars-drugs addicted-zombie state humans..who act and react like absolute programmed robbots-..who are not that allert in regards to what happens around them-when asked a question about 50% answers clear and knowingly the other 50% needs 3 to 6 seconds to absorb the question to be able to react..racism in this city and within the working unions is very clear..classification a absolute fact..religious houses which are not..yongstreet a very bad street..voodoo rituals everywhere..fear of bad spirits very much present as well as the knowing of the practice of bad witch craft..one part of the humans living within this absolute controlled very much looking like Tokyo was used as an example in order to create a 5fth Ellement structured very much resembling that what is called Alien Nation., humans do Not know anything..[ many reasons for this].Titanium and Granite Stones everywhere..A True Dark City with a very Labyrinth structured Layout..filled with head offices and very interesting Art-Crafts-Scytian symbols..as well as proof of the knowledge of Alchemy and Magic.

A city with the worst food I have ever seen..nothing is natural..genetic madness everywhere..hardly any birds..almost death looking soil ..many feel bad..as many feel good..the many drug addicts have history's to tell which pertain to child sacrifice Magic Satanism..many pedophiles bring in children ..when these children reach the age of puberty they mostly will be out in the streets..many handicapped peoples..many wheelchairs..getto's poverty..forced labour underpaid jobs for the normal class..Alice In WonderLand hotels..pedophile locations-heaven

I place where the firts 3 minute long moving pictures where shown..which now shows a financial heaven with man on it that looks like a very American worshipped father...

This and more is what the Ratzinger is reffering to..

The Pope is trying to tell you people [ no offens intended] something ..



[edit on 10-9-2006 by Naya]

No one should confuse seperartion of church and state from church and politics. The Pope wasn't speaking to Canadians in general as much he was Catholics. You also got to remember that the Vatican is a human construction created by the Roman Empire to prevent a full scale religious war in the 4th century. It took 1400 years for humanity to create a semi-secular form of govt.
I've noticed one thing of late with most religious leader of whatever faith you care to point out is that when they call for action or jihad or whatever, a percentage of their faith far north of 50% tend to ignore them. I don't think that we've lost faith in the Creator but we've lost faith in the trappings of religion and religious leaders.

i say we withdraw our troops from afghanistan, and attack VATICAN CITY!
they have been harbouring weapons of mass deception for CENTURIES!

that, and they are a criminal organisation involved in international intrigue and mayhem at the highest levels of MOBDOM.

have a nice opus dei.

Originally posted by donwhite
All of which has nothing to do with your beliefs. That is you right to hold. But don’t play like - take umbrage - the institution to which you belong does not have a shameful history of deceit, treachery, torture and murder. Ugh!

See? This is exactly what I am talking about.

I'm not "playing like" anything at all, and that never came up, so how could I have?

Shall we say streeeeeeeeeeeeetch?

posted by crgintx

I've noticed one thing . . most religious leader of whatever faith you care to point out is that when they call for action or jihad or whatever, a percentage of their faith far north of 50% tend to ignore them. I don't think that we've lost faith in the Creator but we've lost faith in the trappings of religion and religious leaders. [Edited by Don W]

Nicely and I believe, accurately put. As evidenced here, it is hard to speak abou religion civilly. I guess that is because many of us think we know the answer before we hear the question. Martin Luther is not dead!

Originally posted by interestedalways

Not all Catholics are bad people of course just brainwashed and wanting something to believe in

Thank You Interested, I'm catholic and we don't all fallow the pope religiously, shhh don't tell anyone
No seriously I was a postulate(prior to entering) in a contemplative order for several years, a devote catholic and I promise you they and many other catholics did not bow to the doctrine of the church.
500 years ago they would have been burned at the stake.
I am still devoted.
WIS