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with every choice a new reality

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posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 08:07 PM
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I want to bring up a possible theory that might be explainable through science or some form of intelligence.

In the events following up to a choice each person makes on this on this earth, lets say there are two, that person will either choose one or the other, but for every choice that was not made there was an alternate reality created, wither in their mind or in the universe. From that there would billions upon billions of alternate realities, and foremost the ability to hop between each reality traveling through time in the events but never will change your current future. This then giving way for no more paradox’s or time collapsing on itself. Each reality would significantly be a dimension indeed, each dimension created by your own choices throughout time.




posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 08:28 PM
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I thought of the exact same thing almost 15 years ago, and found out later it had already been thought of:

www.tenthdimension.com...

This is a pretty good description of the various dimensions, and nestled in there is the very concept you mention.

-P



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 08:33 PM
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wow I am double amazed, two people have thought of this before, I´ve been thinking this too since I was a kid. This makes me wonder again if there is some kind of higher consciousness and as you open your mind you go up , getting more knowledge etc.



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 11:08 PM
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I've had similair thought, but never tried to verbalize them.


Zeratul, the point about a higher consciousness is an interesting one. I think the human race has some very amazing things to discover in the near future. Personally I think 2012 will be the begining of a new age or way of thinking, and perhaps higher dimensions is part of it?



posted on Jul, 15 2006 @ 02:11 AM
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Well, if you think about it, a reality only TRULEY exsists in the eye of the beholder..IE. YOU. If we...H20 blobs werent around then there would be no reality.



posted on Jul, 15 2006 @ 03:14 AM
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The concept you are talking about originally comes from quantum mechanics. But the idea the it has anything to do with consious choices we make was added on by spirituallists who in my opinion did not understand what QM was suggesting. Basically there is an interpretation of quantum mechanics that says that every possible quantum state of the universe is happening out there somewhere in other parallel universes. So this would(in a way) cover things like the choices made, but its really refering to the quantum states of sub-atomic particles.

Did that make sense? Describing QM can get kind of weird.

Vas.



posted on Jul, 15 2006 @ 07:34 AM
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I have also thought of this before, and worked some stuff out for it! Here's my post from way back when...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Furthermore, I deduce that if we truely take every "choice" as described by Chaos Theory, then every choice revolves around the motions of electrons, which would appear randomly at each "moment" interval (which assumes that there is a minimum unit of time - and that we view the universe like a movie-reel).

If that is true, then the approximate number of universes being generated every "moment" would be:

or 4.6656 * 10^6248 per moment

That number is stupidly large - and more importantly, it's only for THIS universe. Assuming that in other universes the same thing happens, you're looking at a supraverse of infinite possibilities, lives, and choices - whever EVERY event that possibly could happen, does happen.

However, this doesn't mean there's fate, it just means that you have to choose which universe you want to belong to.



posted on Jul, 15 2006 @ 08:31 AM
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In philosophy, it's called modal realism. According to modal realism, all possible worlds exist. In one world, you went bowling, in another you chose to stay home and watch a movie, in a third you were abducted by aliens on your way to the bowling alley. But modal realism doesn't hold that your decision (or the resolution of multiple possibilities) actually creates worlds. They're just there -- at least, this is my understanding.

The idea has a more powerful analogue in physics called the Many Worlds Interpretation. It's basically a theory in quantum mechanics, referring to events taking place on a sub-atomic level (such as the emission of a photon from your TV screen when it is hit by an electron from the cathode). One version of the MWI suggests that every time a quantum event takes place, the universe splits up into many universes, with the event having a different outcome in each universe. The event creates as many possible events as there are possible outcomes.

Here's a good place to start learning about the MWI, with links to lots of other juicy pages.

Here is a rather technical explanation of the Many Worlds Theory.

Here is a many-worlds FAQ, even more technical, I'm afraid, but it spells out the physical ramifications of MWI in some detail.



posted on Jul, 16 2006 @ 01:13 AM
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The links on the Douglas Jones page I posted above don't seem to work any more. Here are some others.

This link is to an evocatively written (and poorly proofread) discussion on the Many Worlds Interpretation, aimed at the general reader. It's part of a rather interesting site that describes the way the universe looks through the eyes of modern physics.

Here is a more exhaustive discussion of the MWI. Pretty technical; I suggest taking it slowly.

Here's the standard Wikipedia link, which is even more technical and has lots of mathematics in it.

And here's the Many Worlds FAQ, which pretty much sums up all the issues.

Enjoy!



posted on Jul, 16 2006 @ 01:24 AM
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The copenhagen interpretation or specifically the copenhagen collapse is a theory (though disputed by some) that I personallyl find interesting, thought you folks might enjoy it as well:

wikiwiki:
en.wikipedia.org...

Happy reading...in whatever reality you currently reside.

Spiderj



posted on Jul, 16 2006 @ 01:51 AM
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Originally posted by Spiderj
The copenhagen interpretation or specifically the copenhagen collapse is a theory (though disputed by some) that I personallyl find interesting

Yes, the Copenhagen interpretation is the standard explanation for the paradox of the observer in quantum mechanics.

