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Topic started on 28-8-2006 @ 04:47 AM by Hellmutt
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Gwadar, situated at Pakistan's south-west coast are going to be Pakistan's new energy port and hub for storage and refining. Gwadar is a gigantic
project. In addition to becoming a huge energy port and hub, it will become a "Las Vegas" with lots of tourist hotels and casinos. Huge investments
have been made in this project. The Chinese have invested at least over $200 Billion (two hundred Billion dollars!) in Gwadar alone, and they are also
planning a naval base there! Look at the map, it's a very strategic location near the Strait of Hormuz. They want to secure supply of oil and gas
from Iran via Gwadar to China.
But there are obstacles... There's a lot of unrest in and around Gwadar. Explosions and sabotage actions against oil facilities and hotels happens
all the time. Lots of Chinese engineers have been killed in Gwadar. "Insurgents" are supplied with weapons, etc. to cause trouble. Taliban is
present. And in addition, the local population are getting ripped off by their government, and they are poor and angry about this whole thing.
There's a proxy war. India for instance, does not like the idea of a Chinese naval presence in the Indian Ocean. And India does not like Pakistan,
but that's old news.
Musharraf has approved a mass transit railway system to connect Gwadar via
Chitral to Tajikistan and China. Those trains will be Chinese made, of course.
Business Recorder: President approves mass transit system
for 8 cities: rail network to link Gwadar with China and Tajikistan ( (July 30 2006))
 Other Means: The White Elephant of Gwadar?
Consider also the possibility that the security situation is now so poor in the area surrounding the port - and more widely in the surrounding
province of Balochistan - that even the port's authorities are reportedly questioning whether the facility can become operational in the near
term.
Couldn't Gwadar and Balochistan thus become the scene of a proxy conflict between China-Pakistan and India? It may already be so, with the Pakistani
regime mainly propped up by the Chinese and its military supplied with Chinese weapons, while there have been accusations of India supplying arms to
the Baloch. General Pervez Musharraf: Gwadar Port: first phase to be
operational within next two months
July 30 2006
Gwadar a new economic hub of Pakistan is located at the entrance of Persian Gulf.It has immense geo economic significance.
With the functioning of Gwadar port Pakistan will become a key player in the Gulf region and serving as an energy corridor for Central Asia, South
Asia and Western Part of China.
Gwadar is situated at a location where 40 percent oil ships are passing.
This Gwadar project is so huge and important, it should be watched closely. If someone pushes the wrong button, it means BIG trouble! If the US starts
bombing oil facilities in Iran for instance, China will be very angry. Add stuff you find related to current events in Gwadar, or feel free to
add your comments instead. Or both 
[edit on 1-9-2006 by sanctum]
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reply posted on 28-8-2006 @ 07:38 AM by FlyersFan
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Did I read this correctly - China has it's own Taliban/Muslim Extremist problem going on? If that's so, it isn't making the news. Guess it
shouldn't surprise me. The communist Chinese and the radical Islamics aren't known for being sources of truthful information. Wonder how China
deals with the Taliban and extremist muslims? I am now wondering about their tolerance and what they do with 'prisoners' from that area.
Interesting. I'm sure our GITMO is a tropical paradise compared to what the Chinese probably secretly have going on ....
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reply posted on 3-9-2006 @ 09:37 AM by Hellmutt
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Baloch leader Nawab Akbar Bugti was murdered by Musharraf's troops. This murder is major, so look out for tsunami effect on this one. ( Btw, Bugti
said in 1973 that men in tin foil hats were running the province...  )
Here are some quotes from articles submitted to the web today:
Bugti Murder -Shocked Into Sensibility
THE year was perhaps 1973. There was a meeting of the federal executive council of the Pakistan Federal Union of Journalists in Quetta . Nawab Akbar
Bugti was prime minister Zulfikar Ali Bhutto’s choice then as governor of Balochistan.
When some of us sought to ask for details about the military operation, Nawab Bugti said: ‘Why ask me? Ask the men in the tin hats. They are running
the province.’ They are still doing it, with ever more frightening consequences appearing daily before us.
All this is extremely clichéd, but unless we repeatedly hold a mirror to our faces we will never fully understand what we have done to ourselves or
why the killing of Nawab Bugti is being viewed with such grave foreboding by so many. Even whatever development we plan for Balochistan is now in
jeopardy, and certainly the future of Gwadar Port , a project already a subject of dispute in the local/non-local context, has a big question mark
over it.
Why fuss over Balochistan?
