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'More Cures' author casts doubt on his own book

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posted on Jul, 18 2006 @ 12:08 PM
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NEW YORK -- Kevin Trudeau, the million-selling author, infomercial star and convicted felon, swears that his new health guide, "More Natural 'Cures' Revealed," is 100 percent true.

Make that 100 percent true "in essence."

"My point is I don't want to be caught in what is true, what isn't true, what is opinion, what is an idea," Trudeau, whose self-published "Natural Cures 'They' Don't Want You to Know About," thrived despite his criminal past and other legal run-ins, told The Associated Press in a recent interview.



Trudeau's TV spots have brought him wealth and trouble. In 2004, he reached a settlement with the Federal Trade Commission banning him from infomercials "that advertise any type of product, service, or program to the public, except for truthful infomercials for informational publications," according to the FTC.

"This ban is meant to shut down an infomercial empire that has misled American consumers for years," the FTC said when the settlement was announced, referring to various other products Trudeau has endorsed over the years, including an infomercial the FTC said gave misleading information on coral calcium as a cancer cure.

Trudeau was able to air infomercials for "Natural Cures" and says a new round would soon come out for "More Natural Cures." He alleges that 900 "independent stations" will show them, but could not identify a specific channel when asked by the AP. An FTC official, Heather Hippsley, said the commission will be monitoring any advertisements.

"He cannot be misleading about the content of the book," said Hippsley, an assistant director in the FTC's division of advertising practices. "And he can't use infomercials to sell specific products outside of his book."


This is not a "slam on Mr. Trudeau or alternative treatments" thread.

WRT natural cures, can a consumer make an educated decision about a health treatment promoted by a person like Mr. Trudeau with a checkered past of deception convictions?

Using Mr. Trudeau's own words quoted above, how is a consumer to know what is true and what has been made up for this book?

By publishing a book in the style that he has, isn't Mr. Trudeau hurting the alternative therapy market more than he is helping it?

I believe in a mix of alternative and mainstream medical treatment, but personally, this guy turns me off.

JDub




posted on Jul, 18 2006 @ 04:52 PM
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I would have thought by now that people would realise this man is a crook, pedlding snake oil to those in terminal conditions which have no real cure or treatment.

Mariella



posted on Jul, 18 2006 @ 05:54 PM
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No, there are some local folks that believe in every word of his first book but I haven't talked to anyone about this new 2nd book.

If someone is desperate enough they will pin their hopes on anything.

JDub



posted on Jul, 18 2006 @ 05:59 PM
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Trudeau is such a scumbag!
All he does is take other people's research and slap his name on it.
Well, and he makes stuff up and sells that too.
Names names?
Yeah right.
Totally a crook!
I'm studying to be in the nutrition field as a career, and guys like him give guys like me a bad reputation.



posted on Jul, 19 2006 @ 10:07 AM
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are just sore cuz Kevin Trudeau doesn't list chemotherapy as a cure for cancer.



No seriously, people that are owned part and parcel by BIG PHARMA simply don't have the credibility to be able to level the type of allegations that are being leveled against entrepreneur Trudeau.

Maybe instead of 'In God We Trust' we should switch to our national motto to 'In a Horrific and Painful Death by OverMedication by BIG PHARMA We Trust'.

THAT would be a lot closer to the truth.

MD types find it necessary to continuously attack Alternative Medicine...

Give it up.


Does anyone have the link to the influence-peddling, corrupt Italian doctors with their sweetheart BIG PHARMA deal?

Now that is a bunch of snake-oil salesman...




posted on Jul, 19 2006 @ 12:04 PM
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Golemina -

If you will read my post, I tried to bring out the fact that he admits part of the book is fiction but doesn't want to get into a discussion of what is factual and what is fictional.

I am not bashing alternative medicine with this, I constructed a post about one individual that I distrust because I have seen all of his infomercials late at night and I have flipped through his first book when I was at a friend's house. I read what was in it and I saw things that I personally don't agree with. As I put in my original post here:


Originally posted by Bluetilespook

This is not a "slam on Mr. Trudeau or alternative treatments" thread.


