Masons: 2 things I KNOW they're hiding

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posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 07:06 PM
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This forum is halarious. I love all the masons that are here to "dispell" myths. I find it interesting to see how many masons frequent these forums. All the posts I've seen by them try to discredit information given by those who raise questions about the society.
If there was no conspiracy, why are there so many masons on these forums trying to defend masonry from these claims. If someone insults me, I dont stand there to tell them why they are wrong for insulting me, I walk away because its not true.

Now, on the subject of what they are hiding from us I know two things. These are instances where the information has been first hand, or at most second hand, so I wouldn't call it heresay.

My friend went to a Masonic school for children. He had no reason to lie about the things that went on there. You don't have to believe me, but I could tell by the look on his face it was painful to talk about. He told me that the children were brought in to special meetings where members of the order conviened. Afterwards the members could "pick" a child. I would rather not go into details, as my freind did not either. They molested him. But not just him. He told me all masonic organizations for children are like this. A buffet for paedophiles. Also, somewhat heresay, I've heard masons have a long history of being busted for child porn.

Now the first hand account. Masons hold the knowledge of geomancy. Some of you may or may not believe in "magic". This is just semantics. If you can admit that we as humans don't know everything, that there may be "sciences" that have been lost through the ages, you can grasp this concept. Native Americans knew about leylines and there holy sites were located on these. When our forefathers came to this country (many being masons) they built masonic lodges on top of these sites. Geomancy is not what its portrayed to be in the main stream. It is not a system of magic used for "divination" as some state. Ancient Dionyssus-Bacchus cults, mostly women, used to used geomancy for several different reasons. An oblelisk, used for focusing earth's energy on top of leylines were built, with the crops growing around it radially. If there was a weed in the fields causing harm they would take a specimen burn it and put it in the obelisk. Everything has a "natural frequency", or a frequency that when reached, an object will resonate at(physics not magic). So evrything that vibrates at the same frequency of that weed would resonate the frequency of the dead plant. Supposedly, this influenced the other weeds to likewise suffer and eventually die. Then the men took over the cult and with it the knowledge of geomancy. The masons now have that knowledge and are using it on humans.

Obelisks are prevalent in many cities in the US. The Washington monument anyone?
Cities today are all built radially, as most have been in america, centering on a town hall or simalar building. usually they are taller than surrounding structures.

I'm not just making an abstract statement to turn heads. I saw this with my own eyes. They do it through their symbolism. In Tempe, Arizona, I saw a symbol on what I think was an office building. It was a symetrical 6 pointed lotus blossom, but instead of the botoom lotus petal there was a down pointing arrow split in half. Search on google for a picture of The Flower of Life. You can then overlay the sephirot from kabbalah onto that. Now if the symbol was laid on top of that, it would be pointing down to Malkut (earth). The goal of Kabbalah is to ascend to god, so pointing down would suggest moving farther away from god. Malkut (earth) is the material realm, therefore focusing on that is focusing on materialism, as opposed to spirituality. I translate this to mean they are trying to keep us asleep, to make us descend in spirituality by pumping energy into these symbols.

[edit on 4-8-2006 by hexrain1]




posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 07:43 PM
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Hexrain 1

I would never try and speak for all my masonic brothers who post on this site, but for myself alone. I totally agree with you about personal insults and walking away, and I have never attempted to "dispell" or to return insults here. My posts are strictly motivated from the point of trying to correct mis-information, or countering outright lies.

As for why I come here, I am interested, and have been for many years, what the basis of anti-masonic feeling is. I would hazzard to guess that each mason who contributes does so for a uniquely personal reason. The "traditional" view of masonry has been to ignore mis-information and/or insults from our critics.

There is no one in society who can or should state that child molestation never occurs. I am profoundly sorry that your friend was subjected to it. This should never have been allowed to occur. The supervision of the masonic orphanages is supposed to be so strict to prevent any such occurence. Masonic orphanages were designed as "safe haves" for children who needed a "home", over time most if not all have been. What you have described would never be tollerated by the vast majority of masons, and if discovered would be stopped immediately. The predators would be trunded over to the police immedately, at the very least.

If any such occurence should ever come to my knowledge I would do whatever was necessary to prevent it, stop it, and punish the adults involved. I do not know any mason who would allow this to occur, or go unpunished.

As for symbols, realistically, there are a limited number of symbols it is possible to draw. These can and have been used in diffrent ways with different meanings by different groups or faiths over the centuries.



