Police state, only way to be safe

Sorry for behavior to this point, hugs hugs and such.

Cool, so now that we are all cool I think a watch-dog group is a great idea. The only thing is how could such a thing be run so as to avoid corruption?

Watch-dog group, cool.

Like the police?

would it be better for the usa to move towards more control by our goverment and the law. maybe a patriot act 3.

Oh how Convenient! This has been the Government plan all along! We *ALREADY* live in a Fascist Police State & it is only going to get worse over time! Bush's Nose is going to grow every time he says "Freedom" on TV now!

It is happening . We all know were moving towards a police state, a bigger brother , and there doesnt seem to be anything we can do to change it.

Not even putting Democrats into office will change the process that is taking place. They are just as evil as the Republicans and I believe they are both controlled by the same elite that control us.

Yes - how intuitive of you!

We are only trying to protect you from the Terrorists says the Government. But what happens when the Government points a Political finger at you and says
"YOU are a Terrorist"? Pathetic!

[edit on 14-8-2006 by Seraphim_Serpente]


[edit on 14-8-2006 by Seraphim_Serpente]

Calling what is America right now fascist is both ignorant and alarmist.

Originally posted by Sauron

If you have not got the balls to live or die as a free person, then you deserve enslavement.

Thank You Souron all said.
WIS

[edit on 14-8-2006 by WalkInSilence]

Originally posted by Johnmike
Calling what is America right now fascist is both ignorant and alarmist.

It's not what America is right now, that is worrisome, it is where we are headed. I would say that America is in the early stages of fascism (Pre-fascism if you would)

[edit on 14-8-2006 by In nothing we trust]

who says were not currently being enslaved.
that is where the problem exsist. its happening people. are you going to do anything about it? NO .
you can talk big and bad all you want but if your going to wait till its too late, your revolution will be as short as WIS last post.
you wont deny were well on our way towards a police state. towards more control by big brother.

it doesnt have to be like what you read in 1984. it doesnt have to be nazi fascism.

i believe the uk is attempting to make a more people friendly big brother. well we are america. we are the greatest country in the world with the greatest minds arent we?
can we not do better. can we not make a big brother for the man instead of a big brother against the man. WE WILL NOT STOP MORE CONTROL ON OURSELVES. not in this current world. all we can do is be the controllers. the all seeing eyes. the guards of the guard.
how can we acomplish this? i think waiting till its too late, would be plain tragic. if that is your plan, ill sell you a pile of rocks for your revolution, because they will do you just as much good as a shot gun.

so yes a police state will make us more safe. it will make us more safe from terrorism,more safe from those who wish to control us . the people you all fear.
a big brother to truly protect the people,a big brother for the people of the people, not a big brother against the people . it is the best way to find the safety and security we desire in this new day and age. or else we can just wait for what we will be given , a police state aka big brother for the elite.
which would you chose. you must make a choice, because we are already on our way to the latter.

that is the question at hand nihilist.

Originally posted by Nihilist Fiend
Sorry for behavior to this point, hugs hugs and such.

Cool, so now that we are all cool I think a watch-dog group is a great idea. The only thing is how could such a thing be run so as to avoid corruption?

how will WE control this inevitable police state we are going to become. How do we keep this absolute power in the hands of the people and not in the hands of the elite or the corrupt. the first part of the solution would be to wake up our fellow americans to what our future holds. wake them up to the enslavement that is on the horizon. just that simple start seems impossibly enormous with the current mind set of you average american.

with so many people against a POLICE STATE , why arent so many trying to figure out how to stop it. or manipulate it to the advantage of " we the people" .our freedoms and our constitution depend on us now in this day and age. we need to find the answer.

