Of All The Liberties You Have Lost, Because Of The 911 Conspiracy. Which One Do You Miss The Most?

Harte,

Thank you for posting section 2331 of article 18. I was having trouble finding it myself. I wanted to use it to elaborate(if I could). Thanks

original quote by: Harte
It is a welcome sight, I might add, to see anybody in these politically charged threads admit to any error, however small, and my esteem for you has grown proportionally, Tone23, for your concession.

False Pride, sir, Is not one of my vices. Your accolades are not why I do it; but, they are appreciated.

original quote by: Harte
And, like I said, the only course of action open to a citizen whose constitutional rights have been violated is legal redress, in civil court. Padilla may have a case. We'll see what happens.

Legal redress is the legal avenue that is afforded the citizen; absolutely. The problem is that most Americans without a full class action would have no chance to actually pursue those grievences; ie.. lack of both funds and time. But there again lies the answer; class action. (Not that I ever really disputed this point )

original quote by: Harte
So, as you see from the part I bolded, only posting half a definition results in a misleading idea of how "terrorism" is defined in US law.

BTW, as you also can see from the above, the Patriot Act made only a few changes to an already existing definition of terrorism.

I left out the whole top part above this quote to save space.
First point: Thank you for elaborating. Reading alot of this is like trying to read a road map in japanese. So I greatly appreciate your being "tour guide"

Second point: I am not paranoid(though extremely concerned) about the loopholes that may or may not exist in these "laws".(not saying you are calling me paranoid..or are you...lol) I only do this as a citizen who cares very greatly for my personal rights and freedoms. Although I will readily admit that at this time my personal life has not changed in my day to day. It is what lies just beyond the realm of sight that concerns me.

Third point: I appreciate you guys all putting up with my flair for the melodramatic... ie.. "End of Point!!!" and "point blank". I will not apologize for it; as that is just part of who I am. I will, however, like to thank YOU Harte for making me laugh when you pointed that out

Anyway, thanks for the insightful post and

You have voted Harte for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have used all of your votes for this month.

Your display of grace and courtesy are often devoid in these heated debates. And You have humbled me with it so. Well worth my vote sir.

thank you for your time,
TONE23

[edit on 8/18/2006 by TONE23]

I will state my point again, but this thread has been posted too early. We don't really "miss" anything, yet. But just so you're sure of what some of us mean when we say things like "loss of our freedoms", or "big brother is watching", make sure you take a look at these links. Hopefully, you'll find them as interesting, as I did. By the way, as far as I know these are actual pamphlets and have not been adulterated in any way.

Happy reading....

www.infowars.com...

www.infowars.com...

www.infowars.com...

www.infowars.com...

You don't even have to be open minded, to read these, it's all there in black and white.

Originally posted by flighttraumajunkie
I will state my point again, but this thread has been posted too early. We don't really "miss" anything, yet. But just so you're sure of what some of us mean when we say things like "loss of our freedoms", or "big brother is watching", make sure you take a look at these links. Hopefully, you'll find them as interesting, as I did. By the way, as far as I know these are actual pamphlets and have not been adulterated in any way.

You don't even have to be open minded, to read these, it's all there in black and white.

I looked at them. Sorry, I don't see anything at all wrong with them.

Harte

Harte

You ever try and defend the Constitution, because if you have then you are on their list. How about made "numerous" references, to the Constitution, you are on the list. Ever have a large amount of stored consumables, e.g. food, water, etc., for emergencies, you might be on a list. Do you own a GPS? You might, well you get the hint. It's not just about you or me, think of all the people you might know who would fit these categories.

Originally posted by flighttraumajunkie
Harte

You ever try and defend the Constitution, because if you have then you are on their list. How about made "numerous" references, to the Constitution, you are on the list. Ever have a large amount of stored consumables, e.g. food, water, etc., for emergencies, you might be on a list. Do you own a GPS? You might, well you get the hint. It's not just about you or me, think of all the people you might know who would fit these categories.

The pamphlets you posted atre not about any "list."

