Ishaqi Massacre Claim Baseless

A pentagon investigation has cleared US troops of any wrongdoing following claims that they carried out `executions ` during counter insurgency raids in the Iraqi town . It was claimed that 11 members of a single family were shot , then buildings demolished to hide the evidence of wrongdoing .





Detractors and opponents of US policy will no doubt dismiss this report as “ white wash “ , but that is to be expected . I have grown used to the culture of any US claim = false and any Iraqi / insurgent claim = true which seems prevalent amongst certain people online .
The bottom line is the Iraqis lied for various reasons , and the insurgents and their allies sat back and milked the story for all it was worth , shame on them all . War his hell , an old cliché but so is crying wolf . No one claims the US troops are infallible paragons of virtue , the other investigations are still ongoing and may possibly discover US complicity . Unfortunately every false story like this slowly poisons the well , and it is the Iraqi victims of the next real outrage who will suffer for the lies told at Ishaqi , because theirs story will be seen as ` just another lie ` by many .


Related News Links:
news.bbc.co.uk

Well this is quite a turn around.
Yes everyone and there brother was ready to jump on the band wagon to show how horrible americans are when this first broke news. To thell you the truth I dontg really know who to belive right now. All I think I can really say for sure is that there is a lot of killing going on. For the time being I think I stop right there.

But then who killed those people? Did the Iraqis kill their own?

Originally posted by RedGolem
Well this is quite a turn around.
Yes everyone and there brother was ready to jump on the band wagon to show how horrible americans are when this first broke news. To thell you the truth I dontg really know who to belive right now. All I think I can really say for sure is that there is a lot of killing going on. For the time being I think I stop right there.

I agree. Both sides have their own propoganda to spin. The terrorist/insurgancy puke up an endless stream of cooked up lies and BS, and the US media chants an Orwellianesque stream of carefully produced mind numbing spin doctor drone.

I got tired of trying to play "spot the BS" so I stopped.

It's a cultural thing.

We, as Westerners, but most especially Americans are put off by the endless lies of the Iraqi witnesses, but you have to remember we are infidels... And Muslims don't view a lie told to an infidel as a lie per se...

I often refer to it as Muslim mendacity.

It CAN be rather humorous though... Like the time the 'victim' of yet another Israeli war crime kept falling off of the funeral procession stretcher. Fortunately, he was just as quick to jump back on!

All caught on video from a UAV circling above...



They are their own worst enemies.

It really does poison the well... And quite frankly the sad sad result is that you can not believe anything they say... ever.

And yes they ARE killing each other.

Golemina,
that sounds like a good and interesting example. By any chance would you have any links or photos of that hapening?

And yet....

Victim's Brother Speaks: New Evidence Undermines U.S. Iraq Claims


New evidence may suggest cover-ups in two separate incidents at the center of a simmering scandal over Iraqi civilian deaths at the hands of American forces.

Iraqi anger is percolating over the incidents, and over an investigation that cleared U.S. forces in a third case.

A brother of a victim, Hashim Ibrahim Awad Abass, in Al Hamadania, Iraq, told ABC News today that Marines killed his brother needlessly.

More...

There was a time when our trustworthiness made positions such as yours, golemenia, fairly reasonable. But that appears to be no longer true. In an era where our government has been repeatedly caught lying, one can not help but wonder whether we are the real fools....

For me, the most painful thing about all that is going on is the dismantling of our integrity from within... Who would have believed such a thing possible?

Don't have any links... saw it on the news at the time.

if you Google sometime along the lines of...

uav dropped palestinian stretcher

You'll get some hits. Looked at one WMV, but its playback was such poor quality, I couldn't even verify if it was the one I saw.

For giggles, if you have any success... Do share with us.

Au contraire loam... The position I'm expressing is MORE reasonable now than ever. In the grand scheme of things, it's important to judge based on character. And though many of us have good cause to doubt the reasons of our governments, the plain and simple truth is ALL governments lies, ALL parties to a conflict lie.

If an honest observer was to weigh the lies being told, that of the Muslims in their holy war on the rest of the world comes in dead last in terms of credibility.

Harsh... but extremely sad AND true.

