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Logic will tell you the whole "War on Terror" is phony

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posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 02:00 AM
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Originally posted by krossfyter
TheHandOfTruth i do not argue against the existence of the illuminati. i understand where you are coming from with this... however you do have more of a grasp on the organization and all its workings in our world.

That being said... i was only arguing for a more objective approach by the first poster...AscendedMaster... (with all due respect to him)
I was ready to be educated about the war on terror being a phony using logic but he failed on the first part... which really soured his whole approach.

The rest just reads like someone reading to many conspiracy books and not actually trying to study this stuff on ones own... i could be wrong.. but thats what it sounds like to me.

maybe if he would of droped the logic part... saying he is going to use logic... i would have never responded the way i did.

i wont argue against most of his views ... from the other side... because i tend to believe a little bit of what is being said... but using logic to come up with this view... thats where im having issue with.

I have heard david ike and alex jones. I have no argument whatsoever against them... they do thier research ... from my understanding. peace.

[edit on 23-8-2006 by krossfyter]


Given that information is confusing or even frightening, some people would readily deny its existance rather than dig. AcendedMaster makes some good points and it's good to see people willing to learn and speak the truth.

It's said that a situation is best viewed from a neutral position and if you put politics aside, (because it's a very sophisticated method of creating divide and rule) you can start to view history and today's world in terms of "who benefits" and then we can focus our efforts on the source of all these groups/people who constitute the answer to the problem. The "Sheeple", we as a human race need to start considering the possibility of impossibility; not just pertaining to the illuminati, but the nature of human existance we believe to be real.

This forum is here so you can ask questions and learn from others, and to be able to voice your knowledge, ignorance, or opinion. (Not saying you're ignorant) The beauty is, if there's a piece of knowledge you want to grasp all you have to do is reach.


[edit on 23-8-2006 by TheHandOfTruth] Damn typos!


[edit on 23-8-2006 by TheHandOfTruth]




posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 02:13 AM
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agreed TheHandOfTruth.

im in constant search for objectivity and truth without the cloud of politics... but its a very hard search.



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 04:15 AM
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Anyone who calls himself "Ascended Master" is a self-important, arrogant, condescending, petulant jerk.

The evidence has bourne that out.

Anyone who addresses fellow ATSers, in the way that the esteemed "Ascended Master" has, is an asshole.

Evidence, meet Bourne Out.

"AscendedMaster",
We await no reply.


[edit on 23-8-2006 by Tuning Spork]



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 04:49 AM
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Although the war on terrorism has taken a propaganda spin and was used to unite Americans in an effort to erradicate an 'evil' element in this world we must not forget that it is Fundamentalist Islam that brought down WTC with passenger planes killing 3000 people.
This war on terrorism is about two NWOs battling it out. One representing (in the extreme versions) Capitalist pigs and the other backward fundamentalist Islamic madmen.

OK some of yuo rightfully say that Al-Qaida was created by the CIA. That is true that the lack of American insight allowed Al-Qaida to back-fire on the US. But saying that Al-Qaida is an American tool for world domination is preposterous.

Let us assume for a moment that the US perpetrated 9/11. Even then thousands on fanatical Muslims danced in the streets and hailed Bin-Ladin as a hero. Was this staged as well?

I have personally met with Islamists in my university days who outright told me that their goal was to see an Islamic empire come about like the Ottoman empire.

Denying the dangers of fundamental Muslims and the cover provided by various radical Islamic elements (Iran, Sudan, Hamas, Hezbullah etc) is plainly stupid unless this is what you want. Allowing Iran to become a nuclear power would be a mistake. Sitting back and letting things unfold without acting to stop it is patently idiotic.



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 05:18 AM
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to me AscendMaster has done the research and knows what he is talking about
i give him credit to what he has said and believe him 100percent
secret socities have been here for a long time!

oh and to TheHandOfTruth i agree with you to


[edit on 23-8-2006 by CYRAX]



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 08:49 AM
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Originally posted by Ox
Great thread.. I have to say I wholeheartedly agree with you.. The Sheeple of the world need to wake up and realise .. YES.. the government WOULD DO THIS TO YOU!
Especially if they had something or EVERYTHING to benefit from it


Yes they surely would!