It seems to be less popular with the diners at physics's top table these days than the MWI. Or so the Many Worlds FAQ would have us believe.

Being a naive klutz, I have a naive, klutzy question:

Where does all the matter (or mass-energy, if you prefer being relativistic about it) to make all these brand-new universes come from?

Any ideas, anyone? Or is it just a stupid question?



posted on Jul, 16 2006 @ 02:04 AM
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Where does all the matter (or mass-energy, if you prefer being relativistic about it) to make all these brand-new universes come from?


I'm completley unqualified but it doesn't sound like a stupid question. I of course am in no position and totally incapable of answering and have no idea what I'm talking about but hey, I'm gonna give it a shot.

Just spit balling here.

But the collapse arises because the alternate realities are weaker, less defined or somehow flawed from the major timeline that continues from your decision.

Going jungian for a second, perhaps it has to do with collective unconcious.

Democracy at it's finest. The bigger the choice, the more people it affects, the stronger the reality. So buying the tuna fish sandwich instead of the roast beef sandwhich could simply create a quantum bubble an instaneous and instantly disintegrating reality that collapse in on itself because the choice is such a minor one.

Dropping the bomb or not dropping the bomb is a much bigger choice with a ripple effect with many consequences and so affecting many more people so you have through subconcious effort a more signifigant reality.

I'm totally talking out my rear end.

Just spit balling, but it is saturday and we ate mexican, which for me always involves tequilla.

viva reality, viva zapata.

Spiderj



posted on Jul, 16 2006 @ 02:44 AM
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Been thinking again.

Perhaps you could tie the collapse phenomena into the MWI.

The more "you's" that make the same decision through out the multi-verse the more defined the new reality through out all the dimensions.

It could even be a survival mechanism within the MWI system. if you have Universe, after universe exploding into reality all the time, constantly coming into being, some blinking out and some continueing on as new realities, I would think in the end would overwhelm the whole system.

So the more "you's" and I mean that as all people in all universes throughout the multiverse. So the more "you's" that make the same decision in a number of universes could (perhaps?) destabilize or somehow bring about the destruction or collapse of a pre-existing; even a number of pre-existing realities.

A quantum version of population control. In the end if the multiverse were to grow to an "unmanagable" amount, the collapse could keep things at a constant and managable number of universes.

Basically if 90% of the Gary's in all universes through out the multi-verse decide to get a hair cut and 90% of the Ellens decide to get their car washed and so forth and so on, these simple decisions add up to create stronger realities and in the end destroy the now, new, weaker realities.

Did that make any sense whatsoever.

Spiderj



posted on Jul, 16 2006 @ 07:59 AM
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Well, like I said, there's a lot of universes being made, so many that it - by all rights - can be considered Infinite.

Because of that, certain universes have a better chance of existing than others. There's only going to be 1 universe where there's nothing in it at all (in that universe, no interactions between quarks ever happens, because of rare quantum fluctuations that always happen in that universe and that universe alone). The chances of Earth forming are extremely likely, and so you could say that the number of times earth forms approaches infinite "faster" than the chances that earth doesn't exist (or that earth suddenly ceases to exist).

If we take things for a more recent perspective though, there's a much greater chance of me going to work today than of not going to work, and so going to work approaches infinite "faster" than not going to work.

Remember, though, that I do mean that not going to work also approaches infinite, because there's an almost inifinite combination of events that can allow me to NOT go to work today. However, there's "more almost infinite" combinations that allow me TO go to work.

Fun stuff, eh?



posted on Jul, 17 2006 @ 04:42 AM
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Originally posted by Spiderj
The bigger the choice, the more people it affects, the stronger the reality. So buying the tuna fish sandwich instead of the roast beef sandwhich could simply create a quantum bubble... Dropping the bomb or not dropping the bomb is a much bigger choice... affecting many more people so... a more signifigant reality.

Hey, that's pretty cool. So you could quantify the significance of an event in terms of its primary knock-on effects, which would be the sum of all events arising in direct consequence of the original event within a specified timeframe (how would you deal with relativistic distortions in spacetime, though? never mind for now) and would probably bear a proportionate relation to either (i) the amount of energy released by the event or (ii) the information content of the event, however measured, or perhaps (iii) both. You could call this variable 'event pressure' or something.

Drunk and stumbling, we stagger in the general direction of a Law of Conservation of Events....



posted on Jul, 17 2006 @ 03:32 PM
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So you could quantify the significance of an event in terms of its primary knock-on effects...(how would you deal with relativistic distortions in spacetime, though? never mind for now) and would probably bear a proportionate relation to either (i) the amount of energy released by the event or (ii) the information content of the event, however measured, or perhaps (iii) both. You could call this variable 'event pressure' or something.


Right, to go newtonian for a second...for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction, so to speak.

If we step away from MWI for a moment and look toward String/Super string theory or M-theory and tie the collpase into that, perhaps it could explain what happens to the excess energy.

