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posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 03:13 AM
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Originally posted by TheBandit795

Originally posted by Snazuolu
Nothing crazy about believeing and having faith in a religion. For that matter, if more of the ppl on this board had any faith, they wouldnt' make such silly comments or posts for that matter.


Explain to me exactly what comments you find silly and with a valid reason why.

Faith does not count as a valid reason. Furthermore I agree with Twitchy, WolfofWar and xmotex.

And two more questions... Aren't we all supposed to be God's children and isn't he supposed to love us all equally? Then what's with the discrimination against the rest of us non-israelis? If you accept that they are God's chosen people then you accept that God is DISCRIMINATING against you. And if God's discriminating against you, then he doesn't like or love you. And yet you would worship such a God who doesn't give a crap about you.

If you have 5 children, would you love them all equally or would you pick one over the rest?? Because that's that it looks like to me.



Faith IS a valid reason, as some ppl are willing to kill others over it. therefore it IS a valid reason, jsut might not be yours. As far as comments that i find silly, for 1 all this talk about oh the world is gonan end in 2012 or we're almsot ready to have ww3 or whatever else ppls delusions make up. It is VERY plain to see that crap like that jsut taints this message board. Nothing wrong with remaining open to a topic, but sometimes its a bit much. I joined this board for the SOLE purpose to learn and educate. I would have thought that others also are here for that reason. I've watched this board for a long time now and some of the stuff about aliens, and other off the wall stuff just pushed me ot the breaking point. I joined to voice my opinion on matters which i feel are either important or jsut plain hogwash..now most of yous guys are saying well he's only here to voice his OPINION, but to counter that excuse, opinions aren't any worse then what some ppl in here call proof IE. someone thought the queen was a lizard or something coz his tv was a POS ... come on folks FOCUS....




posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 04:19 AM
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Originally posted by Snazuolu

Faith IS a valid reason, as some ppl are willing to kill others over it. therefore it IS a valid reason, jsut might not be yours. As far as comments that i find silly, for 1 all this talk about oh the world is gonan end in 2012 or we're almsot ready to have ww3 or whatever else ppls delusions make up.


Those people's apocalyptic ideas may very well be religously inspired. One guy's delusion is another guy's religion. For an atheist, your posts quoting the bible are completely delusional.


Originally posted by Snazuolu

I've watched this board for a long time now and some of the stuff about aliens, and other off the wall stuff just pushed me ot the breaking point.
I've watched this board for a long time now and some of the stuff about aliens, and other off the wall stuff just pushed me ot the breaking point.


Is there any more proof for the existence of god than there is for the existence of aliens? Both are highly debatable, which is what we should be free to do on ATS. It is, after all, a discussion board.


Originally posted by Snazuolu

now most of yous guys are saying well he's only here to voice his OPINION, but to counter that excuse, opinions aren't any worse then what some ppl in here call proof IE. someone thought the queen was a lizard or something coz his tv was a POS ... come on folks FOCUS....


Funny some people believe the queen is a lizard, others think it's alright to claim a land, drive out the inhabitants, kill and maim them, because it says so in a book. It's not important what you call 'the Man': God, Allah, Yahweh ... but if you use his name to dictate state policy and - more generally - hurt others, you're abusing religious faith.



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 11:15 AM
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Originally posted by steve_montana

Originally posted by Snazuolu

Faith IS a valid reason, as some ppl are willing to kill others over it. therefore it IS a valid reason, jsut might not be yours. As far as comments that i find silly, for 1 all this talk about oh the world is gonan end in 2012 or we're almsot ready to have ww3 or whatever else ppls delusions make up.


Those people's apocalyptic ideas may very well be religously inspired. One guy's delusion is another guy's religion. For an atheist, your posts quoting the bible are completely delusional.


Originally posted by Snazuolu

I've watched this board for a long time now and some of the stuff about aliens, and other off the wall stuff just pushed me ot the breaking point.
I've watched this board for a long time now and some of the stuff about aliens, and other off the wall stuff just pushed me ot the breaking point.


Is there any more proof for the existence of god than there is for the existence of aliens? Both are highly debatable, which is what we should be free to do on ATS. It is, after all, a discussion board.