I am not trying to slam him. I am stating my disagreement with his information being factual in regards to some of the treatments.

If you will read some of my other posts in the Medical section here, you will see where I question Big Pharma on some things. In a short amount of time I will be adding to one of my original threads about medical journals being caught short about their contributors not disclosing their financial ties before submitting articles for publication. To me, that is a big issue.

I know you and bsl4doc have a history of butting heads. I have read some of the posts where you two have fired shots over each other's bow. If you would like to start your own thread and have a discussion with her, please feel free, but please, leave the animosity out of my threads.

I like to hear the alternative therapy side of things so if you have something positive to contribute about it, please please please do that by all means. Neither side has all the answers so I like to hear all of the info and decide for myself.

Cheers,

JDub



posted on Jul, 19 2006 @ 12:55 PM
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I saw Kevin years ago on TV pushing some speed reading program, or something like it. I had read later about his various run ins with the law, so when I saw his book I assumed it was just a book to get money. I never took it seriously.

But what is odd to me is that in the past couple of months I have had numerous people talk about his book and how wonderful it was. One person was talking to me while we were in the waiting room at the hospital, both waiting on surgery patients. Since his wife had cancer surgery i tried to tell him that I thought the book was interesting but its good to do your own research and not believe everything you read. I didn't want to tell him I thought the book was probably not accurate, since he was already going thru a lot of personal stuff. At the same time I was hoping he didn't give up on doctors and just follow Kevin's book.

Everytime someone mentions the book I direct them to google and tell them to look up Kevin and do some reading.

I believe there are a lot of medicines and natural cures that haven't been explored, I just think Kevin is out to make a buck.



posted on Jul, 19 2006 @ 12:59 PM
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Yes, I know that sounds strange...

But if you use words like 'CURE' the FDA will put your sorry butt in jail.

For more info on what I'M talking about... go do some research on the gag orders ole Trudeau has had foisted on him by BIG PHARMA... ah... MDs... ah the FDA... ah... (You get the picture?
)

You would have to be more 'in tune' with what the big picture is... to understand exactly how shackled Trudeau and the rest of us 'snake-oil salesman' alternative medicine types (that's me!
) are laboring against.

When you cross one of these lines... despite INDISPUTABLE proof of the efficacy of many of these 'alternative medicine' remedies... big, mean, ugly, gun-totting FDA agents will kick your door in, arrest you, take your computers all your files... etc. etc. etc.

Do you think Trudeau is making these actual threats up BlueTileSpook?

Do you think golem is making these actual threats up?

That's why your boy is dancing on the pinhead of explicit statements.


And it's an IN YOUR FACE YOU CORRUPT BASTARDS at the FDA!



You dig?



posted on Jul, 19 2006 @ 01:08 PM
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Hey golemina, before you call me an alternative medicine basher, you might want to take the time to get to know me.
I've been studying alternative medicine for over 10 years.
My areas of special interest are nutrition and herbology.
(I'm also the son of an organic farmer who lectures on organic farming through her local Co'operative Extension; I've been around "alternative medicine" my whole life; I've even studied some massage and accupuncture, not to mention martial arts including t'ai chi).

Besides, do honestly think that Trudeau gives a s#@t about you?
He only cares about you until your check clears, then you are just another dollar sign to him.
And I still stand by my statement that his book is other peoples research, that he just compiles and slaps his name on.
Entrepenure yes,
anything remotely resembling honest, no.
Go ahead, and prove me wrong...



posted on Jul, 19 2006 @ 01:56 PM
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I've seen the first book, and it's pretty awful.

When you get to the part where he says that plants create matter from sunlight, it really should clue you in to the fact that his scientific grounding is...shaky.

Note that he doesn't say a plant's chloroplasts make ATP and NADPH using sunlight, which the Calvin cycle then uses, along with carbon dioxide and water as building blocks, to make sugars. Not Trudeau, he says they literally take sunlight and synthesize matter directly from energy, ala E=MC^2.

