Help ATS with a contribution via PayPal:
learn more

On Patriotism - Why 11 Million Cubans Love Fidel

page: 1
0
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join

posted on Aug, 2 2006 @ 09:00 AM
link   
Cuba
Brief Data: 42,803 sq mi. The size of Tennessee. Pop. 2006 est. 11,382,820. Est. GDP per capita $3,000. Internet TLD .cu Calling code +53

In 1895, Tomás Estrada Palma and the poet José Martí, led a successful revolt against Spanish rule. Cuba was proclaimed an independent republic on July 15, 1895. Martí was killed shortly thereafter and has become Cuba’s undisputed national hero. Freedom was short lived however, the Spanish reasserted control over Cuba by 1897.

On February 15, 1898, the American battleship USS Maine was mysteriously blown up in Havana harbor, killing 266 men. See Note 1, below. Aggressive political forces in the US led by publisher William Randolph Hearst, favored US intervention in Cuba and war with Spain. The ugly head of an American empire had reared its head. Here was a golden opportunity not to let pass.

The popular war cry, “Remember the Maine” captured the public’s interest and distracted it from the many scandals of the Gilded Age. The US formerly accused Spain of blowing up the ship. Although Spain had no motive for attacking the Maine, and there was no evidence of Spanish culpability, a rising popular sentiment riding a wave of super-nationalism swept aside those who argued for the US to go slowly. But calmer heads were overruled in the well orchestrated rush to war. The US Congress cheerfully succumbed to the hysteria and passed a resolution calling for American intervention in Cuba. War was strongly favored by Pres. William McKinley, who eagerly complied.

The result was the Spanish-American War, in which U.S. forces landed in Cuba in June 1898 and quickly overcame Spanish resistance. In August a peace treaty was signed under which Spain agreed to withdraw from Cuba. Some people in America supported Cuban independence, while others argued for outright annexation, as we had done earlier in Texas. As a compromise, the McKinley administration placed Cuba under a 20-year U.S. trusteeship. The Cuban independence movement bitterly opposed this arrangement, but unlike the Philippines, where events followed a similar course, there was no outbreak of armed resistance.

Theodore Roosevelt, who became President in 1901 following Pres. McKinley's assassination, cancelled the 20-year trusteeship proposal and instead created the Republic of Cuba on May 20, 1902. The US wrote the new Cuban constitution. and the US wrote in the right for America to intervene in Cuban affairs when it determined it was proper to do so and kept the right to supervise Cuba’s finances and its foreign relations. So much for “spreading” democracy and nation building! This must be our first effort at a "puppet" state?

In 1906, following a disputed election, the US exercised its “right” of intervention. The country was placed under US Army occupation. Army General Leonard Wood was appointed Governor-General. He took charge of Cuba for three years. See Note 2, below. In 1908 José Miguel Gómez was elected President, ending the direct control of Cuba by the US but we retained our so-called “constitutional right” of on-going American supervision of Cuban affairs. Which "right" has never endeared us to Cubans of a nationalistic spirit. Say Hello, Ho Chi Minh!

Under terms of the notorious Platt Amendment - attached to an appropriations bill Congress knew TR would not veto - Cuba was forced to agree to a 99 year lease of the Guantánamo Bay site for a US Navy base with an US option to renew. Post-Fidel Cuba has never cashed the checks sent from the US in annual payment on the lease, and continues to protest the lease as having been obtained under duress. Castro’s Cuba wants to submit the matter to the World Court of Justice. The US refuses.

In 1925, on his election as president, Gerardo Machado y Morales, suspended the constitution. His regime had considerable local support. In August 1933, the Cuban army staged a coup which deposed Machado and installed Carlos Manuel de Céspedes as president. In September, a second coup led by Sergeant Fulgencio Batista overthrew Céspedes. In 1940 Batista ran for President and was elected with strong support from the labor unions. His administration carried out major social reforms and introduced a new progressive constitution. At the end of his term in 1944, Batista stood down and Ramón Grau was elected as president to succeed him.

