400,000 Muslims in Texas Equal 400 potential Terrorists, page 4


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reply posted on 27-7-2006 @ 09:27 PM by AbuMusaab
Originally posted by hogtie
AbuMusaab, just let it all out. I am eating this up.

I'll give you something. Let's say that I agree with you about Saudi Arabia to a point. Oil sales helps to prop up the govt there, but remember it is the house of Saud there that is in charge of reforming or not. Not the US. Anyway, I'll go along with you on that. What happens if there is reform? More theocracy? Wahabi becomes mainstream? What will the excuse be then to continue the spread of Islam by the sword? See, what some of us see, and what others don't, is that this isn't about oil, land, freedom. None of that. It is about spreading the Word.

I'll tell you this much. What the middle east has seen up to now is a war based on politics. The US has not been pushed yet, not really. So rise up when the time is right. You have no understanding of the real culture of America. Not the America that lives outside of NY and LA, and not the indoctrinated at universities. If it is brought on the ground inside our borders, it will end in such fury as the Koran could have no words for. The cells will rise but once. And don't forget the conservative Christians. There you will have people fighting for their safety, way of life, and for their faith.

One thing the world has always missed about the US. We have a tremendous capacity for violence. What the world has seen up to this point has been civil and restrained. Force the US to take the gloves off, and Islam may but be a memory.

Tell me. What would Julaladin Rumi have to say about all of this? I think he would just laugh, and say that none of it mattered. You have missed the Message.


The Word does not need the sword to be spread, and it is forbidden to be spread as such. However, if attacked, and attacked, it is our DUTY to push back, and force capitulation for the safety of the believers. Islam is the fastest growing religion on the planet today. And no one is forcing these people to follow God. They are finding out on their own. It is not uncommon for Christians to come to my work, or my home and ask us to come to their Church. We do not even have to go out and seek people. People come to the God on their own by God's will.

I love the never ending arrogance about how America has not been pushed, or is not displaying it's full capablility. As Bush said, "Bring it on!" Already, you have been basically defeated in Iraq, alhamdulillah. We are just waiting for the final withdrawal after some pathetic face-saving attempt is pulled.

If the Khilafah is someday re-established, insha'Allah, it will not seek to cause any violence against America, unless America brings violence to it first. It would be completely against Islam to become the aggressor. The Qur'an is very clear.

Just a couple verses on the subject. There are many, many more.


" GOD advocates justice, charity, and regarding the relatives. And He forbids evil, vice, and transgression. He enlightens you, that you may take heed.(16:90)

"If they resort to peace, so shall you, and put your trust in GOD. He is the Hearer, the Omniscient."(8:61).



America will not be defeated militarily, but, insha'Allah, it will be defeated.


reply posted on 28-7-2006 @ 11:10 AM by marg6043
Shots you know who is Daniel Pipes, Right? I read the link you provided. . .

Just to make you aware of his background and his way of thinking . . . he is considerate an extremist in his views . . . in case you don’t know.

He has shown his displeasure in any way he can about Islam and muslins.

His book "Why I Am Not a Muslim" was called by the National Catholic Reporter in 95, "the literary equivalent of hate radio...literary warfare against Islam".

www.cair-net.org...


Daniel Pipes says the only path to Middle East peace will come through a total Israeli military victory. So why has President Bush nominated him to the board of the government's leading peace think-tank?


I can not trust the views and opinions of somebody that careless of what nations that are Islamic and people that are muslin represent.

US has always have his own militia groups and extremist in one way or other, now they are Tag terrorist we have them and we always will.

Because people that opposed policies pertaining administrations and political views will always be part of a nations make over.

Now Muslin Americans are supposed to be the ones to look forward because their conversion to a religion that is view as linked to most terrorist in the middle east are supposed to be high risk for terrorist acts in the US..

Perhaps the black community in America than accounts for the most muslin converts would see this in a different light.

And as for Pipes well you should research more in his extremist views.

After all even the president thinks that he could make a Great peace keeper in the affairs of the middle east .

Sorry Shots but . . . I agree that we have a possible leak of terrorist through our borders but I can not possibly be influence by the propaganda of Anti muslin resentment that is been pushed for religious and political agendas.


President Bush nominated Pipes to the board of the United States Institute of Peace, a Congressionally sponsored think tank dedicated to "the peaceful resolution of international conflicts."


Incredible that our own president will support and endorse a person with such narrow way of thinking clouded by probably hate against Islam and muslin. . .

www.motherjones.com...


reply posted on 28-7-2006 @ 11:59 AM by shots
Originally posted by marg6043
Shots you know who is Daniel Pipes, Right? I read the link you provided. . .


www.cair-net.org...



Of course the link you furnished is going to paint him in a completely different and bad light they are pro-Islam.

But that does not mean he is totally wacked out.


reply posted on 28-7-2006 @ 06:03 PM by Two Steps Forward
Several points to bring up in general here.