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 07:52 PM
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Thats just like a mason. running around the subject. I'm not saying that your responding to insults. I'm saying that if there was no conspiracy why are there so many masons here trying to tell us there isnt. you dont see that many military officers in the area 51 forums trying to claim there is no area 51. there arent many polititians in the politcal conspiracy forums trying to dispute conspiracy claims. thats because they dont think they are true, and probably aren't so they ignore them alltogether. there are a LOT of masons in this forum for some reason.

My friend wasnt in an orphanage, he was in a masonic school for children.

Do you think i expect anyone to admit to molesting children? of course your going to lie about it.

I'm not saying what the symbols mean to other cultures, im talking about what they meant in the context of what i saw.



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 07:57 PM
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If there was a masonic conspiracy they would not tell most people in the organization. that would lead to leaking information. there is probably few who know the true purpose, i for one do not. but to say that all you leaders are elected are a cop out. if there is in fact a secret inside the secret society than no one but a very few HIDDEN members would control things. this means you, as someone who is obviously not a higher up would know nothing of this "illumanati" type group. If you think you know everything about your organization you are fooling yourself. In a society built on secrets you claim there can be no room for mysteries inside mysteries. thats ridiculous.



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 08:17 PM
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Hexrain 1

If I missed your point I' sorry. I am not awair of any "masonic school for children"(several states have scools connected with their orphanages, for the children there.). Regardless he should go to the police, or to the grandmaster of that state, so he can report it to the police.

As for yor point on consperices, well there have been a lot of posts on that subject, but proving something doesn't exist gets a bit difficult. This is especially true when the recepiat distursts the messanger. After theiry years in masonry, having gone through the chairs of the lodge going through the 32 degree, shrine. And knowing as many masons through out the organisation as I have over the years. I would have expected to have hurd at least a rumor of somesort about a conspericy, if one existed. My "word" is not proof of courrse, for all you might know I could be a member of the vary group you describe.

But if such a group did exist, after all this time don't ou think they would be in power now, if that is what they wanted?

By the way, if you will read some of the older treads, you will see repeated posts that there are no "higher ups" in masonry.



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 09:20 PM
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And knowing as many masons through out the organisation as I have over the years. I would have expected to have hurd at least a rumor of somesort about a conspericy, if one existed.


If you were of the group of the elite, you would know. If not you'de be giving the response that you are now. Or you might just straight up be lying, which if you were involved in global conspiracy i would expect you to.

But if such a group did exist, after all this time don't ou think they would be in power now, if that is what they wanted?

By the way, if you will read some of the older treads, you will see repeated posts that there are no "higher ups" in masonry.

they are in power. MANY of the people in high places in government are members of the masons, or related organizations.

Again, if there were "higher ups" then if your not a part of them you wouldnt know anything about them. just because you don't know it to exist doesnt mean it doesnt.

Also im not wanting to debate with masons, i simply want others to know the truth. if your just going to try and dispute claims that you yourself said you cant prove or disprove, THEN WHY ARE YOU EVEN IN THIS FORUM?

If you're going to debate with me however, which you probably feel obligated to do, bieng of the organization i say these things about, then give me answers that arent indirect.

I notice you didn't dispute the fact about lodges being built on native american sacred places.

[edit on 4-8-2006 by hexrain1]



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 09:24 PM
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If you want to see a great example of how the freemasons on this board operate, check out this thread...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
I was talking about Kosher and one of them even went so far as to post Holocaust pictures.


Edit: just on a side note, ATS has done a great job equalizing the Masonic/Anti-masonic issues, for a time this board had a 'gang' of masons which would flood and hijack any anti-masonic threads. It was WAY out of hand, but the staff here did a great job bringing that under control, and I can honestly say that it has greatly improved the discussions of Freemasonry without fear of being railroaded by them.

[edit on 4-8-2006 by twitchy]



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 09:34 PM
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Hexrain1

IMHO

Your posts remind me of another poster that has been banned numerous times for posting the exact same kind of attacks on Masons. You have told a story, or maybe a fairy tale, who can tell, it's all about your mysterious friend, or it's allabout your own, unsubstantiated claims. If you want a real conversation, stop the attacks and document, solidly, your claims. Present your argument in a way which is not derisive and stop acting like a troll. Otherwise I will claim that Jesus Christ was a known child molester, who spent a huge amount of his time in the company of prostitutes and that the Pope and all his cardinals are running the biggest Dope and Child Molesting operation in the world and the -- oh yeah! According to my friend, who is too hurt to really talk about it, (but I'll just infer what I want from him because I am a hateful little person with too much time on my hands) that all Christians are really worshipers of Mephistopholese and Baal and Satan and every other evil thing.



