It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Rumsfeld May Have Ordered Children To Be Raped and Sodomized In Front Of Parents For Information

page: 11
0
<< 8  9  10    12  13  14 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jun, 25 2006 @ 09:15 PM
link   
WHat does that have to do with anything?

Interesting video, but what does it have to do with this?




posted on Jun, 25 2006 @ 09:23 PM
link   

Originally posted by Interested009

But, it's twue, it's twue.


Not a Quote from Blazing saddles by any chance??


Anyway.. why do people readily dismiss these claims??
You are so terrified to believe that this could actually happen...

Sorry but it does..I,ve had guys tell me..AND I,ve been dismissed as fabricating it or being told untruths..

I,ll say once again. from a girl who was on duty ' National service in Israel by the waý'

She told me through tears about a comrade of hers who shot dead an 8 yr old kid in palestine just because he supported manchester united .. who happened to beat his supporting team in an international match..

She is still undergoing disciplinary procedures because she dared to report it to her superiors... and then found out it was a recognised stratedgy to '' install fear'' into the palestinians..

I also have two friends,one in afghanistan one in baghdad,who work in ordnance disposal and live in military compounds who describe the local ''contract security forces''!!! as a bunch of murdering pshycopaths.

WHY??? I didn,t want to ask them details.. I prefer not to know..

All I know is.. These guys ARE THERE..THEY KNOW what is going on..

I had to ''apprehend'' one said security contract guy who went completely beserk in my district..

I,m Talking COMPLETELY incoherent,uncontrollable and verging on total insanity..Totally unprovoked too..

Within minutes this guy could not remember anything about his conduct

There is no way I can blame him..I said before.. The training SOME of the forces receive is so severe they lose their personality..

Blame the guys in charge.. They both order and condone it



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 02:12 AM
link   
Don't blame , take action against any kind of inhumane conduct conducted by anyone , anyplace , anytime and anyFricking where .
Its all our choice sit in the faeces and keep smelling it , or wipe it away .



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 11:48 AM
link   
Easy to say take action, but when the government can send to to jail for life with no charges, no trial, and no lawyer, hard to do. Bush has passed laws to make him a dictator, legally, so there is nothing you can do. What, going to make plans? They wire tap your phones. Online through IM or EMail? Nope, they went after companies to turn that stuff over to, and can hack you, legally in the name of WOT. In person? FBI/DHS can spy on you, or send spies into the group, or use advanced technology to spy on you. All this before they send you off to jail, no calls, no warning, hell they don't even need a warrent anymore. Taht's right, you could be sitting there at your computer at home while the wife is shopping with your kid when the FBI come in, arrest you, take you away, and no one will know. Next thing the people see on TV is "Local Man disappeared, police are asking anyone with information to call this number..." All the while you're being tortured, no Freedom Tickeled, at a prison.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 02:53 PM
link   

Originally posted by laiguana
To be honest I believe the islamic culture is inferior to any other culture on the planet, it's foundation is one of violence, now one can argue that christianity has also had a past of extreme violence and prejudice, which I can agree to at some point. However I do not see christians (at least not the majority) randomly killing innocent people for a trivial cause.


Two words: Manifest Destiny.

That European white christians think that God put them on this earth to take it all over.. that's *any* different than Islam's beliefs???
How's about the Pope (previous one I believe) telling Africans that they should not use condoms.. thus they're producing children who are bound to starve to death. But I guess that doesn't really count, since *technically* the Pope didn't put his shakey hands around their necks..

And frankly, to say that anyone is inferior to anyone else... Judge not lest ye be judged.

superiority complexes.. for shame.

Edited to say:
How can anyone wage war on religion? or an ideal for that matter? It's not tangible. There is no real enemy.. Religions will never compromise, since that goes against the very nature of what they are..
Besides that -- who are the *real* terrorists when, last I checked, amerikkka went over there and started this whole thing? Who gave them the weapons? Whom is terrorizing whom?
(Not to mention, of course, that we can't even take care of our own.. but we're gonna deliver our brand of capitalist democracy..)

[edit on 26-6-2006 by Diseria]



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 03:02 PM
link   

Originally posted by zorgon
Don't get me wrong, I am in no way condoning the torture of prisoners to extract information, especially if children are involved.