In 1954, under pressure from the US, new elections were held. (The McCarthy-era US was displeased withe perceived communist influence in the labor unions.) Batista was re-elected President in a disputed election. His second regime unlike his first, was marked by severe corruption and widespread poverty. Batista's police force became infamous for harsh tactics and violence against the general population.

In 1956, a band of idealistic young nationalists, including Fidel Castro, started a resistance movement in the Sierra Maestra Mountains. Through 1957 and 1958 country-wide opposition to Batista grew. By late 1958, the rebels broke out of the Sierra Maestra launching a general insurrection. When the rebels captured Santa Clara, just east of Havana, Batista decided the struggle was futile and fled the country to exile in Portugal and Spain. Castro’s rebel forces entered the capital on 1 January 1959. Independence Day!

Fidel Alejandro Castro Ruz, born August 13, 1926. Fidel Castro became Prime Minister of Cuba in February 1959 and has held effective power in the country ever since. He was a strong nationalist, even a radical one and his victory was generally welcomed in Cuba and the US until the summary execution of 500 police officers and others accused of being agents of the Batista regime, aroused immediate disquiet.

During 1959 Castro’s government carried out popular measures such as land reform, the nationalization of public utilities and the nationalization of leading Cuban industries including the American Sugar Refining Company. Typical of Communist regimes - I’m tongue-in-cheek - he implemented a ruthless suppression of corruption, including closing down the gambling industry and evicting the American Mafiosi.

AND THEREIN LIES THE CUBAN PARADOX. OR IS IT DILEMMA? Where the US goes, the Mafia - drugs, gambling, prostitution - is soon to follow! Say No Thanks!

Under Castro, the expansion of publicly funded health care and education has been a cornerstone of Cuba’s domestic social agenda. Some attribute these policies for Cuba's relatively high Human Development Index. In contrast, look at Haiti, which has seen the intervention of the US more than 10 times, and which we occupied from 1918 to 1933. Haiti is still the poorest nation in the Western Hemisphere. Hmm?

Beginning in 1989, and by 1991, coinciding with the decline and fall of the USSR, Castro’s priorities shifted from supporting foreign interventions to partnering with regional socialist figures such as Hugo Chávez in Venezuela and Evo Morales in Bolivia. Data from: en.wikipedia.org...

Note 1. Contemporary investigation of the hull of the Maine indicate a not uncommon coal dust explosion was the most likely cause of the loss of the ship and crew. This conclusion is supported by an on-site examination of the hull showing evidence of an outward force indicative of an internal explosion, rather than an inward force pointing to an external source of the explosion.

Note 2. Leonard Wood (1860 -1927) was the only Army physician who also served as the Chief of Staff of the United States Army. In 1898, while serving as a doctor in Cuba, he was awarded the Medal of Honor for carrying dispatches 100 miles through hostile territory and for commanding an infantry detachment whose officers had been lost. He also was Governor-General of Cuba from 1906 to 1908. In 1920, then retired General Wood was an unsuccessful candidate for the Republican presidential nomination which was won by Warren G. Harding.



[edit on 8/2/2006 by donwhite]




posted on Aug, 2 2006 @ 11:23 AM
link   
I hate to tell you this but most cuban refugees hate castro and cannot eait for him to die. In fact alot of cubans hate castro.



posted on Aug, 2 2006 @ 11:38 AM
link   
It has to do with who has put up with Castro in Cuba all these years that he has been a dictator . . .

After Castro took over the Island most of the exiles were the rich and well to do, while mostly poor and Castro supporters stay in the Island.

These exiles lost everything and had to start over in the US.

They occurs hate Castro and wants him death . . .that the sentiment has been pass through their generations since exile.

But they are not the ones that have suffered under his rule, the ones that support Castro has not choice they has learned to live under him and they actually can no see light after him.

Yes they support him and even love him its their Icon.

Exiles has found a better live in the US and actually many of them don't even remember what it was to be under Castro's rule.



posted on Aug, 2 2006 @ 11:42 AM
link   
Very well written Don. Thanks.