I believe MWI theory allows for the possibility of endless univesrses which though in the end may be correct doesn't help us here so I'm gonna go ahead and toss it out the window for the moment.

Elaborating on my last post but I'm gonna move from tieing the collpase to MWI to either string or M-theory.

String/super string allows for (I believe) anywhere from 16-24 Universes in the Multiverse. M-theory (again correct me if I'm wrong) allows for 11.

So let's say that the entire multiverse system has a pre-determined amount of universe/realities that it can handle before it becomes unmanageable.

For argument sake lets say that the Multiverse consists of 12 stable and complete universe/realities. A stable and healthy multiverse would call for some sort of defense mechanism to ensure the status quo that is the 12 healthy realities.

Think of it as an immune system for lack of a better term.

So, we have at any given moment depending on the choice made and signifigance of that choice an infinite number of universes that exist and then implode almost immediately.

Basically they're quantum farts in an elastic multiverse.

The excess energy that has been both created and destroyed has to have had to come from somewhere and be going someplace.

So, perhaps the energy/energies are dispersed throughout the multiverse in equal amounts so the tiny reality that comes into existing from buying the tuna fish sandwich was created from energies that came from the multiverse. Since it's such a small and insignificant choice the "tuna fish" universe dies almost the instant it's created.

Upon the immediate "death" of this tuna fish universe, the energies that came from the 12 seperate universes are intstantly dispersed and re-distributed throughout the multiverse in equal amounts thus the energy remains constant.

whatever effect this would have had on space and time is made moot by the fact that the energy is both consumed and then redistributed almost instantly.

Now if we go to the bigger decision to drop or not drop the bomb.

In a multiverse of 12 realities let's say that an overwhelming number drops the bomb. Say 10 out of 12 of the realities go nuclear. The 2 that did not are now the minority and may be significantly weakened. Like the lame animal in a herd.

The significance of dropping the bomb in 10 of the realities could send out ripples causing turmoil within the immune system by creating new realities that spring up due to the event.

So, the multiverse goes instantly from containing 12 universes to say 24 or 40 or 100. All this energy must be contained and redistributed. If it can't be it would put the entire multiverse system in jeopardy by overloading it.

Picking an arbitrary number let's say this event creates 30 universes in a system created to hold 12. Out of those 30 universes 28 are weaker than the 2 realities that didn't drop the bomb.

The energy of these weaker universes are distributed as equally as possible and as efficiently as possible as the mutliverse goes critical.

Catastrophe barely avoided the multiverses immune system must now decide what to do with the final 2(out of 30 realities) that seem to be stronger and now more whole than the 2(out of the original 12) realities that did not drop the bomb.

The system then takes these two stronger realities and integrates them into the system. They take the place of the now weaker original hold out realities. The energy created and lost fromt the death of the two original realities is now and instanteously compensated by the replacement of the weaker ones with the now stronger realities that came into existence because of the 10 that dropped the bomb.

So the multiverse goes from its stable/pre-determined 12 realities to 30 and then back to 12. While the multiverse has changed as a whole and the 12 realities within it are significantly different the status quo of the 12 stable universes remains.

While these examples are earthcentric, any major catastrophe anywhere in the universe that could effect that much life could bring about this situation.

I would also think that much like a super-computer the multiverse system would deal with this overload very quickly. So we wouldn't even notice it. Within a tenth of second it all happens and is fixed.

What would happen if the entire thing went critical I have no idea.

Just another spit-balling theory. Which is really the great thing about theory.

My brain hurts.

Spiderj



posted on Jul, 17 2006 @ 03:40 PM
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Originally posted by Vasilis Azoth
Describing Quantum Mechanics can get kind of weird.

un-abbreviation mine.

I don't mean to interrupt the program in progress, but I love this line from Vasilis Azoth.

I may even use it as part of my sig.


We now return to the regularly scheduled program, already in progress......

[edit on 7/17/2006 by Mechanic 32]



posted on Jul, 17 2006 @ 03:45 PM
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That is a good siggy mechanic.

The weirdness is my favorite part of qt.

SPiderj



posted on Jul, 17 2006 @ 03:48 PM
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Now lets intergrate how the multiple realities would play on the course of Quantum Mechanics being weird........



posted on Jul, 17 2006 @ 03:51 PM
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Originally posted by ragster
I want to bring up a possible theory that might be explainable through science or some form of intelligence. [...]
Each reality would significantly be a dimension indeed, each dimension created by your own choices throughout time.


Okay, but where are these other realities? As far as I can tell, there's only this one I'm in right now. When I wake up in the morning, things haven't radically changed. The reality I'm in seems very solid and consistent. And there's just the one, not billions.

Why do I only experience one reality, when I should have a conscious mind in each new reality that's created? How come I apparently don't have contact with or awareness of the others?

p.s. -- Oh, I should say that out of all the possible realities, I guess I only exist in half of them, since in half of them I'm dead (for making the wrong choices) or was never born.

[edit on 17-7-2006 by Enkidu]



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