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So now that ATS has sponsored/advertised for an anti-war, pro-liberal movie...

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posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:02 AM
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Will they do the same with a movie showing the other side? After all, Deny Bias, right?

I had posted that question in the other thread for the movie, missing the warning from SO that the thread was solely to discuss "a move about the GI anti-war movement during the Vietnam era, and the government's efforts to cover it up," and not "about partisan bickering" or "the attributes of the Vietnam war."

Though, as this does concern ATS, so I figured that this forum is a good starting point for such a discussion. Thank you.

EDIT: Left out a couple words here and there.

[edit on 8/30/2006 by cmdrkeenkid]




posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:15 AM
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Ok, so what are we discussing here? Points for or against the movie? Why this movie should not be touted on ats without proper pro war, pro conservative balance? What?

Im in the UK now, so I imagine it will be a while before it comes here, but I doubt I will be watching it. I tend to avoid movies that have a strong political tone to them, whether they are liberal or conservative in nature.



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:22 AM
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Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
Why this movie should not be touted on ats without proper pro war, pro conservative balance?


Exactly. Supporting only one side is making ATS and its owners look like they themselves only support one side. The truth is though, that ATS has a minority of people who do support what happened in the Vietnam War (and other wars, for that matter). Is it really fair to them to not have thier views supported by a site they loyally visit every day?

EDIT TO ADD: After all, ATS has had support of both sides on its ads, even recently. The main example that comes to mind are the 757/Pentagon threads. There is one saying a 757 did, one saying a 757 didn't, and one saying that it's just disinformation. Has the support of the different views harmed ATS in anyway? Certainly not. I would think that ATS has actually benefitted from putting all the views into the open like that. So shouldn't it be done for a movie, as well?
END EDIT

I understand that sales of a DVD can spur a lot of revenue, but are the best interests of the ATS community as a whole in perspective here? I feel that this one-sided support of an issue is leading ATS down a dark path that will alienate those who disagree with the topic of the film, then leading to hatred amongst those on the boards, and in the end just a lot of problems for everyone here, from the highest staff to the newest members.

Honestly, this is the first time that I have doubted the leadership of the Three Amigos, and that's why I wanted to post this here, instead of submitting a complaint. I wanted to have this issue open for discussion for all who support, oppose, and are neutral on this. Also, this venue allows for the staff to interact directly with the board as a whole, versus on just a person-to-person manner.


Im in the UK now, so I imagine it will be a while before it comes here, but I doubt I will be watching it. I tend to avoid movies that have a strong political tone to them, whether they are liberal or conservative in nature.


I feel exactly the same way about political movies, as well.


[edit on 8/30/2006 by cmdrkeenkid]



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:27 AM
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Originally posted by cmdrkeenkid
the GI anti-war movement during the Vietnam era


We all know about the noble GI led anti-war movement. As far as covering it up, I thought this was out in the open.



Personally I see the text "Buy online now" and figure it's just another ad. Click it if you're interested in the subject.

[edit on 30-8-2006 by dbates]



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:28 AM
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"Deny Ignorance" is the motto of ATS, and showing the people a perspective that's been marginalized, and even shut, by the US government and most of the mainstream media as well -i.e. war opposition and resistance among the GIs- is directly related to that!

You want ATS to promote pro-war perspectives? Well FOXnews and CNN already does that, so you just have turn on the TV and stop asking the people here to promote war propaganda crap.

And frankly I don't see any problem with being "anti-war". War is an abomination, and it's always used by the elite against the people like us. War destroys lives, and Life itself... and all that for the sake of a bunch of political parasites (bankers, weapons dealers and of course the President and his "GOP"). In my book anyone who's supporting a war should be the first to be on the OTHER side of the frontline, just to see the real face of his own country...

[edit on 30/8/06 by Echtelion]



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:33 AM
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As usual it's the GOP's fault.


Yeah the GOP got us into Vietnam ehh? Kids please pay attention in school this year. Why don't you also do yourself a favor a review the votes for the IRAQ WAR, and tell me how it's the GOPs fault, considering the opposition overwhelmingly supported it. Ahh revisionist history never bores me.



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:34 AM
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Originally posted by Echtelion
"Deny Ignorance" is the motto of ATS,


Deny Bias is also one of the caveats to Denying Ignorance though, is it not? How can one Deny Ignorance if one does not first Deny Bias?


and showing the people a perspective that's been marginalized, and even shut, by the US government and most of the mainstream media as well -i.e. war opposition and resistance among the GIs- is directly related to that!


I agree, but there are also pro-war perspectives. I'm not saying anything is wrong with supporting the movie. What I'm saying is wrong is the blatant disregard for the opposing side.


You want ATS to promote pro-war perspectives? Well FOXnews and CNN already does that, so you just have turn on the TV and stop asking the people here to promote war propaganda crap.


I don't have TV anymore. On top of that, don't you find that statement a bit hypocritical? Basically, what you've just said was that it's okay for ATS to support one view (the one you agree with) but they shouldn't support the other side of the arguement. Now, moments before I read where you were saying that this is about Denying Ignorance. How can we Deny Ignorance with only one side of an arguement?


And frankly I don't see any problem with being "anti-war".


Where did I say there was a problem with being anti-war?