Originally posted by Snazuolu

now most of yous guys are saying well he's only here to voice his OPINION, but to counter that excuse, opinions aren't any worse then what some ppl in here call proof IE. someone thought the queen was a lizard or something coz his tv was a POS ... come on folks FOCUS....


Funny some people believe the queen is a lizard, others think it's alright to claim a land, drive out the inhabitants, kill and maim them, because it says so in a book. It's not important what you call 'the Man': God, Allah, Yahweh ... but if you use his name to dictate state policy and - more generally - hurt others, you're abusing religious faith.


now where did you EVER see me say i was an atheist?? coz CLEARLY you can't read as i have said that i am a Christian. Also that book that you talk about is no ordinary Book!!! It is THE Book!!! It describes in detail what is needed for your afterlife to be as glorious as that Book tells it to be. As far as abusing religious faith, the Jews have a right to that land as it was promised to them by God and their forefathers.



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 12:33 PM
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Originally posted by steve_montana



Is there any more proof for the existence of god than there is for the existence of aliens? Both are highly debatable, which is what we should be free to do on ATS. It is, after all, a discussion board.



Actually, there is more proof of the existence of aliens. Countless sightings, government documents, video tapes of craft all over the world.


Can't say some mexican kid ever snapped a camera out and video taped god in the sky, unless it was on a piece of toast, ofcourse.



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 10:21 PM
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Originally posted by Snazuolu


Faith IS a valid reason, as some ppl are willing to kill others over it. therefore it IS a valid reason, jsut might not be yours.


Faith is never a valid reason. You can't prove anything with faith empirically speaking. And furthermore, people have been willing to kill each other for a sandwich or a pair of sneakers...


As far as comments that i find silly, for 1 all this talk about oh the world is gonan end in 2012 or we're almsot ready to have ww3 or whatever else ppls delusions make up. It is VERY plain to see that crap like that jsut taints this message board. Nothing wrong with remaining open to a topic, but sometimes its a bit much. I joined this board for the SOLE purpose to learn and educate. I would have thought that others also are here for that reason. etc... etc... etc...


I thought you were talking about the subject at hand... Why are you going off-topic??? I don't believe you for a second what your now saying about what you find silly. Obviously you mentioned that in THIS thread for a reason. Mainly to point out that you think the replies in this thread are silly. That's how I see it.


come on folks FOCUS....


No YOU focus, and answer my questions pease... Here they are again:

Aren't we all supposed to be God's children and isn't he supposed to love us all equally? Then what's with the discrimination against the rest of us non-israelis? If you accept that they are God's chosen people then you accept that God is DISCRIMINATING against you. And if God's discriminating against you, then he doesn't like or love you. And yet you would worship such a God who doesn't give a crap about you.

If you have 5 children, would you love them all equally or would you pick one over the rest?? Because that's that it looks like to me.



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 10:44 PM
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Originally posted by SnazuoluAs far as abusing religious faith, the Jews have a right to that land as it was promised to them by God and their forefathers.


I would like to see some proof that the vast majority of modern jews are descended from ancient Israelites. And no... The bible is not proof.



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 10:54 PM
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Originally posted by TheBandit795

Originally posted by Snazuolu


Faith IS a valid reason, as some ppl are willing to kill others over it. therefore it IS a valid reason, jsut might not be yours.


Faith is never a valid reason. You can't prove anything with faith empirically speaking. And furthermore, people have been willing to kill each other for a sandwich or a pair of sneakers...


As far as comments that i find silly, for 1 all this talk about oh the world is gonan end in 2012 or we're almsot ready to have ww3 or whatever else ppls delusions make up. It is VERY plain to see that crap like that jsut taints this message board. Nothing wrong with remaining open to a topic, but sometimes its a bit much. I joined this board for the SOLE purpose to learn and educate. I would have thought that others also are here for that reason. etc... etc... etc...


I thought you were talking about the subject at hand... Why are you going off-topic??? I don't believe you for a second what your now saying about what you find silly. Obviously you mentioned that in THIS thread for a reason. Mainly to point out that you think the replies in this thread are silly. That's how I see it.


come on folks FOCUS....