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 09:39 PM
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it still seems like they get the job done. they just post off topic in a way that deverts the subject away. they run around subjects. its like "to know one, ask one" or whatever. if you ask one they give you the run around for 3 hours and you dont learn anything. but then again its absurd to think that they would ever admit to any of these things. they are good at hidding what they hide. thats why its worked for thousands of years. they base their entire school of thought on keeping things secret. they worship hiram because he sacrificed himself to keep their secrets. personally i think ALL knowledge should be available to everyone. if you withold things from the general population that could be used to further that persons knowledge, how can you condemn that person for anything he or she does. if information you witheld could further the progress of man and you still refuse to reveal it, then what does that say about your morals. then if you base a society on it, what does that say about your societies morals. a society of secrets? why? it makes my stomach turn to think of all the things the masons could be witholding.



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 09:41 PM
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Originally posted by 2stepsfromtop

Your posts remind me of another poster that has been banned numerous times for posting the exact same kind of attacks on Masons. You have told a story, or maybe a fairy tale, who can tell, it's all about your mysterious friend, or it's allabout your own, unsubstantiated claims. If you want a real conversation, stop the attacks and document, solidly, your claims. Present your argument in a way which is not derisive and stop acting like a troll. Otherwise I will claim that Jesus Christ was a known child molester, who spent a huge amount of his time in the company of prostitutes and that the Pope and all his cardinals are running the biggest Dope and Child Molesting operation in the world and the -- oh yeah! According to my friend, who is too hurt to really talk about it, (but I'll just infer what I want from him because I am a hateful little person with too much time on my hands) that all Christians are really worshipers of Mephistopholese and Baal and Satan and every other evil thing.


i gave you my experience. how can i PROVE anything to anyone? if you dont want to listen to what i have to say you wont. but i'm not a liar, and neither is my friend. i think my own experiences are a way better source to post than some conspiracy theory website that says the same old thing that everyone has heard before, more possible disinformation.

This is what i know, take it into account if it rings true to you. If it doesnt, ignore me and believe that im a slanderer for the sake of slandering. I don't have any qualm with you guys as individuals, but i have a big problem with things that i have seen of the rampant corruption of our society at the hands of the masons ideals as an organization.



[edit on 4-8-2006 by hexrain1]



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 10:31 PM
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Hexrain1
I truly like how you corner all the masons on this board.
EX:

Thats just like a mason. running around the subject

When in truth we are just stating our own opinion as are you.

It is unfortunate in words that I can't begin to express that your friend was molested/abused as a child in one of those schools.

Now I realize that not all masons in your eyes are of the upper echlon/elite group of mason/illuminati/knightstemplar/yorkrite/pta or what evergroup you might think is branched or connected to masons, but would it also be safe to say that since most of the masons on this board have denied ever knowing of, or being a part of a ring of child molestors that it just might be that some really sick people have leaked into a society that prides itself on having good men, rather than it being some wicked evil ring of sick men who like young children.


[edit on 8/4/2006 by tempest_101]



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 10:49 PM
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Originally posted by tempest_101
Heraxin
I truly like how you corner all the masons on this board.
EX:

Thats just like a mason. running around the subject

When in truth we are just stating our own opinion as are you.

It is unfortunate in words that I can't begin to express that your friend was molested/abused as a child in one of those schools.

Now I realize that not all masons in your eyes are of the upper echlon/elite group of mason/illuminati/knightstemplar/yorkrite/pta or what evergroup you might think is branched or connected to masons, but would it also be safe to say that since most of the masons on this board have denied ever knowing of, or being a part of a ring of child molestors that it just might be that some really sick people have leaked into a society that prides itself on having good men, rather than it being some wicked evil ring of sick men who like young children.



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 10:59 PM
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hexrain1

Did you just quote me with out saying anything, or were you going to but forgot?

Just asking?

I am sorry I spelt your name wrong on the previous post

[edit on 8/4/2006 by tempest_101]

[edit on 8/4/2006 by tempest_101]



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 11:06 PM
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Originally posted by tempest_101
Heraxin
I truly like how you corner all the masons on this board.
EX:

Thats just like a mason. running around the subject

When in truth we are just stating our own opinion as are you.

It is unfortunate in words that I can't begin to express that your friend was molested/abused as a child in one of those schools.