China has three requirements to maintain its growth: transit trade route for its western region, energy corridor to import oil from the Gulf region,
and naval facilities for a foothold on the Arabian Sea coast to protect its energy supply line from the Middle East. The Gwadar Port could help China
in enhancing its energy security by offering a transit terminal for oil imports from the Middle East and the Gulf region.
Musharraf will repent Bugti's killing
A large number of Chinese technocrats have been working in Gwadar. Last year Balochs killed many Chinese engineers and other technicians. The Chinese
embassy pressed Pakistan Government for security of their personnel.
The rail and road connectivity under construction would connect Sinkiang with Balochistan's port city of Gwadar. The strategic partnership between
China and Pakistan is not in the field of nuclear armaments only but China has greater stakes in the promotion of its commercial enterprises as well
as naval encirclement of India. Chinese are doing the same on Myanmar front and have embarked on diplomatic manoeuvring in Bangladesh. Baloch fear all
these Chinese-dominated developmental activities.
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reply posted on 12-9-2006 @ 11:51 PM by Hellmutt
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President of Pakistan Gen Pervez Musharraf
Musharraf apparently signed a peace deal with the Taliban on September 5th. Taliban is not a threat to him, but the Baloch freedom-fighters is. So
instead of fighting a two-front war, he can now divert more troops and equipment (given by the US for counter-terrorism operations) to Balochistan.
This move will likely lead to more Taliban attacks against the NATO forces in southern Afghanistan. Musharraf may even get help from the Taliban
against the Balochs...
South Asia Analysis Group: MUSHARRAF SEEKS TALIBAN'S HELP AGAINST BALOCHS- INTERNATIONAL
TERRORISM MONITOR--PAPER NO. 116
06.09. 2006
Osama bin Laden himself and his No.2 Ayman al-Zawahiri live separately. They keep moving between North Waziristan, the adjoining Bajaur agency and the
Chitral area adjoining the Northern Areas (Gilgit and Baltistan).
[---]
They reportedly pointed out that the activities of the Baloch freedom-fighters posed a threat to Pakistan's unity and territorial integrity whereas
the activities of the remnants of the Al Qaeda and the Taliban did not pose a threat to Pakistan's unity and territorial integrity. They, therefore,
urged that Musharraf should reach a cease-fire with the tribals in the FATA area and divert the troops deployed there in support of the operations of
the US-led forces in Afghanistan to Balochistan.
12. Since the beginning of this year, Musharraf started shifting some of the troops and equipment given by the US for counter-terrorism operations in
the FATA to Balochistan.
[---]
14. This peace agreement was signed on September 5, 2006.
[---]
19. His first national security priority now is to crush the Baloch freedom struggle.He is hoping that the peace agreement with the Talibanised
tribals of North Waziristan would enable him not only to divert more troops to Balochistan, but also to seek the help of the Taliban elements in
Balochistan in his operations against the Balochs.
[---]
22. The Miranshah agreement should be a cause for concern not only to the Balochs, but also to the NATO forces in Afghanistan. It is likely to lead to
an intensification of the Taliban attacks in Afghan territory from Balochistan.
Click the link to read the whole thing...
Mullah Mohammad Omar
Related Threads:
Timber Smuggling With Rockets in Chitral, Pakistan
Musharraf: Catch Bin Laden Somewhere Else
Al Qaeda Establish Islamic State In Pakistan
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reply posted on 13-9-2006 @ 01:25 AM by Duzey
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 Originally posted by FlyersFan
Did I read this correctly - China has it's own Taliban/Muslim Extremist problem going on? If that's so, it isn't making the news. 
There is a Uyghur (Turkic, not to be confused with Turkish, Sunni Islamic) group in China called the East Turkestan Islamic Movement that has been
designated a terrorist organization. They want to create East Turkestan.
It's been claimed before that they have groups operating in Pakistan, but I'm not sure what area.
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reply posted on 13-9-2006 @ 03:53 PM by Hellmutt
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Al Qaeda is strong in Pakistan and Musharraf is weak. There are concerns over the control of Pakistani nuclear weapons. Alexis Debat (one of the
premier experts in Washington on Pakistan) believes that the murder of Nawab Akbar Bugti was done without Musharraf's orders.
