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Masons and capitalism

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posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 04:12 PM
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Who would have a vested interest in maintaining a capitalistic economic system?

A) European bankers
B) Drug dealers
C) Criminals and thieves of all types
D) Zionist industrialists

The masons thrive in which type of econmic system?

A) Capitalism
B) Socialism
C) Communism
D) Nationalistic fascism




posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 06:04 PM
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For question 1, A) should be 'Bankers', not specifically European. B) and D) should both be 'entreprenures and industrialists of all sorts'... all business folk thrive in a system that gives them private ownership of their businesses... competition does much for an economy and the players in it. Product and race of the businessmen are irrelevant.

For question 2, A), B) and C) are probably all true answers... but when you produce a genuinely socialist or communist (in practice, not just in name) government, we'll talk.

As for D)... nobody thrives in that sort of place.

...

BUT, I suspect the answer you're looking for is "OH, yes... the masons ARE behind all business... and they've designed the whole economic system to benefit themselves, alone! And when it's not worked for them, they've created 'evil' governments to give the people a front to rally against! Masons are EVIL satanic worshippers, and are corrupt!"

I love loaded questions...



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 06:16 PM
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Originally posted by Hobbes
BUT, I suspect the answer you're looking for is "OH, yes... the masons ARE behind all business... and they've designed the whole economic system to benefit themselves, alone! And when it's not worked for them, they've created 'evil' governments to give the people a front to rally against! Masons are EVIL satanic worshippers, and are corrupt!"


That was the correct answer.



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 06:20 PM
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question 1)

All bankers thrive under capitalism.... not just European.

drug dealers thrive under all governments, but esspecially under corrupt weak governments such as Afgahnistan and Columbia. how else would they be able to grow their product at will. You could say capitalism gives people the money for the drugs, but you know what I don't agree because Russia also has a bad drug problem, and the people there are not wealthy by our standards.

Organized crime will flurish under capitalism, including organized crime by politcal leaders. This is also a problem in Communist countries as well. Any nation that ignores it actually...

Industry grows under capitalism because of the demand for products, people are given a false currency and told to spend at will, the industry thrives on the massive economic power of the consumer, though they are eventually killed off and forced into developing countries because industry does not generate the profit of sales that corporations do, and pay less.

Corporations thrive under capitalism, they are the corruptors of the system, the disease that infects it. when they grow to big, gaining to much power it off sets the power of the government, this is seen through our represenatives being bought out, or our president and his oil investments.

Question 2)

Masons do not thrive off the economy exactly.. not from what I know about them anyways. If you like to think they seceretly run the world then go ahead and think what you want.

They get money through donations and small business deals with local governments, the money in America here obviously is an effect of capitalism, though any government is well suited to support a fraternity, so long as the donations come in.... Communism I do not see them thriving in because they may become suspect of power and murdered by the government. That can go with any paranoid leader though, even democracy (which you never mentioned..... you only said capitalism which is an economic system..)

I think you would prefer however I say that Masons run all governments and yada yada yada..



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 07:13 PM
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Masons would certainly "thrive" more if they stopped giving their money away to charities, eh.

Anyway, kudos to the creator of the thread. We have an astounding new logic model, in which "Masons" in question 2 can be replaced by pretty much anyone.

Who would have a vested interest in maintaining a capitalistic economic system?

A) European bankers
B) Drug dealers
C) Criminals and thieves of all types
D) Zionist industrialists

The Doorknob Manufacturers of America thrive in which type of economic system?

A) Capitalism
B) Socialism
C) Communism
D) Nationalistic fascism



posted on Aug, 31 2006 @ 08:22 AM
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I would argue that most everyone thrives under a mixed economy, regardless of what fraternities or clubs they belong to, at least more so than in the alternatives (fascism, communism, etc.).

Freemasonry has never been legal in any fascist state. It was originally also banned in all communist states, until it ws finally legalized in Cuba. However, even though it is legal today, members of the Cuban Communist Party may not join a Masonic Lodge, under pain of expulsion from the party.



posted on Aug, 31 2006 @ 11:00 AM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light
Freemasonry has never been legal in any fascist state. It was originally also banned in all communist states, until it ws finally legalized in Cuba. However, even though it is legal today, members of the Cuban Communist Party may not join a Masonic Lodge, under pain of expulsion from the party.


So freemasonary is not encouraged in communist or fascist countries.

Both of those systems are theoretically supposed to be in the people's best interests. Which would suggest that freemasonry has never been viewed as being in the people's best interest.



posted on Aug, 31 2006 @ 11:15 AM
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Both of those systems are theoretically supposed to be in the people's best interests. Which would suggest that freemasonry has never been viewed as being in the people's best interest.


yes true. certainly not the "average joes" or "normal-everyday-guys", gd point In nothing we trust


land of the free?...land of the free-masons.



posted on Aug, 31 2006 @ 11:19 AM
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Originally posted by In nothing we trust


Both of those systems are theoretically supposed to be in the people's best interests. Which would suggest that freemasonry has never been viewed as being in the people's best interest.


At least not by Fascists and Communists. But I'm not sure they've had the people's best interests at heart.



posted on Aug, 31 2006 @ 08:07 PM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by In nothing we trust
Both of those systems are theoretically supposed to be in the people's best interests. Which would suggest that freemasonry has never been viewed as being in the people's best interest.


At least not by Fascists and Communists. But I'm not sure they've had the people's best interests at heart.


Yes I am quite sure of that, but fascists and communists have been better at selling hope to the people than the masons have been.

Which means that the free masons have historically never been very good at pretending to help the people or were arrogant enough to think that they didn't really need to bother catering to the people.