But I do have a serious question... What is the alternative? Do we just ask them nicely to tell us what we want to know? Do we just let them go and say "Have a nice day, please don't do it again?

We have not yet devised technology that will get the truth in a nice way, so what are we to do in defense of the Country?


REPLY: How true. Even the use of truth serum is considered "torture". However, America and every other country learned long ago that using extreme torture, like the terrorists/Iraqis/radical Muslims use, provided no usable intel. at all, as one will say anything to get it to stop; which is why we don't use it.

The tripe told about Abu Gharaib was not torture at all, but sexual humuliation. I've seen first hand college hazing that was worse than what went on at AG.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 03:08 PM
link   

Originally posted by Strodyn
I fail to undestand why people are surprised this happens! It is war and the the US troops have already been pretty much proven to have murdered innocent unarmed kids and their families, but it is amazing to think that there has been no rapes???

Some folk might see that if they pulled their heads out of their own arses.


REPLY: "pretty much" are the operative words here. As you mentioned, IT'S A WAR!!!, and innocent people sometimes are caught in the conflict. However, we have spent much time and expense to make weapons that reduces collateral damage to a minimum, as have other countries.

More people die on our roads and highways each year than there have been soldiers in this war.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 03:12 PM
link   

Wonder who changed that?


REPLY: Either Yumi or a moderator.


Libel and slander of a person, whether political personage or average guy is a LIE, a SMEAR, and disgusting.


REPLY: Not if it's true.... except in Canada, where free speech is no longer an option; it's controlled.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 03:16 PM
link   

Yumi: ".... What about brutally sodomizing children to humiliate their parents?
They didn't release the videos of people being beaten until they passed out, the videos of children being raped, the audio of those children screaming in pain, so forth.


REPLY: Don't forget about the childrens prisons; the stinging rooms, where children were stung with wasps and scorpions to get info from there parents; also the places where people were dipped into acid either head or feet first, and the people put into tree chippers........ oh ....... sorry...... that was Saddam and his two boys who did that.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 03:20 PM
link   

Originally posted by LovingSoul

Originally posted by ThePieMaN

Originally posted by zorgon
Don't get me wrong, I am in no way condoning the torture of prisoners to extract information, especially if children are involved.

But I do have a serious question... What is the alternative? Do we just ask them nicely to tell us what we want to know? Do we just let them go and say "Have a nice day, please don't do it again?


To answer your question quite simply: CIA thats what we pay those dips for. To gain intelligence when you can't get it other ways. There is no need for that and if we can't get it like that , then we have to fight the old fashioned way using tactics and common sense. Whats the point in spending billions on spy sattelites and defense programs if the only way to get info is to beat or rape prisoners of war.


Pie


The answer is ... [drum roll]... a drug that has been in use for many many years:

"A truth drug (or truth serum) is a drug used for the purposes of obtaining accurate information from an unwilling subject, most often by a police, intelligence, or military organization on a prisoner.

Drugs used for this purpose have included ethanol, scopolamine, and sodium thiopental (more commonly known as Sodium Pentothal)..." - en.wikipedia.org...

No need for torture chaps - work smart not hard!


REPLY: True.... I mentioned the use of drugs before, but they fall under the "torture" heading in the Geneva Convention. However, the terrorists DO NOT fall under the protection of the GC, so we should use it, or I hope we are by now.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 03:25 PM
link   

Originally posted by Griff

Originally posted by Rockpuck
The ACLU has no credibility, as they support groups like NAMBLA.


This is off topic but hold it right there. The ACLU also is defending reverend Phelps to be able to protest at funerals. The ACLU is there to defend ANYONE'S civil liberties. Hence the name American Civil Liberties Union. Just because you don't like who they try to protect, doesn't automatically make them lose credibility.


Now, back to your regularly scheduled programming...er I mean program.


REPLY: Cases like those are the exception rather than the rule. The ACLU was started by an avowed Communist, and they're intention was and is to destroy America, it's ideals, culture and morality, using our own Constitution.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 03:36 PM
link   

Originally posted by Aelita


I'm not a big fan of Islamic culture but hey, have you read their poetry, studied the books by Avicenna and do you in general appreciate their contribution ot our own society?


