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"What Freedoms Have We Lost?" The Way To Answer It Yourself (OP/ED)
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I have been reading these boards a good deal lately. I have seen a great many conspiracies about our freedoms being taken away. Then I would see a
relatively large amount of responses asking a very relevant question, "What Freedoms Have We Lost?". Well it is time for a response.
I have been seeing so many conspiracy theories about the freedoms our government is taking away from us, about the police state, and about the way our freedoms are being eroded. I have then seen a very relevant question be raised in response to these theories. This question is "What Freedoms Have We Lost?". I thought about this for hours actually, without a way to respond. If you are hoping for me to be able to answer it, you will probably be disappointed.
The reason I say that is because I can't answer it. I will answer why shortly. First you have to see that there is indeed an answer to the question which can be found out quite easily. You can answer the question you ask so easily, yet just about all of us choose not to. It is time we stop waiting for other people to give us the answers and start finding them ourselves. I cannot give you the answer to this question because I am in fact just as guilty as you are. I have just recently realized why.
We sit here and we talk. ATS-PTS-BTS are great places to relieve stress and get your feelings out. Unfortunately we are all guilty of a lack of exercise. I don't mean bench pressing or jogging (though it seems we in America are guilty of not doing that too ha ha). We are guilty of not exercising our rights. We think that if we talk we are suddenly exercising our freedom of speech. I think it is time we ask ourselves a different question.
"What Kind Of Threat Am I To The Government?" is the question you must ask. Ask yourself that question right now. If you answered that question no then you have failed you country. You are suppose to be the biggest threat to the government in the entire world. Every Americans born duty is to be a threat to the government. If you are not, who is left to keep them in check? I am not saying attack them, I am saying be a threat. People are talking about how the threats to the government are dangerous. Threats to our country are dangerous, threats to our government is the only thing keeping them in check.
I ask you to exercise your rights. I ask you to TEST whether or not your freedoms really are being eroded. You want to find the answer, it best be done yourself. Write letter to your congressmen whenever you have an issue, if you have to go to that office personally and complain. You do what you have to do to be heard. Protest, get right out there and voice your opinion to the fullest. It doesn't matter where you are in the political spectrum, because if you use your rights to the full extent you will be a threat to the government. If you disagree with any of their policies, you get right out there and voice it. Be a threat to that government, it is the forefathers wishes that you do so to keep them in check.
I have seen way too many people look around and stand down because they are alone. I have seen way to many people look at their watch and say "I don't have the time". Well isn't that a shame, a simple lack of courage or time has come to restrict people from exercising there birth rights as a thinking individual. You pass off your rights because you are too busy? There is a thing called priorities, and if freedom isn't one of them then that is a shame.
Is there a conspiracy behind all this, hell yes, but its not "Freedoms We Are Losing" that I am referring to, its the fact so many no longer feel the desire to exercise their birth rights. The real conspiracy is the idea that you shouldn't be a threat. That if you are a threat to the government you are dangerous to your country. By being a threat to the government you are a patriot to this country.
If you want to find out the truth of whether or not your rights are being eroded or taken away I suggest you take a simple action. That simple action is this: Exercise those rights down to the bone. Give 110% to make sure your rights are being used to the absolute fullest. Push yourself to do the things you wouldn't do. Instead of watching a protest on TV saying "I agree, but I don't have the time", get out there and protest with them. It may be hard to make that choice but in the end you have to ask yourself whether or not it is worth it to pass of your birth rights because you have other priorities.
Almost all of us can't tell anyone whether or not our rights are being taken away because we aren't exercising them to begin with.
Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
[edit on 5-7-2006 by grimreaper797]
[edit on 6/7/2006 by Mirthful Me]
I have been seeing so many conspiracy theories about the freedoms our government is taking away from us, about the police state, and about the way our freedoms are being eroded. I have then seen a very relevant question be raised in response to these theories. This question is "What Freedoms Have We Lost?". I thought about this for hours actually, without a way to respond. If you are hoping for me to be able to answer it, you will probably be disappointed.
The reason I say that is because I can't answer it. I will answer why shortly. First you have to see that there is indeed an answer to the question which can be found out quite easily. You can answer the question you ask so easily, yet just about all of us choose not to. It is time we stop waiting for other people to give us the answers and start finding them ourselves. I cannot give you the answer to this question because I am in fact just as guilty as you are. I have just recently realized why.
