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Extraterrestrial vs. Military Test @ Roswell

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posted on Jun, 27 2006 @ 08:42 AM
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I recently saw an episode of UFO files on the History channel which toyed with the idea that the craft that crashed in the New Mexico desert was not a mogul balloon, nor an extraterrestrial craft, but a Top Secret US military aircraft operating out of White Sands.

They supported this thesis through the following pieces of information:

1. Secret Nazi blueprints were found after the war detailing saucer-like aerial vehicles.

2. German scientists responsible for the inventing of various Nazi technology were persuaded to work for the US military in early post-war times.

Of course their arguements were more complicated than this, but they have photographs of some of these prototype planes (some of which contained expiremental jet engines) and there shape in very similar to the delta described by Roswell eyewitnesses. Could it be possible that residents of Roswell mistook expirmental airplanes (which possibly had some form of jet engines) for extraterestrail craft?

With my limited knowledge of the Roswell subject, may I ask what evidence, if any, do we have which refutes this idea or points to an extraterrestrial craft over a secret military one?




posted on Jun, 27 2006 @ 12:19 PM
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Its quite possible, but if the US got a working "Nazi UFO" in the air, I fail to see why we havent seen it yet. Sure technology is kept hidden a long time, but not this long. It just goes against all logic. You make something to USE it, not to keep it hidden. Especially if the object in question cost 1000+ billions to develop and maintain.

That they have something like that today and may have had it for the last 10 or even 20 years without telling I could understand, but not 50, no.



posted on Jun, 27 2006 @ 01:43 PM
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Hi there, CaptainKirk!

I believe Gazrok has done a
spectacular job in his systematic approach regarding what happened or what many believe happened in Roswell.

You can go over them as you please, here:

Part I: www.abovetopsecret.com...
Part II: www.abovetopsecret.com...
Part III Section A: www.abovetopsecret.com...
Part III Section B: www.abovetopsecret.com...
Part III Section C: www.abovetopsecret.com...
Part III Section D: www.abovetopsecret.com...
Part III Section E: www.abovetopsecret.com...
Part IV Section A: www.abovetopsecret.com...
Part IV Section B: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Hope I didn't scare yah with the links!

I know it's a long read, but hey...

Happy reading!


[edit on 27-6-2006 by bigmakoy]



posted on Jun, 27 2006 @ 02:25 PM
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I've read Gazrok's fantastic report on the Roswell crash before. I'm just wondering whether their is evidence aside from personal testimony, that would point towards an extraterrestrial craft rather than a secret military vehicle.

Forgive me if their is something in those articles I overlooked. Its' quite a big report.



posted on Jun, 27 2006 @ 06:27 PM
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Originally posted by CaptainKirk
I recently saw an episode of UFO files on the History channel which toyed with the idea that the craft that crashed in the New Mexico desert was not a mogul balloon, nor an extraterrestrial craft, but a Top Secret US military aircraft operating out of White Sands.

They supported this thesis through the following pieces of information:

1. Secret Nazi blueprints were found after the war detailing saucer-like aerial vehicles.


Apparently, yes. Did they work? Not very likely. If the Nazis have had such technology the war would not have ended as it did. The 40's, antigravity technology and particle cannons, please, there's no way they could not have used it.

Anyways, there is no evidence those crafts worked, and the best we have got so far are similarities between some of those crafts, and actual crafts from the USAF, developed decades later. Needless to say, there are no particle weapons on 'em.

Too many assumptions, few evidences.



Of course their arguements were more complicated than this, but they have photographs of some of these prototype planes (some of which contained expiremental jet engines) and there shape in very similar to the delta described by Roswell eyewitnesses. Could it be possible that residents of Roswell mistook expirmental airplanes (which possibly had some form of jet engines) for extraterestrail craft?

With my limited knowledge of the Roswell subject, may I ask what evidence, if any, do we have which refutes this idea or points to an extraterrestrial craft over a secret military one?


Okay, where does the alien bodies fit in? The military report?

I dare to ask, what evidence do we have that those crafts really worked, that the US used nazi cientists to develop those crafts, and in which ocassions it had a later use?
No special weapon is useful if it has no use.

[edit on 27-6-2006 by Expose]



posted on Jun, 27 2006 @ 06:52 PM
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I'm on your side remember. I'm just trying to understand the arguement against this theory.

I never said that these experimental had ion cannons or anti-gravity propulsion systems, but possibly jet engines, something just a tad ahead of its time. Here are some of the craft UFO files showed:



This one with experimental jet engines



and this one with a prop

Could it be possible that the residences of roswell mistook things like these for alien craft?

btw could you point me in the right direction to the military reports detailing alien bodies?

[edit on 27-6-2006 by CaptainKirk]



posted on Jun, 28 2006 @ 04:32 AM
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The jet propulsion was invented by Frank Whittle in 1937. The USAF later gave importance to it, and used it.

Now, I don't see how we can make assumptions like these you are making without any evidence.
We have a military report. A cover-up. A bogus Air Force explanation. Witness report. Documents.

What do we have on this? Nothing. Zero. Nepias. Just some second hands docs and reports. So, I would say to stick on Gazrok's report, which is an amazing piece of intelligence by the way.

Edit: the reports from the aliens bodies came from the eye witnesses. The military didn't deny the existance of bodies, instead they said they were test dummies from years later.