Feel free to drop some knowledge on the little thread I started over yonder:

politics.abovetopsecret.com...'



posted on Aug, 2 2006 @ 05:58 PM
link   


posted by XphilesPhan

I hate to tell you but most Cuban refugees hate Castro and cannot wait for him to die. In fact a lot of Cubans hate Castro


Uhh, X/P, would "refugees" be the operative word here?

And, how many Americans do you think hate Bush43?



posted on Aug, 2 2006 @ 06:13 PM
link   


posted by marg6043

“ . . After Castro took over most of the exiles were the rich and well to do, while mostly poor and Castro supporters stay in the Island. But they are not the ones that have suffered under his rule, the ones that support Castro had no choice they have learned to live under him . . Yes they support him and even love him - its their Icon . . Exiles found a better life in the US and many of them don't remember what it was to be under Castro's rule. [Edited by Don W]


I saw one poster refer to a medical doctor who fled from Cuba rather than to practice his healing arts amongst the poor and dispossessed of Cuba. I say, Good Riddance! I’m sure he does not appreciate that Fidel could have had him (and others of like ilk) shot. But instead, Fidel let him and 200,000 others “bail out” of their country. Now with Federal aid they get rich and famous in Little Havana - Miami - and bad mouth the man who did more for them than any living person! Is that a new definition for “gratitude?”



posted on Aug, 2 2006 @ 08:35 PM
link   
It makes you wonder what will become of Cuba if Castro dies and US has his way and establish a more democratic government with a coporate agenda.

Who will benefit the most . . . natives Cubans that never left the Island . . .

Or . . . many of the ones that are Cuban American waiting to go back and make money in the Island.

Sometimes progress bring a better life but most of the time it bring nothing but hart aches for the ones that will have to endure a hoard of opportunist taking their Island away from them.

Because things can work out if progress is brought a littler bit at a time no all at once and cause a culture shock.



posted on Aug, 3 2006 @ 04:25 AM
link   

Originally posted by donwhite
I saw one poster refer to a medical doctor who fled from Cuba rather than to practice his healing arts amongst the poor and dispossessed of Cuba. I say, Good Riddance! I’m sure he does not appreciate that Fidel could have had him (and others of like ilk) shot. But instead, Fidel let him and 200,000 others “bail out” of their country. Now with Federal aid they get rich and famous in Little Havana - Miami - and bad mouth the man who did more for them than any living person! Is that a new definition for “gratitude?”

Let's see...
"I am Fidel Castro and I could have you shot! You better be grateful to me!"

You have a strange idea of things, donwhite. A murderer allows someone to live, and that makes him a great man?



posted on Aug, 3 2006 @ 08:42 AM
link   


posted by bombers8



posted by donwhite

“ . . Fidel let 200,000 “bail out” of their country. Now rich in Little Havana bad mouthing the man who did more for them . . Is that a new definition for “gratitude?”


Let's see..."I could have you shot! You better be grateful to me!" You have a strange idea of things, donwhite. A murderer allows someone to live, and that makes him a great man? [Edited by Don W]


At the risk of being trite, I’m told making revolutions is a lot like making sausage. It is not a pheasant sight to behold. But in a more serious vein, you can be sure people of privilege and power do not go quietly into the night. I do not know how many people were killed in the process of the American Revolution of 1775 to 17781 or 1783. I have heard several thousands were forced out of the country and went either to Canada of back to England. Leaving all their property behind in either case. Some, I don’t know how many, were subjected to tar and feathers. Usually done by a mob and often resulting in the death of the victim from infections of burned skin.

I have read the Reign of Terror of the French Revolution saw 3,000 people guillotined. For me, the issue is not so much how many people died in the revolution but how many were put to death after the revolution and for what cause.

To my best knowledge, the “500 odd policemen and others” of the former Batista regime who were executed - perhaps summarily? - were the only ones so dealt with by Castro. Any other executions would have been for crimes and after due process. Aside: I wonder if Fidel had as many put to death as Bush43 who ordered 154 executions in 6 years in Texas?