Inevitable? LOL, it's not at all. It can be prevented, and I doubt it would become anywhere near fascism any time soon. It's not "pre-fascist" at all, we're just not enjoying every single freedom we used to have. We've lost sight of what America was, I think, but calling it "fascist" or "pre-fascist" is nothing but exaggeration and completely ignoring the fact that what we have now is better than pretty much most if not all nations that have existed in recorded history.

its not inevitable?

read this im sure your familiar with it
arstechnica.com...

its happening .

abcnews.go.com...

this is from the abcnews article.
WASHINGTON Nov 22, 2005 (AP)— Jose Padilla, a U.S. citizen held without charges for more than three years on suspicion of plotting a "dirty bomb" attack in this country, has been indicted on three counts alleging he conspired to "murder, maim and kidnap" people overseas.

held for 3 years for suspicion to bomb people in america , only to be indicted for planning on killing people overseas.

this is from rense
www.rense.com...

title is America - Soon To Be The
Largest Police State Ever

its going to happen, and is already happening. im just throwing some general stuff into the air. do i need to say patriot act one and two.

this is your quote john -what we have now is better than pretty much most if not all nations that have existed in recorded history.

i believe the usa , pre 2000 was better then what we have today. so its wrong to say our nation is better then any nation in recorded history. just look at the great usa of the 1900s


sorry if im not posting such links right. if i need to claim these are external sources or whatever ill do that now. they are external sources lol. im a noob forgive me. peace

[edit on 14-8-2006 by elitegamer23]

[edit on 14-8-2006 by elitegamer23]

Originally posted by elitegamer23
it doesnt have to be like what you read in 1984. it doesnt have to be nazi fascism.

i believe the uk is attempting to make a more people friendly big brother. well we are america. we are the greatest country in the world with the greatest minds arent we?

can we not do better.

can we not make a big brother for the man instead of a big brother against the man.

OH I get it. Americans used to be the most innovative people on the planet. Maybe we can use our innovative gifts to, "BUILD A BETTER WIDGET", or "BUILD A BETTER POLICE STATE", in this case.

For starters I would like to see a national ID for every citizen. Vistor papers which require an annual review for our Non-citizens. Radom check points for ID and visitor paper checks.

This would be a great way to bust drunks as well (MAD will be happy)

Non-citizens who cannot produce valid visitor papers will be subject to immediate deportation. (Patriots will be happy)

Dead beat dads behind on child support and axe murderers would be incarcerated immediatly. (Single mothers and murder victim survivors would be happy)

Late on your car payment, skipped paying last months credit card bill? Credit checks would also be performed by the authorities at these random check points. Dead beat bill payers would be locked up for the night, just to let them get a taste of what will happen if they don't cough up the cash. (Corporations trying to scrounge up every penny of profit , in order to make next quarters wall street earnings goal, would be happy)

How about secret warrentless house searchs in the middle of the night? We could target poor and impoversed neighborhoods and maybe some lower middle class neighborhoods as well. Because we all know that poverty breeds terrorism. Lets lock up the poor before they have a chance to blow stuff up.

How about setting up a secret prison system where we could torture people. We could keep them locked up indefinetly if we never charge them with a crime. Hell lets go all the way, lets just make them disappear forever. This is really the stroke of genious, since we could target and pick up specific troublemakers as we need to.

Once the population becomes used to this as standard operatiing procedure we could just avoid the middle of the night seizures and just skip right to daylight pickups. I mean who really wants to work night shift anyways? (The columbians have been using this technique quite successfully for awhile now)

How about limiting the free press? If we lock up reporters for asking too many questions or for failing to divulge thier sources we could control what they say and investigate.



[edit on 14-8-2006 by In nothing we trust]

do you deny we ARE becoming a police state? good luck trying to stop it. why not try and influence what it will grow into. its our best option. id love to know how to stop it. any ideas?

its late im off to bed for i have a long day ahead of me tomorrow. may peace be with us all.

[edit on 14-8-2006 by elitegamer23]

I don't believe in what it's become, no, but I think the screams that it's becoming a police state is far fetched. I think our freedoms are being crushed, yes, but not to the extent that the screamers scream about.