We sit here and we talk. ATS-PTS-BTS are great places to relieve stress and get your feelings out. Unfortunately we are all guilty of a lack of exercise. I don't mean bench pressing or jogging (though it seems we in America are guilty of not doing that too ha ha). We are guilty of not exercising our rights. We think that if we talk we are suddenly exercising our freedom of speech. I think it is time we ask ourselves a different question.
"What Kind Of Threat Am I To The Government?" is the question you must ask. Ask yourself that question right now. If you answered that question no then you have failed you country. You are suppose to be the biggest threat to the government in the entire world. Every Americans born duty is to be a threat to the government. If you are not, who is left to keep them in check? I am not saying attack them, I am saying be a threat. People are talking about how the threats to the government are dangerous. Threats to our country are dangerous, threats to our government is the only thing keeping them in check.
I ask you to exercise your rights. I ask you to TEST whether or not your freedoms really are being eroded. You want to find the answer, it best be done yourself. Write letter to your congressmen whenever you have an issue, if you have to go to that office personally and complain. You do what you have to do to be heard. Protest, get right out there and voice your opinion to the fullest. It doesn't matter where you are in the political spectrum, because if you use your rights to the full extent you will be a threat to the government. If you disagree with any of their policies, you get right out there and voice it. Be a threat to that government, it is the forefathers wishes that you do so to keep them in check.
I have seen way too many people look around and stand down because they are alone. I have seen way to many people look at their watch and say "I don't have the time". Well isn't that a shame, a simple lack of courage or time has come to restrict people from exercising there birth rights as a thinking individual. You pass off your rights because you are too busy? There is a thing called priorities, and if freedom isn't one of them then that is a shame.
Is there a conspiracy behind all this, hell yes, but its not "Freedoms We Are Losing" that I am referring to, its the fact so many no longer feel the desire to exercise their birth rights. The real conspiracy is the idea that you shouldn't be a threat. That if you are a threat to the government you are dangerous to your country. By being a threat to the government you are a patriot to this country.
If you want to find out the truth of whether or not your rights are being eroded or taken away I suggest you take a simple action. That simple action is this: Exercise those rights down to the bone. Give 110% to make sure your rights are being used to the absolute fullest. Push yourself to do the things you wouldn't do. Instead of watching a protest on TV saying "I agree, but I don't have the time", get out there and protest with them. It may be hard to make that choice but in the end you have to ask yourself whether or not it is worth it to pass of your birth rights because you have other priorities.
Almost all of us can't tell anyone whether or not our rights are being taken away because we aren't exercising them to begin with.
Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
[edit on 5-7-2006 by grimreaper797]
[edit on 6/7/2006 by Mirthful Me]
basically if you want to find out if your rights are being eroded, go out an use them to the full extent. Test it and find out for yourself.
I love this idea. Good job! If we're complaining about lost freedoms, we should at least know that it's true.
If you don't hear from me, I'll be in jail!
Seriously, I do feel that I have lost some freedom. Maybe not "freedoms" yet, but I guess we shall see.
But I feel I have lost the freedom to communicate openly in my home. That's a big one for me. I actually am concerned about what I say in the house and how, if heard through some techie telephone monitoring divice, it might be interpreted.
I have lost the freedom to remain anonymous. To be wherever I want without it being monitored by someone.
So, these aren't "freedoms" listed in the Constitution, but they certainly are freedoms that I have lost.
If you don't hear from me, I'll be in jail!
Seriously, I do feel that I have lost some freedom. Maybe not "freedoms" yet, but I guess we shall see.
But I feel I have lost the freedom to communicate openly in my home. That's a big one for me. I actually am concerned about what I say in the house and how, if heard through some techie telephone monitoring divice, it might be interpreted.
I have lost the freedom to remain anonymous. To be wherever I want without it being monitored by someone.
So, these aren't "freedoms" listed in the Constitution, but they certainly are freedoms that I have lost.
BH I think we have been confusing terms lately. Rights and Freedoms are two different things. I am thanking The Vagabond for getting my mind working
on this part.
A freedom is nothing more then being able to have choice. Choosing whatever you want to do is the essence of freedom. Rights are the means to preserving freedom. They are afforded to you to protect your entitlement to freedom. You can't take away the ends before you take away the means. We are asking what ends have been taken away. well I think the better question should be what means have been taken away to protect the ends in the future. That is what we need to find out.
