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posted on Aug, 10 2006 @ 05:28 PM
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I don't know if this has happened before, but the Union Jack and EU flag are being used together now
i knew we did it during the EU Presidency, but has the EU flag been given equal status and are we finally not scared to be apart of Europe?

Just saw it on the news




posted on Aug, 10 2006 @ 05:32 PM
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I believe it started out a few weeks ago offically, from what Ive read in the papers.

The EU flag now has the same status as the Union jack, I think.



posted on Aug, 10 2006 @ 05:39 PM
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Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
I believe it started out a few weeks ago offically, from what Ive read in the papers.

The EU flag now has the same status as the Union jack, I think.


Really? i think thats great news


I don't know why certain people are scared of Europe, but our relationship with America has made us more pro-EU i believe. In a recent poll, over 60% said our future is with Europe than America (which is interesting).

[edit on 10-8-2006 by infinite]



posted on Aug, 10 2006 @ 05:42 PM
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I honestly cant comment here. Its not my country, and its not my descision.

Im just reporting what Ive heard.

There are alot of things that creep me out about the EU. Mainly, it smells like federalization, which is showing bad effects in the US.

And then there is a certain Javier Solana who gives me the creeps.............



posted on Aug, 11 2006 @ 03:18 AM
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Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
And then there is a certain Javier Solana who gives me the creeps.............


ah!

the anti-christ



posted on Aug, 11 2006 @ 05:34 AM
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Originally posted by infinite
ah!

the anti-christ


Well, he certainly is high up there on the candidates list.



posted on Aug, 11 2006 @ 07:45 AM
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Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
I believe it started out a few weeks ago offically, from what Ive read in the papers.

The EU flag now has the same status as the Union jack, I think.


Wow, I wouldn't have thought Brussels would have appreciated the EU flag being viewed with the same contempt as the Union flag! Does this mean councils up and down the country will start banning it?



posted on Aug, 11 2006 @ 07:48 AM
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Originally posted by ridcully
Does this mean councils up and down the country will start banning it?


councils tend to fly the EU flag more than the Union flag. I only see the Union flag fly around London and the Chaucer Hotel in Cantetrbury.

councils use to fly the EU flag before this, but UKIP (being the cry babies they are) went complained cause the EU flag was a national flag at the time



posted on Aug, 11 2006 @ 11:27 AM
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Hadn't heard this one.

Who's afraid of the big bad EU?
Hopefully less of us than some claim.
I think there are far more worrying things in the world than a voluntary cooperative collective of relatively prosperous democratic and free sovereign nation states all at a long term and thoroughly durable peace with each other.


BTW on the 'banning' comment
(but I think the summer World Cup illustrated just how detached from reality the supposed PC folk-lore that 'you can't......', as far as the Union & St Georges flag go, is a complete myth.......

.....and even where our arcane law actually makes it illegal to fly the flag improperly - which was all about respect for the flag and nothing to do with 'PC' - the law is in the process of being changed ).

Anyhoo, flags smags.

Try living in Northern Ireland where every damned perpendicular tube/rod available is used as a flagpole for either marking territory as one or other 'kind'.

Union flags, Irish tricolours and a host of paramilitary flags.

I've no problem with people expressing their liking (or, hey, go nuts, even the deepest and truest 'love' for that abstract notion that is 'the nation state') but that's often not what is it about, certainly not here anyways.
It is often about what others are not
(which is why the hijacking of the flag by far-right groups in the UK is so repellent).

I find that part of it all pretty horrible.



posted on Aug, 11 2006 @ 01:40 PM
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Originally posted by sminkeypinkey
Try living in Northern Ireland where every damned perpendicular tube/rod available is used as a flagpole for either marking territory as one or other 'kind'.

Union flags, Irish tricolours and a host of paramilitary flags.


Oh yes, i remember.

i remember in some loyalist areas, you get the US confederate flag and the flag of Israel flying too (never did understand that)



posted on Aug, 11 2006 @ 04:37 PM
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Originally posted by infinite
i remember in some loyalist areas, you get the US confederate flag and the flag of Israel flying too (never did understand that)


Eh??????????????? Now thats plain........weird.

I prefer the Union Jack myself to the St. George's cross mainly on the basis of aesthetics. Being American, the combination of red, white, and blue are pleasing to my eye, and the starburth configuration is pretty damn cool. Plus, its more inclusive of the many countries in britian, like Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. its unifying.

