What if it was all real...?

I would like to pose what I consider a very serious question to the community here.

What if?

What if everything you have been led to believe since the morning of September 11th was true? What if a group of Extremists really did hate the United States that much, and did fly planes into their landmarks to send a message and to cause death. What if Saddam really did have WMDs and was nuts enough to use them? What if there was conspiracy involved? What if the theories of secret societies using this to take over the world, or to gain oil, or to establish one world government were all wrong? What if things were actually as they seem?

What then?

Would you support the War on Terrorism then? Would you support America destroying the forces that tried to destroy them? Would you support overthrowing a maniacal dictator?

Over the course of my time here I've seen thousands of posts about how what we've been led to believe is not true. I ask you then... what if it was? What then? What would you do?


[Edited on 10-21-2003 by Djarums]

Well, on if I would support things...

1) Yes (I support it anyways)
2) Yes
3) Yes (Freeing the Iraqis is good )

Well, we could be led to believe the truth, and partly our, but, of course political leaders aren't going to tell the WHOLE truth, for many different reasons. I would (And am) go on with my life, live it, and research things that interest me (Astronomy, UFOlogy, etc)

-wD

Nice post.

Originally posted by Djarums

Would you support the War on Terrorism then? Would you support America destroying the forces that tried to destroy them? Would you support overthrowing a maniacal dictator?

[Edited on 10-21-2003 by Djarums]

1. No. See my signature. "Terrorism" will never be defeated by a "War".

2. The terrorists who were meant to have engaged in the act are dead. The process of identifying who provided them with resources, if the terrorists were truly known, is not altogether difficult. If the finger points one way, then see justice and the law served there. If it points at yourself, then be prepared to be involved in the settlements due in that case, as well, and to face the consequences, including incarceration or execution for treason or felony, as the case may be.

3. By approval of the UN Security Council, for flagrant human rights abuses, yes.


Unfortunately, it's not how it happened. The links between 9/11 and Iraq are tenuous at best. The stated purpose behind the war was a complete lie, at both the level of "imminent threat of attack by Hussein's readily deployable WMDs" and "we must overthrow Hussein before he exposes segments of his populace to more brutality and tyranny" (whichis actually a post-hoc rationalization by Bush supporters, and not the raison d'etre for the illegal invasion of Iraq). All bull#. And none endorsed by the body who endorses such actions under international law.

It is an interesting hypothetical, and I've answered it honestly, but it is in the realm of the hypothetical.

Better to focus energy on unearthing the actual truth while it matters, and seeing justice done from a human perspective. Not the filthy PNAC agenda of the Bush administration.

Freeing the Iraqi people is good but taking there oil is bad.

USA had no intention of saving Iraqi's and used the WMD's as an excuse to invade a country and kill more civilians to gain control of oil.

Where's the Iraqi's payments?where's the medical help?where's the security?

Violence perpetuates violence. It is no solution.
That is a whole lot of what ifs.... and if you actually think that is the case the Dubya is still the most incompetant and worst president EVER, because he sat there when he heard about the 2ND tower getting hit and finished listening to school kids reading a story rather than excusing himself politely and getting in touch with every man he has to find out what happened and taking action.

Well... I believe most if not all of the conspiracy theories behind 9/11 are ridiculous anyway. I believe there are IN FACT muslim extremists who want to harm this country... And that they DID fly planes into the World Trade Center.
I support the war on terror. They want to fight us, they can die. Fine by me.
I support the war in Iraq based on him having WMD's. I havent seen any, nor do I think I ever will. Never the less, I'm not sorry hes gone.

I don't believe that violence always brings more violence.Look at Japan and what happened when we dropped the big one.Sometimes a punch in the nose is all a bully or an aggressor understands.

Originally posted by Djarums

What if?

What if everything you have been led to believe since the morning of September 11th was true? What if a group of Extremists really did hate the United States that much, and did fly planes into their landmarks to send a message and to cause death. What if Saddam really did have WMDs and was nuts enough to use them? What if there was conspiracy involved? What if the theories of secret societies using this to take over the world, or to gain oil, or to establish one world government were all wrong? What if things were actually as they seem?

[Edited on 10-21-2003 by Djarums]

I've also thought about this a few times, and would be very damn happy if this were true. Cause then I would be able to stop worrying about whether I'm going to be able to grow old to be in my 80's or perhaps my 90's.

if is neither here nor there so the question is false using boolean logic, try again mr.agent...

heres one that is not contemplated at all on the average americans mind.....

what if we commit the most atrocities all over the world and not just in the middle east?...
would you be able to then sleep at night?...
or would you cull your fears by eliminating your enemies?...

No, my views would stay the same. Why?

I used to believe that what I was told was exactly how it happened, because I had no real access to the details of the day. the only thing I saw was on the news, and with my past experience in the middle east, it made sense.

However....

1. I would not support a war on Iraq, Id have supported serious sanctions and diplomatic punishments and the threat of war against Saudi Arabia.
2. Id not support going after every little country that doesnt like us.
3. Our existance as terrorist targets is best cured by cutting off aid to Israel, sealing up and better defending our borders, and taking a good look at our actions, and the concequences in the long term for those said actions. Ultimately, had we really been attacked by nutty muslim kooks that day, Id have been even more in support for Isolationism, more supportive of cutting off monetary and military aid to the world, and from there, working on maiking sure they never got to do it again.
4. Id still not support ther patriot act. Its evil. No matter what.

So, essentially, Id not change, nore would I think this war in Iraq is any more just, if anything, id be railing even more against it, since i would believe the real threat lies within Saudi Arabia, the worlds largest producer, funder, and trainer of terrorists, and a country I despise anyway.

ermm ... Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 ... That was the Alqeda(sp) ... We should be focusing on them, not Saddam. The whole WMD thing has already been proven a lie to gain support for a pre-emptive strike against Iraq ... for what reason, I dunno ...

...double post.weird..

[Edited on 10-24-2003 by darklanser]

i'm not one for playing the "what if game" however i find it interesting that such "enlightened" people are in denial and are believing what they want to believe rather than "playing along" and contemplating even for a second the way they perceive things might be wrong. what we believe after all is a choice even if we think or say it isnt and call them "facts". like many things it is a matter of perception and how we want to see things. the what if game usually results in speculation and opinion and leads to arguments but can also help keep our minds open to other possibilities as a mind that beleives one thing and one thing only is usually left open to be proven wrong at a later date and prevents us from learning as much as possible so we might make a more informed opinion on these matters.

of course the flip side to this what if coin could also be presented to supporters of this war and those who believe there was a connection with 9/11 and saddam. what if there was never a connection?

as far as i'm concerned people have been playing these what if games since 9/11 and neither side has any definitive proof to back up their assertions. of course there is speculative proof on both sides and that usually seems to be enough to make people think one way or the other.

personally i havent made up my mind on any of this, i accept nothing at face value from anyone or anything. both sides seem to be two extremes and i think the answers to these questions and many more lie between them.