That said, I fiercely believe in these freedoms and maintaining them. I realize there is quite a bit at stake.

we are at the point where one major terrorist attack on our country will change our rights forever. we are already poised to lose more and more of our freedoms. just one major terrorist attack. and boom, the screams you hear become reality. it didnt even take an attack for patriot act 2 to pass.

look at the rights we have lost from patriot act 1 and 2. if a nuke goes off in america, be ready for patriot act 3 and 4. i am really off to bed this time. laters .

*sigh* This thread goes from people being angry about a "Police State" to people accepting it as inevitable. I agree it is happening,but your attitude is very defeatist and sad. The minute people decide to give in one bit to this enslavement,there is no going back.

It's almost as if this thread has come full circle.From elitegamer arguing we need a Police State. To elitegamer saying we don't, but he/she is presenting an opposing argument. Gaining sympathy,now back to where we started.Only now more people have jumped on the "Please Enslave Us Master" bandwagon.

Just don't come crying to me about it when America actually DOES resemble 1984,V For Vendetta,and so on.I'll be one of the truly free patriots whether it be dead, alive, or imprisoned. Freedom means that much to me. Apparently it doesn't to many people anymore.

*looks up from behind sunglasses and her laptop and scans the room for any social deviants*

Police State? Inevitable? Honey...please. We are already there.

*flips open cell phone to report a panhandler outside and waits patiently for the cops to haul him off*

Sorry - but that poor soul was disturbing my "ideal reality".

*returns to browsing ebay for meaningless crap to up her social status and discourage any misgivings about not being a "good consumer" with all the latest material trappings*

*casually sips $5 latte*

gonzo you said it yourself-people accepting it as inevitable. I agree it is happening
how can we stop what you fear?
you jsut expect it to go away. ok great . read how my thinking about such has evolved. read the whole thread. i m not the nazi you wish me to be. the bleak future we have in store for us is not just going to go away.

like you said and i said , its happening. what can we do??? saying you are against such will not stop it. claiming you will lay down your life to prevent such will not stop it. its happening. if u truly cared, you would already have died to prevent it, its happening.

i never said we dont need a police state. i said we cant stop it. i said we better create the big brother we will have watching us , instead of the people you so fear creating it for us. that is different

damn phone woke me up, back to bed, gnite.
[edit on 15-8-2006 by elitegamer23]

[edit on 15-8-2006 by elitegamer23]

so you're saying 'if you can't beat them we better join them?' Elitegamer?

Isn't this exactly what happened in Germany during the 1930s? Everyone saw the Nazis rise in power and rather than do anything about it they went along with it in the hope of protecting themselves and their families from within?

Isn't it far better to follow the principle of 'For evil to prevail good men need only to do nothing'

We are now living inside regimes that are systematically invading and occupying other countries (like the Germans did). Who are curtailing civil liberties and inaugurating a system of monitoring its own populace (Just like the Germans did). We are holding people without charge, without recourse to law or lawyers and sanctioning extreme interrogation and torture techniques (just like... well you get it now I'm sure). We have formed an alliance with big business to wage the War on Terror (just such an arrangement was struck with Germany in the 30s). We are using our technological superiority against those without out. We are changing the political landscape in order to maintain a continuous hold on power for those already in power. The military class is being superceded in strategic and tactical decision making by the political class. We are demonising a culture. And furthermore those in actual power have historical connections to nazi Germany.

The last few years feels very much like what it must have felt to be living under the shadow of 1930s national socialism. Except this time, we're not on the outside looking in worrying about it. We're on the inside looking out. The wrong side.

People hope for you to be a Nazi? Uh, okay.

We need to go against the swing toward authoritarianism, yes. I agree on every level. I just don't think it's fair to scream like its the end of the world. Our government would never get away with things the Nazis did. For example, disgusting mistreatment and torture of minorities (Jews, etc.) They were a different people, do not compare America to the Nazis. America is nothing like these and is unlikely to change into that without something very, very bad happening that creates utter chaos, and even then chances are it wont happen.

Go against oppression, but don't exaggerate to move your cause.

If you can't beat them, join them.