I used to listen to the conspiracy stuff and chuckle. Interested non-believer is what I call myself but in the last 6 years I am starting think that something is going on. They seem to be almost blatant about it...hiding it is neither hard nor necessary anymore.

I've been following the "Security and Prosperity Partnership Of North America" for awhile now. The government website for it (and for the patriot act) are hillariously un-funny. They amount to "Don't worry about it, you can trust us!"

There will be a North American Union inside of ten years. Maybe even five.


Ox

posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 09:30 AM
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And thats the point I was trying to make, The US Government has EVERYTHING to gain from this "War on Terrorism" the.. NEVER ENDING WAR... This fight was started by the USA for business.. Unfortunately the old saying "War is good for business" is true...

It bothers me alot when W continues to say "This war on terrorism and the war in Iraq will continue as long as I am President".... That's a VERY VERY loaded statement. A statement that has been said countless times.



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 10:32 AM
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This is how an AscendedMaster behaves




AscendedMaster

you go and make ignorant comments
you moron
your too ignorant
you government swine
We will put a stop to your madness!
We will rise up and take you down
globalist scum
we have to bring you down
the proverbial scum that you are
all of you dark evil minions will rot on the Hell Planet
abberant scum
what did you expect posting an ignorant comment like that



I thought they were humble, and taught peace and love? Why all the hate?



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 11:20 AM
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Someone has to get angry about this, none of the sheeple seem to care. I dont claim to be an Ascended Master yet, I only aspire to be. Learning all I have learned, Ive learned the key to manifesting something in your reality is to live like it already has. I dont claim to be perfect, and neither do the Masters....

I feel justified to get angry at the ones who have harmed mankind for thousands of years. I feel justified to get angry at the ones who blindly support them. The Earth is being turned into a prison planet, we all should be angry about this.


Ox

posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 11:47 AM
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I think Master is on the right track.. .I dont think we should GET angry about this.. I think we should BE angry about this... This is something that has been covered and lied over.. and we are the only ones who can stand up and fight back... Dont just eat everything handed to you.. If your own friends and family will lie to you... why wouldnt the government? and they dont know you.. or care about you..



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 11:56 AM
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posted by AscendedMaster

I write this assuming you know the ties your government has to terrorists . . This thread is based on logic. The government says the terrorists want to destroy America hate our freedoms and want to establish an Islamic Empire around the globe . . If you analyze the excuses the government gives, this is what is says. Like 9/11. The terrorists hit because they wanted to take down American financial, political, and military power. Right? [Edited by Don W]


Reflect back, A/M. By Labor Day, 2001, Bush43 had squandered the budget surplus and the stock market was taking a dive in anticipation of predictable budget deficits. He apparently had only one agenda, to lower taxes on the R&Fs. The rich and famous. Before the second tower fell, someone called B43 and said, “You have just been re-elected!” War trumps economy! And reason. And common sense. And logic!



America was founded upon the ideals of FREEDOM, PRIVACY, AND ABUNDANCE AND PROSPERITY TO ALL. This is not the America we see today. People all over envied and respected America, and wanted to live in America, because at one time it truly was "the land of opportunity" the "land of the free."


Well, A/M, not quite ALL people who lived here were “Free.” But we never want to let facts get in the way of a good story.



But the people who took control of America in 1913 have seen to it that the American people be turned into a bunch of self-centered, gibbering twits who have no mind of their own, who soak in whatever the government says like a sponge, and who totally ignorant of even the basic fundamentals on how the world is run, and what those in control are doing.


