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Is America turning into a Facist State?

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posted on Jul, 6 2006 @ 01:29 AM
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I just watched this 14 minute video about how america is turning into a facist state

video.google.com...

some things are very disturbing. Whenevr i watch videos like this i do not know wether to believe it, or call it another Michael Moore movie. If you watch this video please post here with your thoughts




posted on Jul, 6 2006 @ 01:38 AM
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well it looks like someone beat me too it.. dam im always too late



posted on Jul, 6 2006 @ 01:47 AM
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You're not wrong for drawing those conclusions. The fact of the matter is that we are in trouble. I've only been posting here for a few weeks, but I'd like to share a few things with you.

"The Shape of things To Come" is a thread I started to explain some of my abstract thinking.

The Shape Of Things To Come

"The Future of the Possee Comitatus Act" is a thread I started to point out one of the more sinister things going on in our givernment today.

Future of the Possee Comitatus Act

"Conspiracy To Fight A Conspiracy" is a thread I started to spark some discussion related to unusual solutions. This topic has some bearing on my published work.

Conspiracy To Fight A Conspiracy

My first novel was devoted to this worry and concern. I hope that in the years to come that more people will take interest in the things that are happing to the United States. If we fall, the 'damage' will not be limited. I'm sure you'll find plenty of people to say good riddence, but the fact is that the demise of any nation is...messy.



posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 12:04 PM
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1.Secret Societies
2.Secret Societies 2

Nice documentary....must see...



posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 12:47 PM
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If its against the constitution then why do we do it?
Because the constitution is a joke. It got changed just as fast as it got released.

Yes the federal reserve is a private bank and I can tell you such a thing is proof that the country is on the verge to facism.

But you know what the fact of it all is? The truth is this... democracy put us there.

Democracy was a great idea to everyone back in the 1800's. It was an escape from a WORKING SYSTEM! Thats right, heriditary rule worked! The catch to get so many people to the new land was democracy. It was almost a lie from the start.

We don't have a problem on our hands. We are just witnessing the evolution of democracy. Democracy leads to facism.

Benito Mussolini 1883-1945

“Democracy is beautiful in theory; in practice it is a fallacy”

“Fascism should more appropriately be called Corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power”

“Fascism is a religion. The twentieth century will be known in history as the century of Fascism.”

Mussolini knows that facism is when the corporations own the government and communism is when the government owns the corporations.

My belief is the U.S. was always so anti-communism for the same reason Muussolini was... because the corps own them! The corps DO NOT want communism.

Now you have to ask yourself, do you want the corporations to own you or do you want the government to own the corporations.

I for one believe that communism is the only way to go.

Communsim can be compared to a hierarchy except that a hierarchy cares more for the royal family than the state of the nation.

Communism cares for the state of the nation while at the same time keeping checks and balances on the corporations.

Communism may sit idle while other nations war, but when the time comes communism stands ready to claim new territory.

Facism will only attack if its in the interest of enough corporations.







[edit on 8-7-2006 by Techsnow]



posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 01:10 PM
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posted by Swatman

“ . . just watched this video about how America is turning into a fascist state . . Some things are very disturbing. When I watch videos like this I do not know wether to believe it, or call it another Michael Moore movie.
[Edited by Don W]



You’re OK, S-man. It’s another Michael Moore-type flick but not as good as the original. Take 10% truth, mix in 90% crapola, and you have this anti-tax flick.

Between 2% and 5% of Americans have clinical cases of psychological disorders. That works out to 6 million to as many as 15 million souls. Sick souls.

Believe me, the income tax is real. The Constitution was amended by the 16th amendment adopted in 1913. It is embodied in the Internal Revenue Code. It is found at Title 26. “Title” is like chapter. Or section.

Here follows from the 1999 Code


TITLE 26, Subtitle A, CHAPTER 1, Subchapter A, PART I, § 1

(a) Married individuals filing joint returns and surviving spouses
There is hereby imposed on the taxable income of—
(1) every married individual . .

(b) Heads of households
There is hereby imposed on the taxable income of every head of a household . .

(c) Unmarried individuals (other than surviving spouses and heads of households)
There is hereby imposed on the taxable income of every individual . .