Now I realize that not all masons in your eyes are of the upper echlon/elite group of mason/illuminati/knightstemplar/yorkrite/pta or what evergroup you might think is branched or connected to masons, but would it also be safe to say that since most of the masons on this board have denied ever knowing of, or being a part of a ring of child molestors that it just might be that some really sick people have leaked into a society that prides itself on having good men, rather than it being some wicked evil ring of sick men who like young children.


I'm not quite sure if that was a complement or not... anyway. I agree. everyone should be able to state there opinion. I gave my story, which as I presented it, as fact not opinion mind you, and then a mason posted that I was telling fairy tales. And you are still as I said "RUNNING AROUND THE SUBJECT". I'm telling people what I know, for what it's worth. I don't claim to know many things, but the two things I posted at the top of this thread are some of the only pieces of truth I can hold on to in this age of disinformation and heresay.

On a positive note, yes, I accept the fact that paedophilia may not be a part of everyone's Masonic experience , student, fellowcraft, or otherwise. There is a very real possibility that I'm paranoid and just plain wrong. But, no one has ever given this explaination of geomancy, which I think to be the truth, so I'm not going to hold it back. Also, check any website with up to date news of Masonic misconduct and you'll find more than "a few" masons written about in news stories that have been arrested for a multitude of crimes. How can ANYONE, who you test the moral strength of, a person initiated in the from of ascending degrees, progress unoticed with psychological attrocities present?



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 11:09 PM
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I quess what I am trying to ask is are stating this to mean that all masons are behind some kind of evil ring of some kind (whether it be child abuse, drugs, taking over the world), or are you pointing out that not all masons are good people.

Or, that this just proves ..........?



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 11:27 PM
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ok you ask me for my whole theory on what i claim of the freemasons. i'll give it to you in as much detail as i think i can.

I think the masons, rotary, lions club, fraternal order of police, etc. any secret society today in fact, is a filter system for recruits to the illuminati. whether they state a relation or not, if they are secret they are involved in world domination. Each go through a system of degrees. Those who exhibit the most loyalty to the brotherhood and not to themselves OR their spirit (conscience) are promoted in a way that when deemed easy to completely control they are made to carry out grunt work of the societies which may or may not be good or evil things. They probably do good things starting out but once they start brainwashing you effectively and you don't question anymore and don't speak about it to anyone, they send you off to do the whims of the illuminati. Stealing, killing, silencing, bribing, and possibly worse things, seem like things the powers that be are into. I percieve that their is so much deception in your own ranks even, that you yourself may not be involved in any of this. It could be 1 person in a lodge that only does the dirty work, or takes the fall if someone gets caught. It could be 1 in 100 lodges. All it takes is a few people in high places with the right conections to cover up things. But, you guys, you guys got a whole lot of people in high places, a fact you can't deny. It's common knowledge.

Now, most of what I just stated was completely an opinion. I don't think this is probably anywhere close to what's going on. I can't possibly KNOW with certainty.
I think William Cooper said it best when he said that he can't possibly know the truth, THE ABSOLUTE truth about the masons... because based on his claimes he could only have information that they LET him have. But, then you guys killed him. I'm not going to be able to give any concrete facts, but I shouldn't have to. You guys certainly don't.

I love how you screwed up that quote from the bible in your signature, Tempest. In the scripture women are strongest because they control the men. But I guess that is sort of the truth.


We should start a thread on the wives of the illuminati


[edit on 4-8-2006 by hexrain1]

[edit on 4-8-2006 by hexrain1]

[edit on 4-8-2006 by hexrain1]



posted on Aug, 4 2006 @ 11:42 PM
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Originally posted by tempest_101
most of the masons on this board have denied ever knowing of, or being a part of a ring of child molestors
[edit on 8/4/2006 by tempest_101]


So, are you saying that most mason have individually been accused of being apart of a ring of child molestation? If so I'd like to see the thread... didn't know anyone else knew about it, I gave that example from ACTUALL EXPERIENCE that a freind had. I had no idea someone else has found evidence of this, and that MOST responded to the allegations already. But, this only strengthens my resolve to share this information. The only thing about "rings" I ever heard involving the masons was a "child porn ring". I would like to see this thread. How can there be so many refences to child molestation if it doesn't exist, and why do you take it as a personal attack and feel a need to individualy denounce it. Of course we know that you are not going to admit to it even if it were true. Don't even bother responding when such is the case. It's pointless.



posted on Aug, 5 2006 @ 02:44 AM
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Let me first clarify that I am not a Mason. I state this only because I feel it will be important for you to realize that this is a completely unbiased standpoint. That said, there are a few things I would like to address. First and foremost, is the fact that you keep accusing the Masons, here and everywhere, of covering up and lying about what "really goes on" inside the lodges and around the world. I find this interesting, considering how many times you have also languidly announced that you have no real proof of your own. When was the last time you were involved in the occurences within the lodges?


just because you don't know it to exist doesnt mean it doesnt.