Let’s see, Mr A/M, 1913. The 16th Amendment was adopted and the Federal Reserve System was created. Are you referencing one or both of those sea change events? The 16th Amendment gave the Federal government the ability to tax the citizens directly. The Internal Revenue Service was also created to collect those taxes. This new source of revenue made possible both the welfare state and the military industrial complex we hear mixed reviews about. Washington and Eisenhower had misgivings, the Oberfuhrer Rumsfeld and VP Cheney say it is the best thing to come down the pike. But hey! Who are Washington and Eisenhower compared to the Oberfuhrer and VP Cheney?

The Federal Reserve is a government regulated system of private banks that handle the printing and distribution of paper or fiat money. A system that may not be the best in history but has certainly done more to make the world we live in today possible than any other entity I can think of, offhand.



The whole "war on terror" is pure propaganda; you don’t fight wars against terrorist you are creating. The people need to realize that their governments create and arm all these little terrorist groups. “Al Qaeda planned massive attack; foiled by our great CIA." This was done so much in America especially in the last year. Fake terror to take away our freedoms. The government says the terrorist commit attacks because they hate our freedoms. Why then would the government do exactly those things? Why would they disrupt out society and change our way of life by cracking down on security everywhere because of the terrorist "enemy," why would they give the enemy what it wants?

Answer: the government wasn’t lying. The terrorist DO want to scare us, disrupt our society, and take away our freedoms. Its just the REAL terrorists are the government themselves.


I agree. Just watch how calm it will get after November 7. It is too bad the public can’t see this is how B43 is playing the voters like a master violinist plays a Stradivarius.



[edit on 8/23/2006 by donwhite]



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 12:10 PM
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I agree. Just watch how calm it will get after November 7. It is too bad the public can’t see this is how B43 is playing the voters like a master violinist plays a Stradivarius.

[edit on 8/23/2006 by donwhite]


I agree also, but I disagree with the issue about the voters, Most American people are slow but they are not lost in oblivion yet.

Many Americans has waken up at the reality of the War on terror people are opening their eyes to the issue that they have been play with in the propaganda arena.

If the results of the November elections do not go the way that is desirable for the big interest groups that has not finished yet their agenda in the Oil wars in the middle east . . . you bet that elections will be tampered with and this time it will be blatant and for all to see.

Why? So the American people finally see who is in charge and what place we all hold in these people power ladder.

Yes they will probably show their faces so we may go on our knees to show respect to their might.





[edit on 23-8-2006 by marg6043]


Ox

posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 12:37 PM
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If you want to go the route of election tampering.. Then this might open your eyes a little

Voting Machine Outrage

... Might give you an idea of what the government can do.. and how they squash what they dont want to hear



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 01:26 PM
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.

Originally posted by AscendedMaster

you go and make ignorant comments
you moron
your too ignorant
you government swine
We will put a stop to your madness!
We will rise up and take you down
globalist scum
we have to bring you down
the proverbial scum that you are
all of you dark evil minions will rot on the Hell Planet
abberant scum
what did you expect posting an ignorant comment like that





Originally posted by AscendedMaster
I feel justified to get angry at the ones who have harmed mankind for thousands of years. I feel justified to get angry at the ones who blindly support them.


Angry? This is not anger. Is hatred. Is hate the logic you use to decide what is phony?




The Earth is being turned into a prison planet, we all should be angry about this.


Come on, don't BS us. You didn't say all that nasty stuff to him because he is turning the planet into a prison. You can tell your brothers here at ATS the truth. What set you off? The part about womens rights? The part about stoning people?

Tell us the truth oh wise Ascended one.


Originally posted by AscendedMaster

you go and make ignorant comments
you moron
your too ignorant
you government swine
We will put a stop to your madness!
We will rise up and take you down
globalist scum
we have to bring you down
the proverbial scum that you are
all of you dark evil minions will rot on the Hell Planet
abberant scum
what did you expect posting an ignorant comment like that



Don't you see that your own words seem to prove his point.
You did more harm to your "cause" than any government ever could. Why would you do that?

Are you trying to undermine the whole WOT is phony thing? Maybe your pretending to be part of the "Religion of Peace" so that you can make it look bad? Or have you been taught to be this full of hate and now your trying to spread that hate over the whole world?