One doesn't have to look any farther than what is basically a defacto civil war in progress in Iraq... With both sides killing each other. Yet, some insurgency propagandists are simply NOT MAN enough to say YES! We killed those ##### because we are fighting for our cause/faith/whatever...

Instead, we get yet another dose of Muslim mendacity saying CIA/Mossad agents are tricking simpletons into blowing themselves up.

I could respect them as men... If they took/accepted responsibility for their actions.

[edit on 6-6-2006 by golemina]

I repeat:

Originally posted by loam
...the most painful thing about all that is going on is the dismantling of our integrity from within...

I aspire and expect better from our nation.

Originally posted by MacDonagh
But then who killed those people? Did the Iraqis kill their own?

No . The US does not deny killing them its how , why and the exact time line that is in dispute .

They died because they were in the wrong place at the wrong time , despite some of them having forewarning of the attack .

to trot out the cliche , " war is hell . " And as long as insurgents use civilians as cover for their action , civilians will continue to die .

But worse . Civilians who stand back and allow attacks they know will kill Americans to happen without warning , should not cry when the lead flies in all directions

Counter ambush drills have no time for spectators , especially spectators who knew what was coming .

[edit on 6-6-2006 by ignorant_ape]

Loam :

So the brother sticks by his story , and acuses the US of cover up . So what ?

No one really expected him to cave in and confess to lying , did they ?

People are creating a catch 22 for the US forces , if they admit thier mistakes , Cf Abu Graib , they shriek told you so , look they even admit it .

I they deny them , and produce counter evidence . It is ignored and dismissed as a coverup / whitewash .

Who was doing the investigating? If i was to break the law and then I was to investigate it I'd get myself off too.

Originally posted by polanksi
Who was doing the investigating? If i was to break the law and then I was to investigate it I'd get myself off too.

and the world is going to swallow this one too. But, thats ok, the rest of the inhabitants of this world dont matter. Only us.

Originally posted by polanksi
Who was doing the investigating? If i was to break the law and then I was to investigate it I'd get myself off too.

So why have US led investigations condemed US actioms in other incidence , and in cases CourtsMartial proceedings have been brough , and convictions secured ?

You cannot have it both ways .

The US has shown that it CAN and indeed HAS maintained an independant investigstive and jucicial oversight of its own operation .

You readiliy accept thier descisions when US investigators press charges , and Militaty courts find the accused guilty .

Why are you being hypocrites and ignoring any incidence where the US investigation finds no grounds for censure ?? .

Too bad that the ambassador to Iraq, who's nephew was ambushed and assasinated, knows it is the truth. This had to do with Haditha, but nevertheless, its caused by the same mentality. :shk:

The fact that a 'massacre' by the US armed forces has to be either proven or baseless, and the fact that it happens in the first place is the problem here. The US armed forces should be an organization that is above such accusations. Any accusation that the US armed forces committed a massacre should be a joke.

That's why we'll never again know the truth about these claims. They happen. Here's another one. We have to just let it go and say maybe it's true maybe it isn't. To think that we know the truth about this or Haditha or any of the other possible massacres, is naive.

To think that we will get any kind of thuth about what's happening in Iraq is just dreaming.

dgtempe:

It is the ambassador From Iraq , not to Iraq , Mr. Sumaidaie who is making that claim , and of course you believe him without reservation , because ??

It is not because believing him validates your bias is it ?

In short , how do you know the claims of Samir Sumaidaie have any validity ?

Benevolent Heretic :

why ? why should the current US military be as you said :

The US armed forces should be an organization that is above such accusations

no nation has ever feilded an army that lives up to your unrealistic ideal , EVER !

why do you suddenly expect the US military to confirm to your fantasy ideal , compsing of only paladins of impeccable virtue ?

The Muslims would seek to use our sense of morality and self-restraint against us.

It's all propaganda. The really sad part is the Muslims have been caught in these lies SO MANY TIMES... NO ONE STATESIDE IS EVEN LISTENING ANY MORE.

If the Muslims warriors were real men... they wouldn't need to hide behind civilians.

They are like the Keystone Cops of warriors!

Originally posted by ignorant_ape
why ? why should the current US military be as you said :

Because they say they are.