They can't take away the ends, until they have taken away all the means to protect the ends. This is what we need to find out. Are they taking away our rights, the means to defending the ends, our freedom. In order to know if they are being taken away we need to exercise them. Exercising them to the full extent will show you whether or not your RIGHTs have been taken away.
A freedom is nothing more then being able to have choice. Choosing whatever you want to do is the essence of freedom. Rights are the means to preserving freedom. They are afforded to you to protect your entitlement to freedom. You can't take away the ends before you take away the means. We are asking what ends have been taken away. well I think the better question should be what means have been taken away to protect the ends in the future. That is what we need to find out.
They can't take away the ends, until they have taken away all the means to protect the ends. This is what we need to find out. Are they taking away our rights, the means to defending the ends, our freedom. In order to know if they are being taken away we need to exercise them. Exercising them to the full extent will show you whether or not your RIGHTs have been taken away.
Well here is an idea. How can we rally protests at Federal courthouses in many cities with the facts on 9/11 this september. Will three months be
enough to plan it out? What facts do we have to present to the public? The cpurthouses would need to be targeted in the morning, because if you have
ever been to any court in the morning you can see there is definetly a hell of alot of people there. Is that a way to express our freedoms? Does
anyone even care?
So what other rights do we need to express to the full extent to find out if we have lost them?
So what other rights do we need to express to the full extent to find out if we have lost them?
Originally posted by DYepes
Well here is an idea. How can we rally protests at Federal courthouses in many cities with the facts on 9/11 this september. Will three months be enough to plan it out? What facts do we have to present to the public? The cpurthouses would need to be targeted in the morning, because if you have ever been to any court in the morning you can see there is definetly a hell of alot of people there. Is that a way to express our freedoms? Does anyone even care?
So what other rights do we need to express to the full extent to find out if we have lost them?
I think a goal should be the secret files they are classifying in the name of national security come out. We demand to see the videos. If they say no we have to do something more to show we mean business. That in no way means violence.
You could organize a huge don't go to work day. That usually a great way to demand things. They depend on your labor to support them. When you do this its not the businesses you are trying to damage (although they will be as well) its the taxes the government won't be receiving because of that. Everyone just takes their week of vacation all at the same time until teh government changes their mind.
The people decide what is or isnt in the best interest of our country. if we want the videos, that is our choice.
also, protests are great to rally the people together for the cause. There has to be something more to it if the government doesn't respond though. Some sort of action must be taken. Protest doesn't just mean gathering and saying "give us" and if they don't you go home. protest can be not buying something, not going to work, etc.
[edit on 6-7-2006 by grimreaper797]
We can start with certain things being declared "Privileges " by the State governments. What give our elected officials the power to grant the
people privileges. You may not know it, but everything you have to purchase a license for is considered a privilege. Driving, owning a dog, owning a
business, hunting, fishing, getting married are just a few examples. The original intent behind a driver's license was to have proof that the
operator had the basic skills necessary to operate a motor vehicle. Hunting and Fishing licenses were initially started to ensure that residents of
an area didn't have to worry about outsiders taking all of the fish or game from them. Over the years these intent behind licenses has changed to a
form of government control. Did you know that your State can refuse to issue a driver's license to anyone without having to give a reason? Look at
all of the laws that have been passed enabling your driver's license to be taken for an infraction. In Pennsylvania a man told his doctor that he
drank 6 beers a day when filling out a questionaire. The doctor reported him to the State and his driver's license was revolked. This was without
any type of hearing or trial. The man had never had a ticket or violation for anything. There is no place or way for him to appeal the descision.
Look at Megan's Law and other laws of the same type. It used to be a person served their sentence, paid their fine and got on with their lives, now a person pays forever. The Government used the public's outrage to adopt these laws, but neglected to think about the eventual outcome. In some areas urinating behind a tree in the woods is enough to have you branded as a sex offender. In other areas streaking or mooning is enough. There are people on the offender list who's only crime is that they turned 18 while their boyfriend or girlfriend was still 17. I know of a couple who were charged with posessing kiddie porn because they had a video of themselves having sex when they were only 17. They took their computer in for repairs and the technician turned them in. Now by criticizing these laws there are people who are going to say that I don't want to see people who sexually abuse children punished. They couldn't be further from the truth. The punishment needs to be handed out at sentencing, if there is a shred of evidence that the person may repeat the act then steps need to be taken to ensure that they don't.