As a TCM advocate, I'm sort of used to having to ignore the fact that their models don't seem to have any correlation to biology. Like my practitioner said, though, "Even if you really don't have a way for your spleen to literally be damp, the model works. I don't know what we're really measuring, but it has definite, predictable results." At least this seems honest, as compared with Trudeau's trying to pass himself off as understanding something he clearly doesn't.

Agree with Wu Kung, I finally decided to just ignore the fact that the guy is trying to put himself up as a health advocate that hasn't got a clue about cellular structure or basic biology, and ran into the "this looks like he went on the net and aggregated about 50 websites' content and published it as his own work".

As far as I'm concerned, he's the alternative medicine version of the question mark guy.



posted on Jul, 19 2006 @ 03:53 PM
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Originally posted by golemina


But if you use words like 'CURE' the FDA will put your sorry butt in jail.


And they should because of the likes of people that gave rise to the term SNAKE-OIL SALESMEN - The people that sold turpentine in a bottle as a cure-all. Heck, there are alternative websites on the web right now that encourage people to drink Hydrogen Peroxide to cure several different ailments.

Big Pharma doesn't promise a cure, they TREAT diseases and conditions just like alternative TREATMENTS treat diseases and conditions.


Originally posted by Golemina

For more info on what I'M talking about... go do some research on the gag orders ole Trudeau has had foisted on him by BIG PHARMA... ah... MDs... ah the FDA... ah... (You get the picture?
)

You would have to be more 'in tune' with what the big picture is... to understand exactly how shackled Trudeau and the rest of us 'snake-oil salesman' alternative medicine types (that's me!
) are laboring against.


I have read about the gag orders and I have seen a few interviews about them. No gags were instilled by Big Pharma nor MD's. The FDA is the only one that put a gag on him and his ads.

I am "in tune" with the larger picture. I understand what alternative therapies can or cannot do for me. I still feel that he promises things in the book(s) that he can't deliver on.


Originally posted by Golemina

... despite INDISPUTABLE proof of the efficacy of many of these 'alternative medicine' remedies...


What INDISPUTABLE proof?

I have been from one end of the internet to the other over the last 6 years looking for not only what ails me but something to treat it. I read alot of anecodotal evidence and personal testimonies that different things work, but I am also a part of several different websites for different chronic health conditions and I talk to those people through posts on threads, IM's, PM's or phonecalls and they tell me through first-hand experience that the majority of treatments on the market for my conditions don't work.

I don't want to drink Xanga (Xango?) juice for the next year waiting for it to lessen my symptoms or cure them when the people that I talk to on a daily basis HAVE drank it for a year and say it doesn't work for anything except that it tastes good on a hot day. The only people I have talked to that say it works are the ones that are trying to sell it, have never used it themself and rely on testimonials from the company to back it.

I cringed when bsl4doc asked the question in another thread a while back, "What alternative treatment is there for cancer that is being surpressed?"

I saw a lot of yelling back and forth from members saying in a nutshell, "Well the government doesn't want you to know that there is one", but what I never saw was "take ingredient XXX and mix it in two parts with ingredient YYY, have the person ingest it in ZZZ way for 6 months and it will effectively treat or cure cancer."

I know of detoxification programs to help clean out a persons system, I know of immune system boosting programs that will help, but not an alternative treatment leading to a cure.

I personally have successfully used B-12 to help with my neuropathies in my face, feet and hands. I have used it to help fight overwhelming fatigue. I use a homemade natural fruit paste to regulate my digestive system. I have used chiropractic, massage and accupuncture to help with my with my neuropathies and chronic pain. I have had some success with each one, but none was a cure and none was any better than a med that I can get from my doc. I just have to decide which one I want to do, the alternative or the pill.


Originally posted by Golemina

Do you think Trudeau is making these actual threats up BlueTileSpook?

Do you think golem is making these actual threats up?

