i am disgusted

First off this thread is from 2003 member Shadowhart hasn't posted since 2003. There is no way to know if Shadowhart is this Jesse person or someone who wanted to share his thoughts that you somehow feel relate to this jesse person, regardless of the situation, there is no need to attack or accuse a poster of being someone, when that poster is no where around and haven't been around to defend himself or confirm or deny what you say.

If you want to start a thread on Jesse Macbeth, feel free to do so, but don't go around accusing members. Present your facts, thoughts and opinions and let readers come to their own opinions.

Shadowhart is the same person as IVAW VET, who is Jesse Macbeth.

Have a look through this thread and hit some of the links i supplied. You will soon find out that he is the same person.

This story is all over the net as we speak. Like i said, hit the links..............

AND....
Nuf said.

"The truth shall set you free"

very sorry it is hard to live with the war after they have used you for there game of greed.there is a point to defend life but to be the invaders and push a gun in a kids face yes i must see your point.if everyone had a bucket for all wars of mankind threw history the buckets would be overflowing in blood.buckets of blood you see everyones blood is the same we just been told by the some it not.........

America should help it's self.

Originally posted by worldwatcher
First off this thread is from 2003 member Shadowhart hasn't posted since 2003. There is no way to know if Shadowhart is this Jesse person

I just have to read the posts to know they are the same. People's writing style is easy to spot, they make consistent mistakes and follow the same pattern of argument development, therefore, it's easy to see if someone is using a different identity to support themselves (much like the old "Invincible sunk in '82" thread).

Read Shadowhart, read ivaw vet. They're the same person. I wonder what would happen if an ip search was done...

Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV
Read Shadowhart, read ivaw vet. They're the same person. I wonder what would happen if an ip search was done...

Easy, They are the same person as i mentioned before. An IP search would only confirm what we know already.

To be honest, it took me hours to find this out. IP, or no IP, this guy is the same.

Sorry to post this you guys, but..

even if this guy is a fake as we all suspect.. i come across day after day after day.shellshocked iraqi vets who cry into their beer because they were indoctrinated into shooting civillians.. even kids just because the kids were wearing a football strip that maybe beat their team in a football match,,

i,m talking mowing down a 7yr old kid because he happened to wear a manchester united strip who beat a team from a navy guys town

i have seen this in four different countries already,, and you know what???

it,s not the poor servicemens fault as much as i.d like to bust these guys up..

it,s drilled into them the same way the us used psyops against the vietnamese..

learning to treat them as subhuman/animals

thats the real reason so many people went home with psychological problems from the last three wars.. you thinks it was an anti-chem attack injections... think again..

Hmmm, interesting. The week of cultural awareness training I went through prior to the deployment specifically mentioned not gunning down kids for beating me at football. Of course, with my absence of skill, this would make most people a target...

Sorry for the humour, but really. Teaching military personnel to treat people as sub-human? Give me a break. I've been on a lot of overseas deployments, and each one involves cultural awareness training (I'm Australian, but I'm confident the same is true for the US). I've also been on "non-warlike" operations (peace-keeping, humanitarian assistance), where you have to get on with the civilian population. And these ops also involved US serviceman. Yes, there are people who are not fit to wear the uniform, yes there have been terrible crimes committed, and I hope they track down, try, and punish appropriately those who stray outside the bounds of society. But to categorise all military members as being capable of doing things such as this...way off the mark.

As for those who seem to have a problem with us pointing out that this guy is likely the same person as IVAW, who is Jesse MacBeth, how about the same need for rigourous justification of the statements contained in the start of this thread? How about looking into the fact that the person, if the same, violates the T&C of this site by having two IDs? Compared to some of the attacks that have been leveled at those contributing to this site, I thought the discussion regarding shadowhart's identity was valid, within the spirit and letter of the law of ATS, and wholly appropriate considering the ongoing saga that is MacBeth. It is denying ignorance, it has used sound analytical technique, and it minimises the damage that such posts cause to those who legitimately support the anti-war movement (though I sit closer to the other camp by supporting the troops, but not the justification for invasion), balanced and fair debate on both sides is needed. Allowing the anti-war supporters to get behind posts such as these only hurts their cause, so the benefit in many way is for them.

And I haven't seen a rebuttal from IVAW and Shadowhart as yet.

I went through Marine Training, Scout Sniper School and advanced hand to hand as well as Firearms Instructors school and none of that was part of my training. I have been overseas extensively in the USMC and personally and two tours in combat.

Never even heard of that.

civilization imparts a "fear of aggression" into "the normal man's emotional makeup." The obvious solution was to train soldiers to fire their weapons in combat, overcoming their instincts. Marshall claimed that as a result of his studies the army altered its training and the "ratio of fire" improved. By the time of the Korean War (which Marshall also studied), he reported that the ratio of fire had increased to 55 percent from reportedly 15-25% during ww2

homepage.ntlworld.com...

The search and destroy policy teaches GIs not to value human life and property. It doesn’t teach them in their minds to go commit a war crime. But what we’re saying — what I say is that atrocities in Vietnam, the torture of prisoners and so on, is a logical consequence of our inhuman policy in Vietnam.

This spectrum of dehumanization of which I’m speaking might be seen to start out at the level at which the Vietnamese can be thought of — as they are by practically all Americans in Vietnam — as being of no consequence, as being subhuman in some sense.

I just want to say that obviously this process adds to the GIs confusion and to his mounting fury and frustration. As his fury and frustration mount, his leaders can permit only one outlet, revenge and vengeance against the subhuman gooks, any gook

Accordingly, even South Vietnamese soldiers are devalued as human beings
Their hospitals are given blood considered unfit for American usage, morphine, is not wasted on them, the saying is, “No gook is ever an emergency case''

One bunker — [4265c3] some women and children came out. A man went to flip a grenade in and it bounced off the jamb — the door jamb of the bunker-back into the women and children, wounding them — wounding two women and two children — one of the women quite seriously.
Our company commander refused to allow the medic with us at the time to give the woman treatment.

www.guerrillanews.com...

There have been three occasions when allied troops have been directly connected to the bombing incidents which are invariably blamed either on foreign jihadis or Sunni resistance fighters. The first was the famous incident in Basra where two British paramilitaries were caught disguised as Arabs with a truck-full of explosives in their vehicle.

Bombing mosques and civilians and blaming it on insurgents to justify their presence

HMMM. doesnt sound like much regard for civilian life to me..
Try taking a look at this too

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Then tell me if this is normal social behaviour or the result of training to disregard the ''enemy'' as worthless and subhuman

Try having a chat with dgtempe about her husband,s experiences

I see this day in day out. I have no reason whatsoever to disbelieve these guys,why? what would their agenda be in telling me a load??

i made one booboo though. the guy who shot the 7yr old palestinian manchester united supporter was on foot patrol in israel.It was a female squaddie on patrol with him who told me about it.she is still trying to get the guy court martialled but it is being brushed under the rug at every corner

Try posting your comments here.
I think it could have more relevance in this thread to be honest.

the world needs to stop arguing and start negotiating.

the united states isn't getting anywhere with it's chest beating and hollering. islamic extremism is HURTING followers of islam that don't want anything to do with those crackpots.

can't we just talk about the problems and cooperate!

THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

ok, i'm done