Scholar Warns Iran's Ahmadinejad May Have 'Cataclysmic Events' In Mind For August 22

Originally posted by princeofpeace
Iran bought 2 nukes off of Kazhakstan back in the early 90's but no one seems to know if they are operational or not.

Can I ask you for a link please?

Originally posted by subz

President Ahmadinejad: We are against bloodshed, regardless of whether a crime was committed against a Muslim or against a Christian or a Jew.

Hardly congruent with the "he's a blood thirsty jew hater" argument presented to Americans daily from the biased mainstream media. I highly recommend every one read that interview quoted above. It is very illuminating as to Ahmadinejad's demeanor and goals, none of which is killing Jews in Israel.

sorry subz, but i just cant let that one pass:


israel should be moved to europe

iran's president calls for israel's destruction

an islamic world and death to all jews

iran's president says holocaust didnt happen

he's only playing nice now because the lebanon conflict draws attention away from his ongoing troubles with the UN.

Originally posted by nextguyinline
It's been my impression that President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is nothing more than
a figure head with very little power. I suspect he has influence, but I think the
situation is alot like if Queen Elizabeth Alexandra Mary said the same thing.

that's been brought up several times in the past, and i still disagree. he has the full confidence of the supreme leader or he wouldnt still be the president. at the very least, if Khamenei did not agree with his comments, he would not be allowed to voice them. IOW, he speaks for the supreme leader.

Originally posted by spencerjohnstone

Did you guys knows Isreal has over 300 nuclear bombs? Did you know it's Illegal for them to have just one nuclear bomb under the Nuclear Non-Prolferation treaty.

Did they even sign up to it?, as far as I knew they did not sign up to the Nuclear Non-Prolferation treaty. If they had then oks there would be a problem. Difference between Israel and Iran! Iran signed up to it Israel did not.

Link: en.wikipedia.org...

Second day Second attempt at quoting someone (noob, I know) but in response
If any other country in the world besides Isreal attemted to get nukes (That doesn't already have them of course) it would be illegal. I Guess I'm just foolish for trying to hold Isreal to the same standards as every other country on Earth.

Originally posted by Calm Anomoly
Second day Second attempt at quoting someone (noob, I know) but in response
If any other country in the world besides Isreal attemted to get nukes (That doesn't already have them of course) it would be illegal. I Guess I'm just foolish for trying to hold Isreal to the same standards as every other country on Earth.

both pakistan and india also have nukes....illegally. the world cant stop those that already have them, but they can and should stop their proliferation to other countries.

It is very illuminating as to Ahmadinejad's demeanor and goals, none of which is killing Jews in Israel.

[edit on 8/8/06 by subz]

So he says subz. It is very easy for leaders to lie, I know how rare that is.

I don't believe that Iran is going to nuke Israel or half the fear mongering about Iran and North Korea, but what I do not believe Ahmadinejad is not some polite courteous person as it was portrayed in that article. Then again, I don't think anyone should attack Iran because I think he talks a lot of bs

Originally posted by spencerjohnstone

Did you guys knows Isreal has over 300 nuclear bombs? Did you know it's Illegal for them to have just one nuclear bomb under the Nuclear Non-Prolferation treaty.

Did they even sign up to it?, as far as I knew they did not sign up to the Nuclear Non-Prolferation treaty. If they had then oks there would be a problem. Difference between Israel and Iran! Iran signed up to it Israel did not.

Link: en.wikipedia.org...

Spencer while you are 100% correct and he is wrong about the NPT treaty, f you look back in time, the transfer of heavy water was done illegally through Norway using deceptive methods. If what Israel did was legal by any means then they would have been able to purchase heavy water without fooling around.

Not to mention the fact that Israel also transfered Nuclear secrets to South Africa . There were also suspicions that there was also a transfer of technology between Israel and China as well using our technology ala Johnathan Pollard, United States traitor spying for the State of Israel.


Pie

Second day Second attempt at quoting someone (noob, I know) but in response
If any other country in the world besides Isreal attemted to get nukes (That doesn't already have them of course) it would be illegal. I Guess I'm just foolish for trying to hold Isreal to the same standards as every other country on Earth.

NOOB? I have been a member here for over a year now so Do not think myself as a noob!!, Well I was only more of a queston anyways rather than a rebuttal of your postings, so quit with the attacks or Ii will gae ye a glasgie kiss joke!

Spencer while you are 100% correct and he is wrong about the NPT treaty, f you look back in time, the transfer of heavy water was done illegally through Norway using deceptive methods. If what Israel did was legal by any means then they would have been able to purchase heavy water without fooling around

Do you have links so I can read up on it? But does not take away the fact that Israel did not sign up to it, If they had would there still be double standards? Im just wondering? A question btw

Originally posted by Escrotumus
I'd say that they would be much more likely to light one off in a secluded part of the Iranian desert somewhere as a "hello world, we are now a nuclear power" gesture.