No YOU focus, and answer my questions pease... Here they are again:

Aren't we all supposed to be God's children and isn't he supposed to love us all equally? Then what's with the discrimination against the rest of us non-israelis? If you accept that they are God's chosen people then you accept that God is DISCRIMINATING against you. And if God's discriminating against you, then he doesn't like or love you. And yet you would worship such a God who doesn't give a crap about you.

If you have 5 children, would you love them all equally or would you pick one over the rest?? Because that's that it looks like to me.



We are all Gods children , but that has nothing to do with the Jews being his CHOSEN ppl. The Jews are HIS chosen ppl coz of the agreement God made with them in the beginning. God only discriminates against those who sin. God loves everyone , even the sinners coz He knows they can saved. As far as children i have none , nor will I ever have any. me and the wife came to that conclusion a long time ago. But to answer your question, If i had 5 kids, yes i would love them all the same, but that does not mean i would view them all the same. Not everyone thinks alike nor does everyone have the same amount of book or common sense. Some children are more trustworthy then others.



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 11:00 PM
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Originally posted by TheBandit795

Originally posted by SnazuoluAs far as abusing religious faith, the Jews have a right to that land as it was promised to them by God and their forefathers.


I would like to see some proof that the vast majority of modern jews are descended from ancient Israelites. And no... The bible is not proof.


The proof you want is HIGHLY unlikely to be found as you are well aware of. I dont' know of too many ppl who can trace their roots back that far. Also you say the Bible is not proof, what is your justification for throwing it out? I personally believe the Bible and what it stands for. I find it hard to believe that you can come in here and watch ppl talk about the queen is a lizard, or John Titor is from the future and you lap that up, yet not believe what the Bible has to say. hmmm selective beliefs ???



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 11:45 PM
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Originally posted by Snazuolu

We are all Gods children , but that has nothing to do with the Jews being his CHOSEN ppl. The Jews are HIS chosen ppl coz of the agreement God made with them in the beginning.


And why didn't he make such an agreement with anyone else? Why choose one group out of the millions of people? Are they perfect? Did they not commit sins like everyone else??


God only discriminates against those who sin.


Which means he doesn't love sinners... When you discriminate against someone, you hate them.


But to answer your question, If i had 5 kids, yes i would love them all the same, but that does not mean i would view them all the same. Not everyone thinks alike nor does everyone have the same amount of book or common sense. Some children are more trustworthy then others.


And you determine that from the beginning as well??



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 11:58 PM
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Originally posted by Snazuolu
The proof you want is HIGHLY unlikely to be found as you are well aware of. I dont' know of too many ppl who can trace their roots back that far.


So how can you be so sure that they are really Israeli's then??? Enlighten me...


Also you say the Bible is not proof, what is your justification for throwing it out?


For one, the council of Nicea and the following years where the bible was put together by people like me and you. Gospels where put in or left out for political reasons. Two: Mistranslations from the original languages to the current ones, which where sometimes accidental and which where sometimes done on purpose. Four: At least a century after the events of the new testament the first known stories where put on paper, which leaves an extremely long time for stories to be distored and altered due it being orally told all that time.


I find it hard to believe that you can come in here and watch ppl talk about the queen is a lizard, or John Titor is from the future and you lap that up, yet not believe what the Bible has to say. hmmm selective beliefs ???


And now you are assuming that I believe that John Titor nonsense or the queen being a lizard. John Titor is a hoax concocted by a man whose first name that is similar to a ancient relic from the time of the old testament (yes I do believe some parts of the bible where true, but not all). That dude doesn't even deserve to be mentioned here. And as for the queen being a lizard... How the heck do you think that I would believe such utter bs???

People here on ATS are post about whatever they believe in, but they have to be able to offer proof for their beliefs. Sadly that doesn't always seem to be the case as we can obviously see with you here.



posted on Jul, 11 2006 @ 12:08 AM
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And btw... Seeing that some of my ancestors were jews, some of the land there in Israel is supposed to be mine then..
Technically I'm one of God's chosen people!!



posted on Jul, 11 2006 @ 12:13 AM
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Originally posted by TheBandit795

Originally posted by Knights
I think, if i'm not mistaken, the Israelis decided to return to their 'homeland' without the help of God. Infact many Jews returned on their own accord and decided to act on their beliefs without waiting.