If taxable income is: The tax is:
Not over $22,100 15% of taxable income.
Over $22,100 but not over $53,500 $3,315, plus 28% of the excess over $22,100.
Over $53,500 but not over $115,000 $12,107, plus 31% of the excess over $53,500.
Over $115,000 but not over $250,000 $31,172, plus 36% of the excess over $115,000.
Over $250,000 $79,772, plus 39.6% of the excess over $250,000.


See www4.law.cornell.edu...

It is not a crime not to pay your income tax. It is a crime not to file a correct and complete tax return appropriate to your circumstances. If you do not pay when due or if you refuse to pay at all, the IRS adds penalties and interest and seizes your property which is sold at public auction and the proceeds are applied to your tax bill. Do it hard or do it easy. You decide.


[edit on 7/8/2006 by donwhite]



posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 01:55 PM
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posted by Swatman
some things are very disturbing. Whenever I watch videos like this I do not know wether to believe it. Swatman [Edited by Don W]



Fascism. Usually a totalitarian state with a mix of private capital for the rich and socialist programs for the common man. Benito Mussolini of Italy and Adolph Hitler of Germany are the two who first come to mind when Fascism is mentioned. Francisco Franco is another. And so on.

See below.




Fascism is a radical totalitarian political philosophy that combines elements of corporatism, authoritarianism, extreme nationalism, militarism, anti-rationalism, anti-anarchism, anti-communism and anti-liberalism.

The original facist (fascismo) movement ruled Italy from 1922 to 1943 under the leadership of Benito Mussolini. In time, the term fascism came to cover a class of authoritarian political ideologies, parties, and political systems, most notably Nazi Germany under Adolf Hitler but also Hungary's Arrow Cross Party, Romania's Iron Guard, Spain's Falange and the French political movements led by Marcel Déat and Jacques Doriot and others. From Wikipedia.






posted by Justin Oldham

You are not wrong Swatman, for drawing those conclusions. We are in trouble. "The Shape of things To Come" is a thread I started to explain some of my thinking. "The Future of the Possee Comitatus Act" is another thread I started to point out one of the more sinister things going on in our government. "Conspiracy To Fight A Conspiracy" is yet another thread I started to spark discussion related to unusual solutions.

My first novel was devoted to this worry and concern. I hope that more people will take interest in the things that are happening in the United States. If we fall, the 'damage' will not be limited to us. I'm sure you'll find plenty of people to say good riddance, but the fact is that the demise of any nation is messy.
[Edited by Don W]




Yes, J/O, look at Russia in 1917. Or China in 1949. Or, even the India Pakistan Bangladesh split following the 1947 abdication of power by the British. Despite the best efforts of Lord Louis Mountbatten, and the Mahatma, Mr. M K Gandhi, it turned violent. A great man, and leader in WW2, Lord Mountbatten was killed by an IRA bomb. One of their more singular dastardly deeds.

Fascism? It is hard to define America in 2006 without ending with a definition of fascism! I think of fascism - my shorthand way - as capitalism run amuck. That certainly describes Germany from 1933 to 1945. Bush43 did not invent public corruption, but he seems to be unexcelled in its practice. We are told by bureaucrats - the silent public servants who make it all work - that FEMA - decapitated by Bush43 and the GOP Congress - at first gave out money too slowly to victims, then under pressure, gave away over $1 billion almost to anyone who applied. One prisoner received over $30,000. Others got credit cards on which they charged hotel rooms, room service food, single malt booze and even lap dances and other more disgusting forms of sexually explicit entertainment I shall not describe on this family site.

What with the 2006 election just over 100 days away, the Bush43 team is bringing out the every other year “bomb the NY tunnels” flim flam. This is reported by the FBI. The guys who are alleged to have planned this explosive event were in Lebanon. Yes, Lebanon as in the Middle East. Sure, we could not depend on Homeland Security to stop them at the airport, but still, it is a long way to haul 1000 pounds of bomb materials.

FBI? I can’t seem to forget Robert Hannsen, the FBI agent who worked for the FBI 21 years and worked for the KGB for the last 18 of those years. The FBI never found him out. A KGB defector “gave him up.” For those of you who have humane spirits, you ought to find the circumstances and conditions of his life without parole confinement here in the good ole US of A. Look it up. And I'll bet you thought the Byzantines invented torture.