Its definitely cooler than the EU flag.



posted on Aug, 11 2006 @ 04:41 PM
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Well, my mum (who was born and lived in Northern Ireland until the mid 80s) said its cause the republicans link themselves to the United States and Palestine, so the Unionist link themselves to the Confederate states and Israel. When my Dad served in Northern Ireland (thats how he met my mum cause he was in the army) he said they use to fly them all the time. And UVF were armed by mossad (apparently). Its really complicated.



posted on Aug, 11 2006 @ 09:18 PM
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Originally posted by infinite
Well, my mum (who was born and lived in Northern Ireland until the mid 80s) said its cause the republicans link themselves to the United States and Palestine, so the Unionist link themselves to the Confederate states and Israel. When my Dad served in Northern Ireland (thats how he met my mum cause he was in the army) he said they use to fly them all the time. And UVF were armed by mossad (apparently). Its really complicated.


Tell me about it! The reasoning is at best, absurd.



posted on Aug, 15 2006 @ 02:56 AM
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the flying of european flags is just another way that Blair is using to try to destroy the British identity in this country, if we try to fly the flag of saint george in this country the local authorities jump all over you stating that it may upset the ethnic minorities while these very same ethnic minorities are allowed to fly their own ethnic flags and it said they are only respecting their cultural identities



posted on Aug, 15 2006 @ 06:31 AM
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are they? i do not recall any ethnic groups flying their own flag


Blair is destorying the identity, he is simply helping us understand that we don't rule the world anymore and we are not all high and mighty (even though some like to think)



posted on Aug, 15 2006 @ 08:56 AM
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Originally posted by infinite
are they? i do not recall any ethnic groups flying their own flag


Blair is destorying the identity, he is simply helping us understand that we don't rule the world anymore and we are not all high and mighty (even though some like to think)


what has that got to do with it. We need our own flag, cultural identidy and uniqueness has jack all to do with desires of empire and power. We can't turn our back on our past, purely because we did some bad things (as every other nation and empire on earth has done) we easily foget the acheivments and contributions to world culture. The european union could easily be seen as a new empire anyway (the economy and millitary would rival the US). Europe should purely be an economic union. We are not at war with each other, and I can't see that happening in the future, with or without the EU. The whole Kosovo-Serbia-Croatia-Yugoslavia thing was the only exception and I can't see that turning back after all the atrocities.

It angers me that the EU flag is now considered 'equal'. We haven't even agreed to the constitution. Why are we rushing this through without a proper debate. Note, we can't even have a proper debate on this as opponents are simply labelled as Facsists or empire merchants.

Theres also a conspiricy angle. I doubted about the whole World government thing, but now Bush is planning a North American union..



posted on Aug, 15 2006 @ 09:43 AM
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PRIDE!
I dont think that the majority of people living in the U.K have pride in a "foreign flag"
but are willing to show pride in their national flag!

I for one DO NOT have any inclinations to fly or support the e.u. flag!

Whenever anyone flys the St George / The Union / or the flag of Wessex he or she is automatically branded a rascist? why?

Sminkey (hello)
re: the banning of flying such flags, actually this is NOT a myth, but it is TRUE the council where i live stopped the local FIREBRIGADE from flying the St George during the world-cup?
This particular BAN was Not due to the arcane law but WAS due to the stupidity of Political Correctness gone mad!!!

In N.I you are right (you know this better than most of us ) it was a sign of territory and paramilitary strength.
As are/were the designs painted on walls and the side's of houses that must have been done over a course of a few days as some are extremly detailed?

I do not agree with you when you state that far-right groups are "hi-jacking" the Union and or The St George flags.
As ive debated with you before these particular groups that you(and not only you) claim to be "far right " are infact NOT and yes, right-wing but far -right NO!

Infinate:
Im sorry i dont understand where you get the paramilitarys flying flags of israel from?
This is puzzling me here?
This is contradiction here.....you have a confederate flag supposingly supporting confederacy in the USA and therefore right-wing (and i know you never said that) but im trying to get my head round this, "ip-so-facto- why would a right wing organisation be supporting israel, when they are supposed to be against anything Zionist?

I think the problem here is everyone wants to make something out of someone flying a flag, people are not happy to see another person fly a flag without there being a right wing motive behind it!!!

Now, if you wish to pursue this a bit further ,for those who have no allience to the e.u. (like me) if i stood on the e.u flag or burnt it in public as others have done with the Union/St George/Stars & Stripes would i be committing a crime against the e.u.?
JUST A ThOUGHT








posted on Aug, 15 2006 @ 10:45 AM
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Originally posted by spymaster
Im sorry i dont understand where you get the paramilitarys flying flags of israel from?


if you read my post you would see.
and i made no reference to any paramilitarys, only communities.