Returned???? Show me where it says that all of these Europeans are exactly the same people as the Israelis from 2000 years ago. The most of the jewish people in Israel right now are originally Eastern Europeans who se ancestors have converted to judaism.

[edit on 8-7-2006 by TheBandit795]


Just who are the real Jews Bandit? that is the question that I want answered. The rate things are going in this world we may never know.




posted on Jul, 11 2006 @ 12:16 AM
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Well I don't know, but according to Snazuolu they are the jews from recent centuries and their descendants, which includes me...



posted on Jul, 11 2006 @ 12:26 AM
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Well regarding Israel, it looks like Iran is trying to stir up some trouble.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Hope not though, things could get real ugly.

The problems in this region never seem to cease.

[edit on 7/11/2006 by Mechanic 32]



posted on Jul, 11 2006 @ 12:27 AM
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just because you are a Jew doesn't mean you will goto Heaven, even Jews commit sins...why do you think the Holocaust happened?? or why do you think Solomons temple was destroyed?? Also you say you believe some of the Bible, but not all of it. Thats kinda like what was my term for it earlier, selective beliefs?? its your free will of course...



posted on Jul, 11 2006 @ 06:53 AM
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Originally posted by Snazuolu
just because you are a Jew


Did I say I was a jew, read my words again. I said I have some jewish ancestors.


doesn't mean you will goto Heaven,


I wouldn't want to stay to one of the christian heavens. There's too much to see and do when you're out there. (I've had out of body experiences before)


even Jews commit sins... why do you think the Holocaust happened??


Because of an incredible racist called Adolph Hitler. But I thought you said some children where more thrustworthy than others in the analogy??? If God can't even trust jews not to sin as much as the rest of us, then why pick them as his chosen people? It doesn't make a bit of sense.


or why do you think Solomons temple was destroyed??


Buildings were always being destroyed everywhere in conflict. Why was Troy destroyed in the Trojan wars?


Also you say you believe some of the Bible, but not all of it. Thats kinda like what was my term for it earlier, selective beliefs?? its your free will of course...



posted on Jul, 11 2006 @ 07:45 AM
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Originally posted by Snazuolu

Israel is Gods chosen land and for HIS chosen ppl,



~at least that's what you've been instructed to believe~

the 'G0d' which caused modern Israel, sure used British & Zionist & UN
human agencies to accomplish the birth of this 'divine plan' nation.

here's an easy to follow outline of maps & text
www.masada2000.org...

with the initial 1922 British mandate, following the spoils of OttomanEmpire

including the 1923 British administrative division of the land area
know as Palestine into....Palestine & Trans-Jordan

then the 1947, UN Partition Plan 181

then the 1949, Armistice Line

etc etc



posted on Jul, 11 2006 @ 09:10 AM
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Oh dear, I needed a good laugh - thanks Snazuolu


Im surprised this thread doesnt come with a super hero costume and a decoder ring


I fail to see what Israel being God's chosen people and your faith in that matter has to do with Global Politics. How are we meant to disabuse you of your faith?

[edit on 11/7/06 by subz]



posted on Jul, 11 2006 @ 09:41 AM
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Why would a group of people fight so hard for a plot of dirt!?!

It makes no sense to me, even if you believe that you are Gods chosen people why should you pick such a Godforsaken place to live. It seems to me that if everyone would stop living their lives by what some God tells them, and instead live in the here and now of reality we would be living in a lot better place.

What I fear is the line of thinking exampled in many of the post in this thread. We will do whatever it takes because we have some pact with God and so on. Now what would you say if an angry Palestinian managed to smuggle a small nuclear weapon into a crowded city. He, thinking that he must destroy Israel as decreed by God, detonates it and causes untold chaos. How many innocent children have to die in defense of some sand?



posted on Jul, 11 2006 @ 05:58 PM
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A pile a dirt it definitely is.

"My guess is someone gave the land to God, God saw it and in his infinite wisdom he regifted it" -Rob Corddy (The Daily Show.)

Quoted for the Truth of it All.



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