Look at Megan's Law and other laws of the same type. It used to be a person served their sentence, paid their fine and got on with their lives, now a person pays forever. The Government used the public's outrage to adopt these laws, but neglected to think about the eventual outcome. In some areas urinating behind a tree in the woods is enough to have you branded as a sex offender. In other areas streaking or mooning is enough. There are people on the offender list who's only crime is that they turned 18 while their boyfriend or girlfriend was still 17. I know of a couple who were charged with posessing kiddie porn because they had a video of themselves having sex when they were only 17. They took their computer in for repairs and the technician turned them in. Now by criticizing these laws there are people who are going to say that I don't want to see people who sexually abuse children punished. They couldn't be further from the truth. The punishment needs to be handed out at sentencing, if there is a shred of evidence that the person may repeat the act then steps need to be taken to ensure that they don't.
You could organize a huge don't go to work day. That usually a great way to demand things. They depend on your labor to support them. When you do this its not the businesses you are trying to damage (although they will be as well) its the taxes the government won't be receiving because of that. Everyone just takes their week of vacation all at the same time until teh government changes their mind.
REPLY: Ummmmm, taxes are still taken out of your vacation wages/salery, and the companies still pay taxes when you're on vacation/sick leave, whatever. Just thought I'd mention that.
So Jim what you are proposing is that there are more problems then just the ones we currently acknowledge. I read your post and saw problems amoung
problems that should never be to begin with. Was that your intent?
Originally posted by grimreaper797
I think a goal should be the secret files they are classifying in the name of national security come out.
It is now you who are confused. At no time in the history of the United States of America or the world for that matter has it been a RIGHT or a FREEDOM to see classified material. No matter which government classified it.
You could organize a huge don't go to work day. That usually a great way to demand things.
It may be your right or freedom to protest any way you like ( non violently of course ) But be aware that when you go back to work ( of course being 17 you have parents to support you ) there is no RIGHT or FREEDOM to protect your job. If you leave your job to protest some secret video you just know the government has, you may not have a job to go back to.
No job - no money - no money - good luck.
The people decide what is or isnt in the best interest of our country. if we want the videos, that is our choice.
Wrong again. We live in a Republic, hence our elected officials decide what is best for us. We put them office just for that you know. Good or bad... the only way we decide what is best for us is by voting!
There has to be something more to it if the government doesn't respond though. Some sort of action must be taken.
Sounds just a little bit harsh....just what action would you take? I would really like to know. I can not just decide one day to not go to work or not to purchase gas to protest...the only one I am hurting is ME...by not having a job to go back to.
[edit on 6/7/2006 by Mirthful Me and me too!]
[edit on 6-7-2006 by Mr Beezer]
Originally posted by zappafan1
REPLY: Ummmmm, taxes are still taken out of your vacation wages/salery, and the companies still pay taxes when you're on vacation/sick leave, whatever. Just thought I'd mention that.
then just not go to work, no vacation or anything. What are vacation wages? I know salary wise it would be hard. But as far as wage workers go, they could do alot of damage. Every person being paid wages has a great deal of power just by not attenting work in an organized way.
If the company threatens to fire you, the group threatens to stop buying their products. They tell the companies, help get our problems fixed and we will help fix the problem you are facing now. Never forget the people hold the power. No business or government can bully us into saying what we can or can't do. As long as we aren't taking away other peoples rights and freedom we can do whatever we like, and no one can tell us otherwise. We the people need to make sure they remember we are the threat to them, not they are the threat to us.
Originally posted by grimreaper797
then just not go to work, no vacation or anything. What are vacation wages? I know salary wise it would be hard.
If the company threatens to fire you, the group threatens to stop buying their products. They tell the companies, help get our problems fixed and we will help fix the problem you are facing now.
No offense but you really need to understand how business works before trying to come up with an idea like that.
The company I work sells software (our goods and services ) WORLD WIDE!!!!!
Is this group of people to boycott you are talking about really goign to stand up in Kenya - Nirobi - Greenland - France and everywhere else my company sells goods and say:
"We are not going to buy your software unless you let Mr. Beezer leave for a 2 day protest in Washington so we can see the secret video..of ...umm...the....ummm.....ahhhhhh.....YEAH!"