Well, crapola, you say, what about the CIA’s Aldrich Ames? He was high enough up in the CIA hierarchy that he got his hands on the names of the 16 “humints” - agents on the ground - in Moscow. 16! Over the years, he disclosed the identify of every one of those 16 agents! To the KGB. For money. Jaguars. Fur coats. Etc. Every darn agent we had in Moscow. Did the CIA even blink? Does the CIA have any internal cross-checks? To see why are we losing every one of our hard to get agents? Geez.

Why oh why would any one person in the CIA have access to all those agents cover names. Why? He was caught when another KGB defector gave him away. Or, the worst spy family in American history, the Walker family. He spied long enough to retire from the Navy and turn his spy mission over to his Navy son. The wife and mother finally got to feeling patriotic and turned them both in.

So why am I skeptical of this self serving timed to release close to election day? A “Saved Our Country” boost for the Patriot Act? And we can’t even interview the culprits because they are conveniently off in a foreign country. Hmm? How come we only catch terrorists close to elections? Remember the DVD last time? In 2004. About NY and W-DC. All that hullabaloo until a property owner in NY revealed the DVD was over 3 years old! Yipes! I smell electoral fraud. I smell crapola. Say hello, Ronnie Reagan, Bill Casey, for your October surprise! Bush43 is emulating you!

For more on Bush43, see www.oldamericancentury.org...



[edit on 7/8/2006 by donwhite]



posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 02:04 PM
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The Governments are misusing taxpayers money!


[edit on 8-7-2006 by Amon_Ra]



posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 06:00 PM
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I am not sure
but the behavior of bush administration is really damaging
the reputation of freedom and democracy



posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 07:33 PM
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The changes in the fabric of the Presidency, as made by George W. Bush, have certainly accelerated the rate at which future Presidents will acquire more power. In the past, each new administration since Abraham Lincoln has gathered up just a little more power for the Executive branch. We will see the next President, who ever that is, do the same thing with similar consequences.



posted on Jul, 9 2006 @ 08:59 AM
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oh yes, and we are still allowing all of this!?!

This must come to an end!


Sooner or later!

[edit on 9-7-2006 by Amon_Ra]



posted on Jul, 9 2006 @ 10:29 AM
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posted by Justin Oldham

The changes in the Presidency made by Bush43, [under the tutelage of AG Gonzales] have accelerated the rate at which future Presidents will acquire more power. [Edited by Don W]



Maybe not, J/O. I recently heard one writer (on CSpan2) remind us the Legislative Branch is Article 1, and the Executive Branch is Article 2. This was no accident, he urged. Indeed, he bolstered his argument by pointing to Section 8 of the first article. Nowhere in Article 2 is there such a listing or enumeration of powers. His conclusion was that the legislative branch is the supreme branch of our governmental system, which can, by law, dissolve everything in the Executive Branch other than the President and Vice President. And not be unconstitutional. AJ Thomas - the cannibal - would love that.

The ergonomics of 1 person versus 535 persons makes this assertion of Article 1 power seem highly unlikely, but with sufficient motivation, anything is possible.




In the past, each new administration since Abraham Lincoln has gathered up just a little more power for the Executive branch. We will see the next President, who ever that is, do the same thing with similar consequences.



Well, J/O, I prefer to attribute the on-going centralization of our government as more due to necessity than by malevolent design although that is exactly what I ascribe to Bush43. Malevolent design. I think the US population was about 50 million in Lincoln’s time. Now, it’s given by the US Census Bureau as 295 million but I’m not sure if that includes the 12 million undocumented persons living here. That much growth will in itself require a larger government.

Next, add services. National parks. Indeed, national cemeteries. Veterans care. Customs staffing. Public health system. Flood control systems. A huge - comparatively - standing military and its attendant civilian support infrastructure. 50 states versus only 36 states when Lincoln was assassinated. Plus, until recently, the Panama Canal Zone, the Philippines until 1948 and Hawaii in 1898. And etc and etc. No, J/O, size alone is of no value as a comparative of how the Executive - Article 2 - Branch is “taking” power.

Bush43 is “taking” power of the most egregious nature. He indeed is a usurper!



[edit on 7/9/2006 by donwhite]



posted on Jul, 9 2006 @ 11:45 AM
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Not only are we moving towards a fascist state, but any quick perusal of these boards will show that there are a lot of people in this country who are not only for it, but downright enthusiastic about it.