And just because you say it exists does not mean that it does.

My biggest issue is with the accusation of Masonry being the root of evil due to child molestation and whatnot. It just seems too narrowminded to look at ONLY Masons on this issue. Honestly, ask yourself how many times lately you have heard of Catholic priests being charged with child molestation and other illegal acts. Does this mean that because of the indiscrepancies of a few, then the organization as a whole is inherently corrupt? If you approached every aspect of your life with this same narrow viewpoint, then your entire daily construct would be just one vast conspiracy. Or was that your point?


I'm saying that if there was no conspiracy why are there so many masons here trying to tell us there isnt

I know you have your soap box, but does this really make any sense? Have you ever stopped to consider that perhaps the reason so many are denying a conspiracy is because there isnt one? Just a thought, but this answer seems just as viable as the concept of a global organization, comprised of both rich and poor people trying to cover up some grander scheme.


Do you think i expect anyone to admit to molesting children? of course your going to lie about it.

The main reason I am putting myself out here for discussion with you is because of statements like this. You've already come to a conclusion in your mind that every Mason on ATS is either brainwashed or "Part of the Upper Elite", thereby discrediting anything they might have to say in their defense. Convenient, to say the least.

Finally, on the issue of the Geomancy. I've studied ley lines and the concept of polar alignments for the purpose of godly worship and ceremony, at least to a certain extent. What exactly is it that you are trying to say here? Maybe I could help with it. Hopefully, not being a member of the society you have completely closed your mind to, you and I can have a decent conversation from an unbiased standpoint.



posted on Aug, 5 2006 @ 03:07 AM
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Because a black man raped a woman does that mean all black people are rapists?
Because a mexican murdered someone does that mean all mexicans are murderers?
Because a Jewish person robbed a bank does that mean all Jews are robbers?
Because a muslim commited one terrorist act does that mean all muslims are terrorists?
Because a teacher sept with a student does that mean all teachers are pedophiles?

And because a few black men have been rapists does that mean all black people are trying to cover up a mass rape ring?
And because a few mexicans have murdered people does that mean all mexicans are trying to cover up a mass murder conspiracy?
And because a few jews have been robbers does that mean the entire jewish community is trying to hide a Mob ring?
And because a few muslims are terrorists does that mean all muslims are covering up terrorist conspiracies?
And because a few teachers have slept with their students does that mean that all school systems are secret organizations built for child molestation?

You really have no grounds here. You cannot judge a group of people as a whole on the actions of a few. Until you have information regarding a "lesson plan" in which all masons are taught or urged to be child molesters by the "upper elite" then please don't waste our time with frivolous accusations.

P.S. I am not a mason.



posted on Aug, 5 2006 @ 06:50 AM
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Originally posted by hexrain1
This forum is halarious. I love all the masons that are here to "dispell" myths.


Actually, most of us are here for the other forums. This just happens to be one we know something about, and can contribute to.



I find it interesting to see how many masons frequent these forums. All the posts I've seen by them try to discredit information given by those who raise questions about the society.


There are many of us in society. Wouldn't that mean a fair number of us find our way here?

If someone called you a paedophile, would you not take issue with that?



If there was no conspiracy, why are there so many masons on these forums trying to defend masonry from these claims.


Perhaps because we love our craft, and don't appreciate folks lying about it. Or being falsely accused of being paedophiles.



If someone insults me, I dont stand there to tell them why they are wrong for insulting me, I walk away because its not true.


I doubt that highly. No, I'm betting more you'd get in their face, sputtering something incoherant, and threatening a fistfight.



Now, on the subject of what they are hiding from us I know two things. These are instances where the information has been first hand, or at most second hand, so I wouldn't call it heresay.


Ok, dude... your friend is jerking you around, having a laugh at your expense. Or at least, that would be the case, if your friend existed (which I doubt).

If there was a shred of proof that masons had molested a child, in this day and age, folks would be up in arms over it... if for no other reason than paedophiles sell newspapers and get TV viewers to watch the news. But look... there aren't.

What does that tell you?




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