By the way, how are you planning on "rising up and taking em down"? Terror maybe? Oh wait, I thought you said thats phony?


Ox

posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 01:31 PM
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Wow.. how.. condesending and bitter.. I think anyone is able to speak their opinions, correct? Maybe it's just his opinion.... Dont be counter productive



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 01:33 PM
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Looks to me like he was being counter productive. Thats what I was pointing out to him.

Thank you for helping with that.



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 01:46 PM
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AscendedMaster-Hmm where exactly should I start, hmm, how about where you called me a moron. With posts like these-

"I see lights in my area too...multi colored, all the colors of the rainbow. And I wouldnt judge a book by its cover, there are many sites out there which look real good and have crap information....as there are many sites out there that dont look so trendy but the info is outstanding."

"Given the moral degradation involved in these mens works, it actually doesnt suprise me that theyd be involved in the putrid Freemasonic network.

Like the Elite say all the time, "give the goyen 'bread and circus', and they will be happy." In other words, keep the people fed and entertained, and they wont rebel against the evil things you do. Works pretty well it seems. " Michael Richards Thread

Based on that right there, I could easilly say, you're either a little kid that doesn't know the difference between real and make believe, or you're way too stoned, and you need to lay the bong down for a week or two, or I could even say you're mentally ill.

A majority of muslims are evil, just because they don't strap TNT to their kids chest doesn't mean their not. Here's the reason why, a majority of them stay silent when an attack is carried out by muslims, and when they do condone it there's always a BUT at the end. "Well we condone the acts of these terrorists BUT we wouldn't be driven to this point if it wern't for the evil, zionist, swine trying to take over our lands. Yeah ok. So what I'm comparing muslims to is the german people of the 1940's. They may not be throwing people into ovens, but they sure as hell don't mind. Look at how they treat women, and you say it isn't evil? You're ovbiously a male chauvinist and support the oppression of women in the muslim world. How the hell do you sleep at night man? Oh yeah, the weed.

So I'll ask again, since you don't even live here, how is Americas police forces becoming militarized? Why don't you actually answer this time, considering I actually put forth examples showing that cops in the U.S. are the same as they've always been. Just because you put on the latest TacGear from a mail order catalog doesn't make you militarized. They weapons they carry also don't, considering that as far back as the 1920's they carried weapons with a much greater firepower. Grenade launchers for tear gas? Try again junior, as far back as the 1960's cops used them quite often, and even killed a reporter sitting in a bar when they shot him in the head with a tear gas canister. Armored vehicles? Try again, in the 1960-1970 time frame LA SWAT started using armored vehicles. Ever research Kent State? So once again how are police forces in the U.S. becoming militarized?

Bloodlines again? Bush related to Bin Laden? Prove it. Pardon me if I don't see any resemblance but are you high again? Who else is in this magic bloodline? The Queen of England? Reptilians? LMAO

Oh you read books, well that beats me, considering I grew up in the part of the world we're talking about, and returned for 2 years. Who's ignorant, the moron that believes everything he reads in books, or one who's actually been there. See this is where I think your not even worth talking to, cause your version of reality is that freaking warped. In another thread you basically called me a Nazi, when you said all the soliders in the U.S. Military are WORSE than Nazi's. Ovbiously you're the one who's ignorant since you don't know anything about a little thing called the holocaust, and the fact that you try to compare that to U.S. military actions now show's either how mentally ill you are, unimformed, or how stoned you are.

Ohhh another gem!
"I know NSA monitors this site, so listen good. Its over. Your finished. Your secrets are being exposed! The more you try to control us, the stronger we get, and the more resolve we have to bring you down like the proverbial scum that you are. Rockefeller, Rothschild, Kissinger, Bush, all of you dark evil minions will rot on the Hell Planet, or will be uncreated if you dont release your control over this realm."