[edit on 28-6-2006 by Expose]



posted on Jun, 28 2006 @ 04:43 AM
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A little off subject, did anyone see/read an article surrounding the Nazi experimentation into anti-gravity? I'm sure I saw a picture which was supposidly used in testing, like a stone/steel circle (similar to stone henge). It has interested me for a while but I haven't really had time to look into it. If anyone can provide links/ pictures it would be much appreciated.



posted on Jun, 28 2006 @ 04:47 AM
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I dont buy the Nazi UFO tech for Roswell. Any tech that was top secret in 1947 is mundane now over a half a century later there would be no reason to hide such old tech to this day. There fancy top secret Mogul ballon in 1947 was made out of balsa wood and tinfoil LOL clearly that would appear to be of ET origin to highly trained military personal in charge of the only atomic equiped bomber wing on the planet.

These Nazi saucer designs werent anything special if they were we would likely be talking German right now. They used conventional engines and like countless saucer craft attempts after them are just not very stable at great heights. Avro tried this same stuff for the US years later and never got it to work. The real tech gold from the Germans was the rockets and jet engines they made which is pretty much all public knowledge now.

If the Germans really had practical super advanced anti-grav tech in WW2 I doubt they would have lost. Even if they did have some but perhaps it wasn't quite ready for production the fact that 50 years after the fact neither the US or Russia put it into large scale production for their military means its really pointless IMO.

BTW wait for the next part of that show on the History channel its a two part show. At the end of it they have perhaps the best evidence for a Hyper sonic aircraft flying out of Area51.

Plus some cool info in "Lifer" tech which is very much like UFO described tech

[edit on 28-6-2006 by ShadowXIX]



posted on Jun, 28 2006 @ 07:50 AM
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Why would an alien craft crash??? They traveled so far only to crash? Did they run out of petrol? I don't think so. Advanced technology would prevent a crash. Advanced technology would make it able for them to prevent death. On the other hand, man made aircraft fails all the time.

If they want us to see them we will. It seems as if they don't want us to see them. Why then do we still get a glimpse every now and then? Why would they be visible from time to time? Stealth equipment male function? It seems to me that people are more likely to be behind any metal objects falling from the sky.

Are you prepared to be fooled by an announcement of the existence of extraterrestrials as a pretext to establishing a one world government?

Scientist is yet to find anything from space that would suggest extraterrestrial life. If anything unknown is found it is save to assume that it originated right here on this planet. We are first and only planet with life on it.



posted on Jun, 28 2006 @ 01:29 PM
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I think this sentence says everything you need to know about Roswell:

"Monkeys launched into space using captured Nazi V-2 rockets."





posted on Jun, 28 2006 @ 01:40 PM
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Originally posted by Your Master
Why would an alien craft crash??? They traveled so far only to crash? Did they run out of petrol? I don't think so. Advanced technology would prevent a crash. Advanced technology would make it able for them to prevent death. On the other hand, man made aircraft fails all the time.



You cant assume Alien tech would be infallible no matter how advanced. I dont know of a single mechanical system or organic lifeform that is 100% infallible. IMO its really impossible.

Throw in a lighting storm (a insanely powerful energy weapon really) which was going on at the time and interaction with alien (human) tech no matter how crude things like RADAR could have very well been new to alien lifeforms and the odds of something going wrong can shoot way up if that was the case.



posted on Jun, 28 2006 @ 09:04 PM
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I'm just wondering whether their is evidence aside from personal testimony, that would point towards an extraterrestrial craft rather than a secret military vehicle.

Forgive me if their is something in those articles I overlooked. Its' quite a big report.


Well, there is a lot of corraborating independent testimony that supports it, and that's why it's so intriguing, a few generals, and other high-ranking officers amongst them. And this is in the form of sworn affadavits. It's not like any of these guys ever profitted from their accounts, so it's hard to imagine why they'd risk their reputations (they come from a time when such a thing was valued) in stating the things they say (and have them match up in such incredible detail).

To go into your question though, Major Jesse Marcel was the CHIEF intelligence officer at Roswell Army Air Field in 1947. He THE intel officer of the only base in the WORLD housing an atomic bomber wing. I'd say it's safe to say he'd probably know a top secret project if he saw one, versus the alien debris he described...especially he'd know it from the balsa wood and tin foil used in Mogul.

The other angle here is that sure, such vehicles were attempted and projects were taking place. However, one would also need to show that such tests were taking place in that area. But, apart from some V2 tests at White Sands, no such projects are documented in the area at the time (and after 50 years, you can bet this is all thoroughly declassified), and it's safe to say Marcel would know a V-2 when he saw it. (and there is no record of a launch that would fit the bill). It would still be a few years before alternate aircraft were tested near the area (i.e. like the U-2 in the early 50's...which of course, like any project that could have crashed at Roswell, is full public knowledge these days).

The simplest explanation is easy. If it was such a test, the military could have simply said (in 1947), it was a military test plane, and there would be NOTHING more said about it. Roswell was a military town. Heck, I grew up in military towns and communities, and even in the 80's, if the military said to forget it, you forgot it. So, imagine how much moreso this was true right after WWII!



Scientist is yet to find anything from space that would suggest extraterrestrial life. If anything unknown is found it is save to assume that it originated right here on this planet. We are first and only planet with life on it.


Not so fast! NASA has said quite publicly that they are convinced liquid water flowed on Mars and that it can yet be found there. Clementine has also found what many scientists believe to be ice on a part of our moon. In addition, one of Jupiter's moons is suspected of not only having liquid water, but perhaps even an ocean of it beneath the ice! Now, if you've ever looked at a SINGLE drop of water under a microscope, you'll see it's teeming with life! It's hard to imagine that water elsewhere wouldn't have the same chance of having life. From Earthly life forms, we know that water = life, and that even that isn't always necessary. Indeed, I'd wager our own solar system has life in multiple places, so then what does that say for other average planets around average stars? The Drake Equation may even yield a bigger result than we ever imagined....and we may not be near as special as we think we are....

[edit on 28-6-2006 by Gazrok]



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