Or it means that the communists and fascists have themselves actually been free masons and choose to eliminate what they saw as the competition (other free masons).

'OUT' with the 'OLD CHAOS', in with the 'NEW ORDER'.

What a crazy 'WORLD'.



[edit on 1-9-2006 by In nothing we trust]



posted on Aug, 31 2006 @ 08:09 PM
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Originally posted by marcopolo



Both of those systems are theoretically supposed to be in the people's best interests. Which would suggest that freemasonry has never been viewed as being in the people's best interest.


yes true. certainly not the "average joes" or "normal-everyday-guys", gd point In nothing we trust


land of the free?...land of the free-masons.


My point exactlly.

Just who exactly gets to be free?

Freedom is a lie that has been perpetrated upon the population in the name of capitalism.

[edit on 31-8-2006 by In nothing we trust]



posted on Aug, 31 2006 @ 08:24 PM
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When I'm in the secret high level that only the people in the secret high levels know about will I have any of this money that is supposed to be there cause my mortgage is due and I need some help paying it



posted on Aug, 31 2006 @ 11:07 PM
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Originally posted by In nothing we trust
So freemasonary is not encouraged in communist or fascist countries.

Both of those systems are theoretically supposed to be in the people's best interests.


Theoretically.

Unfortunately, Communism, Socialism, and Fascism have never been put into practice. Dictatorships have been put up, and called those things... but that doesn't make it so.



posted on Sep, 1 2006 @ 12:09 AM
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Originally posted by Hobbes

Originally posted by In nothing we trust
So freemasonary is not encouraged in communist or fascist countries.

Both of those systems are theoretically supposed to be in the people's best interests.


Theoretically.

Unfortunately, Communism, Socialism, and Fascism have never been put into practice. Dictatorships have been put up, and called those things... but that doesn't make it so.


Men start with lofty ideas, but fail in their implementation.



posted on Sep, 1 2006 @ 12:29 AM
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Bingo.

The theoretical systems may seem to be a good idea to some, but they don't incorporate variables like human greed and competitive instinct.


df1

posted on Sep, 1 2006 @ 01:58 AM
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Originally posted by In nothing we trust
the free masons have historically never been very good at pretending to help the people or were arrogant enough to think that they didn't really need to bother catering to the people.

Freemasonry was quite influential in american revolution which removed the shackles of the british monarchy from the colonists. The US constitution which puts strick limits on the operation government is based in large part on Anderson's constitution(s). Freemasonry has no need to seek public acknowledgement or pretend anything. The postive result of virtuous act is a sufficent reward.

I challenge you to find any organization that has historically done more to cater to the needs of the people than freemasonry.
.



posted on Sep, 1 2006 @ 02:28 AM
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Originally posted by df1
Freemasonry was quite influential in american revolution which removed the shackles of the british monarchy from the colonists.


Revolution and the challenging of authority is the only thing that free masonary has created which is good.

What better way to invoke change than to create a bunch of angry psychopaths and sociopaths who are determined to turn the world upside down.

People who don't listen to reason.

The lion in the cage. The ace in the hole.



[edit on 1-9-2006 by In nothing we trust]


df1

posted on Sep, 1 2006 @ 03:25 AM
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Originally posted by In nothing we trust
Revolution and the challenging of authority is the only thing that free masonary has created which is good.

Imho you dismiss this gift far too lightly. The challenging of authority is one of the greatest gifts ever given to mankind and all individual human rights stem from the application of this gift. I defy you to name just one organization that has given a gift to humanity that exceeds the single gift you mention above.



What better way to invoke change than to create a bunch of angry psychopaths and sociopaths who are determined to turn the world upside down.

I agree completely that The Declaration of Independence and The US Constitution both had masonic involvement and both were intended to turn the world upside down, however Ive never seen any mention of angry freemason psychopaths & sociopaths in the founding of america. Exactly what reference are you using for your information?
.



posted on Sep, 1 2006 @ 07:54 AM
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Originally posted by Hobbes


Unfortunately, Communism, Socialism, and Fascism have never been put into practice. Dictatorships have been put up, and called those things... but that doesn't make it so.


I would argue that Fascism has indeed been put into practice: after all, the term was invented by Mussolini to describe his ideal corporate state, which was instituted in Italy after the March On Rome.

Arguably, Nazi Germany and its occupied territories, the Japanese Empire under the dictatorship of Hideki Tojo, Spain under Francisco Franco, and Cuba under Fulgencio Batista were also Fascist states, although they each differed slighty from Mussolini's original model. Nevertheless, they retained the basic form by favoring wealthy industry with near-complete deregulation, while maintaining strict control over the general populace.

I would agree, however, that Communism, at least in the classical Marxist sense, has never been put into practice. Stalinism, from which all other so-called communist states derived, was a form of state capitalism. It simply replaced the bourgeouis capitalist class with the government, while keeping the proletariat bound by the same chains.



posted on Sep, 1 2006 @ 08:21 AM
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.

Who would have a vested interest in portraying Masons as moral monsters?

A) Persons who deplore the freedom of association inherent in a free society
B) Religious fascists who deny others the right of free inquiry
C) Demagogues who get political power by scapegoating minorities
D) Jealous people, who are paranoid about their own percieved lack of social status


The masons are easy targets in what kind of environment?

A) Societies with free speech
B) Societies where freemasons are not actually in control
C) Cultures of critique, where people remember accusations, but not the rebuttal
D) Cultures where any institution is automatically suspect, but whistle-blowers are always giving the benefit of the doubt, regardless of the inherent self contradictions in their accusations.


Hmmm.
.

[edit for spelling]

[edit on 1-9-2006 by dr_strangecraft]



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