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Is the Fear of God Equal to the Fear of Satan?

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posted on Jul, 6 2006 @ 08:35 PM
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To fear losing God's love is to fear something false.

God isn't going to stop loving us. Ever. He never has done anything but love each and every one of us.

Perfect love casts out fear, remember?

God is Perfect. God is Love. God's love is perfect.

There is no fear in that.

Fear comes from the unknown, not the known.




posted on Jul, 7 2006 @ 12:51 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38
This is from a newsletter I get --which is why I'm posting it in its entirety, permission granted at the bottom of the e-mail as follows: Please feel free to use, copy or distribute any material within the "Biblical Hebrew E-Magazine" for non-profit educational purposes only.)

Their website is
Biblical Hebrew Research Center


Word of the Month - יראה (Yirah - Fear)
By: Jeff A. Benner


This Hebrew noun is used forty-five times and is most frequently translated as fear. In our English language fear is a state of excitedness, in a negative way, toward something terrible. Before we look at the Hebraic meaning of this word we will examine its use in the common context of "the Fear of the Lord" which appears twenty-seven times.

Proverbs 15:33 (RSV)
The fear of the LORD is instruction in wisdom, and humility goes before honor.

The common understanding of this verse is that if one is afraid of the Lord he will have wisdom but, as we shall see this is not consistent with its use in the Hebrew language. .........The word yirah comes from the parent root yar which means "to flow" and is related to words meaning river and rain, from their flowing, and to throw in the sense of flowing. From this we can see that when one is afraid the insides begin to shake, a flowing of the insides. But as the word yirah means "to flow" it is not limited to "fear" alone......


Hope I'm not violating some copyright code by shortening the quote, queenannie, but in the Old Testament Hebrew Lexicon on line at Crosswalk.com, yirah is never defined as flow.

Here is how it is defined: fear, terror, fearing

1. fear, terror
2. awesome or terrifying thing (object causing fear)
3. fear (of God), respect, reverence, piety
4. revered

It is from a word transliterated as "Yare'" which is translated " fearing, reverent, afraid"

That word is from another word also transliterated as "Yare'" which means
1. to fear, revere, be afraid
1. (Qal)
1. to fear, be afraid
2. to stand in awe of, be awed
3. to fear, reverence, honour, respect
2. (Niphal)
1. to be fearful, be dreadful, be feared
2. to cause astonishment and awe, be held in awe
3. to inspire reverence or godly fear or awe
3. (Piel) to make afraid, terrify
2. (TWOT) to shoot, pour

Here are some verses where yirah is translated fear: Job 28:28, Ps 19:9

Where the intent is to say "fear the Lord", yare' is sometimes used, as in Ps 33:8, 18; Ps 34:7

Ps 36:1 reads "The transgression of the wicked saith within my heart, that there is no fear of God before his eyes."

The word "fear" there is transliterated as "pachad" and is defined as:
terror, dread
1. dread
2. object of dread

The quote included "yirat" for which there are no entries found in the Hebrew Lexicon. It may have been a simple typo, but it says clearly that the root for yirah is "yar" which is also not found in the Lexicon.

When entered in the search, "yar" returns responses with "yare'" which takes us back to the "fear and reverence" entries.

This cannot be interpreted as meaning that "yar" is not a Hebrew word, since the Lexicon only returns words used in the translation of the KJV Bible, but it is clear from what information can be derived that "yirah" doesn't mean "flow" in the context of any of the places it is found within that parameter.

Hebrew sentence construction is also not commented on in the Lexicon as having studied another language in addition to English, I am aware that a language's constructs are important information.

So then, I'm not discounting what the quote said, just that it is not possible to confirm with what is available to most Christians, and therefore, is not likely to vastly change the meaning of "to fear the Lord" as to "reverence Him, giving respect and submissive homage" which is understood to be the meaning in most of Christianity, since the translators were also Christian.

In addition it is too clear from the other verses, not quoted in the external source quote, which clearly indicate that to "reverence the Lord with submissive homage" is what is intended by the "fear of the Lord" verses.

Examples areL

Ps 102:15 So the heathen shall fear the name of the LORD, and all the kings of the earth thy glory.

Ps 103:17 But the mercy of the LORD is from everlasting to everlasting upon them that fear him, and his righteousness unto children's children;

Prov 2:5 Then you will understand the fear of the Lord, And find the knowledge of God.

And so on.



[edited because I hit the send button instead of the Preview Post button first and grammar was fractured]

[edit on 7-7-2006 by curiousity]



posted on Jul, 7 2006 @ 04:08 PM
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Originally posted by curiousity
Hope I'm not violating some copyright code by shortening the quote, queenannie, but in the Old Testament Hebrew Lexicon on line at Crosswalk.com, yirah is never defined as flow.

I think it is okay-since the initial citation I posted is complete and includes the legal stuff.


The quote included "yirat" for which there are no entries found in the Hebrew Lexicon. It may have been a simple typo, but it says clearly that the root for yirah is "yar" which is also not found in the Lexicon.

Not a typo--its because transliteration of Hebrew is not an exact science, so to speak. Even in Israel.