Once you get out of high school ( you said you are 17 in an earlier post right? ) move out of your parents house and get a job you may know what vacation wages are...and how this world actually works. Nice try to solve some problems though...just won't work my young friend.
Originally posted by grimreaper797
Rights and Freedoms are two different things. I am thanking The Vagabond for getting my mind working on this part.
Well, now I'm thanking you both.
I'm afraid I'm a little slow on the uptake here, however.
A freedom is nothing more then being able to have choice.
So what I talked about losing in my post are freedoms, right? The freedom to speak freely in my home. The freedom to be anonymous. The freedom to go wherever and whenever I want (within reason) without being tracked or monitored.
Rights are the means to preserving freedom.
The privacy rights enumerated in the constitution protect my freedoms mentioned above, is that right?
So...
Rights = means
Freedom = ends
They can't take away the ends, until they have taken away all the means to protect the ends.
Only if we, being afraid to exercise our rights (means), voluntarily give up the ends (freedoms) in hopes of not forcing their hand. And that's what I am guilty of.
I swear, you may be 17 but I wish I had your acumen when I was twice your age!
Originally posted by Mr Beezer
It is now you who are confused. At no time in the history of the United States of America or the world for that matter has it been a RIGHT or a FREEDOM to see classified material. No matter which government classified it.
we decide what is dangerous. The government isn't in charge of our safety to begin with. They are in charge of making sure we have our rights. classified material didn't exist back when this country formed because there is a good quote to answer it.
"We are not afraid to entrust the American people with unpleasant facts, foreign ideas, alien philosophies, and competitive values. For a nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people."
John F. Kennedy
It may be your right or freedom to protest any way you like ( non violently of course ) But be aware that when you go back to work ( of course being 17 you have parents to support you ) there is no RIGHT or FREEDOM to protect your job. If you leave your job to protest some secret video you just know the government has, you may not have a job to go back to.
No job - no money - no money - good luck.
When you are a large group protesting, you hold complete control. You control the government, you control business, you control your nation. If they threaten to fire you, you bring it up to the group. The group tells the company they will protest the product if they fire the workers. Then tell the business all they have to do to end this is help ned the situation. A large group of people not buying their products is a death sentence for the company. The company will be more likely to try and help your group then hurt it. The comapny would rather help you accomplish what you want and get back to business then lose its business almost completely.
Wrong again. We live in a Republic, hence our elected officials decide what is best for us. We put them office just for that you know. Good or bad... the only way we decide what is best for us is by voting!
you are the one who is wrong. This government was entrusted to ensure our rights and nothing more. They don't get to make new rules to decide what is best for us.
Sounds just a little bit harsh....just what action would you take? I would really like to know. I can not just decide one day to not go to work or not to purchase gas to protest...the only one I am hurting is ME...by not having a job to go back to.
Its not what action would I take, its what action would we take. And thats whatever action we feel like. No company or government can bully us if we stick together. You don't see the power of numbers.
Originally posted by Mr Beezer
No offense but you really need to understand how business works before trying to come up with an idea like that.
The company I work sells software (our goods and services ) WORLD WIDE!!!!!
Is this group of people to boycott you are talking about really goign to stand up in Kenya - Nirobi - Greenland - France and everywhere else my company sells goods and say:
"We are not going to buy your software unless you let Mr. Beezer leave for a 2 day protest in Washington so we can see the secret video..of ...umm...the....ummm.....ahhhhhh.....YEAH!"
Once you get out of high school ( you said you are 17 in an earlier post right? ) move out of your parents house and get a job you may know what vacation wages are...and how this world actually works. Nice try to solve some problems though...just won't work my young friend.
No offense but you do realize america is a huge market. You seriously are suggesting that the company would willingly lay off some employees in exachange for a huge loss in profits and workers? Wouldn't it be more profitable to just help the group further their demands to the government, thus not only ending the problem but getting loads of good PR (fighting for the common man). come on now think about the long run.
ahaha 2 day protest? No its more like indefinate. If the government is drained of all those taxes, they will collapse quicker then the time it take to get from lunch to dinner. Soon as those reports came in they would fall out of their chairs and die of a heart attack.
