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Rumsfeld May Have Ordered Children To Be Raped and Sodomized In Front Of Parents For Information

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posted on Jun, 22 2006 @ 09:09 PM
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First of all, yes is in human nature to act in certain way but society dictated the ways in which appropriate to act.

Yes the government doesn’t know how some individuals may act under certain circumstances.

But it seems inexcusable that it was more than a few that acted in the despicable and indecent way that the soldiers involve in the Abu Graib did at certain time.

It was more than a few.


[edit on 22-6-2006 by marg6043]




posted on Jun, 22 2006 @ 09:53 PM
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This was the title of this thread when I first stumbled on it:

Rumsfeld Ordered Children To Be Raped and Sodomized In Front Of Parents For Information

NOW it reads: Rumsfeld May Have Ordered Children To Be Raped and Sodomized In Front Of Parents For Information.

Wonder who changed that?

Libel and slander of a person, whether political personage or average guy is a LIE, a SMEAR, and disgusting.

Just like the lie that fostered changing the title of the thread is disgusting, a coward's twist of truth.

As for you, Yumi, the sources you quote in later posts are not in your first one, and of the ones you did quote there...who knows who put the "Daily Kos" on the net, maybe you and your anti-American friends?

The other, the PDF, is a statement made by a detainee, an enemy soldier, and portends to be an "official document", but how does anyone know that? You say it was from the Washington Post, not that that matters much, but no where does the document show that.

cpdaman said:

yes two americans were mutilated and killed, is it possible to look there family in the eyes, give your condolenses and see those soldiers as brave indiviuals and at the same time be very skeptical of the military's treatment of iraqi's or does your BIBLE SAY AN EYE FOR AN EYE


cpdaman, you totally missed my point and made one up for yourself. Abuse, murder, sodomy, and rape are disgusting and perverted outbreaks of the evil men do, and not tolerable to anyone with a reasonably well-working conscience.

What I'm sick of is people like Yumi posting stuff like this thread and hearing the twisted minds of people who are aching for something really hideous to hang on somebody in government, anybody, so long as the smear is stinking to high heaven, come in like hyenas to the bloody carcass.

Isn't it strange that the Al-Qaeda soldiers/murderers and Taliban and even Osam ben Laden get such an easy ride on ATS? "Oh, sure, they tortured and killed some Americans, well, yeah, they decapitated some and took videos of it, and sent them around the world to show off. oh well....oh, they cut off their genitals?" "well", say those posters, "what of it, American soldiers are dirt on the bottom of our shoes".

It isn't even that the Americans were tortured and killed, it is the glee with which it is dismissed that tells all about the posters who agree with the likes of Yumi.

I'd dearly love to have you "all-Americans" stand up and identify yourselves, Strangerous.. You who take all the liberties with American "rights" and talk smack about your own country, not even bothering to find out who you are agreeing with.

maximusX said:

The executive, legislative, and judicial branches do moniter these threads, and this sight. You are a snitch! You need to be banned. This sight is for freedom of speech, and I don't recalling Yumi breaking any real laws. You should be banned for your obvious ignorance and total disrespect for this forum.


Where is the surveillance video, maximusX, or are you a member of one of those branches that you know that? The only total disrespect I have is for the likes of Yumi
who are soooo brave to smear public figures that really have no comeback, I mean come on, what is Rumsfeld going to do, come on here and debate him?

And just FYI, site as in the "ATS site", is spelled s-i-t-e, not s-i-g-h-t which you do with your eyes.

Just like the bully who only picks on those that can't fight back, so are too many posters on here. And those who are patriotic, and believe in the possibility of good residing in their own country, are overrun by the ones like you, and Yumi, and the other bashers.

Whenever I read one of the patriots posts, they are followed by several vitriolic ones like yours, spitting venom and smoke out both nostrils and eyes. Even the mildly reproving posters are met with hateful spite.

So do I care what you think of me? As a matter of fact, I don't.