Also--the change from 'he' to 'tav' (making yirah to yirat) is something only apparent in the Hebrew text--and so it's not a word even found in Strong's.

In Hebrew, it’s not so much a matter of conjugation and what not—it is a language based on pictographic concepts (somewhat similar to Chinese)—22 that have arisen from ancient concepts. The tendency to translate arbitrarily, as words, is a newer practice, but isn’t very helpful, for the most part. Mostly it is the Christian theologians and scholars who do this—but much is lost in the translation. Hebrew is a very old language—and Christianity is a new religion. Often, study aids and what not, that have been written within the last century, reflect modern doctrine rather than seeking to stay true to the texts available. I prefer things published in the 1800’s, myself. I find them to be more pure and oriented to the original texts, rather than doctrines.

If you’re interested, here are a couple of pages, with charts, that might help—I’m not doing a very good job of explaining it—it’s hard to convey.

www.ancient-hebrew.org...
language evolution

word studies
www.ancient-hebrew.org...

The root for yirah is yar, as you said (when you look up transliterations, in Hebrew, you’ll often get lost, because there is no arbitrary transliteration, even among those whom are fluent in the language)

Reduced to the simplest original form, which is y-r, we get two concepts:

Yod--Closed hand work/throw/worship
Resh--Head of a man/first/beginning/top

With the He added at the end (making it 'yirah') there is the added concept of 'look, reveal, breath, sigh'
And with 'tav' (making it yirat and linked to The Name), the word is enhanced by being defined as a 'mark, sign, signature.' That means it is of God and only God--set with His seal.

Sort of like ‘flowing from the top’ –our ability to understand God (and to understand is to truly be astounded) is given by Him—we cannot seek Him out so our ‘worship’ must come first from Him. And when it's His, as indicated by the phrase, it is trustworthy and true.

We love Him because He first loved us.


You encompasses my path and my lying down, and are acquainted with all my ways. For there is not a word in my tongue, but, O LORD, that you know it altogether. You have beset me behind and before, and laid your hand upon me. Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it.
(Psalms 139:3-6)


Words start out as nouns, and verbs form from those. But it is not always transferable in the exact same fashion—that’s where the symbolism in the characters help clarify the essence of the words. These are word pictures, rich in their own right—whereas our modern words are ideas in themselves—the individual letters are just letters on their own. And so in English, we have so many words! Because we have no way to precisely create an image of the idea with our letters into words.

Also, what is important to note is that being of that group of ideas which share the quality of being ‘of the LORD,’ there is another concept thrown in, as far as God’s royal nature setting the words apart when used with His title, which I mentioned above, with the 'tav' added to the word. 'Tav' also means 'truth.'

These resources are pretty available, anymore--since we have the internet--it's not any farther away than crosswalk or biblegateway, blueletterbible, etc. And much more profitable, by a long shot.

But of course, that's a personal choice! But if you do a google on 'aleph bet' or 'aleph beit,' you'll be rewarded with a huge variety of hits.


Ps 102:15 So the heathen shall fear the name of the LORD, and all the kings of the earth thy glory.

This one isn't the same--this is the heathen fearing the name of the LORD. From the heathen toward the name.


Ps 103:17 But the mercy of the LORD is from everlasting to everlasting upon them that fear him, and his righteousness unto children's children;

This isn't the 'fear of the LORD'--it refers to the something coming from those that fear, toward the LORD.


Prov 2:5 Then you will understand the fear of the Lord, And find the knowledge of God.

This one is 'the fear of the LORD.' But if you apply the regular meaning to it--it doesn't make sense. Does the LORD fear? If He did, how could we understand it? And therefore find knowledge of God? Surely we are not going to get closer to God and find He's got an achilles heel?

Do you see the difference?



posted on Jul, 7 2006 @ 05:56 PM
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Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell

For this reason alone you should fear God. How could you Fear anything else but God?

Proverbs 1:7 The fear of God is the beginning of Wisdom....

Fear God every moment of your life and you will never fail to be attentive to Gods will. By doing so you are assuring your spot in the the Kingdom of God. Is that not wise?

Proverbs 16:6 ...By the fear of God men depart from evil.

Fear God and you will always fullfill the ways of righteousness. You will avoid myraid evils and calamities, you will be physically sound and healthy, and you will live a long life. Your character will improve and your virtue will grow.


When you forget to fear God you become inattentive, you are not heedful of circumstances and potential consequences. You might say something offensive and get into an arguement. You may challenge something you might as well have ignored. Maybe you will become selfish or materialistic. Trouble like this comes from inattentiveness when you fail to fear God at all times.


[edit on 7-7-2006 by JohnDoe43]



posted on Jul, 7 2006 @ 09:58 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38

.......Does the LORD fear? If He did, how could we understand it? And therefore find knowledge of God? Surely we are not going to get closer to God and find He's got an achilles heel?

Do you see the difference?


Not really, and it still makes far more sense in English to read and understand the verses as fear towards, of, for, the Lord, than in any other way, but when I can, I'll go see what your external links are about.

Since I'm no Hebrew scholar I'm out of my depth here anyway.