One is telling citizens what to be aware of, the other is telling local Law Enforcement what to keep an eye out for.

I lived in Florida for years. Right on the Atlantic Coast. People there looked at you funny if you didn't store food, water, batteries, etc. I hardly think that the entire Atlantic and Gulf Coast will end up on somebody's "list" because of this.

Harte

Well..it's tough to talk about..but..

I'd say the thing that has changed for me is..

the price of milk has gone up. whats with that bs? jesus christ. come on bush. do you own a milk company too? you didnt know about your lumber company so why the hell not. 3 bucks a gallon my ass. its just like gas. what a communist.

Originally posted by dstarsfan879905
Well..it's tough to talk about..but..

I'd say the thing that has changed for me is..

the price of milk has gone up. whats with that bs? jesus christ. come on bush. do you own a milk company too? you didnt know about your lumber company so why the hell not. 3 bucks a gallon my ass. its just like gas. what a communist.

REPLY: The whole gas price thing has been covered in other threads; there's no gouging by anyone in the oil companies.

Originally posted by zappafan1

Originally posted by dstarsfan879905
Well..it's tough to talk about..but..

I'd say the thing that has changed for me is..

the price of milk has gone up. whats with that bs? jesus christ. come on bush. do you own a milk company too? you didnt know about your lumber company so why the hell not. 3 bucks a gallon my ass. its just like gas. what a communist.

REPLY: The whole gas price thing has been covered in other threads; there's no gouging by anyone in the oil companies.

and? i was talking about milk dumbass..i can talk about whatever i want to

9/11Conspiracies » EFFECTIVE IMMEDIATELY... ALL MEMBERS PLEASE READ – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 22/8/2006 by Umbrax]

It is important to note three things that history has taught us about the loss of rights and fascism:

1. Rights are taken away slowly so the public either won't notice or won't complain.
2. Once rights are gone the rarely if ever come back.
3. The lost rights are rarely abused until they have 'all' been stripped. This ensures that there are no loop holes and that the public has no recourse.

Originally posted by Slap Nuts
It is important to note three things that history has taught us about the loss of rights and fascism:

1. Rights are taken away slowly so the public either won't notice or won't complain.
2. Once rights are gone the rarely if ever come back.
3. The lost rights are rarely abused until they have 'all' been stripped. This ensures that there are no loop holes and that the public has no recourse.

Slapnuts,

Sounds insidious alright. But has it ever happened?

I mean, you can claim all you want that "history teaches us" this or "history teaches us" that, but I'm not seeing much meat on those bones. How about coming up with a few examples of where fascism crept in to a free society through the "backdoor" so to speak. As I recall, it's usually imposed practically overnight.

Harte

The right to a fair trial, the right against unlawful imprisonment, the right to privacy, the right of freedom of speech, the right to protest, all by way of the Military Commissions Act.

‘National yawn as our rights evaporate’

We'll just keep adding them to the list as time goes on until at some point our right to even discuss this topic is taken away which is just around the corner...

FBI director wants ISPs to track users

This thread is a few months old now. I’m curious… to those who, when the thread was started, felt our rights aren’t being taken away: Does the passing of the Military Commissions Act change your mind at all? Do you still feel there’s no reason for concern? IMO if this doesn't change your mind yet there's nothing that will until we are all in prison, tortured, or worse.

Does anyone have an official count of all the rights that have been eroded or taken away since 9/11? Perhaps it would be easier to just list what little rights we do have left.


[edit on 18-10-2006 by mecheng]

Originally posted by mecheng
I’m curious… to those who, when the thread was started, felt our rights aren’t being taken away: Does the passing of the Military Commissions Act change your mind at all? Do you still feel there’s no reason for concern? IMO if this doesn't change your mind yet there's nothing that will until we are all in prison, tortured, or worse.

Would anyone care to answer?

Since I am not an alien unlawfull combatant, the millitary commisions act does not apply to me.

Originally posted by HowardRoark
Since I am not an alien unlawfull combatant

You make the mistake of assuming you get to make that decision...