That's why your boy is dancing on the pinhead of explicit statements.


No, I know that neither he nor you are making up the legal threats, but I think in the singular case of Mr. Trudeau it is a threat to his business and money that he is worried about, not a threat to cover up good alternative medical practices.

Once again, I think he is promising something that he can't deliver. And that is illegal.


Originally posted by Golemina

And it's an IN YOUR FACE YOU CORRUPT BASTARDS at the FDA!


I think this quote says more about your personal frustration than what it does for you wanting to have an open discussion.

As my old boss would say, "I have a challenge for you today."

What EXACT therapies are being surpressed by the government? And I don't mean, "Well, there is a treatment or cure for XXXX condition but the FDA won't let us tell what it is."

Name the exact disease(s) or condition(s) and the exact treatment(s) for it/them.

Not "eat a well balanced meal".

Not "drink lots of water".

Not "get a full night's sleep"

Those are generalities. I am politely asking for specifics.

We can even label our discussion "hypothetical" in big bold letters so that anyone adding to the discussion is safe from any possible retribution from the FDA. Lay it all out here because you may theoretically hold the key to solving some of my health problems.

Cheers,

JDub



posted on Jul, 19 2006 @ 04:05 PM
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If a person can't determine that this guy is bunk given his history, there's no way that they're going to be able to determine what is bunk within any particular book.



posted on Jul, 20 2006 @ 01:06 AM
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that's one thing that can certainly be said about threads in this forum... LOTS of passion.


Makes me feel right at home.


Wu Kung:

> before you call me an alternative medicine basher, you might want to take the time to get to know me.

Well then... I must not have been talking to you.


>Besides, do honestly think that Trudeau gives a s#@t about you?

I don't mean to be dense... but what exactly is the significance of this statement in this conversation?

>And I still stand by my statement that his book is other peoples research, that he just compiles and slaps his name on. Entrepenure yes...

Hmm... If you were apply this very same standard to another entrepreneur... Say Thomas Edison... This statement would also be EXACTLY correct. But Thomas Edison/General Electric... will quite frankly they are golden.


And apparently so is Trudeaus bank account...



If I was to offer a speculation... it might border on some type of professional/status jealousy.

Me... I don't care... I'm simply NOT jealous of other peoples success.

I think to try and say he is claiming everything in his book is his and only his work product... Is kind of ridiculous, don't you think?

For what it's worth (apparently not much
), you might want to think of his work as an anthology... a sampling... what have you.

He seems to sell a lot of books... What on earth is the significance of that in your opinion?


Tom Bedlam:

>When you get to the part where he says that plants create matter from sunlight, it really should clue you in to the fact that his scientific grounding is...shaky

You might want to get a second opinion on that.


Don't you think that is a better analogy than trying to talk to the man on the street about chloroplasts and ATP?



Truth be told... Very few people understand much of anything how things really work.

You sound quite clever Tom Bedlam... So I know you can read what I'm saying between the lines...


BlueTileSpook:

>I saw a lot of yelling back and forth

That's like the 4th or 5th time in this thread you've tried to attach these type of characterizations to my dialogue.



I'm sorry man... I really don't play that game.

You really sound like you could use the help that SNAKE-OIL SALESMEN (like me!
) offer. You just DON'T get it dude...

>drink lots of water
>get a full night's sleep
>eat a well balanced meal (lots of room for interpretation on this
).

And all of the other 'generalities'...

Those ARE the really important things.

I'd like to help you dude... You certainly sound like you need the help...

I'm getting a feeling of deja vu... All over again.

You are stuck in the cracks brother. Somehow you don't have in your circle a heavyweight with my leanings that can drag you out of this insane nasty place you've fallen in.

You are living in an XYZ world wanting help with your problem that totally does not conform to an XYZ cookbook situation that those mighty MDs can actually correctly diagnose (much less REALLY do something about).

It puts me in a personal quandry... I help people... But considering the threats emanating from your friend via those U2Us...

Nygdan:

(I always save the best for last dude.
)

Hey!

