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Hezbollah use UCAV

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posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 05:03 PM
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according to Yahoo news (I'm sure it's reported elsewhere too) Israel claims that Hezbollah used a drone packed with explosives to attack an Israeli warship on Friday (today?).

EDIT: link to news article is too long for post but it is easy to find here: news.yahoo.com...

The report suggests that the attack was moderately successful although it doesn't seem that the vessel was sunk.

I would GUESS that the vessel was in port and not at battle stations or moving. BUT the report says it happened off the Lebonese coast suggesting that the vessel was at sea - so the vessel must be an unarmed auxillery or else the watchkeeper was asleep....

Hezbollah has at least some Iranian made Mirsad 1* tactical UAVs. Or it could have been a modified recreational remote control aircraft although the warhead would have to be very small.


A typical tactical UAV could carry about 25lb of explosives - compared to about 400lb for a typical anti-ship missile. Add to this the UAVs slow speed and you have a very limited anti-ship weapon - but with some operating advantages for irregular forces (terrorist or otherwise).


Yet another shift in the weapons of war.



There are several UCAV types which employ the whole air vehicle as the weapon (as opposed to returning to base). They include:

> Amber - a US black project which ultimately led to the Predator www.designation-systems.net...

> Tacit Rainbow - a now defunct US anti-radiation drone www.fas.org...

> Harpy - an Israeli anti-radiation drone www.israeli-weapons.com...

> Taifun attack drone www.army-technology.com...


*The exact nature of the Misrad 1 is not clear but presumably it is a typical propeller driven tactical UAV - Iran manufactures several types which fit the bill











[edit on 14-7-2006 by planeman]




posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 05:55 PM
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Pretty impressive for a group like Hezbollah to pull something like this off.

Last reports are that the ship is burning but returning to Israel under it's own power, with four crew members reported missing.

EDIT: latest report says the ship is not under it's own power, but being towed, and still burning four hours after the attack.

[edit on 7/14/06 by xmotex]



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 06:55 PM
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You can thank the Iranians for helping the Hezbollah getting this type of technology. Not to mention hundreds of rockets. Makes you wonder...------->Iran.



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 07:01 PM
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Iran, or RCModeler Magazine?

Really, how much foreign assistance does it take to make a remote controlled plane and pack it with explosives?

We must bomb the offices of RCModeler magazine now, before they destroy us all!



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 07:09 PM
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^^ you can't be serious,Iran gives a great deal of money and aid to hezzbollah.



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 07:11 PM
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msnbc.msn.com...



Hezbollah claims it manufactured the drones itself.

But U.S. and Israeli intelligence sources tell NBC News that Hezbollah actually obtained the UAVs from Iran and that Iranian soldiers are stationed just across the border to help operate them.

At an airshow in Iran earlier this year, an aviation official showed off Iran's UAVs to NBC News.

"When you turn on the engine, it takes off and flies," Abbas Fallah of Iran Aircraft Manufacturing told us. "It's so easy!"




Iranian officials have both taken credit for supplying the UAVs to Hezbollah and denied it.



U.S. and Israeli intelligence believes Iran gave Hezbollah a half-dozen UAVs which feed live video and have sophisticated guidance systems.

"Well, there is a clear escalation, a provocation, and it could be an attempt to collect and gather information and intelligence to attack us," says Daniel Ayalon, the Israeli ambassador to the U.S.

Some Middle East experts worry that the UAVs further destabilize an already fragile environment.

"The danger is that Hezbollah will now have the capability to inflict greater damage on Israel by more precise targeting," says Joseph Cirincione, a weapons expert at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. "Israel cannot simply take those attacks."

Already Israel's vastly superior military is embarrassed that a terror group's little unmanned spy plane has been able to penetrate Israeli airspace — twice.


This tells otherwise. Don't need to blame the modelers. No doubt the Iranians have supplied the UAVs.



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 07:19 PM
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Oh I think it's entirely possible that Iran supplied UAV's to Hezbollah.
It seems certain they're supplying Hezbollah with rockets.

On the other hand, I don't think it's all that difficult for even a small organization to develop such a weapon themselves these days. It doesn't require any magical "high tech", anyone with a reasonable degree of technical ability, a creative bent, and a modest budget could build one with parts ordered at towerhobbies.com. (Well, they probably can't supply the explosives.)

Welcome to the wonderful world of assymetric warfare.

[edit on 7/14/06 by xmotex]



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 07:30 PM
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Originally posted by xmotex


Welcome to the wonderful world of assymetric warfare.



Don't need to introduce me to asymmetric warfare. However you should remember that you can't just simply hit an Israeli warship from a couple of miles without sophisticated guidance system, that is mixed in with explosives, etc. It requires heavy testing and the tech and materials requires to make such drones work as it suppose to be. Can't just buy a model and cram it full of explosives and let it fly.