1. On the identity of Allah -- it is Muslim belief that Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the same God, that Moses, Jesus, and Mohammed were all prophets or messengers of God, and that Mohammed's message supplanted that of Jesus as Jesus' supplanted that of Moses. However, you will not find agreement with much of this coming from Jews or Christians.

Being none of the above myself, I can only say this. All Gods of human theology are metaphors for a Reality that is beyond human understanding, and can be grasped only dimly. In that sense, not only do Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the same God, but all religious people everywhere do, including polytheists and others completely outside the Abrahamic lineage. Each such conception is a metaphor for the Unknowable, and the Reality underlying each is One.

In practice, however, different religions = different Gods, or anyway different conceptions of the divine. In that respect, Jews, Christians, and Muslims do not worship the same God, as we can see by what each God requires of His worshipers; JHVH demands to be worshiped by Jewish rites, the Holy Trinity by Christian ones, and Allah by Muslim ones. Christians have religious artwork in their churches and (in most denominations) drink alcohol, both of which are forbidden to Muslims. Jews do not proselytize, while Christians and Muslims both do. And so on.

2. Regarding possible home-grown Muslim terrorists in the U.S. -- we must recognize that Islam is only one part, and not the most important part, of what makes a Muslim terrorist. There are teachings within Islam (not uncontroverted teachings, to be sure, but they are there) which encourage violence against unbelievers under certain conditions. But without the seething anger that pervades not only the Middle East but in fact most of the world's less-affluent population, anger at the exploitation practiced by the West and especially by the U.S., those teachings would be seeds on poor soil, and would most likely be ignored in favor of others that hint the other direction. (Remember that the Q'ran, like most sacred texts, can be selectively used to justify almost any behavior. Allah is both a God of war and a God of peace and mercy -- depending on which passages one reads and which one ignores.)

The exploitation by the West is not religiously or culturally motivated. It is purely a matter of power and economics. Thus, Muslims living in the United States are not victimized by it, only those living in the Middle East. For American Muslims, the West's behavior towards much of the world might as well not be happening, except insofar as they sympathize with Muslims living elsewhere (some of whom, to be sure, might be their relatives).

While, as the statistics show, Muslims who actually take part in terrorist activities are a tiny minority, they are also the tip of the iceberg. For every insurgent or suicide bomber, there are very likely millions of Muslims who would not take things that far, but still are angry. It is from that much larger base of anger that the tiny fringe of terrorists arise. American Muslims do not share that anger to anything like the same degree, and so we should not expect Muslim terrorist movements to arise in the United States itself among our native Muslims.

UNLESS, that is, we become so paranoid about the possibility that we subject Muslims to persecution. Then, I believe they might become a good deal more miffed, and rightly so.


reply posted on 29-7-2006 @ 09:01 AM by shots
Found this in today's news and it is very sad to see that the violence from the middle east against Israel has moved to the US.



Mercury News

One person was dead and five others were hospitalized Friday in a shooting at the Jewish Federation of Greater Seattle building in downtown Seattle by a man who declared he was ``angry at Israel.''

Seattle police later arrested the alleged gunman, who reportedly had walked into the building and started shooting.

.......

According to Amy Wasser-Simpson, the vice president for planning and community services for the Jewish Federation, the man told staff members, "I'm a Muslim American; I'm angry at Israel,'' and then began shooting. Wasser-Simpson said she heard the account from staff members who witnessed the shootings.



Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


The one thing the story does not mention is the individual was a converted Muslim or one from an Arab Nation.

Edit to add it would appear he was not a convert, but a natural born individual of foreign descent.



Isolated case? Perhaps, but it does prove there are fanatics living in the US.


[edit on 7/29/2006 by shots]


reply posted on 29-7-2006 @ 01:59 PM by Beachcoma
Originally posted by Two Steps Forward
Several points to bring up in general here.

1. On the identity of Allah -- it is Muslim belief that Jews, Christians, and Muslims all worship the same God, that Moses, Jesus, and Mohammed were all prophets or messengers of God, and that Mohammed's message supplanted that of Jesus as Jesus' supplanted that of Moses. However, you will not find agreement with much of this coming from Jews or Christians.

[...]


Maybe coz those who do have converted?

Anyway, on your second point -- I fully agree with pretty much all of what you've said. I've been saying it all this while, it's a socio-economic thing.

I mean take me for example. Yes I am muslim and yes I am angry at what the Western powers seem to be doing to my fellow muslims in the middle-east. But I don't feel the urge to "take things into my own hands" so to speak. Not this (referring to the latest post by shots) way. Not through force or violence. And why is this?

Well, I'm not feeling oppressed, I'm not starving or having too little to eat. Plus I've been educated well, taught to be civil, though being a human animal one can't really get rid of emotions so tempers may flair once and so often. But not to the point of physical harm. So all in all I'm not physically or psychologically feeling any pinch.

Besides, the Middle-East is a far away place to me. The only thing I've got connected with it is that I share the same religion with a lot of the people being affected by the Western powers' military-economic policies there.

Now, the minute I become affected directly by their meddling I might not be such a pacifist anymore. Would you just sit back and let an outsider do the same to you? I didn't think so.
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