Counterterrorism Blog: Pakistan Expert Discusses Powerful Al
Qaeda-Taliban Network in Waziristan
September 13, 2006
Musharraf is weaker than ever. He is slowly losing the military, his best ally, as indicated in the killing of Baluch tribal leader Nawab Akbar Bugti
on August 26, which Alexis believes was done without Musharraf's orders. Other elites in Pakistan, including lower levels of the ISI (Pakistani
intel) are also turning against him and the U.S., for a variety of reasons (more detailed than needed for this post). This also raises concerns over
the control of Pakistani nuclear weapons. The timing of the recent North Waziristan "peace agreement" was probably purposeful and further highlights
Musharraf's weakness.
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reply posted on 14-9-2006 @ 11:55 AM by Hellmutt
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The Pakistani Senate was informed today that the Gwadar Port will be operational by Dec 30, 2006. 90 per cent of phase 1 has been completed.
 Pakistan News Service - PakTribune: Gwadar port to be operational on Dec 30
September 14, 2006
The Senate was informed on Wednesday that Gwadar Port would be operational by Dec 30, 2006. During the question hour, Minister of State for
Parliamentary Affairs Kamil Ali Agha said that 90 per cent work on the first phase of the port had been completed. Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
Another interesting article from today:
International Crisis Group - Pakistan: The Worsening Conflict in Balochistan
Btw, I made a new thread based on the post further up on this page regarding the Pakistani deal with the Taliban:
President Musharraf Made A Deal With The Taliban
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reply posted on 15-9-2006 @ 08:11 PM by Hellmutt
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Balochi leader Marri warned in an exclusive interview that the war for Balochistan's liberation is going to intensify. He mentioned the Gwadar Port
specifically and said they (Balochistan Liberation Army) "will drive out all Punjabis from the Gwadar area". The Balochis are no longer
interested in autonomy, but want complete independence...
War against Pak to intensify: Marri
September 15, 2006
Eighty-two year-old Sardar Khari Baksh Marri has now donned the mantle of Baloch leadership after the August 26 killing of Nawab Akbar Khan Bugti. In
an exclusive interview to the agency, Marri said: "There is no possibility of a peaceful dialogue with Islamabad and the war for Balochistan's
liberation is now going to intensify."
[---]
"Our war is against Punjabis and the exploitation that they have done of our province," Marri said. He specifically mentioned the Gwadar Port, and
said that the Balochistan Liberation Army (BLA) "will drive out all Punjabis from the Gwadar area". Marri said that the resources in Balochistan
belonged to the Baloch people and "no one will be allowed to exploit it". In the interview, Marri made it clear that the Balochis were "no longer
interested in autonomy, but in complete independence." Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
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reply posted on 17-9-2006 @ 09:21 PM by Hellmutt
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Bugti Probe Demanded - Gwadar Port Is A "Conspiracy"
Sind nationalists and the Balochis demands a probe to be held into the killing of Bugti. The Gwadar Port project was termed a "conspiracy" at a Sind
nationalists meeting in Hyderabad.
Indianmuslims.info: Probe
sought into Bugti killing
Sep 17
Sind nationalists in Pakistan have made common cause with rebels in Balochistan in demanding a judicial probe into the killing of Baloch leader Nawab
Akbar Khan Bugti by the army. At a seminar in Hyderabad city, they demanded that a postmortem be conducted on Bugti by an international team of
experts and a probe held into the circumstances leading to his killing, the News International reported Sunday.
Speakers at the meeting termed it a "conspiracy" the setting up of a deep-sea port at Gwadar in Balochistan. It was meant to settle people from
Punjab and turn the Balochis into minorities in their own state, they said. The meeting called for shelving of all mega projects that uprooted the
local population, the newspaper said. Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
Why was Bugti killed and who was behind it?
Originally posted by Dark Vader in this post
we learned that a Baloch leader was killed, Bugti. The truth about his death is that Beijing had a contract on him.
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reply posted on 20-9-2006 @ 01:24 AM by Hellmutt
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Chinese President Hu Jintao is going to visit Pakistan in November. Gwadar Port is on top of the agenda.
Energy pact, Gwadar port high on Sino-Pak agenda
2006/9/20
An "umbrella" energy pact and opening of the Gwadar sea port in Balochistan are on top of the agenda as the Pakistan government prepares for Chinese
President Hu Jintao's visit in November. The term "umbrella" is not elaborated, but media reports quoting unnamed official sources indicate that it
would cover both the oil/gas and nuclear energy sectors.
[---]
Senior level official sources requesting anonymity told The Nation that Pakistan and China were currently exchanging technical delegations, estimating
pre-feasibilities of various energy projects ranging from nuclear power reactors to transnational oil and gas pipelines.