The following is a partial list of countries that have the death penalty in place:
Afghan, Bahamas, Bangladesh, Barbados, Belize, Chad, China, Congo, Cuba, Egypt, Eritrea, Gabon, Ghana, Guinea, Guyana, India, Iran, Iraq, Jamaica, Japan, Korea, North and South, Kuwait, Lebanon, Nigeria, Pakistan, Palestinian Authority, St. Christopher, St. Lucia, Saudi Arabia, Singapore, Sudan, Syria, Trinidad and Tobago, UAE, USA, and Vietnam.
See web.amnesty.org...



posted on Aug, 3 2006 @ 11:40 AM
link   

Originally posted by donwhite
But in a more serious vein, you can be sure people of privilege and power do not go quietly into the night.

This still doesn't explain how refraining from murder makes Castro a great man?


To my best knowledge, the “500 odd policemen and others” of the former Batista regime who were executed - perhaps summarily? - were the only ones so dealt with by Castro. Any other executions would have been for crimes and after due process. Aside: I wonder if Fidel had as many put to death as Bush43 who ordered 154 executions in 6 years in Texas?

Yes, high crimes and misdemeanors, such as being homosexual, eh donwhite?

Some studies report that up to several thousands of political opponents have been killed, primarily during the first decade of Castro's leadership;[96] however exact numbers are not known. Some Cubans labeled "counterrevolutionaries", "fascists", or "CIA operatives" have been imprisoned in extremely poor conditions without trial. [97] Military Units to Aid Production, or UMAP's, were labor camps established in 1965, according to Che Guevara, for “people who have committed crimes against revolutionary morals” as well as Castro's concept of "social deviants," including homosexuals and AIDS victims, in order to work "counter-revolutionary" influences out of certain segments of the population. [98] Professor Marifeli Pérez Stable, a Cuban American who once supported the revolution, reflects on the costs of the Cuban revolution. "[There were] thousands of executions, forty, fifty thousand political prisoners. The treatment of political prisoners, with what we today know about human rights and the international norms governing human rights ... it is legitimate to raise questions about possible crimes against humanity in Cuba." [99]Castro acknowledges that Cuba holds political prisoners, but argues that Cuba is justified because these prisoners are not jailed because of their political beliefs, but have been convicted of "counter-revolutionary" crimes, including bombings.

en.wikipedia.org...

As an aside, I wonder if it is possible for you to post on any topic without resorting to maligning the POTUS in the process?


The following is a partial list of countries that have the death penalty in place:
Afghan, Bahamas, Bangladesh, Barbados, Belize, Chad, China, Congo, Cuba, Egypt, Eritrea, Gabon, Ghana, Guinea, Guyana, India, Iran, Iraq, Jamaica, Japan, Korea, North and South, Kuwait, Lebanon, Nigeria, Pakistan, Palestinian Authority, St. Christopher, St. Lucia, Saudi Arabia, Singapore, Sudan, Syria, Trinidad and Tobago, UAE, USA, and Vietnam.

Sorry, donwhite, I don't see the relevance of that paragraph.



posted on Aug, 3 2006 @ 11:50 AM
link   
Yeah the Cubans love Fidel so much that many are crossing the Straits of Florida to the U.S. in the name of Fidel Castro. And many of them are rich that they use even scraped cars and trucks to be used as a floating boat to get to the mainland. Yep they love him very much.


And comparing to Bush, do you see Americans desperate to get the hell out?



posted on Aug, 3 2006 @ 11:59 AM
link   

Originally posted by donwhite


posted by XphilesPhan

I hate to tell you but most Cuban refugees hate Castro and cannot wait for him to die. In fact a lot of Cubans hate Castro


Uhh, X/P, would "refugees" be the operative word here?

And, how many Americans do you think hate Bush43?