This idea came to my mind when I started reading this thread... Well, maybe not on 22nd, but who knows, nuclear test scenario sounds pretty realistic

Here's a related story...

Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has frustrated Western officials by refusing to reply to their offer of various incentives in exchange for Iran’s discarding its nuclear program until August 22. The Western governments had asked Ahmadinejad to reply by June 29; why would Tehran need two extra months?

And now, according to Ghadry, Ahmadinejad is planning an illumination of the night sky over Jerusalem to rival the one that greeted the Prophet of Islam on his journey. What the Iranian President, he says, is “promising the world by August 22 is the light in the sky over the Aqsa Mosque that took place the night before. That is his answer to the package of incentives the international community offered Iran on June 6.”

www.frontpagemag.com...

It sure seems like the leaders today (I'll include Bush here as well) are driven to fulfill religious prophecy. Some of the statements that they make sound like they want armageddon. It's almost like someone else is pulling the strings.

Originally posted by snafu7700
sorry subz, but i just cant let that one pass:


israel should be moved to europe

iran's president calls for israel's destruction

an islamic world and death to all jews

iran's president says holocaust didnt happen

he's only playing nice now because the lebanon conflict draws attention away from his ongoing troubles with the UN.

Snafu, dont get me wrong Ahmadinejad has no love of Israel. Im not saying that he does. What I am saying is that he does not want to kill Israelis.

With regards to the links you provided, they fall into two distinct categories. 1) Deliberate mistranslations ala "wipe Israel off the map" and 2) References to Zionist regime are portaryed as "Israel".

Ahmadinejad has never said he wants to kill Israelis. He also never said Israel should be wiped off the map. In all instances you will hear Ahmadinejad refer to the "Zionist regime" or the "Zionist regime occupying Jerusalem". Just as the United States did not want to kill Iraqis when it forcibly ousted Saddam Hussein, Ahmadinejad wants to see the removal of the Zionist regime in Israel. There is a major difference between what Ahmadinejad says and what is reported in the media.

Also the Der Speigel interview I quoted was months before the latest conflict between Lebanon and Israel. It was not playing nice to distract from anything.

[edit on 8/8/06 by subz]

I say let every country have a nuke. That'd end all the BS.

Seriously, Wall Street Journal? You guys think its reporting is going to be fair?

But yeah, its sad how our successive goverments have failed to grasp such a basic fact - People do NOT like interference in their business. They do NOT like it when others tell them what to do. And they WILL rebel if there is unjustice done.

We prepped up the Shah, he fell, we demonized Khomeni, we kept on screwing them up. Then the Persian Gulf War - We helped Saddam, fought a proxy war against Iran, we supplied weapons-grade material to Iraq, yada, yada, yada...

What I'm trying to say is enough of the BS the Goverments feed you people. Wake up and speak out. Because unless you don't, they are successful. Silence is the most lethal weapon.

Everything, and I mean everything in the Middle East is orchestrated for what? Israel and Oil. We just can't decide what we want.

Kamran, welcome to ATS From sunny Cymru I see

It's great to see this influx in new members.

Originally posted by subz
Snafu, dont get me wrong Ahmadinejad has no love of Israel. Im not saying that he does. What I am saying is that he does not want to kill Israelis.

is that why he continues to support hizbollah and hamas, both organizations with charters that call for the destruction of israel, with weapons and training?

Ahmadinejad has never said he wants to kill Israelis. He also never said Israel should be wiped off the map.

yes he has, several times on both accounts.

In all instances you will hear Ahmadinejad refer to the "Zionist regime" or the "Zionist regime occupying Jerusalem".

which is what exactly? israel and israelis.

Just as the United States did not want to kill Iraqis when it forcibly ousted Saddam Hussein, Ahmadinejad wants to see the removal of the Zionist regime in Israel.

and have it replaced with what? a muslim regime that will eradicate most of the jewish population in israel (at least those crazy enough to stay if that ever occurred).

There is a major difference between what Ahmadinejad says and what is reported in the media.

do you possibly have some sources to back that statement up?

Also the Der Speigel interview I quoted was months before the latest conflict between Lebanon and Israel. It was not playing nice to distract from anything.

before the current conflict between israel and lebanon, but during the height of the iranian nuclear debate at the UN where concerns of what he would do to israel with nuclear weapons were strongly voiced. of course he would play nice for the cameras....."no, no, we have no intention of attacking the zionist pigs with nuclear weapons....whatever gave you that idea?"