>If a person can't determine that this guy is bunk given his history, there's no way that they're going to be able to determine what is bunk within any particular book.

I can see where some people might take that position.

The specificity of 'his history' might make for an interesting discussion/addition in this thread.

The overall condemnation of your statement kind of reminds me of the statement I read recently by a person I respect that was questioning the wholesale application of an attitude based on seperate occurances not related to that event.




posted on Jul, 20 2006 @ 09:08 AM
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My point is I don't want to be caught in what is true, what isn't true, what is opinion, what is an idea,"

This statement sounds like pure legal disclaimer stuff. I can only presume he has got a few people taking him to court over the efficacy of his so-called "cures" and is starting to back peddle on his claims.



posted on Jul, 20 2006 @ 11:48 AM
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Don't you think that is a better analogy than trying to talk to the man on the street about chloroplasts and ATP?


If you were trying to make some non-specific analogy, perhaps.

However, IIRC, he's trying to make some very specific point, and goes into several paragraphs about how you can grow a plant, then remove it and weigh the soil, and it will still weigh the same (false...the plant removes minerals from the soil, and that weight change is quite measureable), and that "the entire plant has sprung into being through the synthesis of matter, as Einstein described it in E=mc^2!!!111!! Energy can be turned into matter, and this is PROOF!!!!!1!!"

Uh, no. Anyone with a 9th grade education should know that isn't true.

And it's far from the only gaffe, the book is paved with them from one end to the other, it is,however, the point at which I decided to ignore the fact that Trudeau apparently doesn't have the science education of a bright 9th grader, and see what else he had to say.



posted on Jul, 20 2006 @ 11:56 AM
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Hey golemina, I'm not really in the mood to argue about this, so I'll make it short (and semi-sweet):

Trudeau sells a lot of books because he preys on peoples ignorance and fear of being sick.
He is a very, very slick salesman, I won't deny that.
In fact, he even gives away hints about his own greed by constantly repeating his mantra:

"It's all about the money"

This term is repeated more than anything else in his book(s); he's laughing in the face of all the people that spend their hard earned money on his "cures".
And when I asked that if you thought he gives a s@#t about you, I didn't mean you in particular, I meant people in general.
He knows that the health field is a virtual untapped gold mine and he is exploiting it to line his own pockets.
Simple as that.



posted on Jul, 20 2006 @ 12:10 PM
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BTS:

Not trying to pry, but you don't take statins for cholesterol control, do you?



posted on Jul, 20 2006 @ 02:38 PM
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Originally posted by golemina

That's like the 4th or 5th time in this thread you've tried to attach these type of characterizations to my dialogue.



I'm sorry man... I really don't play that game.

You really sound like you could use the help that SNAKE-OIL SALESMEN (like me!
) offer. You just DON'T get it dude...


I apologize. That statement wasn't meant as a direct comment on you. I have seen Excitable Boy and a couple others jump in with "passion" (excellent description from you) on other threads. On the other side, bsl4doc brings her own passion for mainstream medical practices passions into the threads and there have been others, I am just drawing a blank at the moment. I apologize again.

I guess I DON'T GET IT because, like my last visit with the massage therapist, she went from statements to me on the phone when I was scheduling my visit like, "Oh yeah, that is no problem. I know exactly what it is and I can fix it. Give me three visits and you will be 100% better" to "Wow, I'm not sure what this is but maybe I can help ease it" during the massage to "I've never seen anything like this. I can't help you" at the end of the session.

After $300,000 over 6 years spent on surgeries, testing, meds and travel, I am down to the nitty gritty financially. I don't have the time, inclination or money to fool with MD's or alternative therapists (AT's) that waste my time.

I am as tired of sublingual tinctures, steeping teas and balancing my body's Ph as I am of filling Rx's that don't work and having the same tests over and over that do not show any more than the previous three, four or five did.

I have been promised by both sides that they can help me or cure me. Both sides have failed.


Originally posted by Golemina

Those ARE the really important things.