So I take it you think Castro is a great guy?



posted on Aug, 3 2006 @ 12:35 PM
link   
deltaboy

Remember that is not only Cubans the ones to come to the land of bread and honey or that is in the middle east. . . when the God of the Israelis told them to take the land of the Palestine.


Sometimes I get confuse you know.


Well you already know that the vision of a land of Gold and opportunity brings people from all over not only Cubans and if my mind is not playing tricks a lot of immigrants wants to make money or at least come to American and live out of the government.

[edit on 3-8-2006 by marg6043]



posted on Aug, 3 2006 @ 12:58 PM
link   

Originally posted by marg6043
Well you already know that the vision of a land of Gold and opportunity brings people from all over not only Cubans and if mind is not playing tricks a lot of immigrants wants to make money or at least come to American and live out of the government.


How about a couple of years ago where dozens of Cubans crash a bus into the Mexican embassy and were seeking for asylum? Were they seeking political asylum from any country that grants asylum like Mexico? Or they went for the wrong embassy (the U.S. don't have one in Cuba currently)?



posted on Aug, 3 2006 @ 01:05 PM
link   

Originally posted by deltaboy

How about a couple of years ago where dozens of Cubans crash a bus into the Mexican embassy and were seeking for asylum?


Perhaps they wanted Mexico because the open borders with the US . . .


My Island is full of many Cubans, Dominican, Hitians and even Chinese lately, they also see my Island as the doorway to the US that is something we native Puertorricans has known for a long time.

[edit on 3-8-2006 by marg6043]



posted on Aug, 3 2006 @ 01:12 PM
link   

Originally posted by marg6043

Perhaps they wanted Mexico because the open borders with the US . . .


Perhaps...but then not everyone came to America just because of the land of opportunity. Many have long to see their homeland again, like for example the Cuban Americans, or the Vietnamese Americans (mostly South Vietnamese).



posted on Aug, 3 2006 @ 01:16 PM
link   

Originally posted by deltaboy
Perhaps...but then not everyone came to America just because of the land of opportunity. Many have long to see their homeland again, like for example the Cuban Americans, or the Vietnamese Americans (mostly South Vietnamese).



Perhaps some will love to go back and be with the families they left behind.

But is also a big majority waiting for the opportunity to plunder the Island for profits.



posted on Oct, 18 2006 @ 01:04 PM
link   
Most just want the oppourtunity to go home. Plundering the island is not on the "to do" list, not that there is a whole lot to plunder after all these years of Fidel.



posted on Oct, 22 2006 @ 06:05 PM
link   
OHHHHH, My God!!!


I wish i was in the mood for arguing...


And you're right , FF, only aspirins wouldnt do the trick with this thread, this calls for MORPHINE.

What a load of crap. No disrespect of course, to the author who i'm sure spends his waking hours reading all about Cuban dissinformation .May I make a suggestion? Why not move to Cuba? Paradise is just a few miles away. Please GO.

I'll come back when my headache is gone and sort out this (chuckle) thread.

Edited for spelling.

[edit on 22-10-2006 by dgtempe]



posted on Oct, 22 2006 @ 10:28 PM
link   

Originally posted by donwhite
...........
During 1959 Castro’s government carried out popular measures such as land reform, the nationalization of public utilities and the nationalization of leading Cuban industries including the American Sugar Refining Company. Typical of Communist regimes - I’m tongue-in-cheek -


Sir, i don't know who you are or where you get your information, some of it is true, but then it has some well placed lies and exagerations which i guess anyone who is not from Cuba and has not seen what is really happening there, and who doesn't know the history of the regime of castro, might be inclined to believe. It is obvious this is nothing more than propaganda.

All castro did was to take over everything that exists in Cuba. Everyone in Cuba has suffered because of this. The government of Cuba, under the rulership of castro, can order people to leave their lands and homes, whatever might be left of them since most of the land was confiscated for "la revolucion", and they can be placed in a house smaller and in worse condition than the one they were made to leave. Imagine your family being ordered to leave your house and you find yourself going to a smaller house, were 2-4 people have to sleep together. I am not talking about the regime confiscating mansions, just regular houses which they might see fit to confiscate.