You want to see me banned? For what?, oh yeah, for exercising those "freedom of speech" rights to contact MY president and the man named in this heinous excuse for "news" outletting? Hypocrite!



posted on Jun, 22 2006 @ 10:06 PM
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The Moderators changed it, not me.

Also, why are you so wanting to send me to Gitmo? Why do you want me sent to one of the 6 black camps in Eastern Europe to be tortured?



posted on Jun, 22 2006 @ 10:12 PM
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Originally posted by ThePieMaN
Ludachris
You know what? They said the same thing the last time the pics came out, hell even I was like those can't be real its impossible, theyvare fakes...we are AMERICANS FOR CHRISSAKE! They were real , nothing was fake about them and I was wrong. Wether its true or not this time..it HAS occurred in the past and its not going to be forgotten easily. Its a scar that we will carry for a long time. No one has ever been able to say such things in the past about our honor during war, as it was always the other side doing such things. Americans have always been the first to condemn such things , not condone them or practice them. The only thing Abu Gharib and Gitmo will bring is retribution upon our men and women overseas.

Pie


1. I never said that abu Gharib wasnt real, the pictures do speak for themselves.

2. But where are the pictures proving this one?

But you cant judge this story by what has happened in the past, just because it happened then, its doesnt mean it has now. Once again, people jumping to conclusions. I'm not saying we Americans are immune from commiting attrocities. In war there are always those who will commit them, its a fact of life. But the FACT here is that there is only statements from one man(correct me if I'm wrong, Ive got work at 5am and dont have time to read between your last post and the one I'm doing now) claiming these events are happening.

I never said it isnt possible, anything is possible. As someone said earlier this jounalist was right before but that doesnt mean the man is perfect and infallible. All I'm saying is give it some time to develop and see what happens then come talk to me.



posted on Jun, 22 2006 @ 10:25 PM
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The pictures were never released, the Congress, AS STATED, only released that "ok" ones. So the ones of children being raped were never released, or the videos, or the audio of children SCREAMING in pain as they are raped.

I am going to bed, I will continue this sometime, busy day tomorrow so no idea.



posted on Jun, 22 2006 @ 10:43 PM
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can anyone be truly surprised if the worst thinkable were to be proven true in this case? the tactics being reported by Hersch are identical to the tactics admittedly employed in Honduras in '82. the protocol even seems eerily similar doesnt it? just google "selected issues relating to CIA activities in Honduras in the 1980's" for your sources/links. compare the photos from Nydgan's links to the CIA Inspector General's report on Honduras. as the Baltimore Sun put it in 1995 "...a secret CIA-trained Honduran army unit, Battalion 316, that used "shock and suffocation devices in interrogations. Prisoners often were kept naked." we have been perfecting this procedure for a long time. the only surprise to me is it took this long to get caught!



posted on Jun, 22 2006 @ 11:23 PM
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Originally posted by curiousity
This was the title of this thread when I first stumbled on it:

Rumsfeld Ordered Children To Be Raped and Sodomized In Front Of Parents For Information

NOW it reads: Rumsfeld May Have Ordered Children To Be Raped and Sodomized In Front Of Parents For Information.



Curiosity thanks for noticing.

OP - You have got to be kidding!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I'm at work so I hit the speed dial to our attorney who at one time was in the AG's office. I read it to him and explained that it was posted on a public board. He tells me since the original title was written without proof of its validity and that it could conceivably cause financial and personal harm to the victim the author could be charged with a crime (the best I could do in relaying his long winded explanation in short). He also said if he were asked to get involved with a civil case and the author had lots of money, he’d jump at it as he would love to retire early.

Hate, breeds hate, breeds hate ad nauseum……………….
Hate will tear you apart inside if you let it. Get some help before it is to late.

Are you part of a terrorist organization? What's your motive?



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 12:15 AM
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Rumsfeld did admit that very haneous events happened that would never reach the media.

We saw photos of dogs, and fake electrodes..
this is the stuff they ALLOWED
in my mind its pretty weak..