REPLY: Not much gained from them here in America. I HAVE read the Koran, and a history of Mohammed, and it entails killing all infidels, everywhare, by any means.


As for Christians, how about the war in Bosnia and/or Croatia, where Christians were killing other Christians and Muslims as well?


REPLY: Not relevant to this thread.


What about Native Americans decimated by mostly Christian invaders?


REPLY: Not a good thing, true, bit it could have been anyone from any other country. What about the taking over of SO MANY countries by Muslims, even to this day?


What about slavery perpetrated by the Christians?


REPLY: It was also Christians in America who ENDED slavery, which began that movement around the world.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 03:42 PM
link   

Originally posted by SKMDC1

What he is referring to is in 2000 the Bush campaign cold called voters in the South Carolina Primary and asked the question, "How would you feel if you knew John McCain had fathered and illegitemate black child." Or something to that effect. This question was underscored by the presence of McCain's adopted daughter who is (I think) from Bangladesh. It's a classic example of the Bush team turning something honorable into something salacious. (See: Kerry's war record.)

Grover is making the point that the Bush campaign *implied* blatant innacuracies about McCain and have never had to answer for it. So, Bush said whatever he wanted about whomever he wanted with no proof and no credibility and got away with it.... I believe that's the point.


REPLY: It wasn't Bush who did it, but an irresponsible local campaign manager; and it was retracted almost immediately.

As for Kerry's "war record, it's practicxally non-existant; he never released hid medical records concerning the medals he received (which he shouldn't have), and his most famous "medal" is a picture of him hanging in the victory museum in Saigon for his aid in North Vietnam winning the war; much the same as did Murtha, Teddy Kennedy, Jane Fonda, et-al.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 03:59 PM
link   

Originally posted by Interested009
video.google.com...

Feel free toshare this with everyone you know, unless you doubt it as being true.


REPLY: Some of the video is true and, for those who have studied it as I have, they know the tax system is illegal. This has little to do with this thread, and definately nothing to do with this administration.

Unfortunately, our tax system funds all the Marxist/Socialistic programs many have come to rely on, and it will never go away. Again, unfortunately.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 04:06 PM
link   

Originally posted by Johnny Ohm
Easy to say take action, but when the government can send to to jail for life with no charges, no trial, and no lawyer, hard to do. Bush has passed laws to make him a dictator, legally, so there is nothing you can do.


REPLY: Ummmmm, the president cannot pass laws. No laws have been broken.


What, going to make plans? They wire tap your phones. Online through IM or EMail? Nope, they went after companies to turn that stuff over to, and can hack you, legally in the name of WOT. In person? FBI/DHS can spy on you, or send spies into the group, or use advanced technology to spy on you.


REPLY: ..... which started many, many years ago; as in the previous admin. It won't happen to YOU unless you work with the wrong people.


All this before they send you off to jail, no calls, no warning, hell they don't even need a warrent anymore.


REPLY: Not true.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 04:20 PM
link   

That European white christians think that God put them on this earth to take it all over.. that's *any* different than Islam's beliefs???


REPLY: I don't recall any christians cutting off peoples heads.


How's about the Pope (previous one I believe) telling Africans that they should not use condoms.. thus they're producing children who are bound to starve to death.


REPLY: They were doing that anyways. The pope said, truthfully, that only abstinence would prevent unwanted pregnancy and the spread of AIDS/STD's


And frankly, to say that anyone is inferior to anyone else... Judge not lest ye be judged.


REPLY: To belive that every culture is equal is sheer folly; I'll leave it at that.



Edited to say:
How can anyone wage war on religion? or an ideal for that matter? It's not tangible. There is no real enemy.. Religions will never compromise, since that goes against the very nature of what they are.


REPLY: You can when the religion is turned into a "politic".


Besides that -- who are the *real* terrorists when, last I checked, amerikkka went over there and started this whole thing?


REPLY: Wrong!


Who gave them the weapons?


REPLY: France and Russia; maybe Germany, but the first two for sure.


(Not to mention, of course, that we can't even take care of our own.. but we're gonna deliver our brand of capitalist democracy..)