However, though as you said some of the verses that use "fear of the Lord" imply fear by others of the Lord, I don't see that the ones the external source used are significantly different in concept.

I'm sure you will agree that the Lord does seek those who will worship Him in Spirit and in truth? And that we are urged to cast our cares on Him, and to trust in(to) Him, and to depend on Him for our supplies in life? To lean on Him in other words, that He urges us to let Him live through us down here, that we are His outlets on earth? Is that not the "submissive homage" and obedience to a higher order of Being and therefore, reverence as for the Holy which is wisdom to man? It is certainly foolish to depend on man for our well-being.

So then, why try so hard to say that "fear of the Lord" means something other than reverence for and honor to Him?



posted on Jul, 7 2006 @ 10:19 PM
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Originally posted by curiousity
I'm sure you will agree that the Lord does seek those who will worship Him in Spirit and in truth? And that we are urged to cast our cares on Him, and to trust in(to) Him, and to depend on Him for our supplies in life? To lean on Him in other words, that He urges us to let Him live through us down here, that we are His outlets on earth? Is that not the "submissive homage" and obedience to a higher order of Being and therefore, reverence as for the Holy which is wisdom to man? It is certainly foolish to depend on man for our well-being.

A hearty yes to all of those!



So then, why try so hard to say that "fear of the Lord" means something other than reverence for and honor to Him?

Well, I didn't mean for it turn out that way...
I just happened upon that email after posting in this thread and thought I would share it. But, I guess....nevermind!




posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 12:46 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38

Originally posted by curiousity
So then, why try so hard to say that "fear of the Lord" means something other than reverence for and honor to Him?

Well, I didn't mean for it turn out that way...
I just happened upon that email after posting in this thread and thought I would share it. But, I guess....nevermind!


Well, okay, if you say so.

I went to those sites you link-copied above, and they are pretty cool though I don't see what use I can make of them just yet. I've bookmarked them though. I wish I had taken up the study of Hebrew too. I think I'm too fired in the brain with the business of life to start now but who knows, maybe I'll still take a stab at it.

Anyway,I got a book in the mail that I'd like to discuss, probably not one you've seen, but I"m gonna do some quotes from scanned pages in the near future, that is once my shoulder improves a bit more.

Here's a quote to get us started. I might have my granddaughter take dictation as she is a pretty fast typist if not the most accurate.

The author is apparently quoting Irenaeus who "included this in his five volume "Against Heresies"', according to the author, as well as the material included in The Ante-Nicene Fathers, a book by Alexander Robers and James Donaldson. The author indicates that Irenaeus is said to be a discIple of Polycarp, who is said to have been a disciple of the Apostle John, so that only once removed, Irenaeus received the "teaching of the Apostles".

I couldn't find a web site for the book or the author; though there are several Elijah Projects on Google none seem to be the right one. The mailing address is:
The Elijah Project
PO Box 870153
Mesquite, TX 75150

I did find the book for sale at www.fetchbook.info...


THE ANTICHRIST by Larry D Harper, New Matter Copyright @ 1992 by the Elijah Project

Unbelivers have their schools of thought (haereseis), each with its own disciples (mathetes) and its own tradition (paradosis). Christianity also has disciples and a tradition. However, Christianity is not a school of thought because the apostolic tradition is divinely revealed to the Apostes. So it is not the product of human thought processes. The heretics have made the apostolic tradition a school of thought by changing it to suit themselves. Therefore the difference between the Church and Christian heresies is obvious. The church does not change the apostolic tradition. The heretics do.


Can anyone help a sister out by giving me the correct code to quote "external source"? I've tried [ex source] [/ex source] and [quote ex source] [/quote ex source] and [quote external source] [/quote external source], none work.

[edit on 8-7-2006 by curiousity]



posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 01:02 PM
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It is ex (in brackets) and /ex (in brackets, of course)

There is a little button, too, (if your forum settings show the formatting help for links and lists, etc...) and it is the second from the left and it says EX (between H1 and B), that you can use. But ex being so short I usually just type it in.

And thanks for your link--I'll come back after I check it out. I just wanted to answer your question right away!




posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 01:07 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38
It is ex (in brackets) and /ex (in brackets, of course)

There is a little button, too, (if your forum settings show the formatting help for links and lists, etc...) and it is the second from the left and it says EX (between H1 and B), that you can use. But ex being so short I usually just type it in.

And thanks for your link--I'll come back after I check it out. I just wanted to answer your question right away!


Thanks, the thing worked (see edited post)!

I'll be looking forward to the next post.



posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 04:21 PM
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Well, I have a rather lengthy post, but it doesn't seem to be on the same track as the one upon which this thread was started, by Great Tech. So out of respect and courtesy to everyone else, I thought it best to start another thread--more geared toward the ideas of what apostolic means and how that affects us personally.

It is at Apostolic Succession as Authority





[edit on 7/8/2006 by queenannie38]



posted on Jul, 8 2006 @ 10:40 PM
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Is the Fear of God Equal to the Fear of Satan?


Yea, thou I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil; for thou art with me; Thy rod and thy staff, they comfort me. Psalms 23:4




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