IF rumsfield said haneous stuff happened that would never meet the press..

it must be bad.

and this is bad.



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 12:18 AM
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Out there are some very graphic images of US soldiers, most likely in Abu Ghraib prison, gang-raping female prisoners. However, seeing the tension this thread caused, I'll refrain from linking to them to prevent any more emotional outbursts. We all know this stuff is going on, and this is just what we hear about. Who knows what’s going on inside secret prisons on the other side of the world?

About Rumsfeld, he may not have ordered such actions (Gonzales memo?) but he most definitely knew about it. And to the guy to called the White House concerning someone’s post: what the hell is going on in your mind dude? Do you actually think anyone up there really cares?



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 12:20 AM
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Originally posted by Griff
So, now the Washington Post is not reliable? I guess we can call Richard Nixon and tell him (if he weren't dead) that it's all a mistake. Woodward is not reliable. Go back to work.

I agree the Rumsfeld corrolation is not credible but the Washington Post is a very respected publication. And we do know that torture WAS in effect at Abu Graib. So, don't tell me I'm ignorant.


REPLY: The same Washington Post who posted "leaks" that put Americans, coalition troops and Iraqi civilians in harms way? HA HA HA

Abu Gharaib, where "torture" was defined by putting womens underwear on someone's head? Scaring someone with a dog?.... is torture? Playing naked Twister? That's torture to you?

The WP is as reliable as the NYT, and don't even get me started about the Daily Kos; Yeah.... and "Move On" is reliable, too.



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 12:26 AM
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This thread needs to be closed, and people need to stop fighting. Look, there was major scandal at the prison. We all know that. At this point, we need to gather facts, or shut the hell up. All this crap is sickening.



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 12:28 AM
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Originally posted by xmotex


The ACLU has no credibility, as they support groups like NAMBLA.


The ACLU has also defended the free speech rights of NAZI's and the KKK...

Does that mean the ACLU are secretly actually right-wing extremists?

Or maybe they just think it's their mandate to support everyone's free-speech rights, no matter how unpopular?

I have my own problems with the ACLU, they seem to be die-hard supporters of each amendment in the Bill of Rights - except the Second. Which is why I think any American that genuinely supports the Bill of Rights ought to become a member of each organization...

[edit on 6/22/06 by xmotex]


REPLY: Nazi-ism, means national Socialism, which describes the Left over the past 50-some years. Also, the ACLU was started by a Communist, and stated very clearly that they would use our own Constitution to destroy this country.

Gitmo has been visited by virtually every human rights group, and none of them found anything, except for the "torture" dished out to the troops such as "verbal abuse", $hit and urine thrown on them, etc. meanwhile, we provide religiously and culturally correct meals, we provide Korans (which means to me, even though the story about guards throwing Korans in the toilet was BS, they are ours, and can do so if we want to). In three years, there have been no reports about children being there.

[edit on 23-6-2006 by zappafan1]



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 12:36 AM
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Maximus, just because its BAD for the US, doesnt mean we should ignore it.
When alqaeda do something bad, we plaster it,
when we do something bad, we try to shut it up.

Deny ignorance.

If the US committed this Cr@p, then we should be exposing it.



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 12:45 AM
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I'm not trying to succumb the issue. What I'm saying are people are arguing with each other rather than putting forth comments that cooborates with or without the issuers statements. Yes, he came up with one good source in my opinion. But, some are validating the credibility of the source, which is an outstanding and reliable source. However people who seem to know little think, it's easier to speak like they have a paper butt. I am not saying it happened, or it didn't. All I am saying is there seems to be too much anymosity on this thread, as well as others. But this is getting very heated. For one, as I stated before. We all know the atrocities that went on at Abu Gharaib? ( I think that's spelled right) Prison. The question is did that really happen? Now, if you all want to fight, then this needs to go to a forum where contraversy is to be expected. But people. We are fighting with each other about news issues. I don't think the objective of this thread was to start a community war here. Facts, and less ridicule seems to be in order. I will not post my opinion because I don't want to hear the harrassment. This is not what the sight was developed for, I would think. This thread probably needs to be sent to the debate forum, and the real researchers can maybe do a better job to establish facts, without persecuting ones thoughts or beliefs.



