Is Hillary Clinton going to be President?

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posted on Jul, 2 2007 @ 08:11 PM
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Barack Obama has made quite a splash with his second quarter fund raising numbers, but that's still not a guarantee that he'll get the nomination for his party. It does, however, increase the likelihood that he will be Hillary's choice for Vice President.




posted on Jul, 4 2007 @ 04:39 PM
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As we here in the United States celebrate our Independence Day, I'd like to wish you all a happy and free existence, no matter where you are.



posted on Jul, 8 2007 @ 09:23 AM
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Originally posted by Justin Oldham
Barack Obama has made quite a splash with his second quarter fund raising numbers, but that's still not a guarantee that he'll get the nomination for his party. It does, however, increase the likelihood that he will be Hillary's choice for Vice President. As we here in the United States celebrate our Independence Day, I'd like to wish you all a happy and free existence, no matter where you are.


I’m listening to a reading of the book, “The Lost Dinosaurs of Egypt,” by William Northdruft. #RC62417, J/O. The story of paleontology in the dry desert of North Africa, especially Egypt, in the early 1900s by German scholar, Ernst Freiherr Stromer. It covers ever so briefly the political history of Egypt from Napoleon’s 1798 conquest up to his 1803 abandonment of Egypt. The story relates how one of the world’s outstanding collections of dinosaur bones assembled mainly by Stromer, was destroyed by the RAF’s “Bomber” Harris’ last Lancaster raid over Munich in 1945. Target missed. Collateral damage done. Aside: In WW2, sometimes the bombers missed the city not to say the target. Ours today [bombing] is not nearly as good as Pentagon furnished tv snips would have us believe. End.

I’m amazed how much information this 2002 book contains that is both relevant to our understanding of the recent history - say post 1922 - of the Middle East and equally applicable to B43's misguided Second Punitive Expedition to Iraq. I recommend this book to any dinosaur fan. Or B43 critic.

Barack is a shooting star! I admit he is longer lived than those I once watched on a dark, cloudless and moon-less night laying on my back on a quilt spread on the ground in our backyard. Well before city light pollution ended that very inexpensive but highly educational form of family entertainment

Let’s reflect on reality. Tennessee, 2006. Lackluster Republican medical doctor turned politico, Bill Frist retired as GOP Senate Majority Leader. Dem Memphis Congressmen Ford faces Republican Chattanooga mayor Corker to fill that seat once held by Al Gore.

Q. What did the Republicans do? A. PLAY THE RACE CARD.

Mis-using a picture of Ford at a Hugh Hefner Playboy party standing next to a white girl! And you want to run him for president when Chief Justice Roberts and the Neo Con gang of Alito, Scalia and Thomas joined all too often by AJ Kennedy, have rejected efforts to stop '04's 527s of Swift Boat fame and he put the Supreme Court’s approving imprimatur on Republican last minute lying, deceitful and slanderous tv ads? Sweet Jesus! What did we do to deserve this? Why can't we just have an honest debate?

Do you think even black Democrats want to give away the best chance they will have to gain the presidency in this decade just to show a non-caring world how liberal they can be? Maybe put Hillary on the ticket as VP like Geraldine Ferraro with Walter Mondale in 1984?

That cannot happen.

Barack is not going to ‘go away.’ But I will concede that Barack will be offered the VP slot or given the right to choose who gets it.

[edit on 7/8/2007 by donwhite]



posted on Jul, 8 2007 @ 04:52 PM
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There are only two people who can prevent Barack Obama from becoming vice President. One of them is himself, and the other is Hillary Clinton. If she doesn't think he'll be a good team player, she might go with Bill richardson. He has proven that he wants no more than to be Vice President, and who knows? He might make a good in that he knows what he must do. Eyes open, mouth shut.

If I were a member of the DNC, ranking enough to have some real say, I would push for the Clinton-Obama ticket to ensure that the GOP remains shut out for 16 years. All she's got to do is bring the troops home and play the domestic agenda for all its worth and she can't help but win re-election in 2012. Yes, the economy will tank on her watch, but it'll be to her advantage to and she'll use it while making us feel good about it along the way.

We have yet to hear the much awaited announcement of Fred Thompson, but even that won't enough to stop what's coming. Fred's star will shine brightly, to be sure...but he'll be done in by his own party. How could he beat Hilary? Now that...is another thread.



posted on Jul, 8 2007 @ 06:55 PM
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Originally posted by Justin Oldham
There are only two people who can prevent Barack Obama from becoming vice president. One of them is himself, and the other is Hillary Clinton. If she doesn't think he'll be a good team player, she might go with Bill Richardson. He has proven that he wants no more than to be Vice President, and who knows? He might make a good one in that he knows what he must do. Eyes open, mouth shut.