EDIT TO ADD:

I WOULD REALLY LIKE THIS THREAD TO BE ON THE TOPIC OF WHY ISN'T THE OPPOSING, PRO-WAR/CONSERVATIVE VIEW BEING SUPPORTED BY ATS. PLEASE ADHERE TO THAT. THANK YOU.

[edit on 8/30/2006 by cmdrkeenkid]



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:39 AM
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Well, I see your point, cmdr. I suppose though, that the general consense in the US is that Vietnam was wrong, immoral, and costly and a black spot on our country's soul.

However, if this movie is indeed going to be advertised here, I agree that there should be room for debate on both sides. After all, the whole anti-war movement wasn't exactly innocent and righteous either, and there were alot of suspect elements to it, as well as alot of losers, like the morons who spit on GIs when they returned home, harrassed people going into the military, or supported violent communist revolution or race wars and such.



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:46 AM
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Why do people always assume we are "doing this" or in this case "blatantly ignoring the opposing view point"?! You think we've ignored some "pro war movie" in favor of this one?
Sheesh...

If there is a "pro war" DVD for sale that is of this quality production value wise, has some sort of conspiracy to talk about, tells ONLY the TRUTH and is willing to share a very small piece of the sales revenue with ATS, LLP we will certainly consider putting it up.


If you find one that meets the criteria above CKK, get them in touch with me and I'll be happy to work with them.

Springer...

[edit on 8-30-2006 by Springer]



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:59 AM
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The only thing cooler than a ProWar person profiting off war, is AntiWar people profiting off the same war.


How much profit goes towards Vets, and Vietnam Veterans groups? Let me guess, none.



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 10:59 AM
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To be honest I thought it was just about ATS getting a little piece of the action and not making any kind of political statement.

Peace



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 11:01 AM
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Originally posted by Springer
...tells ONLY the TRUTH...


So are you implying that everything that in the film ATS is advertising is 100% true and unbiased? A clarification would be appreciated.

Anyway, I'll do what I can to dredge up a film showing the pro-war side of things. If anyone else has suggestions or can think of anything off the bat, that would be appreciated as well.



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 11:05 AM
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As someone who actually lived through the Vietnam War and knew many, many vets who returned from there, I have known that much of the truth was suppressed from the public at the time. It's high time for the truth to come out now, it's called fair and accurate reporting. So what problem could you possibly have with a film that tells the truth about the other side? Just because it tells the truth doesn't mean it has liberal or any other bias.

Kudos to the Three Amigos for bringing this to our attention.



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 11:05 AM
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Originally posted by WithoutEqual
The only thing cooler than a ProWar person profiting off war, is AntiWar people profiting off the same war.


How much profit goes towards Vets, and Vietnam Veterans groups? Let me guess, none.


This thread has MORE assumptions in it than a court room... What makes you think there IS any profit? What makes you think you know David Zeiger's mind well enough to make a rude statement like that?

Zeiger has put his life's savings into this movie to get the story out, he was THERE when all this happened, he saw what transpired. He is VERY far from turning a profit on this film, he has a long way to go to get to "break even" mate.

IF he ever does make a profit, not that it's any of your business mind you, I am willing to bet he contributes to the Veteran funds he likes best just because of the type of person he is.

What a pitiful, waste of pixels


Springer...

[edit on 8-30-2006 by Springer]



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 11:11 AM
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You can attack me if you like, if you think that'll help your credibility. I'll rephrase myself. IF there are any profits from this DVD does any percentage go to vets? Very simple, very straight forward, I hope that doesn't offend you guys.



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 11:12 AM
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Originally posted by cmdrkeenkid

Originally posted by Springer
...tells ONLY the TRUTH...


So are you implying that everything that in the film ATS is advertising is 100% true and unbiased? A clarification would be appreciated.

You bet your boots! The people who lived through it are the people telling the story, have you even looked at the trailer or are you judging this book by it's cover?


Like I said, Ultra high quality production value, conspiracy angle, the truth, and fair payment for the advertising inventory we are giving up to promote it are all we require.

Springer...



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 11:15 AM
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Originally posted by WithoutEqual
You can attack me if you like, if you think that'll help your credibility. I'll rephrase myself. IF there are any profits from this DVD does any percentage go to vets? Very simple, very straight forward, I hope that doesn't offend you guys.


Why don't you try something novel, go to the site and see for yourself?
You may learn not only that but any active military personell get a FREE COPY.


Attack you?!
oh my...

Springer...

[edit on 8-30-2006 by Springer]



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 11:26 AM
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Yes I've viewed the trailer, and have viewed the entire site. Speaking of which, I find it suprising that you guys stand by the statement that the film is 100% accurate. Pardon my sceptical side, but one look at their Web Resources news links show an ovbious political angle, I mean Jesus H Christ man, they even praise Jane Fonda there.

I also think it's cute that on a site called Above Top Secret, a conspiracy site, I'm told that certain questions are "None of my business". What goes on at a Bilderburg meeting, or Bohemian Grove isn't anyones business here either, yet, Jones is praised for infiltrating these places, and discussion of it is ovbiously allowed. Oh the sweet sweet smell of bias.



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 11:28 AM
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Please allow me time to respond, before assuming 2 times in a row, that I haven't viewed the trailer, including the 12 min one, or the site.



posted on Aug, 30 2006 @ 11:31 AM
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heres a link to the trailer if anyone is interested

www.sirnosir.com...



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