Considering how enlightened you consider yourself to be I'm suprised you think this NSA crap is new. Let me tell you a little something that you don't know, and your books arn't telling you. The NSA has spied on us since the 1970's, the FBI did a stellar job before that. So big suprise the NSA is doing what it's done for almost 40 years. Haven't you even heard of Hoovers FBI?

"Nothing can stop the Light from shining on Gaia."
HAHAHA umm ok we won't, cause Gaia is the bomb.

"I shine light on you all."
You call it light, I call it something that exits a bull.

"I AM Jarin Kumara aka John Jancar, or as you know Ascended Master, Higher Self tuning out."

Whatever elitst snob. LAY OFF THE DOPE.

"Alex Jones, David Icke and others have called this process "problem-reaction-solution"
David Reptilian Icke?!? HAHAHA, not worth the effort.

"You sure don't sound as if you're born in Saudi Arabia, certainly not at all. Where in Suadi Arabia were you born and in what Hospital?"

So you're going to question my backround. Also, why in the hell would I reveal infomation such as that on a site like this, or any personal information on any website? Where are you from? What hospital were you born in? I can't even get Ascended Cheech Master to tell me where he lives, so does that mean? I don't really care if you believe me or not, considering that you buy into this bloodline crap that doesn't really mean much now does it?

"Well, in America, we still practice the death penality unlike our Eurpoean counterparts"

So you're comparing being executed for molesting and killing a child, to stoning someone to death because they were accused of being homosexual? Uhh, ok.

I don't deny that there's a global conspiracy, a NWO if you will, but this illuminati bloodline crap can only be out there to trash the credability of people that mention it. Here's the conspiracy, rich powerful people, are trying to become richer, and more powerfull every day, and will step on any of the little people to get there. Wow, same thing throughout history, bloodlines don't matter, it's just the same golden rule that's existed forever. He with the gold, rules.

Oh, and before you reptile believers start crying about personal attacks, remember, you threw the first rock, freaking psycho



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 03:08 PM
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Originally posted by JudahMaccabbi
Although the war on terrorism has taken a propaganda spin and was used to unite Americans in an effort to erradicate an 'evil' element in this world we must not forget that it is Fundamentalist Islam that brought down WTC with passenger planes killing 3000 people.


That day in New York was a trajic day, and my heart goes out to Americans, but in light of the fact that, and without going into detail:


  1. The American government had sufficient warning and did nothing.
    www.thenewamerican.com...
  2. The fact we were preconditioned with shows like "The Lone Gunmen" (Aired two months before 9/11)
  3. The Fact the steel in the WTC was immediately shipped to China and India, (After cutting the steel up in four N.J scrapyards, despite numerous protests) then recycled (Effectively destroying the important evidence)
    911research.wtc7.net...
  4. The fact that the 9-11 commission was a total white-wash which didn't even touch upon critical issues
    www.americanprogress.org...
  5. The fact that kerosene and trimethylbenzene (plane fuel) can't melt steel, even if it's burning in the ideal conditions.
    www.uscrusade.com...
  6. The fact that the Bush Administration repeatedly fails in capturing Bin Laden (How conveniant, not like they're mentioning him anymore either).


I could list many other things that led me to believe this whole thing is staged.


Originally posted by JudahMaccabbi
This war on terrorism is about two NWOs battling it out. One representing (in the extreme versions) Capitalist pigs and the other backward fundamentalist Islamic madmen.


That is the illusion. Both sides are funded by the same people. This goes beyond governments, little terrorist groups, and idiotic soap-opera notions of left, right, up, down, or center (who cares). We need to start looking at documented associations and start unlocking what they designate "secret". The key to enpowerment is knowledge. That's why they are pulling websites off of respected news companies, hanging up on guest speakers who try to get good websites out to the public (O'Reilly show), rolled out the patriot act, homeland (fatherland) security, (we can replace the word security with control every time)


Originally posted by JudahMaccabbi
Let us assume for a moment that the US perpetrated 9/11. Even then thousands on fanatical Muslims danced in the streets and hailed Bin-Ladin as a hero. Was this staged as well?
Denying the dangers of fundamental Muslims and the cover provided by various radical Islamic elements (Iran, Sudan, Hamas, Hezbullah etc) is plainly stupid unless this is what you want. Allowing Iran to become a nuclear power would be a mistake. Sitting back and letting things unfold without acting to stop it is patently idiotic.