If I were a member of the DNC, ranking enough to have some real say, I would push for the Clinton-Obama ticket to ensure that the GOP remains shut out for 16 years. All she's got to do is bring the troops home and play the domestic agenda for all its worth and she can't help but win re-election in 2012. Yes, the economy will tank on her watch, but it'll be to her advantage too and she'll use it while making us feel good about it along the way. We have yet to hear the much awaited announcement of Fred Thompson, but even that won't enough to stop what's coming. Fred's star will shine brightly, to be sure . . but he'll be done in by his own party. How could he beat Hilary? Now that . . is another thread.


OK, J/O, let’s say it is a Hillary/Barack Dems ticket. Versus a Giuliani and Romney ticket for the GOP. Acceptance speeches done solemnly at the WTC Memorial! Julies the man! The GOP religious base stays home. Homo and aborts. A lot of Dems stay home too, as race is not a GOP only issue. I don’t see the female issue anywhere in 2008. If it works out that way, and unless Iraq self heals before November 4, 2008, then the Dems should win and add a few seats in the House - 10 to 15 - and maybe some more in the Senate - 3 to 5 - but still short of the 60 votes to shut off debate. B43 may pardon Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rove and Rice. And himself? Is that legal? If that happens, then it’s hello 2024 for the GOP! You may be retired to Bimini by then, J/O.

[edit on 7/8/2007 by donwhite]



posted on Jul, 8 2007 @ 08:37 PM
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Originally posted by donwhite
Versus a Giuliani and Romney ticket for the GOP. The GOP religious base stays home.


I am part of the GOP religious base and this Republican ticket is of absolutely no interest to me.



posted on Jul, 8 2007 @ 10:11 PM
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Although I don't think he will win, I do think that Fred Thompson will do quite well for himself when he announces. I would expect many Giuliani supporters to jump ship. With GOP waters still so muddy, it's hard to know exactly who they will run at this time. Thompson could and would galzanize the religious right, but even if the holy rollers turn out en masse, they still won't make up for the disaffected moderates.

I bring this up because the Dems haven't made the mistake of talking smack about their moderates. The Republicans have gone out of their way to find and cruficy their moderates, forgetting all the while that the moderates make up the majority of eitehr party.

Last year, I had the pleasure of being on a radio show where the host was busy nailing my hide to the wall because I am a self-confessed moderate. I did more than hold my own, I told him politely that in the end, Moderates would decide the fate of the GOP in 2008. He promised to have me back if I turned out to be right. I don't expect to hear from him again.

I am not happy at all to see my preferred party eating its own, or acting stupidly.



posted on Jul, 8 2007 @ 10:47 PM
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Well its safe to say that Hillary and the Dems are taking are far more common sense approach to 08 well about as much common sense as there is in politics. You certainly don't see Hillary debating the topic about who is more Liberal with the other candidates from her party. The worst enemy of the Republican party has been and pretty much is itself.



posted on Jul, 9 2007 @ 12:47 AM
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Real skill at anything is something that you have or you don't. Genuine political skill is rare, and its not hard to see who has it and who doesn't. I don't go to GOP fundraisers any more because I keep getting tapped to do strategy...for free. I like to strategize just as much as the next guy, but I have bills to pay.

To paraphrase Machievelli, real political skill is more than a lack of conscience. Just because you are willing to do anything to win high office and stay in power...doesn't mean that you should.

Bill and Hillary are that rare duo who have chased power all their adult lives. They've done it better than their copetition, which means to me that they are vastly more dangerous to us than their competition. I'd say that even if they were Republicans.



posted on Jul, 9 2007 @ 07:43 AM
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Originally posted by dbrandt

Originally posted by donwhite
Versus a Giuliani and Romney ticket for the GOP. The GOP religious base stays home.
I am part of the GOP religious base and this Republican ticket is of absolutely no interest to me.


OK Mr D/B, who now running in the GOP race do you prefer? Fred Thompson had indicated an announcement over the July 4 week, but so far, I have not heard from him. Money may have kept him out of the race. Plus the Iraq thing does not bode well for any GOP candidate. So what's your opinion who will represent the GOP?

[edit on 7/9/2007 by donwhite]



posted on Jul, 9 2007 @ 09:06 AM
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On moderates. The Bell curve. It seems to me that almost any human activity can be plotted on the bell curve with the same outcome. 15% extremes on either end and 70% in the middle with varying degrees of enthusiasm for a cause. “Moderates” they are usually called.

The “problem” is that moderate positions are not newsworthy! It’s like the John McCain case, who is alone in advocating MORE troops in Iraq for LONGER time. He just cannot accept the idea of losing any war. His calculated gambit has failed. There was not an underlying “base” of people from which to draw on for that extreme position. The public has had enough of this particular war.