They are important but they are the equivalent of taking my car to a mechanic to diagnose an engine problem and him telling me that I need to check the tire pressures and fluid levels every day. That is important but it isn't relevant to my situation because those problems were fixed early on.


Originally posted by Golemina

I'd like to help you dude... You certainly sound like you need the help...

I'm getting a feeling of deja vu... All over again.

You are stuck in the cracks brother. Somehow you don't have in your circle a heavyweight with my leanings that can drag you out of this insane nasty place you've fallen in.

You are living in an XYZ world wanting help with your problem that totally does not conform to an XYZ cookbook situation that those mighty MDs can actually correctly diagnose (much less REALLY do something about).


So here is your opportunity to help the whole medical patient community. List the treatments and cures that have been squashed, covered up or gagged.

In the last six years I have developed:

Diabetes type 2
Cardiac Arythmia
Degenerating Musculature in arms and legs
Restless Leg Syndrome
Periodic Limb Movement Disorder
Myoclonic Jerks
Fibromyalgia
GERD
Chronic Sinusitis
Chronic Bronchitis
Chronic Vertigo
Chronic Fatigue
Demyelinating Disease
Neuropathy of the face, hands and feet (Non-diabetes related)
Gall Bladder Disease (4% efficiency, removed surgically)
Essential Tremors
Colon Polyps
Irritable Bowel Syndrome
Intestinal Bleeding of an unknown source
Degenerating Disc Disease
Thinning of the Spinal Cord
Narrowing of the Spinal Canal
Ulnar Neuropathy of unknown origin
Ptosis of the eye and drooping of right side of face
Almost no REM sleep (4%) - CORRECTED NOW
Excessive Dreaming (not REM sleep, just the waves of the brain not shutting down correctly for sleep) - CORRECTED NOW
Narcoleptic Episodes
Unexplained weight loss of approx. 90 lbs. in less than 6 months
Muscle atrophy in my hands and arms
Loss of nerve signal in my hands
Short-term memory loss
Severe muscle cramps and fascillations in hands, feet, shins and calves
Experimental diagnosis of Myasthenia Gravis

There is more, I just can't remember them all.



Originally posted by Golemina

It puts me in a personal quandry... I help people... But considering the threats emanating from your friend via those U2Us...


What threats? From what "friend" of mine here? I have not been here long enough or posted enough to have what I consider a friend here. If someone is U2U'ing you about me or my situation, they are doing it of their own volition.

Cheers,

JDub



posted on Jul, 20 2006 @ 02:42 PM
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Originally posted by Tom Bedlam
BTS:

Not trying to pry, but you don't take statins for cholesterol control, do you?


Tom -

No. I did early on but quickly ran into the side effects of severe pain in my back muscles. The endocrinologist I had at the time said that it was not a known side-effect of the med, but all she had to do was read the documentation that went with the med. I dropped the med, the back pain went away, I went back to the endo doc and took the written documentation with me about the side-effects and she blew me off saying that she had never seen it before.

She was fired and I was with another more knowledgable endo doc in a few weeks.

JDub



posted on Jul, 20 2006 @ 06:21 PM
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Sorry for the threadjack...but...

they put me on Zocor for a 200 cholesterol, and about 35 days later I started having body-wide symptoms of demyelinization, worst was a spectacular neuropathy of my hands and feet. Felt like I had reached into a french-fry vat and grabbed a power cord. I've had lots of bumps, bruises, cuts and broken bones, but NEVER anything that bad.

I went to the doc, who blew me off, so I thought about the timing with the Zocor, it being the only thing I've ever taken 'regularly', and stopped it. Called the company, yes, peripheral neuropathy is a symptom, very rare, sorry about that. Later some other relatives on Mom's side took it, same thing. So it's genetic.

Took about six months to settle it back down, lots of Lyrica and/or neurontin, very miserable. I'd much rather eat lecithin on my oatmeal and take niacin sups. They're trying to sell me Zetia, but the three little numb patches on my fingers say "no".



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