I could see them dancing for this reason (amongst others):
"On August 20, 1998, US President Bill Clinton ordered the United States Navy to fire cruise missiles on four sites in Afghanistan, all near Khost (and one in Sudan), which the U.S. claimed were terrorist training camps." Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org...

Well, in light of PNAC, ( www.newamericancentury.org... ) It's a mistake to let America keep their nuclear capabilities. It's easy to focus on these little Muslim/Islam groups fighting eachother while we ignore the larger issue of America, who has enough nuclear capability to destroy the planet what.. 10 times over? Think about that. We need to disable EVERYONE'S nuclear capability. America has a history of slavery and injustice. So I'm not comfortable with people like that (or anyone for that matter) having control of devices which could annihilate humanity. I partly agree with you.

[edit on 23-8-2006 by TheHandOfTruth]



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 03:26 PM
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Originally posted by makeitso
This is how an AscendedMaster behaves




AscendedMaster

you go and make ignorant comments
you moron
your too ignorant
you government swine
We will put a stop to your madness!
We will rise up and take you down
globalist scum
we have to bring you down
the proverbial scum that you are
all of you dark evil minions will rot on the Hell Planet
abberant scum
what did you expect posting an ignorant comment like that



I thought they were humble, and taught peace and love? Why all the hate?


Its amazing how you managed to twist my words so beautifully, I really admire your skill in propoganda.

Take things from DIFFERENT POSTS about DIFFERENT SUBJECTS, make it look like I am insulting that dude that disagreed with me, all to make me look bad. Nice, try, didnt work.

First of all....

"You go and make ignorant comments" (He did make ignorant comments. His comments had no knowledge in them whatsoever)

"You moron" (If the shoe fits...)

"Your too ignorant" (why do you think the world is how bad it is...because too many people are too ignorant of whats really going on)

"You government swine" (I was actually talking about the dark people in government on that post. Thats whole post I wrote where I got angry it was at the government. Not anyone on this thread!! It was all towards the government!!)

"We will rise and take you down. We will put an end to your madness!" (Yes we will, Illuminati)

"globalist scum" (They are scum! If you people had any idea what the Illuminati do, youd be so shocked, you probably wouldnt believe it.)

"the proverbial scum that you are; all of you dark evil minions will rot on the Hell Planet; abberant scum" (ALL towars the ILLUMINATI)

"What did you expect posting an ignorant comment like that?" (what did he expect! Look up the word ignorant, it means LACK OF KNOWLEDGE. I repeat, LACK OF KNOWLEDGE. The shoe fit perfectly so I put it on him.

Get my point straight before you twist my words and try to use them against me. I still stand by everything I wrote on every different subject on all the posts on this thread.



posted on Aug, 23 2006 @ 03:36 PM
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Hey, WithoutEqual, you dont think the Illuminati exist?

Why dont you ask Andy Pero, that, see what he says. Why dont you ask Cathy Obrian, and Phil Schneider, or anyone else who have been the victims of the Illuminatis sick and dark minds....see what they say??

My bets are you never even heard of these brave souls. Your ignorance is without equal.

Here is a quote I think you better read:

""The Technocratic Age is slowly designing an every day more controlled society. The society will be dominated by an elite of persons free from traditional values (!) who will have no doubt in fulfilling their objectives by means of purged techniques with which they will influence the behavior of people and will control and watch the society in all details". "... it will become possible to exert a practically permanent watch on each citizen of the world".

- Zbigniew Brzezinski - (Illuminati and co-founder of Trilateral Commission)

There is no evil Illuminati? There is no NWO based on total control? WAKE UP SHEEPLE!!!

[edit on 23-8-2006 by AscendedMaster]




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