"The most common way people give up their power is by thinking they don't have any."
Alice Walker
we indeed have more power together then you can imagine. We do it for whatever cause we want. Whatever cause the group agrees on. It doesn't try to get it through some words and play sematics all day, it does it through action.
Lets see who crumbles first, the people or the government getting hardly any taxes. Money makes the world go round.
Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Well, now I'm thanking you both.
I'm afraid I'm a little slow on the uptake here, however.
its alright. I posted this thread then Vagabond said in a u2u that its philosophy in the sense of freedoms and rights. I thought about it and realized that Right are the means, and Freedom is the ends.
So what I talked about losing in my post are freedoms, right? The freedom to speak freely in my home. The freedom to be anonymous. The freedom to go wherever and whenever I want (within reason) without being tracked or monitored.
well its hard to say. I say speak freely. Screw the people listening. the moment some one gets acted upon that though, thats when your freedoms are being taken. Keep doing whatever you want. When its acted on though by the government thats when your freedoms are being taken away.
Its more so that its not the government right to use our taxes this way. I don't want my taxes put toward that, and they shouldn't be allow if we don't want it. They don't decide whats best for our safety, they decide how to protect our rights, thats it.
The privacy rights enumerated in the constitution protect my freedoms mentioned above, is that right?
So...
Rights = means
Freedom = ends
rights are the way to protect the freedom. You have the right to speak out. You have the freedom to make the decisions to do whatever you would like, so long as you don't infringe on some one elses rights.
Only if we, being afraid to exercise our rights (means), voluntarily give up the ends (freedoms) in hopes of not forcing their hand. And that's what I am guilty of.
I swear, you may be 17 but I wish I had your acumen when I was twice your age!
basically. You cannot be afraid of them. You must remain to be a threat to the government, that is your duty. It is your job to make the government fear you, as a duty to your country and people.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE stay in school, and after you graduate from high school go to business school, and then take some law classes along the way.
You seem very smart, just not educated in the REAL WORLD of LIFE.
And sorry my young friend but telling me I am wrong when I said we live in a REPUBLIC?...? That is what we have in America. If it were a Democracy it would be one person one vote...electoral college makes it a REPUBLIC.
You do realize JFK was president in the 1960's right.....the country was formed in the early 1770's and finalized in 1776... Just an FYI...that quote was NOT directed at the founding of the government, but the continuing appathy of the American people.
Besides to say the government didnt classify info as secret in 1776 is humorous at best. Do you think Washington had Ben Franklin print the battle plans to be handed out to every citizen of the colony...ummm NO!
You seem very smart, just not educated in the REAL WORLD of LIFE.
And sorry my young friend but telling me I am wrong when I said we live in a REPUBLIC?...? That is what we have in America. If it were a Democracy it would be one person one vote...electoral college makes it a REPUBLIC.
classified material didn't exist back when this country formed because there is a good quote to answer it.
"We are not afraid to entrust the American people with unpleasant facts, foreign ideas, alien philosophies, and competitive values. For a nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people."
John F. Kennedy
You do realize JFK was president in the 1960's right.....the country was formed in the early 1770's and finalized in 1776... Just an FYI...that quote was NOT directed at the founding of the government, but the continuing appathy of the American people.
Besides to say the government didnt classify info as secret in 1776 is humorous at best. Do you think Washington had Ben Franklin print the battle plans to be handed out to every citizen of the colony...ummm NO!
Originally posted by Mr Beezer
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE stay in school, and after you graduate from high school go to business school, and then take some law classes along the way.
You seem very smart, just not educated in the REAL WORLD of LIFE.
And sorry my young friend but telling me I am wrong when I said we live in a REPUBLIC?...? That is what we have in America. If it were a Democracy it would be one person one vote...electoral college makes it a REPUBLIC.
I suggest you look at the writtings of the foundations of the country. When you read then what does it say was the reason for forming a government?
www.ushistory.org...
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed
to secure those rights. thats why governments are instituted amoung men. Thats what we have strayed from. I will let you know I am very much against a democracy. The reason why, the same reason our forefather were against it, is that in a democracy you can abolish the basic right or make new law to erode those rights by making 51% of the public afraid for their lives.
This government was made to protect our rights, and they are not doing that.