"In addition to the proposal of Saudi-Pak-China oil pipeline, and its possible co-tracking with Pak-Qatar Gas Pipeline, the Chinese are also keen to
participate in other transnational energy transportation projects, namely the TAP (Turkmenistan-Afghanistan-Pakistan) and IPI (Iran-Pakistan-India)
gas pipelines," the sources added. Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
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reply posted on 21-9-2006 @ 09:35 PM by Hellmutt
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Pakistan is concerned that India might be modernizing its nuclear arsenal with more and better nukes with support from the US...
Business Recorder: India-US nuclear deal a
matter of concern: Shaukat
September 22 2006
Pakistan has expressed concern over the possibility of New Delhi acquiring new strategic weapons technologies and fissile material stockpiles for
additional warheads consequent to the recent India-US nuclear deal.
[---]
It provides the shortest access to the sea of landlocked Central Asian States as well as to Western China. With the development of the rail and road
transportation infrastructure, currently underway, Pakistan can link the entire region through its Karachi, Bin Qasim and Gwadar ports, to the rest of
the world. Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
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reply posted on 21-9-2006 @ 09:51 PM by worldwatcher
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hmm can't blame India for wanting more weapons when they know what is going in the region and that Musharraf can't stay in power forever. What a
slippery slope this is becoming!!!
thanks for keep us posted Hellmutt.
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reply posted on 24-9-2006 @ 02:30 AM by Hellmutt
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More trouble for the Gwadar project's future. A grand jirga (the first in 126 years) was held in Kalat. 85 (or 95?) Balochi leaders and 300 elders
announced that a case would be filed to the International Court of Justice. They specifically protested mega projects such as the Gwadar Port.
Musharraf has previously claimed that 72 tribal chiefs were supporting his policy. This jirga announcement proves him wrong...
Grand jirga in Kalat decides to move ICJ
September 22, 2006
A grand Baloch jirga, convened here on Thursday after about 126 years, announced in a declaration that a case would be filed in the International
Court of Justice against what it termed violation of agreements signed by the State of Kalat, the Crown of Britain and the government of Pakistan
pertaining to sovereignty and rights of the Baloch people. The Khan of Kalat, Mir Suleman Daud Ahmedzai, presided over the jirga held in the Shahi
Hall. It was attended by 85 tribal chiefs and about 300 elders.
[---]
The declaration rejected the mega development projects, including the Gwadar uplift programme, and said that the Baloch people would not accept the
agreements signed by the government with international companies. The declaration demanded reunification of all divided Baloch lands into one entity.
In his speech, the Khan of Kalat said that the presence of so many sardars in the Baloch national jirga belied the claim of President Pervez Musharraf
that 72 tribal chiefs were supporting his policy. He asserted that all Baloch people would abide the decision of the jirga. Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
Related News Links:
The Hindu: Baloch leaders for pre-1947 status
DailyIndia.com: Baloch chiefs to approach
International Court of Justice
Indian
Muslims: Baloch chiefs to approach International Court of Justice
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reply posted on 27-9-2006 @ 06:03 PM by Hellmutt
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Pakistan will import 100 megawatt of electricity from Iran to Gwadar. Gwadar is the largest and most important project. There are other mega projects
as well and UAE is also investing alot in Pakistan. They are going to build a new state of the art city near Karachi.
IRNA: Pakistan to import 100 MW electricity from Iran : official
September 27, 2006
Pakistan will import electricity from Iran for the town of Gwadar, in southwestern Baluchistan province where Pakistan is building another deep sea
port, a senior government official said on Wednesday. "A decision has been taken for import of 100 megawatt of electricity from Iran for Gwadar,"
Economic Advisor to the Finance Ministry Dr. Ashfaq Hassan said.
[---]
Dr. Ashfaq said a Dubai-based company Emaar would invest over 43 billion dollars over the next 13 years to establish a state of the art city near
Karachi. The new city spread over 12,000 acres of land would be set up on two islands known as Bundal and Buddo. Another UAE based company Dubai Port
World would invest 300 million dollars on the second container terminal at Port Qasim. Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
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reply posted on 1-10-2006 @ 08:33 AM by CosmicScorpion
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Originally posted by Hellmutt
Musharraf apparently signed a peace deal with the Taliban on September 5th. Taliban is not a threat to him, but the Baloch freedom-fighters is. So
instead of fighting a two-front war, he can now divert more troops and equipment (given by the US for counter-terrorism operations) to Balochistan.
This move will likely lead to more Taliban attacks against the NATO forces in southern Afghanistan. Musharraf may even get help from the Taliban
against the Balochs...
Thanks for the posts Hellmut. Good observation. And that is actually happening to NATO.