Let me hasten to add, wining war good, losing war bad. Americans are fed up with Iraq because we are losing. Americans love a good war and will support almost any war PROVIDING we are winning. But we HATE any war we are losing. That was Bush43's LAST miscalculation in a series of ideologic driven miscalculations. Too much hubris, too little knowledge.

The problem we face in 2007-2008 is that we cannot just “leave” Iraq. We are like the man riding the tiger. See story of Krishna. Also known as a quagmire. Reminds me also of Chandler Harris’ story of the Fox, B’rer Rabbit and Tar Baby.

The more Bush43 worries about his legacy, and well he should, the worse it gets. As in "saving" VP Cheney by the Scotter Libbgy prison sentence commutation to avoid Scotter "telling all" aobut the disgraceful run-up to this Bush43 Iraq War. Ugh! The full pardon will come later. As will a well paying job at Halliburton. God Bless America.

Lesson for America? Never again allow the Supreme Court to designate an under-educated, conceited ideologue to be president. The world would not have ended if we had re-voted Florida and every state where the majority for either party was less than 1% of ballots cast.

I appreciate your constant concern over the potential for the abuse of power in the White House, Mr J/O. That I do not address your worry does not mean I am unaware of it. Perhaps it is because your position is well founded and I have no easy answer.

We started this experiment in self government with a powerful legislature - Congress - and a weak executive. Until the 1800 appointment of John Marshall to the Supreme Court, we had a weak if not meek judiciary. Whether that was what the FFs had in mind is only an historical curiosity. Just as we cannot know what St Paul’s “thorn in the flesh” was, so we cannot know what the FFs had in mind in 1787 and frankly, it is irrelevant anyway.

I am saying a lot to say a little: How we view the exercise of executive power depends mainly on whether we approve of the outcomes. The power is always there. We are poorly equipped to impose any limits. To do that we need to change to a parliamentarian form of government. Like it or not, for better or worse, we are a 50% + 1 country. And so I tned to leave it to fate. For lack of a more viable alternative.

[edit on 7/9/2007 by donwhite]



posted on Jul, 9 2007 @ 06:30 PM
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Actually, I think that lot of he limits we'd like to see can be created by better laws and better law makers. Many of our Federal bureaucratic exceses can be 'cured' by better lawsand better enforcement of those laws. As a Federal civil servant, I chose to not make money disappear. I chose not to take government property. Others who worked right next to me chose differently becuase of the poor law enforcement. The only way we get better law enforcement is to get better people to take those jobs. Ultimately, those "better people" come from society. Until society wants better behavior, it won't happen. Regrettably, we're not going to want that better behavior until the government fails and the nation is in crisis. then and only then will we be sufficiently motivated as a people to "do it."



posted on Jul, 9 2007 @ 07:39 PM
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Originally posted by Justin Oldham
Actually, I think that lot of he limits we'd like to see can be created by better laws and better law makers. Many of our Federal bureaucratic excesses can be 'cured' by better laws and better enforcement of those laws. As a Federal civil servant, I chose to not make money disappear. I chose not to take government property. Others who worked right next to me chose differently because of the poor law enforcement. The only way we get better law enforcement is to get better people to take those jobs. Ultimately, those "better people" come from society. Until society wants better behavior, it won't happen. Regrettably, we're not going to want that better behavior until the government fails and the nation is in crisis. then and only then will we be sufficiently motivated as a people to "do it."


I have been thinking of making a cabinet level “Department of Inspection,” that is, put the IG of each existing department or agency into a single super inspector general office and staff it adequately. Follow the new rule for CIA and FBI directors and appoint the head of the Department for one 10 year term. The person should be over 50 and have 20 years honorable service in local, state or federal government. The person chosen should be required to pass a polygraph every year. The president should send over 3-5 names of qualified persons and the Congress should designate 1 to be the nation’s Inspector General. Or return the first list to the President for another list. Transparency.

We have read in George Tenant’s book the report the CIA's IG was intimidated by VP Cheney. Under my plan, this is less likely to happen. Especially if every IG employee was required to take a polygraph annually as a routine. And be forbidden to hold another government post for 5 years after leaving the IG department. And to never work for a lobbyist or company or entity using lobbyists. All employees of the IG department would, after 5 years, go on a pay scale 50% higher than the grade calls for elsewhere. That is, say a GS 11 gets $78,000 a year, the IG person holding GS 11 gets $117,000 etc. But forbid double or triple dipping, other than military service. Solutions are easy, implementing them are impossible?