People in Cuba can only eat, drink and # what castro says is alright... Have you ever heard of "la libreta"? It is a small book which people in Cuba have, if they want to be able to buy food and other necessities, when there are any, and tells them what they can buy, and how much of those products they can buy, "if" there is anything in the store to buy...because at the end you have to buy the food, and anything else you might need, nothing is given freely by the government...

Most people in Cuba do not "love castro"... but you are led to believe so because there are demonstrations sponsored by the government where people are literally herded, including children from schools, just for such demonstrations or to listen to the maniac talk for 4 hours or more.

If people do not leave their jobs when such demonstrations begin, or if they do not show their "patriotismo por fidel" their names are written down, they can lose their jobs or will be harrased by castro's thugs, yes he does have thugs in many neighborhoods. The Cuban people are a lot worse now than they were under batista, he was not a good man, but fidel and his thugs are 1000 times worse.


Originally posted by donwhite
he implemented a ruthless suppression of corruption, including closing down the gambling industry and evicting the American Mafiosi.
AND THEREIN LIES THE CUBAN PARADOX. OR IS IT DILEMMA? Where the US goes, the Mafia - drugs, gambling, prostitution - is soon to follow! Say No Thanks!


He implemented his own corruption, gambling, drugs, and prostitution. Now things are a lot worse, there is children prostitution like never before in Cuba, and many women have to use their bodies to be able to feed themselves and their families, and the police doesn't do anything about it because is part of what "brings the rich people from all over the world to Cuba"....


Originally posted by donwhite
Under Castro, the expansion of publicly funded health care and education has been a cornerstone of Cuba’s domestic social agenda.


"Publicly funded health care and education"?... Oh wait, you must mean the work camps that children since an early age have to attend every summer to "pay for the education they recieve" until they graduate at whatever age it might be. In these work camps children harvest fruits and vegetable that they can't eat and will never see the Cuban "bodegas" (stores). That food is to spread "la revolucion" to other countries by selling most of it to other Communist, or revolutionary countries.

You should know that under Cuban law the children are pretty much the property of the state. Under Code of the Child, Law No. 16, the education of every child in Cuba is to "develop Communist personality and any ideas or influence contrary to this goal has to be fought. The Communist regime of Cuba can take children away if they think that the parents are hindering the children Communist formation.


Originally posted by donwhite
Some attribute these policies for Cuba's relatively high Human Development Index. In contrast, look at Haiti, which has seen the intervention of the US more than 10 times, and which we occupied from 1918 to 1933. Haiti is still the poorest nation in the Western Hemisphere. Hmm?
.....................
[edit on 8/2/2006 by donwhite]


You have got to be kidding.... All the information that people like yourself get from Cuba comes directly from "the govenrment of Cuba".... Tourists have certain areas where they can go but they are advised not to leave those areas, part of it is because then they will see what the real Cuba is all about...

Cuba having a "relative high human development"?.....
You have got to be kidding....


"Your government's response to The Independent Libraries in Cuba Project clearly violates basic human rights to intellectual freedom.... In persecuting and harassing members of the Cuban library community, your government is striking at the heart of the principles espoused and acted upon by librarians worldwide."
- Letter to President Castro from Kathleen De Long, President of the Canadian Association of College and University Libraries.

OVERVIEW: The general human rights situation in Cuba has been investigated by numerous human rights organizations in recent years. Among the groups which have published reports on Cuba are Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, the United Nations Human Rights Commission, Pax Christi Holland, and the Inter-American Human Rights Commission. The Links section of this database allows immediate access to the websites of these organizations. A concise but thorough overview is "Cuba's Repressive Machinery" by Human Rights Watch (www.hrw.org/reports/1999/cuba).

www.friendsofcubanlibraries.org...

[edit on 22-10-2006 by Muaddib]





new topics

top topics



 
0
<<   2  3  4 >>

log in

join