Is it just because of Bejing's friendship Pak is against their own Balochs. Pak killings are because of Bejings's own energy needs  Very
disturbing. Why China needs to set up a naval base in Pak region? Why Pak allows this?
Knowing all the developement why US is still with Pak? And loads of arms deal to Pak? Isn't it this indirect help to Bejing? Oh... the US, looks
worse than Pak Can't understand anything.
[edit on 1-10-2006 by CosmicScorpion]
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reply posted on 26-10-2006 @ 09:44 PM by Hellmutt
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India has put on hold plans by a Dubai-based company to construct a trans-shipment terminal in India, because the company has been involved in the
Gwadar project.
BBC: India warned on investor 'threat'
23 October 2006
India's National Security Council has recommended new legislation to monitor investment from countries that may pose a threat to national
security.
India has fought wars with China and Pakistan and the council has warned the government to be cautious when clearing investments from these countries.
In recent months India has put plans on hold by a Dubai-based company to construct an international trans-shipment terminal in the southern state of
Kerala. India is concerned that the company has allegedly been operating in Pakistan's Gwadar deep-sea port, which was built with a Chinese
partnership. Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
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reply posted on 12-11-2006 @ 07:02 PM by Hellmutt
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The Chinese continues their investments in Gwadar and are increasing their presence in Balochistan.
Telugu Portal: China to invest in Balochistan
2006/11/12
Chinese companies from different segments will invest in both macro and micro level projects in Balochistan, particularly in Gwadar port city, a media
report said Sunday.
The diplomat, who specially flew to Gwadar from Karachi along with senior executives of leading Chinese companies to attend the conference, said
economic relations between Pakistan and China were "surging to new heights with every passing day".
The envoy expressed optimism about Gwadar's economic potential and said, "Ignoring all security apprehensions, the Chinese companies are increasing
their presence in the province".
Analysts say Gwadar's location has great strategic value - both from the military and energy stand points. Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
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reply posted on 23-12-2006 @ 09:42 PM by Hellmutt
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Pakistan has awarded the contract to manage the Gwadar Port to Singaporean port operator PSA International. They will take control by the third week
of January.
PakRealEstate.com: PSA Singapore to run Gwadar Port
The government has decided to give the management control of the Gwadar deep-sea port to the Singapore port operator PSA International, Federal Ports
and Shipping Minister Babar Ghauri said on Friday. Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
Related News Sources:
Islamic Republic News Agency: Port of Singapore to operate Pakistan's Gwadar port:
minister
People's Daily Online -- Port of Singapore to operate Pakistan's Gwadar
port
Channelnewsasia.com: PSA International to run Pakistan's new
port of Gwadar
Gulf Times: Singapore to manage
Gwadar port
Reuters via Yahoo! Asia News: Singapore's PSA to run Pakistan's Gwadar port
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reply posted on 29-12-2006 @ 08:27 PM by Hellmutt
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Gwadar will get a desalination plant. Right now there's no water resource available in the area. The demand for water in Gwadar will be high and the
cost to transport water there will be too much. The solution is to make a desalination plant.
PakRealEstate.com: Gwadar to have desalination plant
The federal government is urgently providing special Rs700 million funding to Balochistan to help meet 15-year water demand of the Gwadar Industrial
Estate (GIE) through the installation of a foreign assembled desalination plant.
[---]
The objective would be to get a fully foreign assembled plant with sufficient warrantee from a reliable and experienced supplier, who can also
guarantee ready supply of spare parts and can promptly deal with emergencies.
[---]
The future demand of water supply will be met partly by recycling of waste water (irrigation and industrial cooling) and partly by the desalination
plant. At present there is no water resource available in the area.
[---]
There will be approximately 2,000 industrial units in the Gwadar Industrial Estate providing employment to 30,000 workers. Most of the production will
be export-oriented and will bring foreign exchange to the country.
[---]
The only source of surface water that can be used for GIE is Saear Dam located some 24 km away. The cost of transmission of water over 24 km distance
and filtration will be substantially high, roughly estimated at Rs250 - 300 million. Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
[edit on 2006/12/29 by Hellmutt]
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reply posted on 18-3-2007 @ 11:47 PM by makeitso
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It is said that the recent riots in Pakistan, (brought on by the sacking of a judge)
were because of Gwadar. President Musharraf sacked the judge over his supposed objections to giving Singapore the 40 year contract to run the port.
It has also been reported that the port will now be operational March 20th 2007.
[edit on 3/18/07 by makeitso]
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