[edit on 7/9/2007 by donwhite]



posted on Jul, 9 2007 @ 08:23 PM
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People are the influential factor in any political system . In the case of the US political system I don't know of anything quiet like it. Failure to adhere to an political system or people failing to implement the in build safe guards or put in the safe guards to begin with is what leads to problems. Of course people in the US elected there leaders to an certain degree but the power of the vote is depended on there being more then just differnt labels spurted about.

Realistically political leaders will always the full extend of the powers that are available to them so one must judge if there is adequate safe guards in place and if changes to the system need to be made.

[edit on 9-7-2007 by xpert11]



posted on Jul, 10 2007 @ 01:28 AM
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Originally posted by xpert11
Realistically political leaders will always the full extend of the powers that are available to them so one must judge if there is adequate safe guards in place and if changes to the system need to be made.


You have summarized my specific worry.



posted on Jul, 10 2007 @ 08:21 AM
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Thanks Mr X11, for the good explanation of the naming of the Three Kings Island. Being of non-religious interest, that would have forever escaped me. I was thinking of the monarchs who followed the first Queen Elizabeth. (I refuse to change her name and call her Elizabeth the First, she being my heroine of all time).

On the RCC, all of my family are Catholics. I often counter attacks on my anti-religious views here that I’ve probably attended more Masses in the last 5 years than many “devout” Catholics posting here. I maintain a semblance of peace in my family by not discussing religion unless others bring it up. My assertion that Emperor Constantine founded the Catholic Church and that St Peter - No. 2 to James, Jesus’ brother - never left Palestine always gets a rise. And Mary Magdalene was No. 3 in the Jerusalem church then called “The Way.” I would say that I believe in Erasmus, Voltaire and Descartes. So much for that.

National leaders. Yes, it does boil down to the character of the people who rise to power. Only a few leaders are capable of historic exercise of power for the greater good. Who would have thought in 1933, that a crippled polio victim who could not walk would rise to the occasion in America while across the Atlantic a strong, ebullient but calculating megalomanic took office in Germany? It’s fate. And our good luck.

[edit on 7/10/2007 by donwhite]



posted on Jul, 10 2007 @ 01:04 PM
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Character matters. I've learned that I am a better person if I try to be. the choices I have had to make thus far in my lie have caused me to sacrifice money in favor of character, but I seem to be capable of living with it. Our current Presidential choices leave me cold. I admit that.



posted on Jul, 14 2007 @ 06:45 PM
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Mr J/O, here's some polling data.

Posted July 14 polling data from USA Election Polls, www.usaelectionpolls.com

Top 5 Republican candidates, % for May, June and July, in order

Giuliani, 28, 24, 30

Gingrich, 13, 12, 10

McCain, 24, 20, 14

Romney, 8, 10, 10

F. Thompson, 6, 15, 17

Ron Paul, 1, 1, 1

No other GOP candidate is in double digits.


Top 3 Democratic candidates, % for May, June and July, in order

Clinton, 37, 40, 36

Edwards, 11, 15, 17

Obama, 33, 24, 25

No other Democratic candidate is in double digits.



posted on Jul, 16 2007 @ 10:06 AM
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With the GOP going from one mistake to another, it seems less and less likely that they will mount a credible candidate in 2008. It pains me to admit it, but the Republican "machine" has thrown a rod. I really am worried that Mrs. Clinton will use many of the tools left behind by W. to do some very scary things.



posted on Jul, 16 2007 @ 12:21 PM
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posted by Justin Oldham
With the GOP going from one mistake to another, it seems less and less likely that they will mount a credible candidate in 2008. It pains me to admit it, but the Republican "machine" has thrown a rod. I really am worried that Mrs. Clinton will use many of the tools left behind by W. to do some very scary things.


“What Me Worry?” asked a famous proto-intellectual 40 odd years ago. Mr Alfred E Neuman, I believe. Harry Kurtzman, editor of Mad Magazine, borrowed the non-copyrighted image from Ballantine Books, says Wikipedia.

The Democrat’s Pelosi House will never be as complaint as the Gingrich-Hastert House proved to be towards the Bush43 Executive. It is not in the cards. Nor will the Senate but is a more collegial body than the House and so may not look so daring or obstructive. I suggest a Clinton presidency will be mild, moderate and will use persuasion instead of arm twisting. The public expects this. And if VP Obama wants to follow-on to Hillary, the Dems must deliver.

Wow! Think of what I have just said. The Democratic Party of Roosevelt and Truman, Kennedy and Johnson, Carter and Clinton, is the ONLY party to offer the potential of America’s FIRST woman president to be followed by Americas FIRST Africana American president! Now that’s leadership at the grassroots. Say Hello Dems, say goodby GOP?

Will the Party that gave us Abraham Lincoln and Theodore Roosevelt pass into history?

[edit on 7/16/2007 by donwhite]





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