You do realize JFK was president in the 1960's right.....the country was formed in the early 1770's and finalized in 1776... Just an FYI...that quote was NOT directed at the founding of the government, but the continuing appathy of the American people.
You do realize that this just further my point that people deserve to observe the truth. Classified is just another way of saying "something we don't want people to know". If it is something they don't want people to know, that means they are afraid. People shall decide what they do or dont want to hear or be released.
If people are too stupid to know better its only because we allowed it to become that way.
Besides to say the government didnt classify info as secret in 1776 is humorous at best. Do you think Washington had Ben Franklin print the battle plans to be handed out to every citizen of the colony...ummm NO!
no and the people of the colonies knew that it was important and wanted it classified. To say nothing should be classified is stupid. To say the people don't deserve to unclassify whatever documents they want is stupid. Any person american born has the right to know what their government is doing. They don't need to know how they are doing it, but they deserve proof of what they are doing.
In this case, a video of the plane hitting the pentagon, well we want it unclassified and that is our choice.
I have lost the freedom to come to a conspiracy board such as ATS and without a further concern join it knowing that my freedom of speech is protected
and unobserved by Big Brother in any way. Now I gotta think twice about it, which is why I lurked on this board for a year or so before joining. So to
the lurkers- I feel ya.
Should I manage somehow to tick off the wrong guy in a black suit, I now must contend with the possibility that if they really wanted, I could, just at their words, be considered a terrorist and suffer any number of the Patriot Act's provisions. And there's not a damn thing I can do about it. Go read it if you do not know what I am talking about. So I have lost the freedom that comes with guaranteed due justice, and must now to some extent fear the power of government. It used to be that government feared the people. We, the American people have let the government take from us what should never be granted to anyone: total impunity.
I have lost the freedom from worrying that my personal information may be accessed at any time by Big Brother, for whatever they desire.
I have lost the freedom to assemble on public property during certain political events without being stuck in a cage like an animal because I might not agree with their agenda.
I have lost the freedom to spend my money the way I want to and contribute to the tax system on a voluntary basis, the way it was written, and according to what I can afford. As it stands, 35% is witheld from me, no no, let's make that INVOLUNTARILY TAKEN from me, then more from the state, and then I have to pay sales tax on top of that. This country went to war once over 15% taxation. People back then wouldn't put up with that crap. They DIED over someone trying to take their hard-earned money from them. So when do the guns come out? At 80% 90% 10876598760865067%???? Oh, don't worry, they're going to take the guns too.
I have lost the freedom to go down to the voting booth, knowing for sure that my vote would be counted, correctly, for the person I voted for, with a verifiable paper trail. I'll tell you a box that needs to be on those damn voting machines: "Would you favor abolishing the IRS and the FED in favor of a 20% national sales tax?"
I have lost the freedom to travel to most any country in the world without the fear of being kidnapped or murdered just for being an American, thanks to my government being more concerned about the New World Order than the New American Order.
I have lost the freedom to walk down certain American city streets and grab my girlfriend's ass when I thought no one was looking for fear it might show up on some police security camera footage somewhere. (I suppose I could live with this one, but why should I have to, dammit?)
I have lost the freedom to interact with certain ethnicities in this country for fear that it might be considered "helping the terrorists," and alas again be caught in the Patriot Act's overextended web.
I have lost the freedom to speek freely on the phone, knowing that every single phone call is recorded and stored somewhere. And worse, have to avoid any word that could be used as a trigger for red flagging those mean ole black suits into coming after me.
I have lost the freedom to partake in any activist group I want, for fear of being watched by government.
I have lost the freedom that comes with privacy, because privacy is now just illusion.
I have lost the freedom to freely transfer any amount of my money I want to any account I want for fear of it triggering government flags.
And finally, (if things keep going the way they are) I will likely lose the freedom to make this post on the internet. Just a few I could think of, but there are probably more.
Should I manage somehow to tick off the wrong guy in a black suit, I now must contend with the possibility that if they really wanted, I could, just at their words, be considered a terrorist and suffer any number of the Patriot Act's provisions. And there's not a damn thing I can do about it. Go read it if you do not know what I am talking about. So I have lost the freedom that comes with guaranteed due justice, and must now to some extent fear the power of government. It used to be that government feared the people. We, the American people have let the government take from us what should never be granted to anyone: total impunity.