I dont think that the majority of people living in the U.K have pride in a "foreign flag"


why not?
the majority have no problem with feeling proud to be European. The youth are mixing with eachother and traveling around, getting education abroad. Majority of the UK do not live in a dream world, where we think we are better than everyone else.

We, as a country, like to learn about other cultures and traditions, being apart of the EU helps us do that. I do think its hilarious that when the EU flag is mention, you get paranoid nutcases come running out screaming "EU is taking over", "they are controling our lives"...yet they struggle to respond when asked "name one EU law that denies us our freedom and sovereignty?"

Yet, those same euroskeptics have no problem with the UN or UN reform that builds on the idea of a World Parliament (how is that different from the EU parliament?) plus the UN charter (which states our rights), how come we are scared of the EU constitution?(EU is no different to the UN)



Whenever anyone flys the St George / The Union / or the flag of Wessex he or she is automatically branded a rascist? why?


no, i think you find, the reference was to the far right who like to hijack our flag and "pretend" to be speaking for the majority. Which they don't. but brainless football fans who fly the flag alongside a UVF flag....thats your problem (watch the program on BBCone about the world cup?)

Its like when you see tourists coming over here, they buy Union Jack hats and flags, wave them around and have a good time. Yet, when we go abroad, we feel the need to state we are British publically (i know its only a small few) and have no respect for others.

that nots patriotism

[edit on 15-8-2006 by infinite]



posted on Aug, 15 2006 @ 11:53 AM
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Right i will have to do things like this because as yet i still cannot how to use the "quote" buttons properly....

You quoted:
UVF... i miss-read that in the context i saw and automatically assumed that you were refering to UVF as a community?
where we know that they are a paramiltitary organisation.

I quoted :
that the majority of the people in the U.K would NOT have pride in a "foreign flag"
Your answere to that was:
why not?
the majority have no problem with feeling proud to be European. The youth are mixing with eachother and traveling around, getting education abroad. Majority of the UK do not live in a dream world, where we think we are better than everyone else.

Infinate, I really & Genuinly DO NOT class myself as European
I am English and proud to be English first and formost.
I DO NOT think of myself Better than any other race or religion!
I DO NOT live in a dream world as you put it?
Im sorry to say i think its maybe you who live in "that world"!
The youth as you put it, are NOT getting on with each other, surely you must be aware of this? go into any inner city and you will see the what i have said is true.

You quote:
We, as a country, like to learn about other cultures and traditions, being apart of the EU helps us do that.

Havent we been doing that since 1973 (sminkey will know if that date is correct) when we were ""allowed"" into the Common Market.

You quote:
name one EU law that denies us our freedom and sovereignty?"

I cant! i do not know enough about the WHOLE treaty?

You quote:
The football fans and the hijacking of the flag by the "far-right"

Well, i havent seen the programme you are talking about but i can assume that the same flag, presumably the Union had a Red hand in the middle?
If im wrong then forgive me please.
BUT....
Firstly, the "far right" adopted the swastika as their emblem ie groups like:
Stormfront / Combat 18 / Blood & Honor (who as far as im aware believe in National Socialism) etc who yes, have links with paramiltary groups such as UVF.

Right wing Political Parties in the U.K such as BNP have adopted the Union in order to show Nationalism, they as far as im aware DO NOT say that they are speaking for the whole country.
We must NOT forget that groups such as the BNP are a politically elected party!!!
No-one forced anyone to vote for this organisation, people done so off their own backs, perhaps after years of being dissillusioned by other political parties?

And yes you are right it is only a small few that do spoil it , But everyone has the right to be PROUD of their country, isnt that what we are told?



posted on Aug, 15 2006 @ 05:22 PM
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no, it wasn't the red hand of Ulster flag.

Plus all the youth i talk to, students and non-students, have no problem with Europe or the EU. Secondly, i did not make a direct reference to you that you was "living in a dream world" and i cannot go in the inner city, i don't have one of those in my city.



Stormfront / Combat 18 / Blood & Honor (who as far as im aware believe in National Socialism) etc who yes, have links with paramiltary groups such as UVF


all far right parties are based on national socialism, but nearly all have moved away from that. And yes, they do/did have links to the UVF




UVF... i miss-read that in the context i saw and automatically assumed that you were refering to UVF as a community?


well, the communities probably are someway linked to a paramilitary orgranisation. My Father does recall see other flags (like the ones i stated) in North Belfast (that tends to be a loyalist area).



And yes you are right it is only a small few that do spoil it , But everyone has the right to be PROUD of their country, isnt that what we are told?


You answered your own question

English football fans are told to be proud for England not spoil England



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