Originally posted by subz
Kamran, welcome to ATS

From sunny Cymru I see

It's great to see this influx in new members.

Heh, thanks!

They are about to talk about this on Fox news with Hannity and Combes. Its 9:25 eastern US time right now.

Originally posted by snafu7700

Originally posted by subz
Snafu, dont get me wrong Ahmadinejad has no love of Israel. Im not saying that he does. What I am saying is that he does not want to kill Israelis.

is that why he continues to support hizbollah and hamas, both organizations with charters that call for the destruction of israel, with weapons and training?

Ahmadinejad has never said he wants to kill Israelis. He also never said Israel should be wiped off the map.

yes he has, several times on both accounts.

In all instances you will hear Ahmadinejad refer to the "Zionist regime" or the "Zionist regime occupying Jerusalem".

which is what exactly? israel and israelis.

Just as the United States did not want to kill Iraqis when it forcibly ousted Saddam Hussein, Ahmadinejad wants to see the removal of the Zionist regime in Israel.

and have it replaced with what? a muslim regime that will eradicate most of the jewish population in israel (at least those crazy enough to stay if that ever occurred).

There is a major difference between what Ahmadinejad says and what is reported in the media.

do you possibly have some sources to back that statement up?

Also the Der Speigel interview I quoted was months before the latest conflict between Lebanon and Israel. It was not playing nice to distract from anything.

before the current conflict between israel and lebanon, but during the height of the iranian nuclear debate at the UN where concerns of what he would do to israel with nuclear weapons were strongly voiced. of course he would play nice for the cameras....."no, no, we have no intention of attacking the zionist pigs with nuclear weapons....whatever gave you that idea?"

Do you know Hamas and Hezbollah came into being? Israeli my friend. Israel supported Hamas as an opposition to Arafat's PLO (Incase the PLO ever turned on it). Hezbollah was created when innocent little Israel wanted to play War War with Lebanon! Get your facts right mate.

Israel has also said on many occasions how it wants to destroy the Arabs. Oh wait, proof? Here are some 25 or 30 quotes (All documented - No making up) by some leading Israeli statesmen. Respond to the NEXT post.

Oh seriously you're on ATS and still blinded? I am amazed at people like this. It is fear that leads you to denial. Not disinformation, how could it be a lie if everyone says it!

'Radical Islam' is a creation of the West. If we didn't interfere in their business, would they have any reason to attack us and our assets? No! They were not and would not have been in a position to. We would have been justified in any attacks if they were not provoked first. But wait, can you honestly look back at the last century and say we haven't done anything to those people?

We created the hysteria. We created our 'enemies'.

How many International Laws has Israel adhered to? One in a hundred? Two in a hundred? Seriously.....

Okay, read the next post - My character count is almost done here.

Israel an American Value?

Torture and summary executions were not American values until we prostituted ourselves for the sake of Israel, thus adopting their policies, programs and procedures, despite the conflicts with our constitution and stated principles.

Though these actions violate every principle the United States is founded on, we support and protect these policies in Israel and engage in them in Iraq and Afghanistan making the term, "American values" the ultimate oxymoron.

Some of their most beloved Zionist leader quotes:
1. "There is a huge gap between us (Jews) and our enemies not just in ability but in morality, culture, sanctity of life, and conscience. They are our neighbors here, but it seems as if at a distance of a few hundred meters away, there are people who do not belong to our continent, to our world, but actually belong to a different galaxy." Israeli president Moshe Katsav. The Jerusalem Post, May 10, 2001

2. "The Palestinians are like crocodiles, the more you give them meat, they want more".... Ehud Barak, Prime Minister of Israel at the time - August 28, 2000. Reported in the Jerusalem Post August 30, 2000

3. " [The Palestinians are] beasts walking on two legs." Menahim Begin, speech to the Knesset, quoted in Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts". New Statesman, 25 June 1982.

4. "The Palestinians" would be crushed like grasshoppers ... heads smashed against the boulders and walls." " Isreali Prime Minister (at the time) in a speech to Jewish settlers New York Times April 1, 1988

5. "When we have settled the land, all the Arabs will be able to do about it will be to scurry around like drugged cockroaches in a bottle." Raphael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defence Forces, New York Times, 14 April 1983.

6. "How can we return the occupied territories? There is nobody to return them to." Golda Maier, March 8, 1969.

7. "There was no such thing as Palestinians, they never existed." Golda Maier Israeli Prime Minister June 15, 1969

8. "The thesis that the danger of genocide was hanging over us in June 1967 and that Israel was fighting for its physical existence is only bluff, which was born and developed after the war." Israeli General Matityahu Peled, Ha'aretz, 19 March 1972.