REPLY: Geedz.... do some research. First, it's not governments job to "take care" of the prople. You're thinking Marxism/Socialism/Communism, and it doesn't work. Anyone with a calculator can figure it out.

Second, capitolism and democracy are mutually exclusive. America is not a democracy, and for good reason. Do the words Constitutional Representative Republic ring a bell? Where did you get your education? I'm not knocking you, but I'm just curious what school or college you went to.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 04:41 PM
link   

Originally posted by SportyMB


Unless you've been shot at, had your friend killed in front of you or been tortured yourself, it is easier to say "I'd NEVER condone torture, let alone commit torture myself". People who are surrounded by relative safety (i.e. not in the middle of a battlefield), they are less likely to be able to understand where the desire for torture may come from.

You mean like Sen. John Mccain? Does his opinion and experience count? He's been tortured, beaten up, locked in a cell for years and has had many friends die in front of him.


What does John Mccain have to do with my post? Please explain. If you're asking me why he doesn't condone torture despite his bad experiences, I'll have to say that every person on this planet handles stress differently. There is little chance that all of us (when placed into a situation) will react in the exact same way, and feel the same way about it.
If I'm reading too much into your post I apologize, but using the experience of one person does not negate the fact that 'some' people will react violently in that same situation. By the way,.. publically condoning torture would be political suicide.



Are you speaking from experience?


I am not speaking from my own experience when it comes to being in the middle of war, but I am speaking from the experience of those close to me. I have always enjoyed studying the human psyche. I like to find out why and how people react, instead of immediately resorting to judgement.



[edit on 26-6-2006 by 2manyquestions]



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 05:16 PM
link   

Originally posted by 2manyquestions
What does John Mccain have to do with my post?

Everything....you said that since we have never experienced torture and being shot at, etc... that we are less likely to be able to understand where the desire for torture may come from. And Sen. Mccain is a man who has been through that (one of the few) and he does not have a "desire" for torture.


I'll have to say that every person on this planet handles stress differently. There is little chance that all of us (when placed into a situation) will react in the exact same way, and feel the same way about it.

Yes, true...but you categorize combat vets and torture victims as being more likely to advocate torture. Do you have any proof to back that up? Imo, it's just the opposite.



[edit on 26/6/2006 by SportyMB]



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 06:14 PM
link   

Originally posted by zappafan1

Originally posted by SKMDC1

Grover is making the point that the Bush campaign *implied* blatant innacuracies about McCain and have never had to answer for it. So, Bush said whatever he wanted about whomever he wanted with no proof and no credibility and got away with it.... I believe that's the point.


REPLY: It wasn't Bush who did it, but an irresponsible local campaign manager; and it was retracted almost immediately.

As for Kerry's "war record, it's practicxally non-existant; he never released hid medical records concerning the medals he received (which he shouldn't have), and his most famous "medal" is a picture of him hanging in the victory museum in Saigon for his aid in North Vietnam winning the war; much the same as did Murtha, Teddy Kennedy, Jane Fonda, et-al.


Of course it wasn't bush who did it, it never is...its always some shadow group connected with his campagins...how convienent. As for Kerry he most certianly did release his medical records on his website the day after he said he would. i know I went and read them. It was Bush who never released his. As for him helping North Vietnam win...BULLHOOEY!!! And i only say BULLHOOEY because the hall monitors won't let me say what it really is.



posted on Jun, 26 2006 @ 06:22 PM
link   
What let North Vietnam win was no one person, it was the military's lack of wanting to win. If they wanted to win they would have, instead they pussyfoot around the issue and don't do a thing to win. If the military had attacked hard, fast, and repeat, they would have won. Instead they tried to win by playing defense instead of offense. You don't win a war by invading a country then playing defense...

Also, Zappafan, watch the video, it shows the exact laws Bush signed making it legal for him to arrest you, put you in jail, with no lawyer, no trial, no warning, for life. So instead of of giving an ignorant answer like you did watch the video that names the exact laws Bush signed into law that allow this.

[edit on 26-6-2006 by Johnny Ohm]



new topics

top topics



 
0
<< 8  9  10    12  13  14 >>

log in

join