I have lost the freedom from worrying that my personal information may be accessed at any time by Big Brother, for whatever they desire.
I have lost the freedom to assemble on public property during certain political events without being stuck in a cage like an animal because I might not agree with their agenda.
I have lost the freedom to spend my money the way I want to and contribute to the tax system on a voluntary basis, the way it was written, and according to what I can afford. As it stands, 35% is witheld from me, no no, let's make that INVOLUNTARILY TAKEN from me, then more from the state, and then I have to pay sales tax on top of that. This country went to war once over 15% taxation. People back then wouldn't put up with that crap. They DIED over someone trying to take their hard-earned money from them. So when do the guns come out? At 80% 90% 10876598760865067%???? Oh, don't worry, they're going to take the guns too.
I have lost the freedom to go down to the voting booth, knowing for sure that my vote would be counted, correctly, for the person I voted for, with a verifiable paper trail. I'll tell you a box that needs to be on those damn voting machines: "Would you favor abolishing the IRS and the FED in favor of a 20% national sales tax?"
I have lost the freedom to travel to most any country in the world without the fear of being kidnapped or murdered just for being an American, thanks to my government being more concerned about the New World Order than the New American Order.
I have lost the freedom to walk down certain American city streets and grab my girlfriend's ass when I thought no one was looking for fear it might show up on some police security camera footage somewhere. (I suppose I could live with this one, but why should I have to, dammit?)
I have lost the freedom to interact with certain ethnicities in this country for fear that it might be considered "helping the terrorists," and alas again be caught in the Patriot Act's overextended web.
I have lost the freedom to speek freely on the phone, knowing that every single phone call is recorded and stored somewhere. And worse, have to avoid any word that could be used as a trigger for red flagging those mean ole black suits into coming after me.
I have lost the freedom to partake in any activist group I want, for fear of being watched by government.
I have lost the freedom that comes with privacy, because privacy is now just illusion.
I have lost the freedom to freely transfer any amount of my money I want to any account I want for fear of it triggering government flags.
And finally, (if things keep going the way they are) I will likely lose the freedom to make this post on the internet. Just a few I could think of, but there are probably more.
You don't have to worry until you start losing rights. When you start losing rights, your freedoms are coming next. The thing is hardly anyone uses
those rights anymore, so how do we know we are losing them? Exercise them and you will find out how much of your rights have been lost.
Go out and buy a gun. Go out and protest. Go out and gather with other people to decide how to stop stuff you don't agree with. It is your duty to stand for something. It is your duty to act on that.
In california you can no longer by rifles that use .50BMG bullets. Thats our RIGHTS being taken away right there. Little by little or one big step, those are our rights. We must practice or rights to defend them. You use the protest to defend the gun. If they take your right to protest you use that gun to protect that right to protest. If you can't protest, thats why they gave you that right to the gun. You are given EVERY right to defend them, and to defend the ends which is freedom.
They gave you multiple rights as a fail safe to protect eachother. To protect one right, you must use the other as a fail safe. If you let them take both, then all you have left is freedom with no way to defend it. Freedom becomes a privilage rather then your liberty. When you lose the means the ends become a privilage, its then a dictatorship because you don't have the power to decide what will or won't be done, your freedom is then gone.
These rights must NEVER be eroded in the slightest. You must exercise your rights because they are the means to freedom, they are the duties of every american citizen.
Go out and buy a gun. Go out and protest. Go out and gather with other people to decide how to stop stuff you don't agree with. It is your duty to stand for something. It is your duty to act on that.
In california you can no longer by rifles that use .50BMG bullets. Thats our RIGHTS being taken away right there. Little by little or one big step, those are our rights. We must practice or rights to defend them. You use the protest to defend the gun. If they take your right to protest you use that gun to protect that right to protest. If you can't protest, thats why they gave you that right to the gun. You are given EVERY right to defend them, and to defend the ends which is freedom.
They gave you multiple rights as a fail safe to protect eachother. To protect one right, you must use the other as a fail safe. If you let them take both, then all you have left is freedom with no way to defend it. Freedom becomes a privilage rather then your liberty. When you lose the means the ends become a privilage, its then a dictatorship because you don't have the power to decide what will or won't be done, your freedom is then gone.
These rights must NEVER be eroded in the slightest. You must exercise your rights because they are the means to freedom, they are the duties of every american citizen.
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