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 07:50 PM
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You don't need a sophisticated guidance system, just a miniature camera with a transmitter capable of reaching out a few miles. Those can be obtained at supercircuits.com.

And no I'm not shopping to make weapons - at my last job we looked into using cheap UAV's for webcasting aerial shots of live events over the internet. Our conclusion was we could have done it for a few $k, but we never had the time to work on it, and there were liability concerns - if the thing failed and fell on someone's head we could get sued. With a weapon, that's not so much of a problem.

[edit on 7/14/06 by xmotex]



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 08:43 PM
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Originally posted by xmotex
And no I'm not shopping to make weapons - at my last job we looked into using cheap UAV's for webcasting aerial shots of live events over the internet.


Cram it full of explosives that can disable a warship and then we can talk. Otherwise, it won't be simple just to make a model plane and later on fill it up with explosives without trading off weight, space, etc.



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 09:02 PM
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It's not nearly as difficult to pull off as you think.

Here is an example of the kind of thing commited amateurs with a decent budget can pull off.



A 23' wingspan, turbine powered 1/8 scale B-52, weighing 330 pounds loaded.

Without the requirement of making it a scale model of a real plane, with retractable gear, etc, it would not be too difficult to make a UAV that could deliver a significant payload a significant distance with great accuracy.

Given a contest between a small group of creative & motivated individuals and a sprawling hierarchical bureaucracy, I'll bet on the small group every time.

[edit on 7/14/06 by xmotex]



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 09:43 PM
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I seen the video before...but not the video where it crashed (thanks for that one, did not expect something like that for such a beautiful model). Model airplanes were built for entertainment. However the ones that Hezbollah had were meant for recon and to be used as a possible UCAV or even cruise missile equivalent as the Hezbollah used it for, most likely from Iran's help. Now that requires significant amount of manpower and resources to involve such a project for military purposes.



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 09:59 PM
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Please forgive my ignorance, but what seperates a UAV used for kamikaze missions from a cruise missile?



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 10:05 PM
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Originally posted by cyberdude78
Please forgive my ignorance, but what seperates a UAV used for kamikaze missions from a cruise missile?


www.state.gov...


What are UAVs?

"Unmanned air vehicles" is the term used in the Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR) to refer to unmanned systems that fly within the atmosphere and are not rocket-propelled. Different terms may be used other contexts, but for MTCR purposes this term includes cruise missiles, as well as target drones, reconnaissance drones, and other forms of UAVs, be they military or civilian, armed or unarmed. UAVs can be as large as a jetliner or as small as a model airplane, can be jet or propeller driven; there are even concepts for guided, unmanned blimps that would be UAVs.


No difference, in their view it applies to all that meets the requirements.



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 10:10 PM
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I read on yahoo news the ship had a crew of twelve. This would make me believe it was a smaller ship, if a combat ship. This is an interesting development. If it is Iranian made and they have more we will see more used. I tend to believe a well resourced group ( which Hizbolah is) could pull off a few, but if we see many of these being used it is a direct link to whoever provided them and a possible motivator for wider war. I really want to know what type of ship it is. I say probably a gunboat type, but a possible support ship is possible too (it'd probably have a smaller crew as well).



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 10:12 PM
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Now that requires significant amount of manpower and resources to involve such a project for military purposes.


Only if you think like a conventional military, going for milspec components instead of off-the-shelf, etc. A 300lb flying vehicle is a 300lb flying vehicle. Just because it would cost DARPA millions to build the exact same thing these guys built for thousands, doesn't mean the homebuilt version can't do the job just as well. Probably better.



I say probably a gunboat type, but a possible support ship is possible too


According to Israeli media reports it was a Saar 5 stealth corvette, Israel's most advanced and heavily armed surface vessel. Built by Northrop Grumman in Mississippi.

[edit on 7/14/06 by xmotex]



posted on Jul, 14 2006 @ 10:34 PM
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Wow, nice link on that corvette. Not a navy guy here but that looks like more than a 12 crew ship. Seen specs on it says it has a phalanx on it shouldn't that be able to shoot down most uav's. That's a major hit for Hezbolah. Not trying to say it couldn't be done on the cheap xmotex but it's looking like a more advanced type weapon to me. Like something straight outta someone's arsenal.



posted on Jul, 15 2006 @ 04:41 AM
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www.interestingprojects.com...


how to build a cruise missile for under $5k


so if a cruise missile can be built then im rather sure that a radio controlled aeroplane carrying bombs can be built



posted on Jul, 15 2006 @ 05:38 AM
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According to BBC News 24 this morning (0745 UK time), the Israeli ship had been off the Labanese coast shelling targets when this remote controlled aircraft/missile hit the warship.

At present, four Israeli sailors are missing and the warship is being towed back to Haifa (?)



posted on Jul, 15 2006 @ 07:28 AM
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how about if most of their ucav are stealth,sneaking around the israel defend building and then straight dive into it.i think this will trigger more firepower to bring in to the actions in to the battles




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