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 12:46 AM
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I've posted and linked this many times, but the Geneva Convention does not apply to those not fighting for a recognized countries army, or to those who do not wear the uniform of same, or follow the rules of carrying weapons openly, etc, etc, etc.
Be that as it may, coalition troops still do the "politically correct" things so as to not "offend" anyone.
It used to be that "the agressor sets the rules of engagement", but you won't see American or coalition troops cutting off peoples heads with a knife, or otherwise beheading them and hanging them from lamp-posts then burning them. I wasn't on this forum then, but I wonder how many of you who are so distressed by things like this thread responded in a like manner to THOSE types of torture.



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 12:53 AM
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Originally posted by Yumi
The Moderators changed it, not me.

Also, why are you so wanting to send me to Gitmo? Why do you want me sent to one of the 6 black camps in Eastern Europe to be tortured?


REPLY: THAT says all I need to know about you, yumi.Human rights groups around the world (most are commie-lovers) looking for "black camps", and yet none have been found, let alone what goes on there.
As fas as "torture", even using sodium pentathol..... truth serum, is considered "torture".... something that is used in about 80% of operations around the world.

Gitmo might be too good.... three healthy meals a day, good weather, showers every other day.... even a free koran if that is your religion. How about Cuba?



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 12:59 AM
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well ladies and gentlemen, without naming names you can clearly see that there are many people this administration would have to pick and choose from to accomplish what they have accomplished all these years. This administration would never be able to do the things that have been done without supporters, just remember that.



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 02:43 AM
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Originally posted by Agit8dChop
Rumsfeld did admit that very haneous events happened that would never reach the media.



Agreed. Horrible stuff happens in wars. People snap under pressure and criminals end up in uniform. But to state that Rumsfeld ordered it I think is just a crazed partisan attack which does nothing constructive. I’m not sure why this is even a matter of discussion anymore as it has been covered over and over and no one is saying nothing bad happened. Everyone who has a shred of decency is appalled about this. Everything else is just hatred rearing its ugly head.



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 02:48 AM
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I suppose the bottom line is SOMEONE must of OK'D this practice.

And all the practices that were signed off end with Rumsfield.

To be hoenst it doesnt surprise me that this happens.

1 mans life and decency is worth the life of .. 10 men ?

In war people die, stuff happens and bad things happen to good and bad alike.

The generals need to make tough calls, as im sure this one was.

I dont hate the american gvt for doing it..
I hate the fact they used saddams methods as another reason for this invasion, when yet they are doing just the same.

Accept the Americans can class it not as Chemweapons, but white pospherous..
and not as torture, but interrogation.



posted on Jun, 23 2006 @ 06:04 AM
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The general attitude of the two types of people on this planet truly worries me. You have those who live in the US and those who look at the US. Living in the UK I have oftern found myself in conversations that are very anti-US. Not because I believe Americans are unpleasent or rude, but because the general concensus is that for all the terror and madness in the world - should this world ever come to a crashing end that it will be instigated by a bumbling ex film star or a dodgey business man with the title 'President'. To vote in someone like Bush, who quite frankly I wouldn't trust to keep my goldfish clean is an insanity I will never understand. Having said that our own Prime minsiter - 'The Son of BEELZE-BUSH' or Blair as we like to call him isno better.

I fully understand that what happened to those two soilders was truly horrific, but at the same time I understand that what has happened to many innocent civillians in Iraq is also truly horrific. Is this really getting to a 'who did the least horrific thing is in the right' kind of discussion? If you had a foreign force running around the US and appearing to be the reason you had lost loved ones what would your reaction be? I know what mine would be and I would not think twice.

I truly hope that one day that the world will be a happier place, but I seriously doubt that the US will have a hand to play in it.

[edit on 23-6-2006 by Quackmaster]



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