9. David Ben Gurion (the first Israeli Prime Minister): "If I were an Arab leader, I would never sign an agreement with Israel. It is normal; we have taken their country. It is true God promised it to us, but how could that interest them? Our God is not theirs. There has been Anti - Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault ? They see but one thing: we have come and we have stolen their country. Why would they accept that?" Quoted by Nahum Goldmann in Le Paraddoxe Juif (The Jewish Paradox), pp121.

10. Ben Gurion also warned in 1948 : "We must do everything to insure they ( the Palestinians) never do return." Assuring his fellow Zionists that Palestinians will never come back to their homes. "The old will die and the young will forget."

11. "We have to kill all the Palestinians unless they are resigned to live here as slaves." Chairman Heilbrun of the Committee for the Re-election of General Shlomo Lahat, the mayor of Tel Aviv, October 1983.b

12. "Every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." - Israeli Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, October 3, 2001, to Shimon Peres, as reported on Kol Yisrael radio. 13. "We declare openly that the Arabs have no right to settle on even one centimeter of Eretz Israel... Force is all they do or ever will understand. We shall use the ultimate force until the Palestinians come crawling to us on all fours." Rafael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defense Forces - Gad Becker, Yediot Ahronot 13 April 1983, New York Times 14 April 1983.

13. "We declare openly that the Arabs have no right to settle on even one centimeter of Eretz Israel... Force is all they do or ever will understand. We shall use the ultimate force until the Palestinians come crawling to us on all fours." Rafael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defense Forces - Gad Becker, Yediot Ahronot 13 April 1983, New York Times 14 April 1983.

14. "We must do everything to ensure they [the Palestinian refugees] never do return" David Ben-Gurion, in his diary, 18 July 1948, quoted in Michael Bar Zohar's Ben-Gurion: the Armed Prophet, Prentice-Hall, 1967, p. 157.

15. "We should prepare to go over to the offensive. Our aim is to smash Lebanon, Trans-Jordan, and Syria. The weak point is Lebanon, for the Moslem regime is artificial and easy for us to undermine. We shall establish a Christian state there, and then we will smash the Arab Legion, eliminate Trans-Jordan; Syria will fall to us. We then bomb and move on and take Port Said, Alexandria and Sinai." David Ben-Gurion, May 1948, to the General Staff. From Ben-Gurion, A Biography, by Michael Ben-Zohar, Delacorte, New York 1978.

16. "We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population." Israel Koenig, "The Koenig Memorandum"

17. "Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages. You do not even know the names of these Arab villages, and I do not blame you because geography books no longer exist. Not only do the books not exist, the Arab villages are not there either. Nahlal arose in the place of Mahlul; Kibbutz Gvat in the place of Jibta; Kibbutz Sarid in the place of Huneifis; and Kefar Yehushua in the place of Tal al-Shuman. There is not a single place built in this country that did not have a former Arab population." Moshe Dayan, address to the Technion, Haifa, reported in Haaretz, April 4, 1969.

18. "We walked outside, Ben-Gurion accompanying us. Allon repeated his question, What is to be done with the Palestinian population?' Ben-Gurion waved his hand in a gesture which said 'Drive them out!'" Yitzhak Rabin, leaked censored version of Rabin memoirs, published in the New York Times, 23 October 1979.

19. Rabin's description of the conquest of Lydda, after the completion of Plan Dalet. "We shall reduce the Arab population to a community of woodcutters and waiters" Uri Lubrani, PM Ben-Gurion's special adviser on Arab Affairs, 1960. From "The Arabs in Israel" by Sabri Jiryas.

20. "There are some who believe that the non-Jewish population, even in a high percentage, within our borders will be more effectively under our surveillance; and there are some who believe the contrary, i.e., that it is easier to carry out surveillance over the activities of a neighbor than over those of a tenant. tend to support the latter view and have an additional argument:...the need to sustain the character of the state which will henceforth be Jewish...with a non-Jewish minority limited to 15 percent. I had already reached this fundamental position as early as 1940 [and] it is entered in my diary." Joseph Weitz, head of the Jewish Agency's Colonization Department. From Israel: an Apartheid State by Uri Davis, p.5.

21. "Everybody has to move, run and grab as many hilltops as they can to enlarge the settlements because everything we take now will stay ours... Everything we don't grab will go to them." Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of militants from the extreme right-wing Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, November 15, 1998.

22. "It is the duty of Israeli leaders to explain to public opinion, clearly and courageously, a certain number of facts that are forgotten with time. The first of these is that there is no Zionism,colonialization or Jewish State without the eviction of the Arabs and the expropriation of their lands." Yoram Bar Porath, Yediot Aahronot, of 14 July 1972.