Look at all the people in the "NY Times is not treasonous" thread calling for the imprisonment/execution of the staff of the largest newspaper in the country, essentially for daring to criticize the leadership and expose their wrongdoings. These are your latter-day Brownshirts, and they're on the march. They probably don'rt see themselves as such, or at least won't admit it outright, but make no mistake - the march toward a fascist state is in motion, and it is supported by many, even many here on ATS.

I won't even mention the fishiness of the last two Presidential elections, or all the questions circling around 9-11 (Reichstag fire anyone?), as they have been covered plenty here.

[edit on 7/9/06 by xmotex]



posted on Jul, 9 2006 @ 02:53 PM
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Don:

You and I have already had discussions like this. People like bush 43 have been taking bites out of the Constitution for decades. that's the overall trend that I wrote about in my book, and its the same overall trend that I talk about on these boards.

I agree that there is some necessity. The rest is just individual greed. the people who make up our ruling political class no longer feel like they are at risk of losing hteir jobs. They see themselves as being firmly in control. They view the jobs they hold as theirs by right of ownership. they paid for them, and they've held them long enough...they own them. That's how they see it.

The Constitution works properly when office holders have some character. If you think bush 43 has made you unhappy, wait 'til the next President takes office. Those of us who had issues before will have fits.



posted on Jul, 9 2006 @ 07:30 PM
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Lincoln's use of executive power far exceeds anything since, including FDR's during WWII. Disagree with the war in 1863 and you faced prison for sedition.
Was he a fascist?

I don't mean to sound like a troll here, but you scholars of the left may remember how Nixon was going to cancel the 1972 elections, Reagan was going to launch a nuclear war, etc, etc.

The constitution has been a joke since the commerce clause in the 10th amendment was used by FDR's communist "New Dealers" to take over federal control of this country. The Supreme Court rules for the power elite,

Here's a question for you "Amerika is going fascist" people: who wrote "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need."?

It's a trick question.



posted on Jul, 9 2006 @ 10:03 PM
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90% of Bush43's problems are self-inflicted. If he has a plan, other that to muck up the world, I don't know what it is.

And yes, he is a usurper of power.



posted on Jul, 9 2006 @ 10:23 PM
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Don, make sense. To usurp is to take what does not rightfully belong to you. Count your selected Florida districts from 2000 and he's still President.

Can nobody answer my question?



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 12:29 AM
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wow i never thought my thread would get turned into a heated debate. i am liking this a lot. but im not good at debating or preparation so ill sit back and watch



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 01:08 AM
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In classical terms, a usurper is one who upsets the natural order of things while gathering tremendous power unto themselves. Some of them come to power through legitimate means, and others do not.

Don gets no arguement from me when he says that Bush 43 is a usurper. For what it may be worth at this early stage, I do expect the same attitudes and actions to be taken by future Presidents. That, by itself, will drive us toward what many call Fascism.

As a practical matter, I'm not sure that our government in its current form could accomodate true Fascism. I can see a very hard core ultra right situation, and that would be scary enough. Is it possible? Yes.

Consider that in his Presidency, bush 43 has broken several bureaucratic functions. Broken, as in wrecked to the point of uselessness. to borrow an element from my book, a future President who could break a few more of these linkagas...and gain a super majority in congres...that person could be said to be a true Fascist leader.



posted on Jul, 10 2006 @ 01:49 AM
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The natural order of things, in regards to government, is to grow not to shrink. Men do not give up power, they seek to gain it. When you look at how much the national government has infringed upon state and civil rights in the past 100 years its astounding. We are not the country we were founded as, we are different from that now, and the government will just get bigger and bigger. Right now it would seem like the begining of the end, not to sound as a doomsayer please im not, but right now we are divided, at eachothers throats. Divide and Conquer. We don't see president BushesExecutive orders as a bad thing, hell we don't see them. We are more conserned about how bad those nasty liberals are, or those backwards conservatives are. I think though, that when they get to far along in this process whether planned or unplanned, there will be a revolt and then the begining of our second civil war. Will it be in my life time? Maye, I am only 20, but I won't see my family put in box cars like cattle and I won't see my taxes go up anyfurhter. People cant hardly live anymore, think about the poor souls making 5.35 an hour! How can you affoard to pay rent off that. Congress voted that down last week, as John on the Daily Show said "Congress today took a giant sh%^ on the little guy."




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